Hello! Just joined. I don’t think I’ve been to this one before.

[farouk]

Good passage Farouk xx

@Rita Yes; @dhh712 mentioned Romans 14; as regards moderation in things; e.g., such as with table wine, and on the other thread her occasional cigarettes, etc.

 

[Marine0311]

Interesting post. You introduce yourself with some of what you believe( your opinion not scriptural) , and when another poster tries to give you some sound direction you aren’t interested and know they are to be ignored. My question is how did you learn about God ? I would think it would be from scripture that was shared with you, and or from scripture you have read. I see already what type of Christ follower you are you believe what you accept and reject what you , based on your opinion, don’t. Scripture says God created the heavens and the earth and everything therein. How can you claim to be a Christian in one sentence and call Almighty God a liar in the next sentence ? You are following yourself not God.

 

[Heart2Soul]

Hello my name is Mi though I guess here I’m going by Skovand. I have been a Christian since I was baptized into Christ in 08. Though I begin studying the Bible in 07 with disciples in Portland.

I don’t have a specific denomination, it’s more of a specific paradigm about the Bible but doctrinally I am most closely to the Churches of Christ born out of the American restoration movement. Though within the denomination there is a wide span of biblical understanding and I fall on the progressive liberal side of Christianity. Im a evolutionary creationist which is very different from intelligent design beliefs like YEC or OEC. I understand the closed handed topics, and I don’t fully agree with them but I’m not particularly here to debate as much as discuss and enjoy time online. I will wax and wane between how active I am here since I work Monday through Friday 5am-130pm at a metal shop ( not music but actual metal manufacturing) and then from 230-830 I work as a subcontractor building and maintaining water gardens and ponds. Im working on my certifications for landscaping and pesticide management. Im big into native plants and how ecology and habitat systems play a role in developing functional and attractive residential gardens that can help combat some of the anti stewardship practices our species have developed.

I take studying the Bible very seriously. I read weekly and by read I mean studying with a purpose. I read lots of commentaries and books by scholars. Also listen to several podcasts on the subject. I am most influenced by NT Wright, Tim Mackie, Pete Enns, Francis Collins, John Walton and Richard Friedman. I also like Heiser.

Im big into horror genre as entertainment and that includes not just watching, reading and listening to it but also into documentaries on the evolution of horror, behind the scenes and the tropes used. Really enjoy horror as a social commentary.

I really enjoy hiking and foraging when I have time. I hike probably 10-20 hours a week. Though now it’s closer to 5-10 hours a week. I like lifting and biking. Live alone with my cats on a dead end street in the country of Alabama.

Welcome to Christianity Board...you will find there are plenty of members skilled in the knowledge of His Word in this forum.
Your personal likes and dislikes are specific to you. There may be others who enjoy the same things but yet they are still specific to you. Everything has an effect on individuals in different ways.
My concern about horror movies is the character in the movie. I won't watch demonic movies...i.e. The Exorcist,...or witchcraft movies...i.e. The Craft...simply because the mind is too vulnerable to the things it sees and hears.
You read the Bible...awesome! Then you have read that we, as born again Christians, should avoid the very appearance of evil.
Why?
Because it opens doors for the enemy to sneak in.

Have a blessed day!

 

[farouk]

You read the Bible...awesome! Then you have read that we, as born again Christians, should avoid the very appearance of evil.
Why?
Because it opens doors for the enemy to sneak in.

Have a blessed day!

@Heart2Soul Very good point......

 

[Dropship]

..Im big into horror genre as entertainment..

Yes it's great fun, one of my favourites is "The Stone Tape" where a high-tech team of electronics engineers rent a big old country house for their research but quickly discover the place has a ghost, so they switch all their efforts into trying to trigger / capture it, here's an extract-

Full film-

 

[Skovand1075]

I’ll definitely look into it. Thanks. Inside Shudder and Tubi a lot.

 

[bbyrd009]

Well I think the same about your social skills.

narf!
the horror thing will be a bit off-putting tho, i guess

is that a fly agaric on your head? lol

 

[bbyrd009]

Scripture says God created the heavens and the earth and everything therein. How can you claim to be a Christian in one sentence and call Almighty God a liar in the next sentence

Yah cant use evolution to create? Why not?

 

[Dropship]

..Im a evolutionary creationist..

