About the Signs of the Second Coming of Jesus

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Robert Gwin

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And what makes you think Jesus' "name in heaven" would be for us to find out? If you look in Revelation it says that we will be given a new name known only by ourselves and God. If Michael is supposedly the name of Jesus before His incarnation, then why would we be able to find it out?

Also, show me where in the bible that Angel's incarnate on earth as humans.

I would suggest you read Hebrews 1.

All who came from heaven who appeared in the flesh to humans were angels sir. Jehovah is never recorded as ever coming to earth, He always used representatives. The Bible clearly states that no man can see Him without dying.
 

Jostler

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He is both Lamb, and Lion. I suspect that within most of western pop-culture christianity, we have way too little understanding of the magnificent grace of God....and almost NO understanding of the unimaginable terror of His wrath.

Romans 11:22 NKJV — Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.
 
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Jostler

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to the newly born He is the Lamb. It is His kindness that leads to repentance.

Romans 2:4 NKJV — Or do you despise the riches of His goodness, forbearance, and longsuffering, not knowing that the goodness of God leads you to repentance?
 
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Jostler

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To those who are growing in Him, H e begins to reveal Himself as the Lion....

To the mature...He is both....without any sense of conflict. His gift is eternal fellowship, intimate fellowship with the Father. Eternal.

The misery of rejecting that gift of I credible grace, is also eternal. It is justice, BECAUSE He is love. Eternal judgements is a topic/doctrine of Christ listed by Paul in Hebrews 6:1-3. One of six doctrines of Christ so fundamental we have to master them before we can even consider growing into any form of maturity in Him. Many still need to do the basic fundamental work of mastering those 6 doctrines. Once more do it...establishing the foundation of Christ in their lives, we won't have these arguments about judgements.
 
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Robert Gwin

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Now disasters are occurring frequently around the world. The signs of the second coming of Jesus have appeared. Clearly, the prophecies the Lord Jesus said 2,000 years ago have been fulfilled, like “And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, see, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood” (Revelation 6:12), and “For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matthew 24:7–8). Facing frequent disasters, how can we welcome the Lord’s return and avoid missing the chance to reunite with the Lord? The following content will tell you the answer.

1. The Appearance of the plagues, War, Famine, and Earthquakes
2. Spiritual Famine
3. The Restoration of Israel
4. Visions Appeared in the Stars
5. The Gospel Spreads to the Ends of the Earth
6. The Appearance of False Christs and Antichrists


Yes sir, to me this is the most fascinating part of the Bible. Like you I believe we are very near. As a faith we believe that we are very near the end of the generation Jesus referred to as not expiring before all the things he spoke were fulfilled that he gave us in Mat 24. In relation to this prophecy, I can only echo John's closing words found in the Bible: "Amen! Come Lord Jesus". No doubt you are looking forward to that as well. We pray it comes soon, but fully realize there is yet much to be done.
 
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friend of

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All who came from heaven who appeared in the flesh to humans were angels sir.

There's a difference between descending to earth from the heavens and being born on earth as a human being. There is no biblical precedent of angels being born as humans.
 

kcnalp

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Best to learn what that means K, as you are accusing God, who is love of torturing people forever. Is not the lake of fire symbolic? Didn't God clearly define it in both places where it occurs in scripture as representing the second death? So what did He mean by tormented day and night forever? Check out how it was understood to the people of the time era that version was translated.
Have you ever read the Bible my friend. It it FILLED with the wrath of God. Hell will be filled with people who don't believe in Hell.
 

Robert Gwin

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Have you ever read the Bible my friend. It it FILLED with the wrath of God. Hell will be filled with people who don't believe in Hell.

Yes sir hell is quite populated, however it is not full yet. Everybody who dies goes there, with the possible exception of the anointed who die at this time who likely receive their spirit life instantaneously. That wasn't always the case, but we believe the first resurrection has occurred.

Were you aware that all in hell will receive a resurrection, and it will be emptied?
 

Robert Gwin

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There's a difference between descending to earth from the heavens and being born on earth as a human being. There is no biblical precedent of angels being born as humans.

Yes sir, the only spirit being to ever come to earth to be born as a human was Jesus.
 

