Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
This is a complete lie.All that reject the rapture "catching up" will get to be left behind!!!Your choice!
Whereby we know that the Resurrection and Rapture have not occurred at this point in time.IN Christ believers HAVE crucified their body with Christ Jesus.
IN God believers ONLY, IN Jesus believers ONLY….must physically give their body’s unto death.
Yes there will be Believers entering into the Tribulation Era and As well unbelievers who will become Believers and physically die in Belief, and Thus Saved.
“Pre-trib rapture” is a modern term that parallels a “Great ancient” event regarding “this world” a “Great future” event of “this world”.Whereby we know that the Resurrection and Rapture have not occurred at this point in time.
Only at the Second Coming of Christ does the First Resurrection with the Rapture take place and NEVER before.
There has never been found in Scripture(and never can be found) a single pre-trib rapture passage, declaration or prophecy.
Let us, together in Christ, rejoice together and Break Bread.Continued…
NOW turn to Scripture regarding Gods Great Second and Last GREAT TRIBULATION.
WHO, shall it APPLY TO?
WHO, shall be EXCEPTED, ESCAPE, and WHY?
The destruction SHALL again come Down from Heaven, and come UPON the face of the Earth and the inhabitants ON the face of the Earth killed.
The EXCEPTED who shall ESCAPE, ARE those “IN” Christ, WHO have already willingly, freely, GIVEN their body unto dead; FOR THE Lord God, to have, claim, except FROM Gods anger, wrath, tribulations.
The EXCEPTED (nothing new under the sun), SHALL BE Called UP, RISEN UP, CAUGHT UP, RAPTURED UP (whatever term one prefers to use, all means the same event).
1 THES 4:16-17
from the face of the earth, above the mountain tops, to the CLOUDS ….. WHILE the face of the Earth is being destroyed…..with FIRE….(BECAUSE, God promised He would not AGAIN destroy the Earth with Water….BUT DID reveal He would destroy the Earth with FIRE.)
It is a parallel….to NOAH’S experience…
It is a parallel….of a repeat expectation…
(Luke 17: 26-30)
It is a parallel….to John the Baptists WATER “cleansing” Baptism of man.
It is a parallel….to Christ Jesus’ SPIRIT “purifying” Baptism of man.
It is a parallel….to Destruction of mans habitat.
It is a parallel….to Destruction of man occupying his habitat.
It is a parallel…to SAVING a man FROM DESTRUCTION, is accomplished BY LIFTING the man UP from the face of his habitat/estate.
Both was NOAH , AND ARE men IN Christ, FOUND in the EYES of the LORD, IN Gods GRACE….
Neither was NOAH, OR men IN CHRIST appointed to SUFFER, GOD being ANGRY with THEM, to SUFFER Gods Great Tribulation sent down from Heaven, to be DESTROYED by the Earth….
BUT…LIKE Noah…the BUT..
Gen 6:8 … a man IN Gods GRACE, excepted, escaped BY expressly ….
THE MAN, (as did NOAH), Prepare (according to Gods instructions)…
AND (like NOAH), when God Sends Down from Heaven His GREAT TRIBULATION upon the face of the Earth…
the man SHALL be LIFTED UP OFF the face of the Earth….TO the Clouds…
1 Thes 4: 17-18 And forever more BE WITH the Lord.
And where exactly might the Lord BE?
Now IN HIS world, High Heaven.
He shall descend to the Clouds, Lower Heaven.
He shall call up, lift up His faithful IN Gods Grace (aka IN CHRIST)…to Him.
He shall appear to men, as the Son of Man, on a white cloud, that ALL natural mens eyes can see.
He shall reap the Earth … dividing, separating, THOSE with Him…and THOSE without Him.
WHO IS HIM…? The Son of Man, The Lord.
WHO IS the Son of Man, The Lord? Jesus.
WHO is WITH the Son of Man, The Lord? (Those IN CHRIST).
