Do Men Have Authority Over Women?

[marks]

Utter nonsense you say?

No, IT IS BIBLICAL!

Have ye not read how Abigail behaved herself towards David BEFORE she was married to him? Bowing down before him and calling him “lord”?

“And when Abigail saw David, she hasted, and lighted off the ass, and fell before David on her face, and bowed herself to the ground, And fell at his feet, and said, Upon me, my lord, upon me let this iniquity be: and let thine handmaid, I pray thee, speak in thine audience, and hear the words of thine handmaid.” (1 Samuel 25:23-24)

The Bible has more than a handful of examples like this. Look at how Ruth behaved herself towards Boaz:

“Then she fell on her face, and bowed herself to the ground, and said unto him, Why have I found grace in thine eyes, that thou shouldest take knowledge of me, seeing I am a stranger? And Boaz answered and said unto her, It hath fully been shewed me, all that thou hast done unto thy mother in law since the death of thine husband: and how thou hast left thy father and thy mother, and the land of thy nativity, and art come unto a people which thou knewest not heretofore. The LORD recompense thy work, and a full reward be given thee of the LORD God of Israel, under whose wings thou art come to trust. Then she said, Let me find favour in thy sight, my lord; for that thou hast comforted me, and for that thou hast spoken friendly unto thine handmaid, though I be not like unto one of thine handmaidens.” (Ruth 2:10-13)

The state of Christianity is in shambles these days. Soo many Bibles and so little readers…

Show me the passage that grants men in general authority over women in general.

You realize, right, that your view makes rape not a crime? Is that consistent with what you have in mind?

Much love!

 

[PinSeeker]

Yes, Scott... I think this is what you're getting at... "remaining silent" or "remaining quiet" is another misunderstood concept introduced by Paul, there. It's not a wooden "keep your mouth shut."

Grace and peace to you.

 

[marks]

Right, and right. And again, I would add the question, "What does true biblical authority and true biblical submission look like? In Ephesians 5 in particular, just before Paul gives instruction to husbands and wives, He exhorts all of us ~ men and women alike, regardless of any position in society ~ to submit ourselves to one another out of reverence for Christ. That's worth really pondering, right?

So...


Yes, it is nonsense, that all women should submit to all men, unless you understand what true Biblical submission really is (not subservience), and that, as above, all women should submit to all men and women, and all men should submit to all men and women also. We are all to submit ourselves to one another out of reverence for Christ. But again, it is very important to understand what this submission really is.

Grace and peace to all.

It's hard to understand submission when one's true interest is in having power.

Much love!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Show me the passage that grants men in general authority over women in general.

You realize, right, that your view makes rape not a crime? Is that consistent with what you have in mind?

Much love!

Well, let’s look at the BIBLE:

“If a man find a damsel that is a virgin, which is not betrothed, and lay hold on her, and lie with her, and they be found; Then the man that lay with her shall give unto the damsel's father fifty shekels of silver, and she shall be his wife; because he hath humbled her, he may not put her away all his days.” (Deuteronomy 22:28-29)

“If a damsel that is a virgin be betrothed unto an husband, and a man find her in the city, and lie with her; Then ye shall bring them both out unto the gate of that city, and ye shall stone them with stones that they die; the damsel, because she cried not, being in the city; and the man, because he hath humbled his neighbour's wife: so thou shalt put away evil from among you.” (Deuteronomy 22:23-24)

Do you even care what the Bible says?

 

[praise_yeshua]

You misunderstand.

These things were spoken to the church and to those who were to hear His voice. Obviously, many have not heard.

Those to whom these things were spoken, was to the Bride--of whom all before Christ are as women. Therefore, it is the church that is to submit to their Husband (Christ); the church that has no authority over the Bridegroom; and the church that is to be silent, that only the Holy Spirit sent by Jesus can be heard above the chatter.

That is ridiculous.

Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
Eph 5:33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

 

[Lifelong_sinner]

And yet again, it appears its us reformed vs everyone else.

 

[praise_yeshua]

It's hard to understand submission when one's true interest is in having power.

Much love!

Exactly. That is what the carnal mind craves. Power. Power over another instead of serving one another.

 

[praise_yeshua]

And yet again, it appears its us reformed vs everyone else.

Luther wasn't like you.

 

[ScottA]

Utter nonsense you say?

No, IT IS BIBLICAL!

Have ye not read how Abigail behaved herself towards David BEFORE she was married to him? Bowing down before him and calling him “lord”?