Yes, on the one hand we know evolution exists simply by looking at the survival of the fittest, but at the same time there seems to be a guiding hand behind it.
Senator John McCain summed it up nicely with- "I believe in evolution, but when I hike the Grand Canyon at sunset, I see the hand of God there also"..

 

[Skovand1075]

Interesting post. You introduce yourself with some of what you believe( your opinion not scriptural) , and when another poster tries to give you some sound direction you aren’t interested and know they are to be ignored. My question is how did you learn about God ? I would think it would be from scripture that was shared with you, and or from scripture you have read. I see already what type of Christ follower you are you believe what you accept and reject what you , based on your opinion, don’t. Scripture says God created the heavens and the earth and everything therein. How can you claim to be a Christian in one sentence and call Almighty God a liar in the next sentence ? You are following yourself not God.

where did I call Yahweh a liar? That is in fact a lie. That kind of makes you the liar dissent it?

 

[Skovand1075]

Yes, on the one hand we know evolution exists simply by looking at the survival of the fittest, but at the same time there seems to be a guiding hand behind it.
Senator John McCain summed it up nicely with- "I believe in evolution, but when I hike the Grand Canyon at sunset, I see the hand of God there also"..

I see the hand of god everywhere. Even when it’s hot and a cloud blows over me and the wind picks up. Does not mean I think he supernaturally made it happen.

 

[Skovand1075]

@Heart2Soul Very good point......

Have you ever looked into the way that verse can be better translated? If horror is evil that means the Bible is evil as well since it’s full of horror.

just think about it. Do you think god wants us to avoid the appearance of evil even when it’s not actually evil or does it mean we need to avoid all forms of evil.
Then what’s evil? Is evil horror stories or is evil sin? Is evil being a crappy person who uselessly bothers others or is it enjoying doing tribal stories? Lots of ways to dig into it.

 

[Skovand1075]

Welcome to Christianity Board...you will find there are plenty of members skilled in the knowledge of His Word in this forum.
Your personal likes and dislikes are specific to you. There may be others who enjoy the same things but yet they are still specific to you. Everything has an effect on individuals in different ways.
My concern about horror movies is the character in the movie. I won't watch demonic movies...i.e. The Exorcist,...or witchcraft movies...i.e. The Craft...simply because the mind is too vulnerable to the things it sees and hears.
You read the Bible...awesome! Then you have read that we, as born again Christians, should avoid the very appearance of evil.
Why?
Because it opens doors for the enemy to sneak in.

Have a blessed day!

I have read the Bible which is why I disagree with you. Maybe some verses to showcase it?

 

[farouk]

Have you ever looked into the way that verse can be better translated? If horror is evil that means the Bible is evil as well since it’s full of horror.

just think about it. Do you think god wants us to avoid the appearance of evil even when it’s not actually evil or does it mean we need to avoid all forms of evil.
Then what’s evil? Is evil horror stories or is evil sin? Is evil being a crappy person who uselessly bothers others or is it enjoying doing tribal stories? Lots of ways to dig into it.

@Skovand1075 Well, it's a Scripture quotation.

"22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (1 Thess. 5.22-23)

 

[Dropship]

..Then what’s evil? Is evil horror stories or is evil sin?..

Some people see evil everywhere, for example fundy religionists said Elvis was evil when he first appeared on the scene, right Elv?

 

[Skovand1075]

@Skovand1075 Well, it's a Scripture quotation.

"22 Abstain from all appearance of evil.

23 And the very God of peace sanctify you wholly; and I pray God your whole spirit and soul and body be preserved blameless unto the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ." (1 Thess. 5.22-23)

so normally I don’t repeat myself. But I will this one time and then ignore you. I just did not join to hash out this people. Reads why I mentioned that in the post and why it’s in the fellowship threads.

So I mentioned have you ever looked at better ways it can be translated. This is what I meant.
I’ll teach one one time how to do a study on a verse. When you’re read multiple translations it will clue you into how tricky certain words and phrases can be. Here’s a handful of them for this verse.