What is the DIFFERENCE? IN Christ, IN Jesus?
IN Christ…ARE IN Gods GRACE, because they LAID down their LIFE, crucified with Jesus.
IN Jesus…Believe but have NOT YET laid down their Life!
BEFORE the last Great Tribulation….
IN Christ are risen up.
DURING the last Great Tribulation…
IN Jesus and AGAINST Jesus are Separated…
Rev 14: 14-16
Those IN Jesus give their life unto Death for God. Their body’s dead, Their souls Saved and rise to Heaven.
** (Another EXCEPTION) Some IN Jesus, escape Being Killed, by Satan, by God, by the Tribulations. Remain Mortal believers…and will repopulate the Earth, DURING Christ’s Millennial Reign.
Those Against Jesus continue to live, and continue to experience, Gods Wrath and Tribulations; The VIALS.
Because of the VIALS, ALL against God, will become bodily dead, and their souls sent to hell.
Satan, with his band of demonic angels, shall be SENT to hell, for a period of one thousand years.
CHRIST JESUS and His Faithful IN Christ shall return to Earth, and occupy CHRIST’S KINGDOM (Abraham’s Promised Land)…
AND the Remnant of mortal believers IN Jesus, shall begin establishing cities, nations, and appointing kings to rule their Nations.
The Nations ruling kings, shall rule according to KING CHRIST JESUS’ Word/Law.
All in harmony, as the population increases, mortals live, reproduce, die natural mortal deaths….for 1,000 years….VOID of Satan’s influence.
Return of Satan to earth….Satan’s influence AGAIN on the nations of mortals….ear tickling lies, greed, power, wealth….AGAIN intrigues men….and WAR of the ALL the Nations AGAINST KING CHRIST’S KINGDOM ensues….for a brief moment…
THEY are DESTROYED, by the TWO EDGED SWORD (WORD OF GOD) of KING CHRIST JESUS….and (FIRE) FROM God sent down UPON them.
AND…
WAR between holy and demonic Angels ensue. Holy Angels triumph, Demonic Angels are Sent for eternity to the Lake of Fire IN Hell.
ALL men, WHO….were crucified with Christ Jesus (aka called IN Christ)….and Already with their KING … they having been ON Earth, Raised UP above the face of the Earth to Escape Gods Tribulations Upon the Earth, and having RETURNED to Earth WITH Christ, for 1,000 years……Remain on Earth, as the WHOLE Earth is Renewed….and the New Jerusalem is sent down from Heaven….
AND?
What about those who LIVED and DIED “IN” Jesus….(but yet never became “IN” Christ”?)
THEY are the BODLY raised UP ……
BY THE Lord??? No…BY GOD…
1 Thes 4:14
from their Graves, TO the Face of the NEW EARTH, IN their NEW glorified BODY, and their saved soul and quickened spirit RETURNED to their BODY, and THEY occupy the face of the Earth forever, with THEIR God, who is WITH them and GOD of the WHOLE WORLD(S)…Heaven and Earth.
WHEN???
Rev 20:
[5] But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
AND WHAT is it called ???
WHEN the “rest” of the DEAD (IN Jesus) are raise up?
The First Resurrection.
Being RAISED UP, by the Lord unto the Lord, is called the RAPTURE, (caught UP)
(1 Thes 4: 16-17) and it applies to those IN Christ, who are NOT Appointed to WRATH,
(1 Thes 5:9) Gods Anger, or to Suffer Gods Great tribulations.
Being RAISED UP, by God unto God, is called the FIRST RESURRECTION.
Being RAISED UP, by God unto Damnation, is called the LAST RESSURECTION.
@David in NJ
There has never been found in Scripture(and never can be found) a single pre-trib rapture passage, declaration or prophecy.
DISAGREE. Scripture notifies us expressly of what was, who it applied to, and why, and Prophetic Scripture of expressly what Shall Again come to pass and who it Shall apply to and why.
