Hell

[kcnalp]

I gave you the scriptures last Tuesday sir. They are quite clear.

Guess you missed this.

Acts 2:27 (NKJV)
27 For You will not leave my soul in Hades, Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (CJB)
27 that you will not abandon me to Sh’ol or let your Holy One see decay.
Acts 2:27 (ASV)
27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul unto Hades, Neither wilt thou give thy Holy One to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (CSBBible)
27 because you will not abandon me in Hades or allow your holy one to see decay.
Acts 2:27 (CEB)
27 because you won't abandon me to the grave, nor permit your holy one to experience decay.
Acts 2:27 (Darby)
27 for thou wilt not leave my soul in hades, nor wilt thou give thy gracious one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (ESV)
27 For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NCV)
27 because you will not leave me in the grave. You will not let your Holy One rot.
Acts 2:27 (NIV)
27 because you will not abandon me to the grave, nor will you let your Holy One see decay.
Acts 2:27 (NRSV)
27 For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One experience corruption.
Acts 2:27 (RSV)
27 For thou wilt not abandon my soul to Hades, nor let thy Holy One see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (TEV)
27 because you will not abandon me in the world of the dead; you will not allow your faithful servant to rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (ETRV)
27 because you will not leave me in the place of death. You will not let the body of your Holy One rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (GW)
27 because you do not abandon my soul to the grave or allow your holy one to decay.
Acts 2:27 (ICB)
27 This is because you will not leave me in the grave. You will not let your Holy One rot.
Acts 2:27 (MLB)
27 because Thou wilt not abandon my soul to the realm of the dead, neither wilt Thou permit Thy holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NET1)
27 because you will not leave my soul in Hades,[52] nor permit your Holy One to experience[53] decay.
Acts 2:27 (NASB77)
27 BECAUSE THOU WILT NOT ABANDON MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR ALLOW THY HOLY ONE TO UNDERGO DECAY.
Acts 2:27 (NASB)
27 BECAUSE YOU WILL NOT ABANDON MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR ALLOW YOUR HOLY ONE TO UNDERGO DECAY.
Acts 2:27 (NIV2011)
27 because you will not abandon me to the realm of the dead, you will not let your holy one see decay.
Acts 2:27 (AMP)
27 For You will not abandon my soul, leaving it helpless in Hades (the state of departed spirits), nor let Your Holy One know decay or see destruction [of the body after death].
Acts 2:27 (MontgomeryNT)
27 "For thou wilt not leave my soul in Hades, Nor give up thy Holy One to see corruption."
Acts 2:27 (CEV)
27 The Lord won't leave me in the grave. I am his holy one, and he won't let my body decay.
Acts 2:27 (GenevaBible)
27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in grave, neither wilt suffer thine Holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (HCSB)
27 because You will not leave me in Hades or allow Your Holy One to see decay.
Acts 2:27 (MaceNT)
27 because thou wilt not leave my soul in the grave, nor wilt thou give thine holy one a prey to corruption.
Acts 2:27 (MOFF)
27 because thou wilt not forsake my soul in the grave, nor let thy holy one suffer decay.
Acts 2:27 (NJB)
27 for you will not abandon me to Hades or allow your holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NLT2)
27 For you will not leave my soul among the dead or allow your Holy One to rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (MSG)
27 I know you'll never dump me in Hades; I'll never even smell the stench of death.
Acts 2:27 (WesleyNT)
27 For thou wilt not leave my soul in Hades, neither wilt thou suffer thy holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (YLT)
27 because Thou wilt not leave my soul to hades, nor wilt Thou give Thy Kind One to see corruption;

No Hell for Jesus!

 

[keithr]

Guess you missed this.

...
Acts 2:27 (YLT)
27 because Thou wilt not leave my soul to hades, nor wilt Thou give Thy Kind One to see corruption;

No Hell for Jesus!

I thought you were just kidding. Surely you're not really that ignorant or stupid?

Surely you realise that hell (and grave in some of the translations) is just a translation of Hades? Why did you miss out the KJV (the translation which introduced the word hell, rather than grave), which says:

Acts 2:27 (KJV)
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

I'm so flabergasted that I just had to reply, despite saying I wasn't going to any more!

 

[Robert Gwin]

Guess you missed this.