Abstain from all appearance of evil.
ASV
abstain from every form of evil.
AMP
Abstain from every form of evil [withdraw and keep away from it].
AMPC
Abstain from evil [shrink from it and keep aloof from it] in whatever form orwhatever kind it may be.
BRG
Abstain from all appearance of evil.
CSB
Stay away from every kind of evil.
CEB
Avoid every kind of evil.
CJB
but keep away from every form of evil.
CEV
and don't have anything to do with evil.
DARBY
hold aloof from every form of wickedness.
DLNT
be abstaining from every form of evil.
DRA
From all appearance of evil refrain yourselves.
ERV
and stay away from everything that is evil.
EHV
Keep away from every kind of evil.
ESV
Abstain from every form of evil.
ESVUK
Abstain from every form of evil.
EXB
and stay away from ·everything that is [every form/kind of] evil.
GNV
Abstain from all appearance of evil.
GW
Keep away from every kind of evil.
GNT
and avoid every kind of evil.
HCSB
Stay away from every kind of evil.
ICB
And stay away from everything that is evil.
ISV
Keep away from every kind of evil.
PHILLIPS
Never damp the fire of the Spirit, and never despise what is spoken in the name of the Lord. By all means use your judgement, and hold on to whatever is really good, Steer clear of evil in any form.
JUB
Separate yourselves from all appearance of evil.
KJV
Abstain from all appearance of evil.
AKJV
Abstain from all appearance of evil.
LEB
Abstain from every form of evil.
TLB
Keep away from every kind of evil.
MSG
Don’t suppress the Spirit, and don’t stifle those who have a word from the Master. On the other hand, don’t be gullible. Check out everything, and keep only what’s good. Throw out anything tainted with evil.
MEV
Abstain from all appearances of evil.
MOUNCE
abstain from evil of every kind.
NOG
Keep away from every kind of evil.
NABRE
Refrain from every kind of evil.
NASB
abstain from every form of evil.
NASB1995
abstain from every form of evil.
NCB
Avoid every form of evil.
NCV
and stay away from everything that is evil.
NET
Stay away from every form of evil.
NIRV
Say no to every kind of evil.
NIV
reject every kind of evil.
NIVUK
reject every kind of evil.
NKJV
Abstain from every form of evil.
NLV
Keep away from everything that even looks like sin.

now with these verses you’ll notice the word , appearance is hardly ever used. It’s mostly form as in sin. It’s saying avoid sin. All kinds of sin. Avoid it. Don’t do it. Repent. Bear the fruit of righteousness, not the flesh.

Then we can take another simple step forward.

Maybe you can. Read through these and get a better idea.

Strong's Greek: 1491. εἶδος (eidos) -- visible form, shape, appearance, kind

 

[Heart2Soul]

I am most influenced by NT Wright, Tim Mackie, Pete Enns, Francis Collins, John Walton and Richard Friedman. I also like Heiser.

Why are you not most influenced by God's Word?
I just researched these men you admire and allow to influence you in interpretation of scripture.
I was rather dismayed that Wright and Mackie both teach justification is a process to be obtained at a future time.
This is a quote from the link below....
What’s Wrong with Wright: Examining the New Perspective on Paul by Phil Johnson


So in Wright’s estimation, justification is an ecumenical and ecclesiological issue, not a soteriological one. Page 158:

Paul’s doctrine of justification by faith impels the churches, in their current fragmented state, into the ecumenical task. It cannot be right that the very doctrine which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong at the same table (Galatians 2) should be used as a way of saying that some, who define the doctrine of justification differently, belong at a different table. The doctrine of justification, in other words, is not merely a doctrine in which Catholic and Protestant might just be able to agree on, as a result of hard ecumenical endeavour. It is itself the ecumenical doctrine, the doctrine that rebukes all our petty and often culture-bound church groupings, and which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong together in the one family. . . . The doctrine of justification is in fact the great ecumenical doctrine.

Is there no soteriological or personal dimension in Wright’s understanding of justification, then? There is, and this is one of the most troubling aspects of his work. Like many today who are proposing new

And you see this most clearly in the fifth distinctive of Wright’s position that I want to highlight for you. Here is idea number five, if you’re making a list of these: According to Wright, Protestant and Reformed exegetes who in the mainstream of evangelical theology have all misread what Paul meant when he spoke of “the righteousness of God.” According to Wright, divine righteousness is not an asset that can be imputed from God to the believer. It has nothing to do with virtue or excellence or moral rectitude that can be imputed. Instead, God’s righteousness is simply His covenant faithfulness. And when Paul speaks of the believer’s righteousness as a righteousness that comes from God, he is talking about covenant membership, our status in the covenant, which ultimately must be maintained by our own faithfulness.

