Forgiveness can only be for Past Sinning.

[quietthinker]

Forgiveness can only be for Past Sinning....so you say

Sooo, you say one is forgiven for yesterday's sins, ie, past sins but today you sin again which you say is not forgiven yet tomorrow makes today yesterday which will then qualify as past for which you say will be forgiven. Have I got that right?

 

[Robert Gwin]

Reason alone says that no one can be forgiven for something not done, nor is being done at present. No harm, no foul.

The only things we can be forgiven of rightly, is what was done by us to God and/or man.

Scripture teaches such common sense, that only a sin committed against God or man, needs and can be forgiven, by God or man.

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God. (Rom 3:25)

1. Remission is forgiveness of sins that are past, which is only past sinning: sin that has been committed in the past, whether a moment ago or anytime before.

The LORD is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet. (Nahum 1:3)

2. This Scripture applies to present sinning, Which is by them who are doing evil and are presently wicked in sight of God. God does not at all acquit, forgive, remit the guilty while sinning against Himself.

A moment ago, yes, but not while doing so.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. (1 John 1)

The Scripture says two things: if we are now confessing our sins (homologomen), then He will forgive our sinning.

The confession is present time only, not future, and so forgiveness can only be for the present, not the future.

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

3. Confession is godly sorrow to repent, and so forgiveness is only for sins being confessed from the heart to repent of.

This excludes any present sinning still going on with the devil at any time.

Not a moment ago, nor any time before, and certainly not yet committed in future.

Only past sinning can be forgiven by God, which is only when the sinning is being confessed with godly sorrow to repent thereof.

No wicked person while sinning with the devil, can possibly be acquitted and forgiven by Jesus Christ.

That is why it is important to continue to ask for forgiveness, not for the sins we have yet committed, but those we have committed after our last petition for forgiveness

 

[robert derrick]

No apologies...but I couldn't read all that blether.

No apology needed. Nothing I write is for you anymore, having proven yourself incorrectable. Trying to get a straight answer out of you is like trying to get a yes or no from a gypsy's crystal ball.

But I see you don't understand just how time and eternity converge.

No, I'm not into space-time convergence, 4th dimensions, nor alternative realities. Although I did really enjoy the Twilight Zone.

You're stuff has too much mystery-shadows enfolding on themselves.

I don't want you people to go away, because you are still useful for discovering more OSAS nuts and bolts in your armor. I now just enjoy exposing them what they are, without all the fluffy celebratory grace, and new revolutionary jargonese.

So keep it coming. I really have missed your particular brand in a sort of funsy-weird way.

 

[robert derrick]

What is OFAF ? I know what OSAS stands for eventhough it is NOT backed by or in the word. Those that believe such, cherry pick the word. Few ever give scripture in context !

Once Forgiven Always Forgiven.

The truth is that all past sins need not be itemized, and are all forgiven forever, when first confessing to Christ.

Also. if any man does confess with godly sorrow, then Jesus will always the forgive him immediately.

But once we are being saved, then we must confess any future sinning we may do against our Lord, in order to be forgiven and saved from spiritual death.

The OSAS version is like their salvation, Once they are forgiven of all past sins, they are also forgiven of any present and future sinning. (And they will certainly be sinning today and tomorrow, because they also have an 'impossibility' clause with their salvation, where it is not possible not to be sinning against God at any given time on earth)

And so, OSAS teaches Once for all saved forever, and Once for all forgiven of all sinning past, present, and future.

The teaching of course is to have no accountability for sinning in the flesh. The soul is no more judged for it, but only that hapless bad ol' body of theirs.

I know. Childishly dystopian. But Scripture never accused mystery Babylon of making any sense.

"It's not my fault Judge! It's that sorry low life body of mine!!"

"No problem. That criminal body of yours is going to jail. Whether you choose to join it or not, is entirely up to you. I have no say in such matters."

I have characterized their 'non-responsibility clause' of OSAS in this way several times, and they have never disagreed with it's accuracy.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I often wonder if the purpose for starting a thread had underlying motives to it. Meaning do you really want to discuss it or argue it?
2 Timothy 2 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
¹⁴ Of these things put them in remembrance, charging them before the Lord that they strive not about words to no profit, but to the subverting of the hearers.
¹⁵ Study to shew thyself approved unto God, a workman that needeth not to be ashamed, rightly dividing the word of truth.
¹⁶ But shun profane and vain babblings: for they will increase unto more ungodliness.
…
²³ But foolish and unlearned questions avoid, knowing that they do gender strifes.

1 Timothy 6 (KJV)
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯
³ If any man teach otherwise, and consent not to wholesome words, even the words of our Lord Jesus Christ, and to the doctrine which is according to godliness;
⁴ He is proud, knowing nothing, but doting about questions and strifes of words, whereof cometh envy, strife, railings, evil surmisings,
⁵ Perverse disputings of men of corrupt minds, and destitute of the truth, supposing that gain is godliness: from such withdraw thyself.

