Are you a liberal?
- Thread starter Brother James
- Start date
-
Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.
You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.
We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!
- Aug 10, 2012
- 5,592
- 6,845
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
If these ideals define a classical liberal, by what perversion do we arrive at modern liberalism?
1. Liberty -> Entitlement
2. Individualism -> Collectivism
3. Skepticism About Power -> Hypocrisy about Power
4. Rule of Law -> Popular Opinion
5. Civil Society -> Nanny state
6. Spontaneous Order -> Instituted Order
7. Free Markets -> Regulated Markets
8. Toleration -> Bigotry
9. Peace -> Cowardice
10. Limited Government -> Bureaucracy
Could I be less diplomatic
1. Liberty -> Entitlement
2. Individualism -> Collectivism
3. Skepticism About Power -> Hypocrisy about Power
4. Rule of Law -> Popular Opinion
5. Civil Society -> Nanny state
6. Spontaneous Order -> Instituted Order
7. Free Markets -> Regulated Markets
8. Toleration -> Bigotry
9. Peace -> Cowardice
10. Limited Government -> Bureaucracy
Could I be less diplomatic
One could also say that most of the things in the video are conservative values as well.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is another "list of traits" that are so true ....
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If a conservative doesn’t like guns, he doesn’t buy one.
If a liberal doesn't like guns, he wants all guns outlawed.
If a conservative is a vegetarian, he doesn't eat meat.
If a liberal is a vegetarian, he wants all meat products banned for everyone.
If a conservative sees a foreign threat, he thinks about how to defeat his enemy.
A liberal wonders how to surrender gracefully and still look good.
If a conservative is homosexual, he quietly leads his life.
If a liberal is homosexual, he demands legislated respect.
If a black man or Hispanic is conservative, they see themselves as independently successful.
Their liberal counterparts see themselves as victims in need of government protection.
If a conservative is down-and-out, he thinks about how to better his situation.
A liberal wonders who is going to take care of him.
If a conservative doesn’t like a talk show host, he switches channels.
Liberals demand that those they don’t like be shut down.
If a conservative is a non-believer, he doesn’t go to church.
A liberal non-believer wants any mention of God and religion silenced. (Unless it’s a foreign religion, of course!)
If a conservative decides he needs health care, he goes about shopping for it, or may choose a job that provides it.
A liberal demands that the rest of us pay for his.
If a conservative slips and falls in a store, he gets up, laughs and is embarrassed.
If a liberal slips and falls, he grabs his neck, moans like he's in labor and then sues.
If a conservative reads this, he’ll have a good laugh.
A liberal reads this he will complain and be offended because his feelings are hurt.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Here is another "list of traits" that are so true ....
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
If a conservative doesn’t like guns, he doesn’t buy one.
If a liberal doesn't like guns, he wants all guns outlawed.
If a conservative is a vegetarian, he doesn't eat meat.
If a liberal is a vegetarian, he wants all meat products banned for everyone.
If a conservative sees a foreign threat, he thinks about how to defeat his enemy.
A liberal wonders how to surrender gracefully and still look good.
If a conservative is homosexual, he quietly leads his life.
If a liberal is homosexual, he demands legislated respect.
If a black man or Hispanic is conservative, they see themselves as independently successful.
Their liberal counterparts see themselves as victims in need of government protection.
If a conservative is down-and-out, he thinks about how to better his situation.
A liberal wonders who is going to take care of him.
If a conservative doesn’t like a talk show host, he switches channels.
Liberals demand that those they don’t like be shut down.
If a conservative is a non-believer, he doesn’t go to church.
A liberal non-believer wants any mention of God and religion silenced. (Unless it’s a foreign religion, of course!)
If a conservative decides he needs health care, he goes about shopping for it, or may choose a job that provides it.
A liberal demands that the rest of us pay for his.
If a conservative slips and falls in a store, he gets up, laughs and is embarrassed.
If a liberal slips and falls, he grabs his neck, moans like he's in labor and then sues.
If a conservative reads this, he’ll have a good laugh.
A liberal reads this he will complain and be offended because his feelings are hurt.
Conservatives and classical liberals are generally one in the same, IMHO. There might be minor distinctions.
At the same time, just as liberal has been hijacked, so has a large swath of the term conservative - the terms have evolved.
At the same time, just as liberal has been hijacked, so has a large swath of the term conservative - the terms have evolved.
revturmoil
New Member
We hear in Australia have two political parties. they are called the Liberal & Labor parties. and the Liberal party people are like as you have put in the conservative position and the Labor voters are as you have in the liberal position.
- Aug 10, 2012
- 5,592
- 6,845
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
Here's how classical liberalism has morphed into social liberalism. Faith in yourself, society, and God are required in classical liberalism. When you entitle yourself towards equality you no longer need faith in anything. So it has digressed into a system that doesn't require faith.
What I don't understand is now that I have little faith in myself and no faith in society why I'm still conservative and can't comprehend being liberal.
