Have you understood all this

[Keraz]

After explaining to His disciples the parables of the Kingdom of Heaven, Jesus asked them; Have you understood all this? Matthew 13:51 and they answered – Yes.

It was a simple sounding question, but actually He was asking the most profound question of the ages.. Jesus was asking if they knew that, in Gods eyes there are two and only two – classes of people in the world: Those that accept God and His Laws:

wheat, buried treasure, pearls and good fish - and the children of Satan: tares, weeds and worthless fish.

Matthew 13:37-42... He replied; The sower of the good seed is the Son of Man.
The field is the world, the good seed stands for the children of the Kingdom and the weeds, the children of the evil one.
The enemy who sowed the weeds is the devil The harvest is the end of time and the reapers are angels.

As the weeds are gathered up and burnt at the end of the age, the Son of Man will rid His Kingdom of every cause of sin and all whose deeds are evil. These will be thrown into the blazing furnace, where there will be much wailing and sorrow.

Matthew 13:43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the Kingdom of their Father If you have ears, then hear.


Just a speculation – but Jesus gave four parables about who will and who will not inherit the Kingdom;

1/ The wheat and the weeds – Messianic Jews and apostate Jews, the House of Judah.

2/ The buried treasure – The born again Christians who are also the House of Israel.

3/ A pearl of great value – A person who dedicates their life to the Lord.

4/ The good and worthless fish – Gentile peoples, believers and unbelievers.


Luke 6:20 Blessed are you who are in need; the Kingdom of God is yours.
Reference, Revised English Bible.


“There are two kinds of people – those who say to God: Thy will be done, and those to whom God says “all right, then, have it your way” C.S. Lewis

 

[Davy]

After explaining to His disciples the parables of the Kingdom of Heaven, Jesus asked them; Have you understood all this? Matthew 13:51 and they answered – Yes.

It was a simple sounding question, but actually He was asking the most profound question of the ages.. Jesus was asking if they knew that, in Gods eyes there are two and only two – classes of people in the world: Those that accept God and His Laws:

wheat, buried treasure, pearls and good fish - and the children of Satan: tares, weeds and worthless fish.

Matthew 13:37-42... He replied; The sower of the good seed is the Son of Man.
The field is the world, the good seed stands for the children of the Kingdom and the weeds, the children of the evil one.
The enemy who sowed the weeds is the devil The harvest is the end of time and the reapers are angels.

As the weeds are gathered up and burnt at the end of the age, the Son of Man will rid His Kingdom of every cause of sin and all whose deeds are evil. These will be thrown into the blazing furnace, where there will be much wailing and sorrow.

Matthew 13:43 Then the righteous will shine like the sun in the Kingdom of their Father If you have ears, then hear.


Just a speculation – but Jesus gave four parables about who will and who will not inherit the Kingdom;

1/ The wheat and the weeds – Messianic Jews and apostate Jews, the House of Judah.

2/ The buried treasure – The born again Christians who are also the House of Israel.

3/ A pearl of great value – A person who dedicates their life to the Lord.

4/ The good and worthless fish – Gentile peoples, believers and unbelievers.


Luke 6:20 Blessed are you who are in need; the Kingdom of God is yours.
Reference, Revised English Bible.


“There are two kinds of people – those who say to God: Thy will be done, and those to whom God says “all right, then, have it your way” C.S. Lewis

Your interpretations of the parables are quite a bit skewed.

1. parable of the 'tares of the field' -
wheat = "children of the kingdom" (Christ's future Kingdom of both believing Israelites and believing Gentiles).
tares = the devil's children; the crept in unawares of the Book of Jude; the brute beasts; the wicked; especially the Canaanites and followers of Cain; the "synagogue of Satan" (i.e., false Jews that crept in among Israel long ago from the nations of Canaan).

2. the treasure hid in a field - it's actually about Christ's Salvation and Kingdom as the Treasure, that when one finds it (is born again in Christ), takes it and hides it, and then sells all he has to buy that field, the treasure is put above all else.

3. the pearl of great price - like the parable of the treasure. The pearl represents Christ's Salvation and Kingdom. One who finds the pearl then sells all he has to buy it.