Glory to God,
Taken
IN JESUS… is people CONVERTING “IN” Jesus (which is they who before their bodily death CONFESS they BELIEVE Jesus lived, Jesus died and God raised Him UP….)Yes but there is nothing written about them converting to Christ in the tribulation.
But the rapture is not HIs return!!!! HIs return is at the end of the Tribulation when He comes back to earth. at the Rapture, Jesus opnly descends to the atmosphere at most, so it is not HIs return.LOL!!! Read again very slowly===
Jesus will return for the believers that are looking for Him
So Christ, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time, not to deal with sin but to save """those who are eagerly waiting for Him"""". Hebrews 9:28
IN JESUS… is people CONVERTING “IN” Jesus
But the rapture is not HIs return!!!!
There is nothing written that what you describe happens during the GT.
you can think that if you wish, but that is unbiblical! At the Rapture, only the dead in Christ (the church) are raised! OT saints and Tribulation saints are risen at different times. And we leave before the tribulation starts. anywhere between now and when Israel signs a 7 year covenant with the AC which begins the 70th week of Daniel aka the tribulation.Nothing but the return is the return but the rapture does take place during the return, just after the resurrection of all the saved dead.
Jesus is sitting on His throne in Jerusalem during the Trumpets and Thunders. So unless Jesus moves Jerusalem and surrounding area, up into the clouds, He puts His feet on the Mount of Olives at the 6th Seal on the surface of the earth, and not the clouds.But the rapture is not HIs return!!!! HIs return is at the end of the Tribulation when He comes back to earth. at the Rapture, Jesus opnly descends to the atmosphere at most, so it is not HIs return.
And when you read Thessalonians, the rapture is for ALL in Christ- not just select categories.
According to your reinterpretation of the Bible, but not according to the bible as written. You would have Jesus on earth when God is pouring out His fierce wrath against the earth!Jesus is sitting on His throne in Jerusalem during the Trumpets and Thunders. So unless Jesus moves Jerusalem and surrounding area, up into the clouds, He puts His feet on the Mount of Olives at the 6th Seal on the surface of the earth, and not the clouds.
The Trumpets are not God's "fierce wrath", as that is your interpretation, and Not how God's Word is read.According to your reinterpretation of the Bible, but not according to the bible as written. You would have Jesus on earth when God is pouring out His fierce wrath against the earth!
And Jesus does not put His feet on the Mount of Olives and splits it in two until He defeats teh armies of the antichrist, defeats teh antichrist and false prophet, then moves on Jerusalem.
You would have Jesus sitting watching the antichrist rise from the dead, and the false prophet make the image come alive and order all on earth take the mark and sit there twiddiling His thumgbs!
Jesus has been "twiddling" for 1993 years.You would have Jesus sitting watching the antichrist rise from the dead, and the false prophet make the image come alive and order all on earth take the mark and sit there twiddiling His thumgbs"
The Trumpets are not God's "fierce wrath", as that is your interpretation, and Not how God's Word is read.
The 7 vials are God's wrath, and only those with the mark are alive at that point. Not even the 2 witnesses are alive. They are laying dead in Jerusalem during the 7 vials.
Jesus, and the sheep and wheat are not on earth during Satan's 42 months. That is the time those who are beheaded make that choice to avoid the mark.
The Trumpets and Thunders are not Satan's 42 months, but the GT.
YOU really do not know the word of God do you. For if you did know His Word you would not have made such a completely unintelligent statement about what Jesus has been doing.Jesus has been "twiddling" for 1993 years.
That is not what I said. Jesus comes to earth to sit on His throne in judgment of the nations at the 6th Seal. The Trumpets are the call to assembly for all of Israel. Yes judgment happens. There are 2 woes as well at the sounding of the 5th and 6th Trumpet.You said Jesus comes down tro reign before the trumpets. Now you are sayhing He stops reigning! Did you create your own bible? It sure sounds like it.