Acts 2:27 (NKJV)
27 For You will not leave my soul in Hades, Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (CJB)
27 that you will not abandon me to Sh’ol or let your Holy One see decay.
Acts 2:27 (ASV)
27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul unto Hades, Neither wilt thou give thy Holy One to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (CSBBible)
27 because you will not abandon me in Hades or allow your holy one to see decay.
Acts 2:27 (CEB)
27 because you won't abandon me to the grave, nor permit your holy one to experience decay.
Acts 2:27 (Darby)
27 for thou wilt not leave my soul in hades, nor wilt thou give thy gracious one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (ESV)
27 For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NCV)
27 because you will not leave me in the grave. You will not let your Holy One rot.
Acts 2:27 (NIV)
27 because you will not abandon me to the grave, nor will you let your Holy One see decay.
Acts 2:27 (NRSV)
27 For you will not abandon my soul to Hades, or let your Holy One experience corruption.
Acts 2:27 (RSV)
27 For thou wilt not abandon my soul to Hades, nor let thy Holy One see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (TEV)
27 because you will not abandon me in the world of the dead; you will not allow your faithful servant to rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (ETRV)
27 because you will not leave me in the place of death. You will not let the body of your Holy One rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (GW)
27 because you do not abandon my soul to the grave or allow your holy one to decay.
Acts 2:27 (ICB)
27 This is because you will not leave me in the grave. You will not let your Holy One rot.
Acts 2:27 (MLB)
27 because Thou wilt not abandon my soul to the realm of the dead, neither wilt Thou permit Thy holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NET1)
27 because you will not leave my soul in Hades,[52] nor permit your Holy One to experience[53] decay.
Acts 2:27 (NASB77)
27 BECAUSE THOU WILT NOT ABANDON MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR ALLOW THY HOLY ONE TO UNDERGO DECAY.
Acts 2:27 (NASB)
27 BECAUSE YOU WILL NOT ABANDON MY SOUL TO HADES, NOR ALLOW YOUR HOLY ONE TO UNDERGO DECAY.
Acts 2:27 (NIV2011)
27 because you will not abandon me to the realm of the dead, you will not let your holy one see decay.
Acts 2:27 (AMP)
27 For You will not abandon my soul, leaving it helpless in Hades (the state of departed spirits), nor let Your Holy One know decay or see destruction [of the body after death].
Acts 2:27 (MontgomeryNT)
27 "For thou wilt not leave my soul in Hades, Nor give up thy Holy One to see corruption."
Acts 2:27 (CEV)
27 The Lord won't leave me in the grave. I am his holy one, and he won't let my body decay.
Acts 2:27 (GenevaBible)
27 Because thou wilt not leave my soul in grave, neither wilt suffer thine Holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (HCSB)
27 because You will not leave me in Hades or allow Your Holy One to see decay.
Acts 2:27 (MaceNT)
27 because thou wilt not leave my soul in the grave, nor wilt thou give thine holy one a prey to corruption.
Acts 2:27 (MOFF)
27 because thou wilt not forsake my soul in the grave, nor let thy holy one suffer decay.
Acts 2:27 (NJB)
27 for you will not abandon me to Hades or allow your holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (NLT2)
27 For you will not leave my soul among the dead or allow your Holy One to rot in the grave.
Acts 2:27 (MSG)
27 I know you'll never dump me in Hades; I'll never even smell the stench of death.
Acts 2:27 (WesleyNT)
27 For thou wilt not leave my soul in Hades, neither wilt thou suffer thy holy one to see corruption.
Acts 2:27 (YLT)
27 because Thou wilt not leave my soul to hades, nor wilt Thou give Thy Kind One to see corruption;

No Hell for Jesus!

As you can see, he was not left there, as verse 32 stated God resurrected Jesus

 

[kcnalp]

I thought you were just kidding. Surely you're not really that ignorant or stupid?

Surely you realise that hell (and grave in some of the translations) is just a translation of Hades? Why did you miss out the KJV (the translation which introduced the word hell, rather than grave), which says:

Acts 2:27 (KJV)
Because thou wilt not leave my soul in hell, neither wilt thou suffer thine Holy One to see corruption.

I'm so flabergasted that I just had to reply, despite saying I wasn't going to any more!