These are just a few scriptures about arguments and disputes over discussions that profits no one.
Page after page, thread after thread....except for the prayer, Praise, testimony, and fellowship forums....tend to end up in conflict and leading to strife and division.
It's time we join together in singleness of faith...in one mind and one accord...so that we may see the kingdom of God within ourselves.

 

[robert derrick]

All believers are being sanctified, all time means all time not just the present but past and future.

You can think you are already living out your future, but that is Twilight Zone stuff.

Go to now, ye that say, To day or to morrow we will go into such a city, and continue there a year, and buy and sell, and get gain: Whereas ye know not what shall be on the morrow.

OSAS, OFAF, and now Once Sanctified Always Sanctified is the presumption of people who trust in their own believes and doctrine only. They do not consider any accountability for themselves in the future.

14because by a single offering He has made perfect for all time those who are being sanctified.

Being is the operative word, which means now at this time.

This Scripture proves that only now is all that matters to God pertaining to salvation, sanctification,a nd justification with Him. Not yeterday which is past, nor tomorrow that may not come.

If we are NOW forgiven, saved, sanctified in Christ in spirit and in flesh, then God considers us forever so, since one day with Him is as a thousand years.

But if we are not NOW forgiven and saved in Christ, because we are NOW sinning against Him with the devil, then God considers us to be so forever, since yesterday's righteousness is forgotten by Him, and He does not guarantee a tomorrow for us to repent and be forgiven and saved by His Son.

So long as NOW remains the same, then it will be so tomorrow, whether it be for good or evil, saved or unsaved, forgiven or condemned.

And so, if we are forgiven and saved and sanctified in Christ NOW by His grace, the so long as we are remaining faithful to Him, then we are remaining forgiven and sanctified in Him.

The out-of-time theology of having already been saved, forgiven, and sanctified in the future, is spiritual delusion of them, that think they are no longer spiritually accountable for what their bodies are doing and will do on earth.

No man sinning against God NOW with the devil is in Christ, Neither being saved, forgiven, nor sanctified by Him. Not here and not now. Perhaps tomorrow by His mercy to repent, if tomorrow comes, but certainly not now.

And so, it is always best just not to be doing evil, but if we are sinning with the devil, then it is best to stop and confess now, and so be forgiven of anything done a moment ago.

For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.

 

[Behold]

If you sin how long does it take for you to confess it?

You confessed it when Jesus paid for it all on the day God forgave you.

The blood of Jesus, is God's Blood.
Its an eternal one time sacrifice for sin.... Its offered to the WORLD. John 3:16
It has that POWER to Eternally Forgive....... and from 2000 ago, till today, and tomorrow and beyond, its still forgiving sinners when they come to the Cross, and its already forgiven all sin of those who have become born again.

Romans 4:8, tells the born again, that God does not charge sin to them, and that this is to be BLESSED..
And isn't it?

And a born again babe in Christ says...>"well, how can God not charge my sin to me, anymore"???

A.) Because your sin has been placed on Jesus, and He has died for them all.

B.) God can't charge sin to the born again, as He has already JUDGED JESUS ON THE CROSS FOR THEM...

"So where are my sins"..

C.) JESUS BECAME SIN....... not some......not a few.......but "SIN". 2 Corinthians 5:21 And if you are born again, you now have the Righteousness of Christ. You have been "made righteous", and if you weren't you would not be a son or daughter of God, today.

"well what about 1 John 1:9. """"

That is not for you if you are born again.... that is for the unbelievers.

1 John 3:9 is for you, if you are born again.

 

[robert derrick]

I often wonder if the purpose for starting a thread had underlying motives to it. Meaning do you really want to discuss it or argue it?

On this thread I have posted exactly what I believe and live by according to the Scriptures I provide. It is a perfectly legitimate thread for the Bible Study forum.

And then others have come out to denounce it, as well as me as teaching a cult, without even addressing points I make. I then defend what I teach, and I am the one denounced as only wanting to argue with them?? Seriously?

You moderators need to get together and decide exactly what your are looking for on the Bible Study forum.

These are just a few scriptures about arguments and disputes over discussions that profits no one.
Page after page, thread after thread....except for the prayer, Praise, testimony, and fellowship forums....tend to end up in conflict and leading to strife and division.
It's time we join together in singleness of faith...in one mind and one accord...so that we may see the kingdom of God within ourselves.

I completely agree. I have called for in private, and now do so publicly with you. I say you enforce an agreement free Bible Study forum and leave personal disputes to the Debate Forum.

