Believers stay righteous through their obedience

[Episkopos]

The covenant was the Law. The Ark of the Covenant held the two tablets of the law. etc.

Nice try. The law of God is eternal. We are all subject to the law of God. What is obsolete is the MEANS by which we are to observe the law. No longer is circumcision physical...or the Sabbath outward. God is looking for people who worship in Spirit.


But that doesn't mean the law is passed away.

 

[Dave L]

Nice try. The law of God is eternal. We are all subject to the law of God. What is obsolete is the MEANS by which we are to observe the law. No longer is circumcision physical...or the Sabbath outward. God is looking for people who worship in Spirit.


But that doesn't mean the law is passed away.

““The LORD our God made a covenant with us at Mount Sinai. The LORD did not make this covenant with our ancestors, but with all of us who are alive today.” (Deuteronomy 5:2–3)

 

[Episkopos]

““The LORD our God made a covenant with us at Mount Sinai. The LORD did not make this covenant with our ancestors, but with all of us who are alive today.” (Deuteronomy 5:2–3)

As a means to worship God. God hasn't changed. Neither has the law of God changed.

God has increased His power to us and increased His expectations of us with that.

The New Covenant makes God still harder to satisfy than before. That is because of grace. We have access to the MEANS to be holy as Christ is. As He is we are to be in this world.

 

[Dave L]

As a means to worship God. God hasn't changed. Neither has the law of God changed.

God has increased His power to us and increased His expectations of us with that.

The New Covenant makes God still harder to satisfy than before. That is because of grace. We have access to the MEANS to be holy as Christ is. As He is we are to be in this world.

Still, the Ten Commandments were not eternal but came into play under Moses. And Jesus replaced them with the New Covenant.

 

[Episkopos]

The NT says the Law was given to PROVE that people could NOT obey it
(in their own strength, etc.) ... NOT even His own special "chosen ones", the Israelites.

But, BACs have NO excuse for not satisfying God, because He has given them:
1) the precious Holy Spirit
2) a new nature
3) the word of God (the Bible)
... far beyond what all of the Old Covenant people had!

BACs have been totally FREED from sin!
And Jesus said 4 times in John 14 ...
"Those who love Me will obey My commandments."
.

That's not the purpose of the law. It is to show God's standard.

But I agree with the rest of your post.

 

[Episkopos]

Still, the Ten Commandments were not eternal but came into play under Moses. And Jesus replaced them with the New Covenant.

Not at all. Jesus came to tighten up the loopholes ie....outward obedience but without the inward reality.

So then what has been abolished is pretense and religiosity.

 

[Episkopos]

"..the priesthood being changed, there is of necessity a change also of the law." (Hebrews 7.12)

What we now have is better than the law.

"For the law made nothing perfect, but the bringing in of a better hope did; by the which we draw nigh unto God." (Hebrews 7.19)

The law of God has not changed... but the ordinances have that show HOW we are to go about fulfilling the law of God.

Do a study on the law of God in the NT. You will see that it has not been abolished or changed.

 

[Dave L]

Not at all. Jesus came to tighten up the loopholes ie....outward obedience but without the inward reality.

So then what has been abolished is pretense and religiosity.

This is not true. The Ten Commandments were the Old Covenant. The New Covenant replaced them.

 

[Dave L]

The law of God has not changed... but the ordinances have that show HOW we are to go about fulfilling the law of God.

Do a study on the law of God in the NT. You will see that it has not been abolished or changed.

“For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:3–4) (KJV 1900)

 

[Zachary]

That's not the purpose of the law.

Romans says it was!!!

 

[brakelite]

I'm not sure about what you are saying, but nowhere in the NT are we instructed to keep any sabbath.

What I was saying is that there is no statement anywhere in the NT authorising the removal of the 4 th commandment from the Decalogue.
Any suggestion that it has been removed... that keeping the Sabbath holy is no longer a valid requirement for the people of God... Is merely human interpolation. It is your idea, not God's.