I quote 32 English Bibles that say you're wrong and you imply that I'm "ignorant or stupid"? Irony?

 

[kcnalp]

As you can see, he was not left there, as verse 32 stated God resurrected Jesus

Of course He wasn't left in Hell because He wasn't there.

 

[keithr]

I quote 32 English Bibles that say you're wrong and you imply that I'm "ignorant or stupid"? Irony?

My goodness, you really are stupid! Those 32 translations all agree that Jesus was in the same place (they're all translating the same Greek word "hades"!), they just call it by different names - Hades (original Greek untranslated), Sheol (original Hebrew from the Old Testament verse that is being quoted), grave, "place of death", "world of the dead", "realm of the dead" or "among the dead". They're all referring to the same thing, which is more commonly referred to as "hell", which is what the KJV translates it as. The KJV, MKJV, KJ21, Websters, RWebsters and NET translate Luke 16:23 using the word hell. You're either lying that you didn't know that hell is a translation of Hades, or you are really stupid.

I pointed out in reply #6 of this thread that hell is a translation of sheol in Hebrew (Old Testament), and hades in Greek (New Testament) and others in this discussion have confirmed that, and nobody has denied it. You even quoted Luke 16:23 in reply #53, NKJV version which uses Hades, quoting that in evidence to support your idea of what hell is like, so you obviously know that Hades and hell are referring to the same thing (remember, this is a discussion entitled "Hell").

So you say that Lazarus, or the rich man, went to hades, and you claim that the Luke 16 passage is a "very literal" description of hell, and Act 2:31 says that Jesus' soul was in hades, so you have proved that Jesus was in hades/hell. Deliberately choosing a translation that doesn't use the word hell and claiming that proves that Jesus didn't go to hell, in a discussion entitled "Hell", is just deliberately trying to deceive.

So the evidence is pointing to you either deliberately lying or you're incredibly stupid. Which is it?

 

[kcnalp]

My goodness, you really are stupid!

I think that's against forum rules.

Those 32 translations all agree that Jesus was in the same place (they're all translating the same Greek word "hades"!), they just call it by different names - Hades (original Greek untranslated), Sheol (original Hebrew from the Old Testament verse that is being quoted), grave, "place of death", "world of the dead", "realm of the dead" or "among the dead". They're all referring to the same thing, which is more commonly referred to as "hell", which is what the KJV translates it as. The KJV, MKJV, KJ21, Websters, RWebsters and NET translate Luke 16:23 using the word hell. You're either lying that you didn't know that hell is a translation of Hades, or you are really stupid.

Again, against forum rules.

I pointed out in reply #6 of this thread that hell is a translation of sheol in Hebrew (Old Testament), and hades in Greek (New Testament) and others in this discussion have confirmed that, and nobody has denied it. You even quoted Luke 16:23 in reply #53, NKJV version which uses Hades, quoting that in evidence to support your idea of what hell is like, so you obviously know that Hades and hell are referring to the same thing (remember, this is a discussion entitled "Hell").

NONE of the translations I quoted say "Hell". You're making it up.

So you say that Lazarus, or the rich man, went to hades, and you claim that the Luke 16 passage is a "very literal" description of hell, and Act 2:31 says that Jesus' soul was in hades, so you have proved that Jesus was in hades/hell. Deliberately choosing a translation that doesn't use the word hell and claiming that proves that Jesus didn't go to hell, in a discussion entitled "Hell", is just deliberately trying to deceive.

So the evidence is pointing to you either deliberately lying or you're incredibly stupid. Which is it?

You're being naughty!

ONLY sinners go to Hell fire. I hope you don't go for calling Jesus a sinner!
Mark 9:43 (NKJV)
43 If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life maimed, rather than having two hands, to go to hell, into the fire that shall never be quenched--

 

[Robert Gwin]

Of course He wasn't left in Hell because He wasn't there.

Thanks K, for allowing me to bear testimony to you.

 

[keithr]

NONE of the translations I quoted say "Hell". You're making it up.

What am I making up? Most of the translations you quoted leave the word hades untranslated. You seem to favour the NKJV which says (full verse):

"he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption."

He (David) was saying that God would not leave Jesus's soul in Hades. Hell = Hades. Therefore Jesus was in hell and God resurrected him from it, not leaving him in hell.