4. the parable of the kingdom of heaven like a net -
good fish = the children of the kingdom, i.e., Christ's Church of both believing Israelite believing Gentile
bad fish = the wicked, like the tares

 

[Keraz]

Your interpretations of the parables are quite a bit skewed.

Actually we do agree on the basic meaning of those parables.
My point in the OP, was to prove that there is but two types of peoples in God's eyes; those who love Him, keep His Commandments and are born again in Jesus and those who say there is no God, who ignore the Commandments and reject Jesus.
There is no 'third party' that is: the Jews, a wrong idea made just to support the 'rapture' theory.

 

[Stranger]

Actually we do agree on the basic meaning of those parables.
My point in the OP, was to prove that there is but two types of peoples in God's eyes; those who love Him, keep His Commandments and are born again in Jesus and those who say there is no God, who ignore the Commandments and reject Jesus.
There is no 'third party' that is: the Jews, a wrong idea made just to support the 'rapture' theory.

Ah yes. Here is the real reason for your thread. "There is no third party...the Jews"

Stranger

 

[Keraz]

Ah yes. Here is the real reason for your thread. "There is no third party...the Jews"

Stranger

God will protect and save His true Israelites. His Promises to them will not fail.
But the Jewish State of Israel, the usurpers of Israel, those who say they are Jews, but are not, the State founded on communist principals, the people who allow anyone who accepts Judaism to immigrate, but refuses any Christian, the people who rely on their armed forces to save them, THEY will be judged and punished. Only a remnant will survive. Isaiah 29:1-4, Romans 9:27, +

 

[Stranger]

God will protect and save His true Israelites. His Promises to them will not fail.
But the Jewish State of Israel, the usurpers of Israel, those who say they are Jews, but are not, the State founded on communist principals, the people who allow anyone who accepts Judaism to immigrate, but refuses any Christian, the people who rely on their armed forces to save them, THEY will be judged and punished. Only a remnant will survive. Isaiah 29:1-4, Romans 9:27, +

Give me the historical point, verified in Scripture, where Israel in the Old Testament no longer meant Israel.

Stranger

 

[Keraz]

Give me the historical point, verified in Scripture, where Israel in the Old Testament no longer meant Israel.

Stranger

There are OT scriptures that say how foreigners joined the Israelites and many prophesies pertain to a people included into ethnic Israel. My faithful people; those ransomed of the Lord, etc. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10
But it is ever since Jesus came and offered Salvation to all who would accept it, John 3:16, that the Israel of God became a people identified by faith and ethnicity is no longer of any consequence. Ephesians 2:11-18 is undeniable and refutes any ideas that Jewish Israel still has a special place to God.

I know this truth messes up your beliefs; face facts; the 'rapture to heaven' of the Church is false teaching, a lie that many have fallen for, to their disgrace. You just may have enough time to renounce it and be ready for what God actually does plan for His people.

 

[Stranger]

There are OT scriptures that say how foreigners joined the Israelites and many prophesies pertain to a people included into ethnic Israel. My faithful people; those ransomed of the Lord, etc. Ezekiel 34:11-16, Isaiah 35:1-10
But it is ever since Jesus came and offered Salvation to all who would accept it, John 3:16, that the Israel of God became a people identified by faith and ethnicity is no longer of any consequence. Ephesians 2:11-18 is undeniable and refutes any ideas that Jewish Israel still has a special place to God.

I know this truth messes up your beliefs; face facts; the 'rapture to heaven' of the Church is false teaching, a lie that many have fallen for, to their disgrace. You just may have enough time to renounce it and be ready for what God actually does plan for His people.

Foreigners who joined Israel became part of Israel. This did not remove Israel from being Israel. Why didn't Israel cease being special to God then when the foreigners joined themselves to Israel?

But, that which is addressed to Israel in the Old Testament is addressed to Israel. Correct?

I have no problem with (Eph. 2:11-18). The Church is composed of both Jew and Gentile. So? That doesn't refute any idea that God still has plans for Israel. That doesn't make one a Jew who now follows Christ. That doesn't make the Church the true Israel.

Stranger

 

[Keraz]

That doesn't make one a Jew who now follows Christ. That doesn't make the Church the true Israel.