Randy Kluth

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Now disasters are occurring frequently around the world. The signs of the second coming of Jesus have appeared. Clearly, the prophecies the Lord Jesus said 2,000 years ago have been fulfilled, like “And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, see, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood” (Revelation 6:12), and “For nation shall rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom: and there shall be famines, and pestilences, and earthquakes, in divers places. All these are the beginning of sorrows” (Matthew 24:7–8). Facing frequent disasters, how can we welcome the Lord’s return and avoid missing the chance to reunite with the Lord? The following content will tell you the answer.

1. The Appearance of the plagues, War, Famine, and Earthquakes
2. Spiritual Famine
3. The Restoration of Israel
4. Visions Appeared in the Stars
5. The Gospel Spreads to the Ends of the Earth
6. The Appearance of False Christs and Antichrists

To be honest, sometimes I can't tell if John is just seeing the paraphernalia associated with his visions, of if he is actually predicting events in literal fashion. When John saw an "earthquake," for example, is this just symbolism indicating judgment is coming, or is he literally predicting an earthquake? I don't know.

I do know that at times John is predicting a literal earthquake. For example, in ch. 11 he said that a city suffers a tremendous earthquake and so many people died. This sounds very literal.

But when if I had a vision, and saw veils open up in heaven, with angels blowing trumpets, I might conclude that this is paraphernalia associated with the vision itself, and not predictions of events to literally happen. Heaven opening is not something that I would be predicting is coming in the future. Angels won't literally be blowing trumpets--they are just announcing judgments *to me,* so that I can tell others the grave importance of events to come. Veils opening up only show that what was previously unknown to me is now being revealed to me.

If you have insight into this kind of question, I'd love to hear how you deal with it? Or if someone else knows, I'd be interested in hearing from them, as well!

The initial signs of war and rumors of war Jesus gave in conjunction with his prophecy of the imminent judgment of Jerusalem, including the end of temple worship. Roman military activity Jesus said was solid evidence that the Romans would soon turn against Jerusalem itself.

In the book of Revelation Jesus seems to reveal that this warfare will continue on, unabated, just as he said it would continue for the Jewish People until their blindness is healed. And so, there is a difference between the "birth pains" of Israel's judgment in 70 AD and the "birth pains" of the actual coming of the Kingdom. But both signs spell trouble for the present age, when sin still runs rampant among the nations.

The Restoration of Israel is a promise God made to Abraham in about 2000 BC. And it is a promise that has never been abrogated. In fact, the Prophets regularly confirmed it. So yes, Israel's national restoration in 1948 was a clear sign of the soon appearing of Christ's Kingdom. Judgment, however, will continue to be on Israel as long as they remain spiritually blind.

I don't know if visions in the stars are meant to be symbolic or literal. Sounds literal enough! But in my view, the physical evidence depicts a symbolic, spiritual reality, that God's People, heavenly witnesses, are going to seem to fall. Christian Civilization is presently collapsing, with religious leaders falling in droves. The "stars are falling!"

Both the Gospel Spreading and Antichrists Proliferating are signs that began in the Early Church. And these things will be present until Christ returns. Thanks.
 

kcnalp

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Yes sir hell is quite populated, however it is not full yet. Everybody who dies goes there, with the possible exception of the anointed who die at this time who likely receive their spirit life instantaneously. That wasn't always the case, but we believe the first resurrection has occurred.

Were you aware that all in hell will receive a resurrection, and it will be emptied?
Revelation 20:10 (NKJV)
10 The devil, who deceived them, was cast into the lake of fire and brimstone where the beast and the false prophet are. And they will be tormented day and night forever and ever.
 
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Ronald David Bruno

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The beast and the false prophet will not be cast into the Lake of Fire by Jesus until after they are released from the Bottomless pit, and shortly afterwards, Satan is also captured and thrown into the Lake of fire with them.
This happens after the Millennial Kingdom. They are released for a short time to test the world once again (believers and unbelievers that are born and lived during this time).