ONLY sinners go to Hell fire. I hope you don't go for calling Jesus a sinner!

Where does the Bible does say that only sinners go to Hades/Sheol/Hell? The phrase "hell fire" only occurs 3 times (Mat 5:22, Mat 18:9 and Mark 9:47, and in all cases the word that is translated as hell is Gehenna - not Hades.

Mark 9:43 (NKJV)
43 If your hand causes you to sin, cut it off. It is better for you to enter into life maimed, rather than having two hands, to go to hell, into the fire that shall never be quenched--

That "hell" is Gehenna, not Hades! It's referring to something different.

 

[kcnalp]

What am I making up? Most of the translations you quoted leave the word hades untranslated. You seem to favour the NKJV which says (full verse):

"he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption."

He (David) was saying that God would not leave Jesus's soul in Hades. Hell = Hades. Therefore Jesus was in hell and God resurrected him from it, not leaving him in hell.


Where does the Bible does say that only sinners go to Hades/Sheol/Hell? The phrase "hell fire" only occurs 3 times (Mat 5:22, Mat 18:9 and Mark 9:47, and in all cases the word that is translated as hell is Gehenna - not Hades.


That "hell" is Gehenna, not Hades! It's referring to something different.

You said "Hell". Make up your mind. Jesus was never in Hell.

 

[kcnalp]

What am I making up? Most of the translations you quoted leave the word hades untranslated. You seem to favour the NKJV which says (full verse):

Why are you lying? None of them leave it "untranslated".

"he, foreseeing this, spoke concerning the resurrection of the Christ, that His soul was not left in Hades, nor did His flesh see corruption."

He (David) was saying that God would not leave Jesus's soul in Hades. Hell = Hades. Therefore Jesus was in hell and God resurrected him from it, not leaving him in hell.

No Jesus was not in Hell. You're making it up!

Where does the Bible does say that only sinners go to Hades/Sheol/Hell? The phrase "hell fire" only occurs 3 times (Mat 5:22, Mat 18:9 and Mark 9:47, and in all cases the word that is translated as hell is Gehenna - not Hades.


That "hell" is Gehenna, not Hades! It's referring to something different.

Jesus was in Hades, not Hell fire!

 

[keithr]

Why are you lying? None of them leave it "untranslated".

Well above (e.g. reply #141) you quoted many translations, starting with:
Acts 2:27 (NKJV)
27 For You will not leave my soul in Hades, Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.

So as you can see it plainly says Hades. That is the Greek word untranslated and left as it is. Check it for yourself using a concordance. Why can't you understand that? Why do you keep accusing me of lying and making it up?!

No Jesus was not in Hell. You're making it up!

Jesus was in Hades, not Hell fire!

So you agree that Jesus was in Hades. Good. Hades is translated as hell in the KJV and other translations that use the word hell. So you have just agreed that Jesus was in hell. Finally!

 

[kcnalp]

Well above (e.g. reply #141) you quoted many translations, starting with:
Acts 2:27 (NKJV)
27 For You will not leave my soul in Hades, Nor will You allow Your Holy One to see corruption.

So as you can see it plainly says Hades. That is the Greek word untranslated and left as it is. Check it for yourself using a concordance. Why can't you understand that? Why do you keep accusing me of lying and making it up?!


So you agree that Jesus was in Hades. Good. Hades is translated as hell in the KJV and other translations that use the word hell. So you have just agreed that Jesus was in hell. Finally!

Hell fire is for sinners! Is your Jesus a sinner? Did He have to burn in Hell fire? Jesus of the Bible didn't go to Hell! I quoted 32 English Bibles that say Hades NOT HELL!

 

[keithr]

Hell fire is for sinners! Is your Jesus a sinner? Did He have to burn in Hell fire? Jesus of the Bible didn't go to Hell! I quoted 32 English Bibles that say Hades NOT HELL!

I'm not going round this loop again. Your questions have already been answered - read the previous replies. It seems that you are incapable of understanding it. No live person burns in hell (Gehenna) fire.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

No live person burns in hell (Gehenna) fire.

is this from the Bible, or just your opinion?

 

[keithr]

is this from the Bible, or just your opinion?

