Explaining the Trinity

[Dave L]

Show how my doctrine does not compare with the scriptures. I dare you to pick apart posts #1-#4 of the following thread line-by-line and show how it is not a biblical teaching.

Trinity vs. Tritheism

But you couldn't do it before; so how are you going to do it now?

If you believed in the trinity you would present it and not your own twisted view.

 

[justbyfaith]

Bye-bye now.

Your own view is the one that is twisted, since it amounts to believing in three gods rather than in one Triune God.

I know that I am not mistaken in my view of the Trinity; but as it is written:

Gal 4:29, But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

I am not going to have a long and drawn out exchange with you wherein you assert that I don't believe in the Trinity and I keep asserting that I do.

I am going to say one time that I believe in the Trinity and that you have no authority to say otherwise, since you are not me and therefore you do not know what is going on in my brain.

You should stop and consider the fact that you might be misunderstanding where I am coming from.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

You insist that I am not trinitarian. I know that what I believe in is not disparate from the doctrine of the Trinity.

But I feel that you have some sort of vendetta against me. In one thread, you tried to assert over and over again that I do not believe in the Trinity and that my understanding is false.

DaveL has an issue with every person that doesn't believe exactly as he does. So for what it's worth, it's not a grudge personally against you.

We are not saved by our ability to pass a theology test, including the sub-section "please describe to me the nature of God". Don't let those type of people bother you.

 

[Dave L]

Bye-bye now.

Your own view is the one that is twisted, since it amounts to believing in three gods rather than in one Triune God.

I know that I am not mistaken in my view of the Trinity; but as it is written:

Gal 4:29, But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born after the Spirit, even so it is now.

I am not going to have a long and drawn out exchange with you wherein you assert that I don't believe in the Trinity and I keep asserting that I do.

I am going to say one time that I believe in the Trinity and that you have no authority to say otherwise, since you are not me and therefore you do not know what is going on in my brain.

You should stop and consider the fact that you might be misunderstanding where I am coming from.

Just own up to scripture and all will be fine.

 

[justbyfaith]

Just own up to scripture and all will be fine.

I could say the same to you.

Please quote for me the scripture that I am not owning up to.

The only thing I can think of that might fit, is that you think that the baptism of Jesus means that there are three gods present in that story.

But I would say to you that that story does not contradict my theological view.

If there is something else in scripture that you think that I am not owning up to, then by all means lay it on me.

I certainly don't want to believe in lies. So enlighten me.

But my experience of you is that you will make no such attempt; but will continue to make offensive statements that amount to "You don't believe properly".

But if I don't believe properly, then please, I am asking you to please, show me the error of my way.

You have not been able to do so up to the present moment, one thread was over 60 pages long. So I doubt you are going to be able to do it in this thread.

 

[Dave L]

I could say the same to you.

Please quote for me the scripture that I am not owning up to.

The only thing I can think of that might fit, is that you think that the baptism of Jesus means that there are three gods present in that story.

But I would say to you that that story does not contradict my theological view.

If there is something else in scripture that you think that I am not owning up to, then by all means lay it on me.

I certainly don't want to believe in lies. So enlighten me.

But my experience of you is that you will make no such attempt; but will continue to make offensive statements that amount to "You don't believe properly".

But if I don't believe properly, then please, I am asking you to please, show me the error of my way.

You have not been able to do so up to the present moment, one thread was over 60 pages long. So I doubt you are going to be able to do it in this thread.

I have both history and scripture supporting my view. You have a few misfits the AOG kicked out of their church in the 1900s as heretics supporting your views.

 

[justbyfaith]

I emphasize the Oneness of the Lord but do not deny His threeness.

Those "misfits" have baptism in Jesus' Name on their side. A definite promise of holy scripture that they have the gift of the Holy Ghost.

I think that I will side with those who have the Holy Ghost for that the scripture says so, than those who have no direct promise of scripture saying that they have the Holy Ghost.

The way to life is narrow and few there be that find it according to our Lord and Saviour.

 

[Dave L]

I emphasize the Oneness of the Lord but do not deny His threeness.

Those "misfits" have baptism in Jesus' Name on their side. A definite promise of holy scripture that they have the gift of the Holy Ghost.

I think that I will side with those who have the Holy Ghost for that the scripture says so, than those who have no direct promise of scripture saying that they have the Holy Ghost.

The way to life is narrow and few there be that find it according to our Lord and Saviour.

They are a bunch of hicks the AOG kicked out as heretics. They God baptism wrong too not knowing Jesus Christ = Yahweh = trinity.

 

[Jane_Doe22]

They are a bunch of hicks the AOG kicked out as heretics. They God baptism wrong too not knowing Jesus Christ = Yahweh = trinity.

Again, a person is not saved by passing a theology test.