In Daniel 12 He is told that all the prophetic wonders that he had been told about would not be fulfilled until three and a half ages had passed. My understanding is that an Age and a Day of the Lord has the same duration length and that length is a little longer than 1,000 years where Satan is given a little while after he is released to do his worst, and the duration of that time period is somewhere between 20 to 30 years. It is after Satan is dispatched into the Lake of fire that Jesus' second coming to judge all the peoples of the earth will occur.
Most end time scholars interpret, "age, ages and half an age" as 3 1/2 years. We see 42 months, 1260 days, 1290 days and 1335 days mentioned in scripture that also pertain to the length of the Great Tribulation period. Although some see it as seven years who believe in Dan. 9:27 as the 70th week, in which a temple must be built, a 7 year Peace Treaty made and broken half way through - leaving 3 1/2 years of GT. So either way you slice it, that's what you get, capisce?
 

Jay Ross

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Most end time scholars interpret, "age, ages and half an age" as 3 1/2 years. We see 42 months, 1260 days, 1290 days and 1335 days mentioned in scripture that also pertain to the length of the Great Tribulation period. Although some see it as seven years who believe in Dan. 9:27 as the 70th week, in which a temple must be built, a 7 year Peace Treaty made and broken half way through - leaving 3 1/2 years of GT. So either way you slice it, that's what you get, capisce?

Daniel 12:4-13: - 4 "But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase."

5 Then I, Daniel, looked; and there stood two others, one on this riverbank and the other on that riverbank. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?"

7 Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.

8 Although I heard, I did not understand. Then I said, "My lord, what shall be the end of these things?"

9 And he said, "Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

11 "And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days.

13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days."​
NKJV

The question posed by one of the two on the river banks, is "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?" to which the one standing above the river responded with: -

" . . . - it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished."

Now, my understanding of the length of time that has presently happened from when this prophecy was given, that around 2,500 years have past, but the end has not yet occurred since it still has around another 1,000 years to go before this prophecy has been fulfilled.

Then Daniel asks the question as to "what shall be the sign of the end of these things will be?" and the man above the river refers Daniel back to Daniel 7:23-27

Daniel 7:23-27: -

23 "Thus he said:​

'The fourth (i.e. a four facetted) beast shall be
A fourth kingdom on earth,
Which shall be different from all other kingdoms,
And shall devour the whole earth,
Trample it and break it in pieces.​
24 The ten horns are ten kings
Who shall arise from this kingdom.
And another shall rise after them;
He shall be different from the first ones,
And shall subdue three kings.​
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time (i.e. year) and times (i.e. years) and half a time (i.e. year)
.
26 'But the court shall be seated,
And they shall take away his dominion,
To consume and destroy it forever.​
27 Then the kingdom and dominion,
And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven,
Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.'​
NKJV

I hold a slightly different storyline to the one that you have presented. Now do you get it? The missing 1,000 or so years, is when the beasts, the false prophet and Satan have been judged in heaven and cast down to the earth to be imprisoned in the Bottomless Pit for 1,000 years, when they will be released for a little while period when they will try to gain the upper hand over the Saints because their time is so short, but when the end is decreed, they will all be captured and cast into the Lake of Fire, after which the Righteous will be separated from the rest of the peoples of the earth, both the resurrected and the living. This is the 1,000 year gap that is found in Daniel 7. "capisce?"


Shalom
 

Ronald David Bruno

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Daniel 12:4-13: - 4 "But you, Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book until the time of the end; many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase."

5 Then I, Daniel, looked; and there stood two others, one on this riverbank and the other on that riverbank. 6 And one said to the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?"

7 Then I heard the man clothed in linen, who was above the waters of the river, when he held up his right hand and his left hand to heaven, and swore by Him who lives forever, that it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished.

8 Although I heard, I did not understand. Then I said, "My lord, what shall be the end of these things?"

9 And he said, "Go your way, Daniel, for the words are closed up and sealed till the time of the end. 10 Many shall be purified, made white, and refined, but the wicked shall do wickedly; and none of the wicked shall understand, but the wise shall understand.

11 "And from the time that the daily sacrifice is taken away, and the abomination of desolation is set up, there shall be one thousand two hundred and ninety days. 12 Blessed is he who waits, and comes to the one thousand three hundred and thirty-five days.