Actually it DOES. Romans 2:29, Galatians 3:26-29 & 6:14-16

Who is the true Israel of God?
Who are the legitimate heirs of God’s promises? It cannot be just those who claim to be descendants of Jacob, such as the citizens of the modern State of Israel, or the many people groups who assert they are the ‘lost tribes’, etc.
The true Israelites of God are those individuals who meet the Covenant conditions, who by belief in God and in their moral and ethical behavior, prove they belong to Him. 1 Peter 2:9-10

It was always possible for foreigners to become an Israelite, therefore parentage and actual descent is irrelevant:
Leviticus 19:33-34…foreigners are to be treated as native born among you…..
Isaiah 56:1-8….foreigners who give their allegiance to Me will be acceptable in My House of Prayer…..I shall add them to those who are already gathered.

Jesus said: Other sheep I must gather….John 19:16 and the Apostles made it clear that it is only by righteousness and faith that anyone is accepted into the House of Israel. Romans 9:6-9, Galatians 3:26-29, Ephesians 2:11-18

So to determine who qualifies as an Israelite person of God, we know:

1/ They cannot be determined by natural descent from Abraham, or more specifically, from Jacob. There are no proofs of ancestry back to Abraham extant today.

2/ They cannot become an Israelite by conversion to Judaism.

3/ Any person can become an Israelite of God by faith in Him, obedience to His Laws and the acceptance of the atoning sacrifice of Jesus. John 3:16-17


Jesus is the ‘root and tree trunk’ of Israel. Paul said that the promises made to Abraham were to one Person and they are all ‘yes’ in Christ. Galatians 3:16, 2 Corinthians 1:20
So now all we Christians, in Christ as His friends and working with Him, are now the branches of the ‘olive tree’ of the true Israel.

Jews have been cut off, but can be grafted back, as individual Christian believers. Bible prophecy proves that only a remnant will do that. Ezekiel 6:1-14, Zechariah 13:7-9, Romans 9:27

WE Christians are all true born again people from every tribe, race, nation and language. Romans 2:28-29, Revelation 5:9-10, Isaiah 56:1-8


This truth that: all righteous Christians are the Israel of God, Galatians 6:16, destroys the false ‘rapture to heaven’ theory. We will never go to live in heaven, but eventually heaven comes down to earth. Revelation 20:4

The prophesies about Judah, the Jewish people, are clear: only a remnant will survive. Isaiah 6:13, Luke 19:27. Romans 9:27 They have set up their own religion and refuse to acknowledge Jesus. Romans 10:1-4

It will be all the true, righteous Christian people that will inherit the holy Land and they are the people who will display God’s glory and be His witnesses to the nations, in the last few years before Jesus Returns. Ezekiel 39:21-29, Isaiah 66:18b-21, Isaiah 49:8-13, Ephesians 1:11, Romans 9:24-26
Ref: logostelos.info

 

[Enoch111]

This truth that: all righteous Christians are the Israel of God...

Until the Rapture, after which the redeemed and restored kingdom of Israel under Christ will be established on earth. The Church will remain in the New Jerusalem in Heaven (contrary to your opinion).

 

[Stranger]

Actually it DOES. Romans 2:29, Galatians 3:26-29 & 6:14-16

Who is the true Israel of God?
Who are the legitimate heirs of God’s promises? It cannot be just those who claim to be descendants of Jacob, such as the citizens of the modern State of Israel, or the many people groups who assert they are the ‘lost tribes’, etc.
The true Israelites of God are those individuals who meet the Covenant conditions, who by belief in God and in their moral and ethical behavior, prove they belong to Him. 1 Peter 2:9-10

It was always possible for foreigners to become an Israelite, therefore parentage and actual descent is irrelevant:
Leviticus 19:33-34…foreigners are to be treated as native born among you…..
Isaiah 56:1-8….foreigners who give their allegiance to Me will be acceptable in My House of Prayer…..I shall add them to those who are already gathered.

Jesus said: Other sheep I must gather….John 19:16 and the Apostles made it clear that it is only by righteousness and faith that anyone is accepted into the House of Israel. Romans 9:6-9, Galatians 3:26-29, Ephesians 2:11-18

So to determine who qualifies as an Israelite person of God, we know:

1/ They cannot be determined by natural descent from Abraham, or more specifically, from Jacob. There are no proofs of ancestry back to Abraham extant today.

