Eternal Security

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Heb 13:8

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Does God not want us to produce fruit? Or else we are rejected. Does this sound like a God who is not expecting a return on His investment?

Those who have the indwelling Holy Spirit and His oil produce fruit. Those who are working their way to heaven as in non-osas do not have the fruit, and guess what the sub title is for Ezek 13.

Ezek 13

“ ‘Because they lead my people astray, saying, “Peace,” when there is no peace, and because, when a flimsy wall is built, they cover it with whitewash, 11therefore tell those who cover it with whitewash that it is going to fall. Rain will come in torrents, and I will send hailstones hurtling down, and violent winds will burst forth. 12When the wall collapses, will people not ask you, “Where is the whitewash you covered it with?” 13“ ‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: In my wrath I will unleash a violent wind, and in my anger hailstones and torrents of rain will fall with destructive fury. 14I will tear down the wall you have covered with whitewash and will level it to the ground so that its foundation will be laid bare. When it b falls, you will be destroyed in it; and you will know that I am the Lord. 15So I will pour out my wrath against the wall and against those who covered it with whitewash. I will say to you, “The wall is gone and so are those who whitewashed it, 16those prophets of Israel who prophesied to Jerusalem and saw visions of peace for her when there was no peace, declares the Sovereign Lord.” ’

Matt 7

15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. 24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
 

Heb 13:8

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A better question is...how do we get onto the path of life? Saved is for the end...no one wins a race until the race is finished. We are redeemed to run a race...until the day of Redemption.

No, we're redeemed to trust in the finished work of the cross. Running the race is in reference to rewards and crowns, not loss of salvation. Redemption is the result of our belief, not running a race. Guaranteeing our inheritance until when?? Stop doubting, start believing.

Eph 1:13-14 And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption (apolutrósis) of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

apolutrósis: a release effected by payment of ransom
Original Word: ἀπολύτρωσις, εως, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: apolutrósis
Phonetic Spelling: (ap-ol-oo'-tro-sis)
Definition: a release effected by payment of ransom
Usage: release effected by payment of ransom; redemption, deliverance.
 

Heb 13:8

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All covenants require a two-way agreement and performance. God's part is done....but we need to come into the full provision of Jesus in order to do as we are commanded to do.

The New Covenant is a harder covenant to keep...in the natural strength...but we have access to the power that fulfills it in Him.

It's not about you, teh gift is free remember. Why do you continue to put a price tag on believers in Christ? The New Covenant is actually easier to keep, it is better not worse.

Unchecked Copy Box 2Co 3:6
He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Unchecked Copy Box Heb 8:6
But in fact the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, since the new covenant is established on better promises.

Unchecked Copy Box Heb 9:15
For this reason Christ is the mediator of a new covenant, that those who are called may receive the promised eternal inheritance—now that he has died as a ransom to set them free from the sins committed under the first covenant.

Unchecked Copy Box Heb 12:24
to Jesus the mediator of a new covenant, and to the sprinkled blood that speaks a better word than the blood of Abel.
 

Heb 13:8

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As long as they remain in Christ. Once they renounce him, there remains no more sacrifice for their sins and they will be eternally lost because of their unbelief.

Which they do because it is already finished at the cross. Heb 6:4-6 is actually in reference to maturity in Christ, via Heb 5:14, Heb 6:1. Do you believe God throws His children into hell because of lack of maturity? We are only believing once Jhn 3:16, Eph 1:13-14, Rom 10:9. God bless.
 

Heb 13:8

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Hebrews 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.
Hebrews 3:19 So we see that they could not enter in because of unbelief.
Hebrews 4:6 Seeing therefore it remaineth that some must enter therein, and they to whom it was first preached entered not in because of unbelief:
Hebrews 4:11 Let us labour therefore to enter into that rest, lest any man fall after the same example of unbelief.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Spirit,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
Heb 6:7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
Heb 6:8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

Heb 10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,
Heb 10:27 But a certain fearful looking for of judgment and fiery indignation, which shall devour the adversaries.
Heb 10:28 He that despised Moses' law died without mercy under two or three witnesses:
Heb 10:29 Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?
Heb 10:30 For we know him that hath said, Vengeance belongeth unto me, I will recompense, saith the Lord. And again, The Lord shall judge his people.
Heb 10:31 It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.​

If you read closer, the book of Hebrews is actually an encouragement letter to the believer, partial rapture is a false doctrine gadar...