13 "But you, go your way till the end; for you shall rest, and will arise to your inheritance at the end of the days."​
NKJV

The question posed by one of the two on the river banks, is "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?" to which the one standing above the river responded with: -

" . . . - it shall be for a time, times, and half a time; and when the power of the holy people has been completely shattered, all these things shall be finished."

Now, my understanding of the length of time that has presently happened from when this prophecy was given, that around 2,500 years have past, but the end has not yet occurred since it still has around another 1,000 years to go before this prophecy has been fulfilled.

Then Daniel asks the question as to "what shall be the sign of the end of these things will be?" and the man above the river refers Daniel back to Daniel 7:23-27

Daniel 7:23-27: -

23 "Thus he said:​

'The fourth (i.e. a four facetted) beast shall be
A fourth kingdom on earth,
Which shall be different from all other kingdoms,
And shall devour the whole earth,
Trample it and break it in pieces.​
24 The ten horns are ten kings
Who shall arise from this kingdom.
And another shall rise after them;
He shall be different from the first ones,
And shall subdue three kings.​
25 He shall speak pompous words against the Most High,
Shall persecute the saints of the Most High,
And shall intend to change times and law.
Then the saints shall be given into his hand
For a time (i.e. year) and times (i.e. years) and half a time (i.e. year)
.
26 'But the court shall be seated,
And they shall take away his dominion,
To consume and destroy it forever.​
27 Then the kingdom and dominion,
And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven,
Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High.
His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom,
And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.'​
NKJV

I hold a slightly different storyline to the one that you have presented. Now do you get it? The missing 1,000 or so years, is when the beasts, the false prophet and Satan have been judged in heaven and cast down to the earth to be imprisoned in the Bottomless Pit for 1,000 years, when they will be released for a little while period when they will try to gain the upper hand over the Saints because their time is so short, but when the end is decreed, they will all be captured and cast into the Lake of Fire, after which the Righteous will be separated from the rest of the peoples of the earth, both the resurrected and the living. This is the 1,000 year gap that is found in Daniel 7. "capisce?"


Shalom
Apparently you don't capisce! Why don't you search any reliable Pre-Millennial scholar's understanding of what "age, ages and a half an age" means - if you don't capisce the meaning of all the scriptures below.
>>>>>> 3 1/2 years <<<<<<
Dan. 7:25; 12:7; 12:12
These are all references to the same specific time period
Rev. 11:2, 3; 12:6, 14; 13:5
 

Jay Ross

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Apparently you don't capisce! Why don't you search any reliable Pre-Millennial scholar's understanding of what "age, ages and a half an age" means - if you don't capisce the meaning of all the scriptures below.
>>>>>> 3 1/2 years <<<<<<
Dan. 7:25; 12:7; 12:12
These are all references to the same specific time period
Rev. 11:2, 3; 12:6, 14; 13:5

Thanks for showing your understanding, but history has demonstrated that it is not so. The time period of 7:25 is not the same as the time period as mentioned in 12:7. However I will accept that 7:25 and 12:12 are speaking about the same event and time duration.

Now when the question asked by one of the men standing beside the river asked: - "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?", I have to consider what wonders were embedded within that question? Did it include all of the wonders that Daniel had been told about over the course of many years?

Perhaps, your cherry cutter has excluded all of the other wonders from sight and is only focused on just one particular event from the many others.

Shalom
 

Ronald David Bruno

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Thanks for showing your understanding, but history has demonstrated that it is not so. The time period of 7:25 is not the same as the time period as mentioned in 12:7. However I will accept that 7:25 and 12:12 are speaking about the same event and time duration.

Now when the question asked by one of the men standing beside the river asked: - "How long shall the fulfillment of these wonders be?", I have to consider what wonders were embedded within that question? Did it include all of the wonders that Daniel had been told about over the course of many years?

Perhaps, your cherry cutter has excluded all of the other wonders from sight and is only focused on just one particular event from the many others.

Shalom

There are many teachers out there, here are just two I respect ... could get many that would make the same claim.

