Biblical Proof Of A Pretribulation Rapture!

[stunnedbygrace]

Jesus IS Israel along with believers in the New Covenant. The broken off unbelievers are not. These are Antichrists according to John because of their saying Jesus is not the Messiah. Only through faith in Christ will God reattach any of them to Israel in Christ. “And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.” (Romans 11:23)

And consider “For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.” (2 Corinthians 1:20) So there are no promises to the unbelieving Jews apart from their acceptance of him.

You scare me for yourself. Was your faith a gift or not? Did you heal your own blindness?

 

[teamventure]

You got the whole passage wrong IMO

II Thessalonians 2:3 "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come , except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

The verse says the anti christ must be revealed first.Where may I ask do you see what you are saying?

That day is the Day of the Lord the verse says Christ won't come until after the ac is revealed.

I see those verses as saying the second coming won't happen until the rapture happens first and the son of perdition is revealed. Shalom!

 

[stunnedbygrace]

You are agreeing with the pharisees if you do not consider Christ's interpretation of the OT.

Too bizarre to even find an answer for...

 

[Heart2Soul]

I see those verses as saying the second coming won't happen until the rapture happens first and the son of perdition is revealed. Shalom!

Wow, you really see that in those verses? because I kept rereading them to try to find it saying that. Think about what you are saying....the second coming won't happen until the rapture happens first....."the" second coming I presume means the 2nd coming of Christ.....so you just negated your rapture theory which you claim that at the 2nd Coming you will be raptured. If you are getting raptured before the 2nd coming....who is rapturing you?

 

[Helen]

....and...if there is no such thing as a rapture " as taught" ...then no one flies away anywhere...but are caught up in the Spirit while our feet still are firmly upon the earth!!!!

 

[larry2]

A little on the Kingdom given in a study I transcribed for Prison Ministries given by Gene Hawkins.

Rev 1:9. "I John, who also am your brother, and companion in tribulation, and in the kingdom and patience of Jesus Christ

God's kingdom on the earth, and heaven.

. . . “There are those that are in heaven, and there are those that are in earth and if you go through the four gospels there are times when Jesus says the kingdom of heaven, and then we find the kingdom of the earth. Is one contradictory to the other? No. They are both a part of the same ministry. There is the heavenly kingdom, and there is the earthly kingdom and the reason being because Jesus is what? The Lord of heaven and earth.

Now Ephesians 2:19 says it this way. "Now therefore ye are no more strangers and foreigners, but fellowcitizens with the saints, and of the household of God." But this is what we want to notice. The household of God includes those which are in heaven and those which are on the earth also. Ephesians 3:15 says, "Of whom the whole family in heaven and earth is named." So Verse One shows that this woman is the part of God's kingdom in heaven, and Rev 12:13-17 shows that same woman on the earth, or that part of the kingdom of God on the earth. . . .

Anyone who is on the earth after the Church is gone is not a part of the Church and considered a part of the kingdom of Israel, and their reward there bears that out also because He says there in Rev 2:26 "I will give power over the nations" and that will be a part of the kingdom of Israel. Even Gentiles saved during that time will be Jewish in spirit or spiritually speaking and they will have a part of that power over the nations He is talking about there."

 

[Rollo Tamasi]

....and...if there is no such thing as a rapture " as taught" ...then no one flies away anywhere...but are caught up in the Spirit while our feet still are firmly upon the earth!!!!

we are told to be strong in our faith and be ready for persecution.
So forget about the rapture for kitties.

 

[CoreIssue]

Israel was restored in 1948. It is no the MK.

 

[teamventure]

You got the whole passage wrong IMO

II Thessalonians 2:3 "Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come , except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;"

The verse says the anti christ must be revealed first.Where may I ask do you see what you are saying?

That day is the Day of the Lord the verse says Christ won't come until after the ac is revealed.

The Lord won't come back until the apostasy happens AND the ac is revealed.

 

[teamventure]

Jesus IS Israel along with believers in the New Covenant. The broken off unbelievers are not. These are Antichrists according to John because of their saying Jesus is not the Messiah. Only through faith in Christ will God reattach any of them to Israel in Christ. “And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be graffed in: for God is able to graff them in again.” (Romans 11:23)

And consider “For all the promises of God in him are yea, and in him Amen, unto the glory of God by us.” (2 Corinthians 1:20) So there are no promises to the unbelieving Jews apart from their acceptance of him.

Is anyone going to call out this mans anti-semetic replacement theology?