 

[farouk]

The law of God has not changed... but the ordinances have that show HOW we are to go about fulfilling the law of God.

Do a study on the law of God in the NT. You will see that it has not been abolished or changed.

The heart of the law system was the Levitical priesthood. The writer to the Hebrews points out that the Lord Jesus is a priest for ever according to the order of Melchizedek; the old Levitical priesthood has thus been changed and so Hebrews 7.12 shows that of necessity there has been a change in the law.

What we now have is better than the law, (Hebrews 7.12).

 

[Helen]

Still, the Ten Commandments were not eternal but came into play under Moses. And Jesus replaced them with the New Covenant.

....

 

[Episkopos]

The heart of the law system was the Levitical priesthood. The writer to the Hebrews points out that the Lord Jesus is a priest for ever according to the order of Melchizedek; the old Levitical priesthood has thus been changed and so Hebrews 7.12 shows that of necessity there has been a change in the law.

What we now have is better than the law, (Hebrews 7.12).

You would have to understand what "means" means...to see the difference.

Christianity is a "means".

 

[Nancy]

The reality of this has to do with what you are seeking to be justified by. It is important that we obey God's commandments once we understand that we are justified through the blood of Jesus Christ alone; and that law-keeping doesn't save us in any regard.

If our obedience results from the fact that we love Jesus because He has forgiven us of so much, I think that we will be alright: as long as we don't ever begin to trust in our obedience as being salvational to us. It is not our obedience that saves us; it is our faith in Jesus and what he did for us on the Cross that accomplishes this.

If we ever begin to trust in what we do/our performance to save us, then we have ceased to trust in the finished work of the Cross.

When someone is truly born again, there is a basic imprint in our psyche that we are redeemed by the blood of the Lamb and nothing else.

Therefore because this trust in the finished work of the Cross is imprinted on our minds and hearts, we cannot lose our salvation because that imprint will never be erased from the mind of the genuine believer in Christ.

re #39.

It seems that many Christians look at "obedience" as a burden. We are His children and we act immature that way sometimes when we do not obey. We need to understand that obedience to our Creator is meant soley for our ultimate good. Our Father wants His children to be blessed beyond measure in many ways. Our obedience can be seen as access to His treasure to the fullest. Yes, even in this life! And yes it should def be His love for us that should cause us to WANT to obey, when we dis-obey, we grieve His Spirit. Saved by grace through faith alone=obey Him as a result. Good post JBF. ♥

 

[Nancy]

We always try to make it about ourselves, what we have done, what we do, it is not about us, The believer is found righteous not because of anything they have done or could ever do, but because He who was without sin remained obedient to the end, and because God keeps His promises.

God bless

Amen!

 

[Nancy]

Don't mix up the law of God with the law of Moses.

The 10 commandments are still valid...but we are to fulfill them in their depth...not just outwardly.

Jesus said that we must love as He loves. If we do that then the 10 commandments will be fulfilled.

Oh, c'mon now Epi! That's just too simple!

 

[justbyfaith]

Don't mix up the law of God with the law of Moses.

The 10 commandments are still valid...but we are to fulfill them in their depth...not just outwardly.

Jesus said that we must love as He loves. If we do that then the 10 commandments will be fulfilled.

If we love as He loves then we generally will not violate the commandments.

 

[justbyfaith]

What I was saying is that there is no statement anywhere in the NT authorising the removal of the 4 th commandment from the Decalogue.
Any suggestion that it has been removed... that keeping the Sabbath holy is no longer a valid requirement for the people of God... Is merely human interpolation. It is your idea, not God's.

Under the New Covenant keeping the commandments translates into being a privilege rather than a requirement; and this includes the sabbath day.

 

[Dave L]

What I was saying is that there is no statement anywhere in the NT authorising the removal of the 4 th commandment from the Decalogue.
Any suggestion that it has been removed... that keeping the Sabbath holy is no longer a valid requirement for the people of God... Is merely human interpolation. It is your idea, not God's.

It is not required under the NT.