Rule of Bible Study Forum:
1. Only teach what we believe Scripture is saying.
2. Do not personally respond to, nor quote anyone, to disagree with them, or to try and change their opinion.
3. Only personally respond to anyone, or quote them, to either agree, or to ask for clarification, or for more Scriptural proof.

Until you make this rule for the Bible Study forum, then there will never be a separation from agreeable study and debate with personal disputes.

I would be more than glad to properly participate in a Bible Study forum like that.

However, so far as whether disputing the Scriptures is godly or not, it is exactly what the apostles did in private and publicly, beginning with Jesus, which is why the rulers had Him crucified:

Jesus answered and said unto them, Ye do err, not knowing the scriptures, nor the power of God.

Then there arose certain of the synagogue, which is called the synagogue of the Libertines, and Cyrenians, and Alexandrians, and of them of Cilicia and of Asia, disputing with Stephen.

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

And he went into the synagogue, and spake boldly for the space of three months, disputing and persuading the things concerning the kingdom of God.

But when divers were hardened, and believed not, but spake evil of that way before the multitude, he departed from them, and separated the disciples, disputing daily in the school of one Tyrannus.

They were disputing with one another and others, as to exactly what Scripture teaches. Which is every Christian's right to do, unless we want to join a cult, where no such 'disagreement' is allowed.

I will be looking for a reply to my suggestion for the Bible Study thread. In the meantime, if anyone comes out to specifically disagree with anything I teach, I will defend it. And if that means exposing what they say as false according to Scripture, so be it.

What you ought be doing is telling others, that if they get offended by being argued with, then they should not be disagreeing with anyone else, but only post what they believe.

If someone posts something independently of what they believe on this Bible Study forum. I do not argue with them. But if they are addressing it personally to me, then I either agree and add to it with more Scripture, or I disagree and show by Scripture why.

 

[ScottA]

I see you don't understand just how time and eternity converge.

No, I'm not into space-time convergence, 4th dimensions, nor alternative realities. Although I did really enjoy the Twilight Zone.

You're stuff has too much mystery-shadows enfolding on themselves.

There is only one who doesn't like Revelation.

 

[robert derrick]

There is only one who doesn't like Revelation.

There is only one Revelation I like and love. Jesus' written by John.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John:

It doesn't include any new ones not already confirmed by Scripture on paper, written by old flesh and blood prophets and apostles of Jesus Christ.

 

[Heart2Soul]

On this thread I have posted exactly what I believe and live by according to the Scriptures I provide. It is a perfectly legitimate thread for the Bible Study forum.

Yes this is a Bible Study forum...not a debate forum. And you are not studying the Bible but rather are debating with others who post contrary to your belief and vice-versa.
But will be happy to move it to a debate forum.

 

[robert derrick]

Sooo, you say one is forgiven for yesterday's sins, ie, past sins but today you sin again which you say is not forgiven yet tomorrow makes today yesterday which will then qualify as past for which you say will be forgiven. Have I got that right?

Thanks for the question.

While we are sinning, we cannot be forgiven for sinning, except we come to our senses as the prodigal, and confess to repent and be forgiven, even if we were sinning one moment ago. Jesus is faithful and just to forgive us completely of any sin that is now in the past.

If this is the case I cannot help but conclude that all your barking amounts to muddle headedness.....and I'm not saying that disrespectfully.

I've reported you for personal insult. They can decide.

 

[robert derrick]

Yes this is a Bible Study forum...not a debate forum. And you are not studying the Bible but rather are debating with others who post contrary to your belief and vice-versa.
But will be happy to move it to a debate forum.

So, the rule I wanted is confirmed by you. No one on the bible study forum can personally disagree with what someone else is teaching. We can independently post what we believe, even if it is not in agreement with someone, but we do not post a contrary and personal disagreement.

No back and forth disputes and arguments. We can either agree with others, or ask for clarification, or just teach what they believe independently without objecting to someone else's posting.

I will now start warning and/or reporting anyone that posts a personal disagreement with me on the bible study forum, and I will not get into a personal disagreement with anyone else.

If we want to argue back and forth, which is fine, then we must only do so on the debate forum.

Thanks, I'm all for it. With your help, we can truly make this bible study forum exactly that: argument free. We only seek to teach what we believe, and also to learn exactly what others are trying to teach. If we disagree, we keep it to ourselves and move on.

 

[robert derrick]

A person can commit a sin in word, thought or deed. I would venture to say there are many who have thought evil thoughts towards someone without repenting of them.
The Holy Spirit has brought past thoughts to my remembrance that I needed to repent of...
So sin, whenever it is committed, needs to be repented of and ask forgiveness for. It's a daily walk we walk....and daily the opportunity to sin comes before us...I have to repent daily of the evil thoughts I have towards a drivers on the highway....if only I could find a way not to have to get on that highway everyday... (deleting all my evil thoughts, amen!)

I agree in the need to throw away such thoughts, but are you saying having such thoughts appear in the mind is sinning?