["Now, Daniel is the first of what we call apocalyptic books. It is the first book that gives a message through signs and symbols. A prophetic message of the future through signs and symbols. We’ve already seen something of the dreams and the visions of Daniel in the first part of the book, and we’ll see even more of that now as we enter the second part, the last six chapters.
You might look at it this way: the first six chapters of Daniel are mostly history with a little bit of prediction; the last six chapters are mostly prediction with just a little bit of history.
So, we come then to the dividing point at the beginning of chapter 7. And here, in this one chapter – mark this for your thinking – we have in this one chapter the outline of the sweep for the whole history of the future of the world. Then in chapters 8 to 12, the individual elements are dealt with. So, the panorama comes in chapter 7, and the individual features are dealt with in the following chapters." ] by John MacArthur

Also R.C. Sproul explains what Daniel 7:25 means as well:

Yes, The Revelation Beast Is Still Coming — Christ Will Return
 

Daniel Veler

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It sounds like some on this thread has taken pieces of the prophecy and have drawn a conclusion. This is never good. You must have all the pieces together to see the whole matter. What you read in revelation is said in the very first chapter this it is the testimony of Christ. What the Revelation is, it is the same gospel Christ taught in parables. It includes scriptures that had not been fulfilled at the time of writing. Do you want to know when Christ will return? The signs of it are in Revelation. When the sixth seal is opened and the sun is darkened and the moon turn to blood red. This marks the end of the prophecy quote by Peter on the day of Pentecost. The world will see Christ in the air with his angels and then will men know the wrath of the lamb is about to come. When time is changed win the fourth trumpet the day goes from 24 to 18 the beast will rise from the pit. When you see the last trumpet which Paul wrote about and Christ gathers his people you will see the mark of the beast implemented. After the beast rules the Lord sends his angels to harvest the righteousness those who have gotten victory over the beast. When Christ returns he casts the beast and false prophet into the lake of Fire. Christ sets his kingdom for a thousand years. We see the people with him to include those having gotten victory over the beast. At the end of Christ’s reign Satan is set loose once again. We see another battle where God casts Satan into the lake of Fire where the beast and false prophet was casts earlier. Read revelation asking for understanding the Lord will give it to you.
 

Jay Ross

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There are many teachers out there, here are just two I respect ... could get many that would make the same claim.

["Now, Daniel is the first of what we call apocalyptic books. It is the first book that gives a message through signs and symbols. A prophetic message of the future through signs and symbols. We’ve already seen something of the dreams and the visions of Daniel in the first part of the book, and we’ll see even more of that now as we enter the second part, the last six chapters.
You might look at it this way: the first six chapters of Daniel are mostly history with a little bit of prediction; the last six chapters are mostly prediction with just a little bit of history.
So, we come then to the dividing point at the beginning of chapter 7. And here, in this one chapter – mark this for your thinking – we have in this one chapter the outline of the sweep for the whole history of the future of the world. Then in chapters 8 to 12, the individual elements are dealt with. So, the panorama comes in chapter 7, and the individual features are dealt with in the following chapters." ] by John MacArthur

Also R.C. Sproul explains what Daniel 7:25 means as well:

Yes, The Revelation Beast Is Still Coming — Christ Will Return

One of your respected explanations was written over 40 years ago and much understanding has changed since then.

Perhaps if you could correctly answer just two questions concerning who or what is mentioned in Dan. 7:2 and then describe what is happening in 7:3, then I may be interested in continuing this discussion with you, but as an older person, I have spent many years meditating on the scriptures and as such I believe that I have a fairly good handle on the end times as prophesied about in the scriptures. The question that I am asking you is how good a handle do you have to lecture anyone else on the End Times about when and what happens as they unfold.

The other item of interest that you may like to provide your understanding on is the 2,000 or so years where Babylon lay desolated and devastate during the time of the Roman Empire, and where it fits in the Dan. 2 statue prophecy and the nations that rose up after this period to have dominion over the Land of Babylon during these present times. Both Isaiah and Jeremiah speak of the two age period where Babylon will be left desolated and devastated before it is remembered once more before God as foretold in Rev. 16:17-21.

I await your response.

Shalom

PS: - If you can demonstrate that my understanding is wrong then I am willing to change my understanding, but so far few have come close to providing such evidence that would prove me wrong.