 

[Kermos]

Again, a person is not saved by passing a theology test.

"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments." Jesus Christ (John 14:15)

"If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me." Jesus Christ (John 14:23-24)

"He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day." Jesus Christ (John 12:48)

"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven [will enter]. Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.' Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock. And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and [yet] it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock. Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell - and great was its fall." Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:21-27)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses the love, authority, importance, relevance, and impact of Lord Jesus' words!

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God." Jesus Christ (John 3:3)

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit." Jesus Christ (John 3:5-8)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses that a person MUST be born of the Spirit to enter into the kingdom of God!

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." Jesus Christ (John 6:29)

And Jesus said to His disciples, "Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
When the disciples heard [this], they were very astonished and said, "Then who can be saved?"
And looking at [them] Jesus said to them, "With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
(Matthew 19:23-26)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses a person faith/belief in Jesus whom the Father has sent is a work of God!

"I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged." Jesus Christ (John 16:7-11)

"I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; [that is] the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, [but] you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you." Jesus Christ (John 14:16-18)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses the ourpouring of God's Holy Spirit in us believers!

"But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God." Jesus Christ (John 3:21)

"Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn [bushes] nor figs from thistles, are they? So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So then, you will know them by their fruits." Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:15-20)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses that we believers exhibit fruit of the Spirit of God (not fruit of man), the fruit is consistent with the words of Lord Jesus the Anointed!

Jane_Doe22, a person is saved by grace through faith/belief, and the very belief/faith is a gift, a work of God not of the person (Ephesians 2:8-9, John 6:29). The Spirit of God reveals the nature of God to the person whom God gives faith/belief.

Lord Jesus Christ expresses
A) "He" for the Father (John 14:16)
B) "He" for the Holy Spirit (John 16:8)
C) "Me" for the Son (John 14:5)

Lord Jesus decisively declared "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30); therefore, three eternal persons are revealed in One Holy God! If a person does not believe this, then the person does not believe the words of Lord Jesus, and that has severe consequences. It is not a theology test, and that is a trite representation - at best. On the other hand, fruit exhibits who is a believer, and that which comes out of the mouth reveals that which is in the heart.

 

[justbyfaith]

They are a bunch of hicks the AOG kicked out as heretics. They God baptism wrong too not knowing Jesus Christ = Yahweh = trinity.

They had no recourse but to label them as heretics; since they couldn't defeat their theology. See Luke 21:15, Acts of the Apostles 6:10.

 

[Dave L]

They had no recourse but to label them as heretics; since they couldn't defeat their theology. See Luke 21:15, Acts of the Apostles 6:10.

Oneness; Numerous books, pamphlets, and essays that tell the story of Pentecostalism in America summarize quite well the particular and peculiar story of Oneness. Though the “New Issue” of the early 1900s has become a rather old issue, long since dismissed as being heretical within Assembly of God ranks, it is still an extant movement in the rich variety of American religious experience. The largest and most influential Oneness group continues to be the UPCI.

Because Oneness rejects the traditional Christian doctrine of the Trinity and invests the »sacrament of baptism with a theology unlike any believed, taught, or confessed within the ranks of orthodoxy throughout the centuries, it must in the last instance be regarded as being a heretical sect by those Christian churches that uphold the ecumenical creeds. As has already been shown, however, its anti-Trinitarianism is not an expression of bias against the deity of Christ. Ironically, the opposite is true. For this reason, some Oneness advocates are more willing to acknowledge Trinitarians as being true Christians than are most Trinitarians willing to return the favor.


Nichols, L. A., Mather, G. A., & Schmidt, A. J. (2006). In Encyclopedic Dictionary of Cults, Sects, and World Religions (pp. 224–225). Grand Rapids, MI: Zondervan.

 

[Helen]

DaveL has an issue with every person that doesn't believe exactly as he does. So for what it's worth, it's not a grudge personally against you.

We are not saved by our ability to pass a theology test, including the sub-section "please describe to me the nature of God". Don't let those type of people bother you.

Agree.

Sadly it seems to be getting worse. Or maybe he just kept it hidden until now.

More and more we are seeing this Site getting dominated by unkind unfriendly people.

If these know-it-alls really cared for God's people they would nurture rather than lecture with legalism and harshness.

 

[Dave L]

Agree.

Sadly it seems to be getting worse. Or maybe he just kept it hidden until now.

More and more we are seeing this Site getting dominated by unkind unfriendly people.

If these know-it-alls really cared for God's people they would nurture rather than lecture with legalism and harshness.

You would have canned Jesus long ago if you can't handle what I'm saying.

 

[Pearl]

Agree.

Sadly it seems to be getting worse. Or maybe he just kept it hidden until now.

More and more we are seeing this Site getting dominated by unkind unfriendly people.