Those are only the tempting thoughts the devil throws at every soul on earth, especially the people of God. They are thoughts we are not to receive nor act on. Having a clean mind and pure heart is not walking around with airy lovely thoughts all the time like some New Age divine.

Jesus had every such unwanted unrighteous ungodly thought the devil has ever thrown, and so He was tempted in all points like all men. The devil was shooting fiery darts at Jesus on the cross to revile them, that were reviling Him. But yet without doing so and sinning against God nor man.

Having a sinful thought is temptation, not sinning. Taking those thoughts to heart is to then lust for them and be enticed.

The highway you are yearning for, is the resurrection of the body, where your renewed and cleansed mind of Christ will be perfected, and as He is on the throne in heaven, you will never so much as think anything unwanted, unclean, unlovely, ungodly, untrue...thoughts, intents, nor imaginations. That is the indeed the glorious liberty and hope waiting to be manifested in the children of God forever.

Until then, we must endure such tempting thoughts for today, and remain pure in heart, and let tomorrow take care for itself:

Take therefore no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.

Those who teach having tempting thoughts is sinning, are teaching a perfectionism that Jesus never lived and does not command nor teach to His body today.

And I have been practicing the argument free Bible study forum, as here. I agree with what you were saying and only offer additional clarity on how to succeed in it, without sinning, daily.

 

[quietthinker]

Thanks for the question.

While we are sinning, we cannot be forgiven for sinning, except we come to our senses as the prodigal, and confess to repent and be forgiven, even if we were sinning one moment ago. Jesus is faithful and just to forgive us completely of any sin that is now in the past.



I've reported you for personal insult. They can decide.

I guess you want to control my conclusions!

 

[robert derrick]

I guess you want to control my conclusions!

I no longer argue with people on the study forum. You asked, and I gave an answer.

If you want me to clarify more, I'd be glad to do so. If you want to argue, you can go private with me, or take it to be the debate forum.

Thanks.

 

[Heart2Soul]

I agree in the need to throw away such thoughts, but are you saying having such thoughts appear in the mind is sinning?

I know that the temptation to sin is processed in our mind and if we don't cast it down immediately then it begins to consume your thoughts until it enters your heart and you give in to the temptation. ...that's why it is so important to guard what you allow your mind to dwell on...put on the mind of Christ...be Christ-minded...

 

[Bob Estey]

Reason alone says that no one can be forgiven for something not done, nor is being done at present. No harm, no foul.

The only things we can be forgiven of rightly, is what was done by us to God and/or man.

Scripture teaches such common sense, that only a sin committed against God or man, needs and can be forgiven, by God or man.

Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God. (Rom 3:25)

1. Remission is forgiveness of sins that are past, which is only past sinning: sin that has been committed in the past, whether a moment ago or anytime before.

The LORD is slow to anger, and great in power, and will not at all acquit the wicked: the LORD hath his way in the whirlwind and in the storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet. (Nahum 1:3)

2. This Scripture applies to present sinning, Which is by them who are doing evil and are presently wicked in sight of God. God does not at all acquit, forgive, remit the guilty while sinning against Himself.

A moment ago, yes, but not while doing so.

If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. (1 John 1)

The Scripture says two things: if we are now confessing our sins (homologomen), then He will forgive our sinning.

The confession is present time only, not future, and so forgiveness can only be for the present, not the future.

For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the sorrow of the world worketh death.

3. Confession is godly sorrow to repent, and so forgiveness is only for sins being confessed from the heart to repent of.

This excludes any present sinning still going on with the devil at any time.

Not a moment ago, nor any time before, and certainly not yet committed in future.

Only past sinning can be forgiven by God, which is only when the sinning is being confessed with godly sorrow to repent thereof.

No wicked person while sinning with the devil, can possibly be acquitted and forgiven by Jesus Christ.

If I believe my future sins are already forgiven, there isn't much incentive for me to stop sinning, is there?

 

[L.A.M.B.]

I have decided to obey what @Heart2Soul has posted about above.

Everything comes at us to destroy our peace. We are the only one, with the HOLY SPIRIT who can control what we let into our spirit to tear it down or lift it up.

No longer will I engage in trying to correct the heretical falsehoods ppl have been taught and INDOCTRINATED into. If I respond it will be to try and edify or encourage by the word of God.

Nothing here is worth being in bondage to. These arguments, disputes, debates ect. take us CAPTIVE instead of us using the word to take vain thoughts, reckless words, pleading engaments, any device we may use to convince another of the word.

 

[Skovand1075]

Seems like forgiveness occurs lost resurrection. We die and are all dead. Then everyone, the righteous and wicked are resurrected. There is a judgement. Those whose names are in the book of life are saved. It’s at that moment you’re saved from judgement. Those not found are destroyed in hell.