2/ They cannot become an Israelite by conversion to Judaism.

3/ Any person can become an Israelite of God by faith in Him, obedience to His Laws and the acceptance of the atoning sacrifice of Jesus. John 3:16-17


Jesus is the ‘root and tree trunk’ of Israel. Paul said that the promises made to Abraham were to one Person and they are all ‘yes’ in Christ. Galatians 3:16, 2 Corinthians 1:20
So now all we Christians, in Christ as His friends and working with Him, are now the branches of the ‘olive tree’ of the true Israel.

Jews have been cut off, but can be grafted back, as individual Christian believers. Bible prophecy proves that only a remnant will do that. Ezekiel 6:1-14, Zechariah 13:7-9, Romans 9:27

WE Christians are all true born again people from every tribe, race, nation and language. Romans 2:28-29, Revelation 5:9-10, Isaiah 56:1-8


This truth that: all righteous Christians are the Israel of God, Galatians 6:16, destroys the false ‘rapture to heaven’ theory. We will never go to live in heaven, but eventually heaven comes down to earth. Revelation 20:4

The prophesies about Judah, the Jewish people, are clear: only a remnant will survive. Isaiah 6:13, Luke 19:27. Romans 9:27 They have set up their own religion and refuse to acknowledge Jesus. Romans 10:1-4

It will be all the true, righteous Christian people that will inherit the holy Land and they are the people who will display God’s glory and be His witnesses to the nations, in the last few years before Jesus Returns. Ezekiel 39:21-29, Isaiah 66:18b-21, Isaiah 49:8-13, Ephesians 1:11, Romans 9:24-26
Ref: logostelos.info

No, it doesn't. (Rom. 2:29) is addressing the Jew. (2:17) The true Jew is the Jew, one of the twelve tribes, who is a believer. (2:28-29) The Gentiles were discussed in (Rom. 2:1-16). So no, the Israel of God is not eveyone who believes on Christ. The Israel of God is the Jew who believes on Jesus Christ.

Concerning (Gal. 3:26-29) I have told you already. I have no problem with the Church not being Jew or Gentile.

Concerning (Gal. 6:16) there is distinction made between the believers. "As many as walk according to this rule" and also, "upon the Israel of God". Nothing here makes the Church Israel. In fact it disproves it.

(1 Peter 2:9-10) says nothing about the Church being Israel. It just says the Church is now the people of God. So?

Just because proselytes are allowed in Israel, doesn't remove the necessity of the Israel nation being from the 12 tribes.

Just because there are other sheep, doesn't make the Church Israel. The very fact that they are called 'other' proves that.

It doesn't matter if there are no genealogical records all the way back to Abraham. You don't have a record back to Adam either, do you? But you know you are of Adam. The Jews know who they are. And the world knows who the Jews are, as they persecute them.

Yes, a remnant of Jews will survive. And they will be Jews, not the Church.

No, Christians have no part in the Holy Land. That is for the Jews.

Stranger

 

[Keraz]

Until the Rapture, after which the redeemed and restored kingdom of Israel under Christ will be established on earth. The Church will remain in the New Jerusalem in Heaven (contrary to your opinion).

Your unsupported opinion. Contrary to what God does plan for His people.

No, Christians have no part in the Holy Land. That is for the Jews.

Yes, the Jews are there now, in a small part of the holy Land. About 20 prophesies tell us they will soon be gone, except for a remnant. Jeremiah 12:12-14 plainly tells the story.
As for who are the real Israelites:
The Jews are of many racial origins:

1. THE ASHKENAZIM JEWS

Some claim a link between Edom and the Khazars, but apart from that there is more than one

identity calling themselves “Jews”; none of these have claim to the name ‘Israel’.. Regarding

the Ashkenazim Jews who speak Yiddish, most dictionaries and encyclopaedia define

Ashkenazim in words like after ‘Ashkenaz’, the second son of Gomer. This confirms

Scripture concerning the sons of Noah, [Shem, Japheth and Ham], and their offspring:

2. THE KHAZAR JEWS

The Khazars claimed descent from Japheth, and from their adoption of Judaism, they became

known as Jews. But they did not descend from Shem, and therefore they are not Semitic in

origin. To relate the term “anti-Semitism” to Jews of this origin is nonsense and part of the

great deception! Eastern European Jews of this origin have no Israelite connection. Anti-

Semitism could not apply to them! These are the majority in the Israeli state.