1Th 4:18 Therefore encourage one another with these words.

Heb 3:13 But encourage one another daily, as long as it is called “Today,” so that none of you may be hardened by sin's deceitfulness.

Heb 10:25 not giving up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but encouraging one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

Heb 12:5 And have you completely forgotten this word of encouragement that addresses you as a father addresses his son? It says, “My son, do not make light of the Lord's discipline, and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,
 

Heb 13:8

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If we don't produce holy fruit...we will be rejected....meaning we have not made the right connection. That means the NC is indeed conditional. It depends on faith.

No, you're already rejected by not believing in the finished work of the cross. The NC is unconditional upon belief.

Jhn 3:18 Whoever believes in him is not condemned, but whoever does not believe stands condemned already because they have not believed in the name of God's one and only Son.
 

gadar perets

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Which they do because it is already finished at the cross. Heb 6:4-6 is actually in reference to maturity in Christ, via Heb 5:14, Heb 6:1. Do you believe God throws His children into hell because of lack of maturity? We are only believing once Jhn 3:16, Eph 1:13-14, Rom 10:9. God bless.
No. He throws them into "hell" because they renounced His Son.
 

gadar perets

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Ahh but He did, John 10:25-30, Eph 1:13-14, Rom 6:3-4, Rom 8:33-39. Many will not believe that it is finished at the cross.
These verses teach us that no one from the outside can snatch us out of the hand of the Father or the Son. It doesn't tell us the person inside their hand cannot exercise his freewill and jump out of their hand by renouncing Yeshua.
 
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Heb 13:8

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These verses teach us that no one from the outside can snatch us out of the hand of the Father or the Son. It doesn't tell us the person inside their hand cannot exercise his freewill and jump out of their hand by renouncing Yeshua.

Read about the "gate" in Jhn 10. Jesus was speaking to the Pharisees gadar. Who is the gate to salvation?
 

Heb 13:8

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I'm not going to derail this thread into a discussion of the supposed rapture. Feel free to start a new thread.

Ok, well take a look at what scripture says about non-osas and works salvation....

Ezek 13

“ ‘Because they lead my people astray, saying, “Peace,” when there is no peace, and because, when a flimsy wall is built, they cover it with whitewash, 11therefore tell those who cover it with whitewash that it is going to fall. Rain will come in torrents, and I will send hailstones hurtling down, and violent winds will burst forth. 12When the wall collapses, will people not ask you, “Where is the whitewash you covered it with?” 13“ ‘Therefore this is what the Sovereign Lord says: In my wrath I will unleash a violent wind, and in my anger hailstones and torrents of rain will fall with destructive fury. 14I will tear down the wall you have covered with whitewash and will level it to the ground so that its foundation will be laid bare. When it b falls, you will be destroyed in it; and you will know that I am the Lord. 15So I will pour out my wrath against the wall and against those who covered it with whitewash. I will say to you, “The wall is gone and so are those who whitewashed it, 16those prophets of Israel who prophesied to Jerusalem and saw visions of peace for her when there was no peace, declares the Sovereign Lord.” ’

Matt 7

15Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves. 16Ye shall know them by their fruits. Do men gather grapes of thorns, or figs of thistles? 17Even so every good tree bringeth forth good fruit; but a corrupt tree bringeth forth evil fruit. 18A good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit, neither can a corrupt tree bring forth good fruit. 19Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire. 20Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them. 21Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. 22Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works? 23And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity. 24Therefore whosoever heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock: 25And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell not: for it was founded upon a rock. 26And every one that heareth these sayings of mine, and doeth them not, shall be likened unto a foolish man, which built his house upon the sand: 27And the rain descended, and the floods came, and the winds blew, and beat upon that house; and it fell: and great was the fall of it.
 

CoreIssue

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Nowhere in the New Testament even hint at someone who was saved becoming unsaved. Nowhere.

Romans 8 is unconditional. God knows who will love him and he predestines them all the way to glorification. No exception.

When born-again our spirits changed. Look at the angels in heaven. They are spirits. They had of time a choice during the war in heaven. There is no indicator of any angel changing their minds afterwards. Those in the pit are going to go into the lake of fire and brimstone. Nothing negative is ever set up about those that did not rebel against God.

I believe our new nature new hearts are such that leaving God is unthinkable. It sure is for me. How about you?