What I don't understand is now that I have little faith in myself and no faith in society why I'm still conservative and can't comprehend being liberal.
revturmoil
New Member
We also have two main parties in our country. The national party [middle right - conservatives] and the Labour party [middle left - Liberals]. The rest of the party seats are made up of minor parties. Our voting system is MMP [Mixed Members Proportional]
- Aug 10, 2012
- 5,592
- 6,845
- 113
- Faith
- Christian
I was wrong.
No political movement can be devoid of faith. There needs to be something to tickle in the ears of the constituency.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
classic liberalism embraces change, just like modern liberalism pretends to do - you guys only think it is great because it was the response to monarchy during the 1700s and 1800's in America and France; and you have been told that we live under an American, tyrannical government that has regulated all services in an attempt to make you all communists....lol. Open your eyes! Conservatives were the Monarchs in power during the days of 'classic liberalism' - the Big Business interests that you guys are defending have filled the void of those monarchs. If you were honest and informed, you would have to admit that you would have hated those liberal Enlightenment atheists that were threatening the conservative monarchs and the conservative church if you lived during the 17 and 18 hundreds. The real problem of today is that our country has never elected a true liberal - instead all of our politicians resist change - they are all backers of the new monarchs.
Aspen, I ask you this with both a little jest and a little truth...
Why is that response "you haven't seen a/the true ________ yet!" becoming the lock, stock and barrel response? I hear this one all the time for Communism apologetics. At what instance does the true whatever become a chimera? I could argue the converse is true in regards to conservatism; I mean you could easily argue there never has been a true conservative leader using that logic, but is there ever an ideologically pure candidate?
I also think your characterization is a little too neat and tidy. I'd point out Edmund Burke for example. He supported the American revolution, and his support for the monarchy only materialized when the French Revolution went off on the murdering tangent. Additionally, on our side of the pond, you have Alexander Hamilton who did favor quite the strong central government, with the idea that the aristocrats of the new country (including big business at that time), would be held in check by taxation.
Burke, 1775, House of Commons speech:
The common caricature is to portray conservatives as resistant to change, but that's again too neat and tidy. There was conservative support for the American Revolution (see above) as well as other [classical] liberal activities. My point is merely that we all are classical liberals, but that the modern word liberal has grown to mean something more.
Why is that response "you haven't seen a/the true ________ yet!" becoming the lock, stock and barrel response? I hear this one all the time for Communism apologetics. At what instance does the true whatever become a chimera? I could argue the converse is true in regards to conservatism; I mean you could easily argue there never has been a true conservative leader using that logic, but is there ever an ideologically pure candidate?
I also think your characterization is a little too neat and tidy. I'd point out Edmund Burke for example. He supported the American revolution, and his support for the monarchy only materialized when the French Revolution went off on the murdering tangent. Additionally, on our side of the pond, you have Alexander Hamilton who did favor quite the strong central government, with the idea that the aristocrats of the new country (including big business at that time), would be held in check by taxation.
Burke, 1775, House of Commons speech:
The common caricature is to portray conservatives as resistant to change, but that's again too neat and tidy. There was conservative support for the American Revolution (see above) as well as other [classical] liberal activities. My point is merely that we all are classical liberals, but that the modern word liberal has grown to mean something more.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Nonsense,liberals want freedom for themselves and their kind and bondage for evereyone else,they are the most intolerant people one will ever find with zero tolerence for dissent or disagreement,not content to have their way through legislation they are some of the sorest winners in existence....not only will you do things their way but you will do it with a smile or else.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
Seems to me that Democrats have a much better record of voting with Republicans on issues than the other way around.
revturmoil
New Member
Makes me wonder how you come up tith that! You're obviously prejudice toward liberals. I would never want to be called a conservative due to the high number of people who are that I don't like!
Democrat independents have always been more centered than the few Republican independents that exist. They are more willing to vote for the person rather than the party.
I don't subscribe to a political philosophy based on whether others who subscribe to it are people I like or don't like. I subscribe to a philosophy or ideology based on whether there are good arguments to support it. The notions of limited government, personal liberty, economic freedom, self-reliance, and so forth are well supported regardless of who else says they believe in those things.
Well sure,same old liberal song and dance from the inventors and creators of P.C the greatest tool of intolerence of the last 50 years...i am a conservative with not so much as a moments thought of whether somebody like you will like me or not....couldn't care less.
aspen
“"The harvest is plentiful but the workers are few
The way i treat people ? how would you know ? you say that because i do not take a deferential and submissive attitude towards people who are both destroying the country i live in and in the case of some, claiming to be good christians at the same time.I am disguested with both liberals and conservatives....liberals for doing everything they can to destroy the country financially,culturally,legally,spiritually while promising a socialist utopia at the same time,meanwhile conservatives do nothing but chatter,listen to all talk and no action radio and pat themselves on the back for being so swell.
The liberals feel good about themselves for failure while conservatives feel good about themselves for failure as well....in the end emotions rule...and all of us play in the great big fun house until it all comes crashing down.
The conservative/liberal paradigm as well as the R/D paradigm is the perfect storm for destruction...each one,aware or unaware is a catalyst for the other...spiraling downward.
Similar threads