“And when Abigail saw David, she hasted, and lighted off the ass, and fell before David on her face, and bowed herself to the ground, And fell at his feet, and said, Upon me, my lord, upon me let this iniquity be: and let thine handmaid, I pray thee, speak in thine audience, and hear the words of thine handmaid.” (1 Samuel 25:23-24)

The Bible has more than a handful of examples like this. Look at how Ruth behaved herself towards Boaz:

“Then she fell on her face, and bowed herself to the ground, and said unto him, Why have I found grace in thine eyes, that thou shouldest take knowledge of me, seeing I am a stranger? And Boaz answered and said unto her, It hath fully been shewed me, all that thou hast done unto thy mother in law since the death of thine husband: and how thou hast left thy father and thy mother, and the land of thy nativity, and art come unto a people which thou knewest not heretofore. The LORD recompense thy work, and a full reward be given thee of the LORD God of Israel, under whose wings thou art come to trust. Then she said, Let me find favour in thy sight, my lord; for that thou hast comforted me, and for that thou hast spoken friendly unto thine handmaid, though I be not like unto one of thine handmaidens.” (Ruth 2:10-13)

The state of Christianity is in shambles these days. Soo many Bibles and so little readers…

These things were only a foreshadowing, practices, like the law and only until the coming of the Bridegroom. After which the church should have understood that all who are espoused to Christ, are as women before God; and having observer the former practices, should know how to behave before their betrothed, their Husband.

Which is not to say that we do not still have such rolls to portray how we are to be before God--we do; and we would do well not to deviate. But if we have not understood that it is to us all--all the church, the Bride, that these words pertain to...we have not heard His voice, and risk becoming abusive.

 

[praise_yeshua]

These things were only a foreshadowing, practices, like the law and only until the coming of the Bridegroom. After which the church should have understood that all who are espoused to Christ, are as women before God; and having observer the former practices, should know how to behave before their betrothed, their Husband.

Which is not to say that we do not still have such rolls to portray how we are to be before God--we do; and we would do well not to deviate. But if we have not understood that it is to us all--all the church, the Bride, that these words pertain to...we have not heard His voice, and risk becoming abusive.

That is a metaphorical expression. Physically there are still male and female. One is not without the other.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

These things were only a foreshadowing, practices, like the law and only until the coming of the Bridegroom. After which the church should have understood that all who are espoused to Christ, are as women before God; and having observer the former practices, should know how to behave before their betrothed, their Husband.

Which is not to say that we do not still have such rolls to portray how we are to be before God--we do; and we would do well not to deviate. But if we have not understood that it is to us all--all the church, the Bride, that these words pertain to...we have not heard His voice, and risk becoming abusive.

Thats absurd sir.

 

[ScottA]

That is ridiculous.

Eph 5:32 This is a great mystery: but I speak concerning Christ and the church.
Eph 5:33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

Apparently the mystery of marriage as explained by Paul, has escaped you. Or you would not call him "ridiculous" as you have (for I only spoke the same).

 

[ScottA]

That is a metaphorical expression. Physically there are still male and female. One is not without the other.

No...the two become One. But here you are purposing to separate what God has joined together. Woe.

 

[praise_yeshua]

Apparently the mystery of marriage as explained by Paul, has escaped you. Or you would not call him "ridiculous" as you have (for I only spoke the same).

You didn't speak the same. You left out part of it....

Eph 5:33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

 

[ScottA]

Thats absurd sir.

You can tell that to Paul when you see him, he is the one who revealed the age of mystery of marriage. I only received it, and pay it forward.

 

[praise_yeshua]

No...the two become One. But here you are purposing to separate what God has joined together. Woe.

They are both separate and one. I'm not trying to separate anything. I'm recognizing EVERYTHING about them.

 

[ScottA]

You didn't speak the same. You left out part of it....

Eph 5:33 Nevertheless let every one of you in particular so love his wife even as himself; and the wife see that she reverence her husband.

"...as Christ loves the church." Get it?

Apparently not.

 

[praise_yeshua]

You can tell that to Paul when you see him, he is the one who revealed the age of mystery of marriage. I only received it, and pay it forward.

You're not paying anyone but yourself. I suppose you prefer men?

 

[ScottA]

They are both separate and one. I'm not trying to separate anything. I'm recognizing EVERYTHING about them.

And I am just quoting scripture--not my words, but His. But you reject it.

 

[praise_yeshua]

"...as Christ loves the church." Get it?

Apparently not.

So Christ is a female?