 

[farouk]

Why are you not most influenced by God's Word?
I just researched these men you admire and allow to influence you in interpretation of scripture.
I was rather dismayed that Wright and Mackie both teach justification is a process to be obtained at a future time.
This is a quote from the link below....
What’s Wrong with Wright: Examining the New Perspective on Paul by Phil Johnson


So in Wright’s estimation, justification is an ecumenical and ecclesiological issue, not a soteriological one. Page 158:

Paul’s doctrine of justification by faith impels the churches, in their current fragmented state, into the ecumenical task. It cannot be right that the very doctrine which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong at the same table (Galatians 2) should be used as a way of saying that some, who define the doctrine of justification differently, belong at a different table. The doctrine of justification, in other words, is not merely a doctrine in which Catholic and Protestant might just be able to agree on, as a result of hard ecumenical endeavour. It is itself the ecumenical doctrine, the doctrine that rebukes all our petty and often culture-bound church groupings, and which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong together in the one family. . . . The doctrine of justification is in fact the great ecumenical doctrine.

Is there no soteriological or personal dimension in Wright’s understanding of justification, then? There is, and this is one of the most troubling aspects of his work. Like many today who are proposing new

And you see this most clearly in the fifth distinctive of Wright’s position that I want to highlight for you. Here is idea number five, if you’re making a list of these: According to Wright, Protestant and Reformed exegetes who in the mainstream of evangelical theology have all misread what Paul meant when he spoke of “the righteousness of God.” According to Wright, divine righteousness is not an asset that can be imputed from God to the believer. It has nothing to do with virtue or excellence or moral rectitude that can be imputed. Instead, God’s righteousness is simply His covenant faithfulness. And when Paul speaks of the believer’s righteousness as a righteousness that comes from God, he is talking about covenant membership, our status in the covenant, which ultimately must be maintained by our own faithfulness.

I've had some misgivings also about NT Wright's doctrinal position, in places, @Heart2Soul ...

Justification is a judicial reckoning, not a process.....

 

[Angelina]

@Skovand1075

 

[Skovand1075]

Why are you not most influenced by God's Word?
I just researched these men you admire and allow to influence you in interpretation of scripture.
I was rather dismayed that Wright and Mackie both teach justification is a process to be obtained at a future time.
This is a quote from the link below....
What’s Wrong with Wright: Examining the New Perspective on Paul by Phil Johnson


So in Wright’s estimation, justification is an ecumenical and ecclesiological issue, not a soteriological one. Page 158:

Paul’s doctrine of justification by faith impels the churches, in their current fragmented state, into the ecumenical task. It cannot be right that the very doctrine which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong at the same table (Galatians 2) should be used as a way of saying that some, who define the doctrine of justification differently, belong at a different table. The doctrine of justification, in other words, is not merely a doctrine in which Catholic and Protestant might just be able to agree on, as a result of hard ecumenical endeavour. It is itself the ecumenical doctrine, the doctrine that rebukes all our petty and often culture-bound church groupings, and which declares that all who believe in Jesus belong together in the one family. . . . The doctrine of justification is in fact the great ecumenical doctrine.

Is there no soteriological or personal dimension in Wright’s understanding of justification, then? There is, and this is one of the most troubling aspects of his work. Like many today who are proposing new

And you see this most clearly in the fifth distinctive of Wright’s position that I want to highlight for you. Here is idea number five, if you’re making a list of these: According to Wright, Protestant and Reformed exegetes who in the mainstream of evangelical theology have all misread what Paul meant when he spoke of “the righteousness of God.” According to Wright, divine righteousness is not an asset that can be imputed from God to the believer. It has nothing to do with virtue or excellence or moral rectitude that can be imputed. Instead, God’s righteousness is simply His covenant faithfulness. And when Paul speaks of the believer’s righteousness as a righteousness that comes from God, he is talking about covenant membership, our status in the covenant, which ultimately must be maintained by our own faithfulness.

So I only read the first few sentence and stopped. I would expect better from staff to be honest. That’s a very immature question. I’m not even going to entertain responding to that question.

as for the bit I skimmed about your issues with Mackie and Wright. Well when are we saved? are we saved on earth or are we saved when we hear our names called by Yahweh from his great book? The Bible says the saved and lost will be resurrected and face judgment. Those who are found in the book of life seems to be saved right then. The others are not. We are saved at the same moment the others are damned.