All the verses that use the word Gehenna are spoken by Jesus, except one verse (James 3:6). He always uses the word to represent destruction, e.g.:

(Mat 5:29) If your right eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it away from you. For it is more profitable for you that one of your members should perish, than for your whole body to be cast into Gehenna.

Here he is saying that it is better for one of your members to perish than for your whole body to perish.

Gehenna, literally, was a deep valley, or ravine, just outside the ancient city of Jerusalem which was used as a place for the disposal of the offal of the city. In the Hebrew language it was know as the "Valley of Hinnom." Fires were kept constantly burning in this valley in order to assure the destruction of everything that was cast into it. Not only, therefore, was Gehenna a place of destruction, but that which was destroyed therein was
worthless.

The dead bodies of criminals were burned in Gehenna. Jesus (and James) used it as a demonstration of destruction, NOT torture! Sinners were NOT tortured there; they had already been put to death for their crime, and then their dead bodies were burned in the dump, because it was thought they had lost any right to be buried in a regular grave. It was all over in a few minutes and certainly cannot be compared to being burned alive in a conscious state forever.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

All the verses that use the word Gehenna are spoken by Jesus, except one verse (James 3:6). He always uses the word to represent destruction, e.g.:

(Mat 5:29) If your right eye causes you to stumble, pluck it out and throw it away from you. For it is more profitable for you that one of your members should perish, than for your whole body to be cast into Gehenna.

Here he is saying that it is better for one of your members to perish than for your whole body to perish.

Gehenna, literally, was a deep valley, or ravine, just outside the ancient city of Jerusalem which was used as a place for the disposal of the offal of the city. In the Hebrew language it was know as the "Valley of Hinnom." Fires were kept constantly burning in this valley in order to assure the destruction of everything that was cast into it. Not only, therefore, was Gehenna a place of destruction, but that which was destroyed therein was
worthless.

The dead bodies of criminals were burned in Gehenna. Jesus (and James) used it as a demonstration of destruction, NOT torture! Sinners were NOT tortured there; they had already been put to death for their crime, and then their dead bodies were burned in the dump, because it was thought they had lost any right to be buried in a regular grave. It was all over in a few minutes and certainly cannot be compared to being burned alive in a conscious state forever.

do you believe that the wicked lost will suffer eternal punishment, or be annihilated?

 

[keithr]

do you believe that the wicked lost will suffer eternal punishment, or be annihilated?

They will suffer the second death, from which there will be no resurrection to life again, i.e. they will perish, and be utterly destroyed.

(Psa 9:5) You have rebuked the nations. You have destroyed the wicked. You have blotted out their name forever and ever.
(Psa 37:38) As for transgressors, they shall be destroyed together. The future of the wicked shall be cut off.
(Psa 92:7) though the wicked spring up as the grass, and all the evildoers flourish, they will be destroyed forever.

Likewise regarding Satan God said:

(Eze 28:16,19) Therefore I have cast you as profane out of God’s mountain. I have destroyed you, covering cherub, from the middle of the stones of fire. ... You have become a terror, and you will exist no more.

 

[ByGraceThroughFaith]

They will suffer the second death, from which there will be no resurrection to life again, i.e. they will perish, and be utterly destroyed.

(Psa 9:5) You have rebuked the nations. You have destroyed the wicked. You have blotted out their name forever and ever.
(Psa 37:38) As for transgressors, they shall be destroyed together. The future of the wicked shall be cut off.
(Psa 92:7) though the wicked spring up as the grass, and all the evildoers flourish, they will be destroyed forever.

Likewise regarding Satan God said:

(Eze 28:16,19) Therefore I have cast you as profane out of God’s mountain. I have destroyed you, covering cherub, from the middle of the stones of fire. ... You have become a terror, and you will exist no more.

Why did Jesus say this about Judas?

"The Son of Man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born.” (Matthew 26:24)

And Revelation 14:11, say this about those who go to hell?

"And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

And John the Baptist about Jesus Christ,

" His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire.” (Matthew 3:12)

And what was the purpose of John the Baptist preaching this?

"Then he said to the multitudes that came out to be baptized by him, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?"

 

[JunChosen]

Also, EVeryone, including you, is going to the Grave.

ERROR - guess you've never read I Thessalonians 4:13-17.

So, your teaching is cult based, and you should get away from it.

Practice what you preach!

To God Be The Glory