If these know-it-alls really cared for God's people they would nurture rather than lecture with legalism and harshness.

I totally agree.

 

[Dave L]

Again, a person is not saved by passing a theology test.

But if they are saved they will know the truth, which anti-trinitarians do not know.

 

[Helen]

"If you love Me, you will keep My commandments." Jesus Christ (John 14:15)

"If anyone loves Me, he will keep My word; and My Father will love him, and We will come to him and make Our abode with him. He who does not love Me does not keep My words; and the word which you hear is not Mine, but the Father's who sent Me." Jesus Christ (John 14:23-24)

"He who rejects Me and does not receive My sayings, has one who judges him; the word I spoke is what will judge him at the last day." Jesus Christ (John 12:48)

"Not everyone who says to Me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven [will enter]. Many will say to Me on that day, 'Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many miracles?' And then I will declare to them, 'I never knew you; DEPART FROM ME, YOU WHO PRACTICE LAWLESSNESS.' Therefore everyone who hears these words of Mine and acts on them, may be compared to a wise man who built his house on the rock. And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and [yet] it did not fall, for it had been founded on the rock. Everyone who hears these words of Mine and does not act on them, will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. The rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and slammed against that house; and it fell - and great was its fall." Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:21-27)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses the love, authority, importance, relevance, and impact of Lord Jesus' words!

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God." Jesus Christ (John 3:3)

"Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Do not be amazed that I said to you, 'You must be born again.' The wind blows where it wishes and you hear the sound of it, but do not know where it comes from and where it is going; so is everyone who is born of the Spirit." Jesus Christ (John 3:5-8)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses that a person MUST be born of the Spirit to enter into the kingdom of God!

"This is the work of God, that you believe in Him whom He has sent." Jesus Christ (John 6:29)

And Jesus said to His disciples, "Truly I say to you, it is hard for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven. Again I say to you, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle, than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
When the disciples heard [this], they were very astonished and said, "Then who can be saved?"
And looking at [them] Jesus said to them, "With people this is impossible, but with God all things are possible."
(Matthew 19:23-26)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses a person faith/belief in Jesus whom the Father has sent is a work of God!

"I tell you the truth, it is to your advantage that I go away; for if I do not go away, the Helper will not come to you; but if I go, I will send Him to you. And He, when He comes, will convict the world concerning sin and righteousness and judgment; concerning sin, because they do not believe in Me; and concerning righteousness, because I go to the Father and you no longer see Me; and concerning judgment, because the ruler of this world has been judged." Jesus Christ (John 16:7-11)

"I will ask the Father, and He will give you another Helper, that He may be with you forever; [that is] the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive, because it does not see Him or know Him, [but] you know Him because He abides with you and will be in you. I will not leave you as orphans; I will come to you." Jesus Christ (John 14:16-18)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses the ourpouring of God's Holy Spirit in us believers!

"But he who practices the truth comes to the Light, so that his deeds may be manifested as having been wrought in God." Jesus Christ (John 3:21)

"Beware of the false prophets, who come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Grapes are not gathered from thorn [bushes] nor figs from thistles, are they? So every good tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears bad fruit. A good tree cannot produce bad fruit, nor can a bad tree produce good fruit. Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. So then, you will know them by their fruits." Jesus Christ (Matthew 7:15-20)

God incarnate, Jesus Christ, expresses that we believers exhibit fruit of the Spirit of God (not fruit of man), the fruit is consistent with the words of Lord Jesus the Anointed!

Jane_Doe22, a person is saved by grace through faith/belief, and the very belief/faith is a gift, a work of God not of the person (Ephesians 2:8-9, John 6:29). The Spirit of God reveals the nature of God to the person whom God gives faith/belief.

Lord Jesus Christ expresses
A) "He" for the Father (John 14:16)
B) "He" for the Holy Spirit (John 16:8)
C) "Me" for the Son (John 14:5)

Lord Jesus decisively declared "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30); therefore, three eternal persons are revealed in One Holy God! If a person does not believe this, then the person does not believe the words of Lord Jesus, and that has severe consequences. It is not a theology test, and that is a trite representation - at best. On the other hand, fruit exhibits who is a believer, and that which comes out of the mouth reveals that which is in the heart.

Is that all you can do...just keep copying and pasting repetitive posts!!

If you check the rules of the site I think you will read that repetitive posting is classed as spamming..

 

[Helen]

@Kermos

You have posted the same post three times...one more and we will start reporting your spamming to the Admins.

 

[justbyfaith]

B) "He" for the Holy Spirit (John 16:8)

"I" for the Holy Spirit (John 14:17-18).

 

[Dave L]

@Kermos

You have posted the same post three times...one more and we will start reporting your spamming to the Admins.

Isn't it better to "ignore" than to censor?