3. THE SEPHARDIM JEWS

The American People’s Encyclopaedia, 1925, indicates that these people descended from

Edomites who were cast out of Palestine by Prince Titus in AD 70. From thence they spread

to North Africa and to Spain converting Berber Tribes and others to Judaism. There were

Cardinals and Popes who were Sephardim Jews. They have no simple blood line, being

Edomites diluted with Syrian, Canaanite, Phoenician and North African blood.

4. THE SEPHARDIM / ASHKENAZIM JEWISH MIXTURE

It is impossible to determine the degree of intermarriage between these two groups of non-

Israelites, but there is evidence that this has been common.

5. THE ETHIOPIAN DESCENDANTS OF HAM [The Falashas]

These are known as “Jews” because of acceptance of Judaism. The Encyclopaedia Judaica

states:

The joke here is that Ham, as a son of Noah, was not a black man. It is amazing that these

people, who are supposed to be the educated and erudite, could make such a stupid statement.

6. BABYLONIAN and PROSELYTE JEWS

In the days of Mordecai and Esther - many who obviously were not of Judah took up Judaism

These are people from almost every race on earth. They became known as Jews because of religious spirit and belief in Judaism.

8. THE SHEMITE DESCENDANTS OF ESAU

These people also known as Edomites and some other names in Scripture. Historically, and

Biblically, most of these were made proselytes to Judaism and became known as “Jews”.



Anyone who wants to identify the Jews as “Israel” is not speaking about the true Israel of

God, as defined in the Bible. If we have another Israel, we have another gospel. But the

same people will insist that Jews of much racial mixture are a single race when they are not.

They want it both ways.

The term Ioudaios [Judean] is wrongly accepted as the “racial” term Ioudas [Jew] when

reading the New Testament and is the root of the misunderstanding. The use of the territorial

term, Judean, is not a measure of race, although some Israelites were amongst the proselytes

to Judaism in Judea.

The word, “Jews”, cannot always be taken in the way that is commonly accepted. Modern

international Jewry is primarily of Edomic or Japheth/Ashkenazim or Sephardim origin, and

the Jewish Encyclopaedia states that Edom is modern Jewry. Edomites are not Israelites; it

was Esau who sold his birthright. The descendants of Japheth cannot be ethnic Israelites. Neither

are “Jews” of other races Israelites by race.

Modern Jewry relates to Edom, Zionism, World Government and the Israeli state, but not to

Biblical Israel. At the end of the age it will be the Edomite-Jewish association with their

Babylonic enmity that will be burned by fire. Obadiah 1:16-18; Rev 18:6-8


But there is a final twist declared in Encyclopedia Judaica 1971, 10, column 23:

“JEWS BEGAN IN THE 19TH CENTURY TO CALL THEMSELVES HEBREWS AND ISRAELITES IN 1860.

This coincides with the cry, “anti-Semitism”.. If Zionists began so late in history to pretend

that they were Israelites or Hebrews, this confirms the hoax that claims “The Jews” are the

Israel of God. Ref: A.E.Kennedy

 

[Stranger]

Keraz

If you are such a grand writer of Bible studies, why are you always posting someone else's stuff? I mean, can't you just respond from your own knowledge at times?

Stranger

 

[Keraz]

Keraz

If you are such a grand writer of Bible studies, why are you always posting someone else's stuff? I mean, can't you just respond from your own knowledge at times?

Stranger

Nothing wrong with quoting someone who knows the facts.
However, what I do know, is that the Jews represent only 2 of the 12 tribes of Israel and the great rejoining as described in Ezekiel 37, has not taken place as yet.

Obviously, you have no answer to these truths and you fail to change your beliefs to conform to historical and Biblical facts.

 

[Acolyte]

I know this truth messes up your beliefs; face facts; the 'rapture to heaven' of the Church is false teaching, a lie that many have fallen for, to their disgrace. You just may have enough time to renounce it and be ready for what God actually does plan for His people.

I don't wish to take this off topic, but I'm thinking alot of people here say rapture when they are talking about the first resurrection. It's very confusing.