 

[Jay Ross]

Israel was restored in 1948. It is no the MK.

Really, that is your opinion and the restoration of Abraham's descendants in 1948 is not based scripture. 1948 was the fulfilment of Genesis 15:16a when some of Abraham's descendants returned to the land of Canaan in their own strength, without God's acting to help them return.

As a point of interest, God in Genesis 12 never promised "land" to Abraham, but rather told Abraham that God will lead Abraham to an Earth that He will show him, at some point in the future.

Other passages in Ezekiel, God indicates that, he will lead Israel into Good soil, where He will teach them about the rock's truth that comes down out of heaven and becomes the highest mountain in all of the world.

Daniel 7:27 also tells us that all of the kingdoms of the earth which are under the heavens will be given to the people, the Saints of the most high. No mention of land in the context of this passage.

In Ezekiel 47:1-12, the prophet Ezekiel saw no discontinuity in the river of life until it cascaded over the escarpment into the land below after a period of 4,000 years. The river of life did not disappear in this prophecy with the so called rapture of the Saints into the air as is suggested in the Pre-tribulation theories and understandings of many today.

 

[teamventure]

Wow, you really see that in those verses? because I kept rereading them to try to find it saying that. Think about what you are saying....the second coming won't happen until the rapture happens first....."the" second coming I presume means the 2nd coming of Christ.....so you just negated your rapture theory which you claim that at the 2nd Coming you will be raptured. If you are getting raptured before the 2nd coming....who is rapturing you?

It is a basic thing to understand the rapture happens before the second coming. Biblical knowledge is not a theory but the word of God. Jesus will rapture us.

 

[CoreIssue]

• Jay Ross,The nation of Israel was restored in 1948.

The covenant is restored at the Rapture.

Your link is a 218 year translation.

No River of Life here.

It is prophecy about Jerusalem.

Bible Gateway passage: Ezekiel 47:1-12 - New International Version

The Land Covenant is prophecy yet fulfilled.

Nothing to do with the restoration of the nation of Israel.

Daniel is about the AC. Time and times and half a time is 3.5 years, 2nd half of the Trib.

 

[CoreIssue]

Is anyone going to call out this mans anti-semetic replacement theology?

Too bizarre to even find an answer for...

Remember, Dave L is a non literal Amil.

 

[teamventure]

Remember, Dave L is a non literal Amil.

It's hard to see a non literal Amil perspective when you have to abandon a natural enterpretation of scripture to even go there.

 

[Jay Ross]

• Jay Ross,The nation of Israel was restored in 1948.

The covenant is restored at the Rapture.

Your link is a 218 year translation.

No River of Life here.

It is prophecy about Jerusalem.

Bible Gateway passage: Ezekiel 47:1-12 - New International Version

The Land Covenant is prophecy yet fulfilled.

Nothing to do with the restoration of the nation of Israel.

Daniel is about the AC. Time and times and half a time is 3.5 years, 2nd half of the Trib.

Your short hand response to my post is very confusing as to how you arrived at the statements that you used in your post above.

The rapture does not figure as a sign post as to when Israel will be restored.

Where does 218 years come from?

The river that flows out from under the altar of the temple is the river of life inhabited by the saints.

The Ezekiel 47 prophecy is not about Jerusalem, that is just the starting point for the stream of water flowing to form the flowing river.

The specific verse that I quoted from Daniel 7, that is verse 27, is about the Saints receiving their inheritance of all of the earth after God has judged the beast and the little horn.

Perhaps you may like to retry formulating your response again in a manner in which others can come to the same understanding as was in your mind when you began composing you post in response to my previous post.

 

[Enoch111]

Is anyone going to call out this mans anti-semitic replacement theology?

He's been pointed in the right direction many times, but there is no cure for wilful blindness. "Seeing they will not see, and hearing they will not hear".

 

[teamventure]

He's been pointed in the right direction many times, but there is no cure for wilful blindness. "Seeing they will not see, and hearing they will not hear".

Thanks for the word Enoch111. There will be no excuse in the end for that kind of wilful ignorance.

 

[Helen]

Is anyone going to call out this mans anti-semetic replacement theology?

Why? We all have different opinions...and we each interpret scripture from where we stand.

A discussion is just that......a discussion..

 

[teamventure]

Why? We all have different opinions...and we each interpret scripture from where we stand.

A discussion is just that......a discussion..

I'm all for discussion but no one should say things that God said to Abraham he would curse people for saying.