Are Protestants "saved? "

[Joseph77]

The false ecumenical world church is prophesied in Scripture , and is fatal to those who go along with it.

 

[Paul Christensen]

Last time I checked, it was that you are joined with us in the Holy Spirit. Even if you're wrong about that.



Or if you didn't, and were where Protestants had control, you would have been burned at the stake. That's how it was then. Or even worse, if you were Jewish where Lutherans were in power...



Nope. But Lutherans don't hate Jews today, and Catholics accept that Protestants are our fellow Christians, and most Protestants know this as well.

Considerable improvement, I'd say.

So, both Catholics and Protestants are sinners and all need Christ, including you and me. None of us are righteous and outside of Christ we would be condemned at the judgment.

 

[Brakelite]

It does not. Only if one realizes that he's following a false doctrine, will he put his soul at risk. The principle of invincible ignorance makes it clear that one cannot be guilty of sin at all, if one cannot believe it is sin. Sin is a rebellion against God, and requires that one know this.

This is why Lumen Gentium makes it clear that Protestants are united with us in the Holy Spirit. As you many have noticed, the only ones objecting to this truth on this forum, are anti-Catholics. That alone should settle the issue.

Please provide evidence that there are anti- Catholics here.

 

[Brakelite]

Last time I checked, it was that you are joined with us in the Holy Spirit. Even if you're wrong about that.



Or if you didn't, and were where Protestants had control, you would have been burned at the stake. That's how it was then. Or even worse, if you were Jewish where Lutherans were in power...



Nope. But Lutherans don't hate Jews today, and Catholics accept that Protestants are our fellow Christians, and most Protestants know this as well.

Considerable improvement, I'd say.

More than considerable improvement...a gargantuan about face in policy. What happened to papal infallibility when Popes would pronounce judgement and condemnation upon entire Nations and all within is borders with bulls and declarations of condemnation and threats of eternal damnation and even war if said nation refused to bow to papal supremacy? Now while the former persecutions may have abated, that claim to papal supremacy and ultimate authority over the whole world is still around. Sorry if we choose to believe 1500 years of bloody history and war based on claims of papal authority over the whole planet rather than a few recent minor apologies for being unkind.

 

[Joseph77]

Please provide evidence that there are anti- Catholics here.

Is there an emogee of a raised hand !? HERE I AM! WITH JESUS < HERE AM I !

 

[Joseph77]

Please provide evidence that there are anti- Catholics here.

(don't forget SDA's too) (I would guess there's a few around)

 

[Yehren]

More than considerable improvement...a gargantuan about face in policy. What happened to papal infallibility when Popes would pronounce judgement and condemnation upon entire Nations and all within is borders with bulls and declarations of condemnation and threats of eternal damnation and even war if said nation refused to bow to papal supremacy?

Example?

Now while the former persecutions may have abated, that claim to papal supremacy and ultimate authority over the whole world is still around.

Jesus didn't seem to think that was a problem.

. Sorry if we choose to believe 1500 years of bloody history

To be fair, Protestants are a lot less bloody than they used to be, too.

Jesus showed us a way out of that cycle of revenge and death. Let's go with Him, this time, um?

 

[Yehren]

So, both Catholics and Protestants are sinners and all need Christ, including you and me. None of us are righteous and outside of Christ we would be condemned at the judgment.

Yep.

 

[Joseph77]

Yes, Jesus and the Father told the believers "COME OUT" and we did.

 

[Paul Christensen]

Yes, Jesus and the Father told the believers "COME OUT" and we did.

You try telling that to unsaved people these days, and they will get a totally different meaning to what you intend!

 

[Joseph77]

You try telling that to unsaved people these days, and they will get a totally different meaning to what you intend!

>... ugh,,,, did not see that , but then again, the (faithful) (repentant) believers never took part (or did repent of) that perversion.... so the believers do not give it a thought....

 

[Brakelite]

It's true that during the Reformation, there were both Catholics and Protestants who eagerly tortured and burned any of the other side they could find. Luther advocated the slaughter of peasants for nothing more than being free of serfdom

I think if you did a little deeper you would also find the motives very different between the Protestant and Catholic actions during those times. For the Catholic hierarchy, the extermination of protestantism was as I've said previously, based on papal supremacy. The Protestant rulers actions were based more often, ( not always) on the defense of the nation against treason. Allowing Catholic rule and freedom in this times meant literally a submission to a foreign power.

you can't be a heretic for accepting that, and you can't be excommunicated from the Roman Catholic Church, because you're not part of it.

Explain that to the Waldensians...Albigenses...Hussites.... The Celtic church in Britain.... The chyrvh in Goa India...

 

[Brakelite]

(don't forget SDA's too) (I would guess there's a few around)

You think SDAs are anti-Catholics?

 

[Brakelite]

Example

Ummm, seriously? What were the crusades about? Not just the ones to the middle East, what about the Spanish Armada?

 

[Yehren]

Please provide evidence that there are anti- Catholics here.

Read the posts. It's not hard to find. Jesus said the world would hate us. And it does.

 

[Yehren]

You think SDAs are anti-Catholics?

I know of some who are. While I don't at all subscribe to many of their doctrines, I have to admit that many of them are very good imitations of Christ. And in the end, that is what will matter.

 

[Yehren]

Ummm, seriously? What were the crusades about?

The recovery of Jerusalem from Muslims. But back then, the Protestants were still just Catholics.

Not just the ones to the middle East, what about the Spanish Armada?

I wasn't aware that the Pope commanded the Spanish Armada. Evidence?

From what history says, religion was an excuse for Spain to revenge themselves against the English for divorcing a Spanish Princess, which was also political, with religion as an excuse.

Likewise with Cromwell's ethnic cleansing of Ireland; religion was just an excuse. You really, really, don't want to go there, if you're looking for some kind of justification.

Bottom line? Catholics accept that Protestants are united with us in the Holy Spirit. At least those of them who love God more than they hate Catholics.

 

[Marymog]

History? Did you read those posts I mentioned? #s 306,7,8?

I do love history. Are you talking about the historical writings of the men of the Early Church ? Or just Christian history in general?

Yes....I did read those posts

 

[Marymog]

I did answer your question

the church started at pentecost

you will find the truth church expands across many denomination,

a denominational difference is really based on how different they are and how they worship. Most have the same basic doctrines

if people are sick of the “status quo” and start a different church which does things differently, is this a bad thing?

it has gotten to the point we are seeing numerous non denominational churches, because the traditional church has stopped what paul commanded, and lived as an example, of being all things to all people

Titus 1:9 and 2:1 talk about doctrine. Does it comply with your theory that it is ok for most churches to have the same basic doctrine?

Jesus prays in John 17 that we may all be one. If we have different doctrines HOW can we all be one?

What is a basic doctrine? My definition is probably different than yours.

 

[Marymog]

Your welcome

denomination does not make a church, no denomination is the church, that includes the Roman Catholic denomination.

them church of columbus (my hometown) is a church which expands across different denomination of people who feed their people they way they think is right, other denominations feed their church the way they think is right. Yet in they all lead people to Christ,

yes, you are but one of many denominational churches,

Again, we go back to the original point, made. What makes a church the church? And they answer is not what building they worship in or what name they give themselves,

I agree with you that a denomination does not make a church (The Church). What Church has the authority to fulfill Matthew 18:17?