• Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
-

Here is how a born again believer becomes : '"""bewitched.""""

Here is the verse..

Paul teaching..... Galatians 3:3

""How foolish can you be? After starting your new lives in the Spirit, why are you now trying to become perfect by your own human effort?""""

""""How can you be so stupid? Do you think that by yourself you can complete what God's Spirit started in you?"""""

""""How can you be so foolish! You began by God's Spirit; do you now want to try to go to heaven by your own power?""""""


So,
I really dont have to explain much, to you., as a 9 yr old could understand those verses, and if you are over 20, and can't, then you are the very One the verse is talking about.

See, if you can't understand Paul, in that verse, is explaining that a born again believer, at FIRST, understood that God has saved them, and that is for eternity.....and then, you lost that understanding... your faith was corrupted and subverted, and now you are trying to STAY SAVED... by self effort. By Works.. by commandments.... by SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS.

See that?
And who is that? ???
Its anyone who believes they can lose their Salvation.
As when you believe that, you are the very one who is trying to go to heaven by trying NOT to lose your salvation.
This means You are absolutely not trusting in Christ to keep you saved.
Your faith is BROKEN.
You "started in the Spirit", but you are now in the 'mind of the flesh".
You are literally the same carnal mind as found in an unbeliever.

As the unbelievers, (never born again) always BELIEVE that if they do more good works than bad works in their life, then God will accept them based on them doing more Good = Works..
This is a carnal mind (darkened) that is trying to get God's acceptance based on their SELF effort.
JUDE describes this mind this self effort as "the Error of Cain".
And that is what Paul is describing as the darkened mind of a person who is born again, but now believes they can lose their salvation.
Its the same carnal mind that is found in an Unbeliever who also believes in Works.....
You, are trying to keep yourself saved by the same WORKS that an unbeliever believes they can do, and will go to heaven.
See that?
That is the SAME Carnal MIND, in both the unbeliever, and the BELIEVER.

Paul says that if you have that mind, (if you believe you can lose your Salvation) you are "bewitched" = by someone.

""who has bewitched you, that you no longer obey THE TRUTH" ??

And that is always a scripture quoting heretic who will convince you that you are responsible to keep yourself saved.
They will break your faith in Christ, as that is their demonic ministry.
They will cause you (bewitch you) to BELIEVE THAT You have to work to stay saved and that you can lose your salvation.
And once you are deceived by their Cross Rejection LIES, you are become "fallen from Grace" "Foolish", and "in the flesh"... "bewitched".

Listen to me now...

If you do not believe that Jesus Keeps you SAVED....that GOD keeps you saved... Philippians 1:6 ..then what do you believe keeps you saved?

You believe YOU HAVE TO DO IT, and that is why you believe you can lose your salvation.
A devil deceived deceiver has bewitched you ...= to get you to put the responsibility of going to heaven on yourself.
You are now nailed to the Cross of your own Self Righteousness.
They have ruined your faith.
They have caused you to "fall from Grace".

You are now, = "in the flesh"... "Bewitched". "Fallen From Grace".
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
4,234
2,223
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Paul, in that verse, is explaining that a born again believer, at FIRST, understood that God has saved them, and that is for eternity....

now you are trying to STAY SAVED... by self effort.

By Works.. by commandments.... by SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS.

It had nothing to do with “self righteous works”. That’s just your cults’ talking point.

The Galatians were being admonished by Paul for their desire to get circumcised and observe religious holidays according to the law:

Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years. I am afraid of you, lest I have bestowed upon you labour in vain.” (Galatians 4:10-11)

“Behold, I Paul say unto you, that if ye be circumcised, Christ shall profit you nothing. For I testify again to every man that is circumcised, that he is a debtor to do the whole law. Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.” (Galatians 5:2-4)
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
4,234
2,223
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
They will cause you (bewitch you) to BELIEVE THAT You have to work to stay saved and that you can lose your salvation.

“They” believe what the Bible says:

“Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12)

“…brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall” (2 Peter 1:10)
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
It had nothing to do with “self righteous works”. That’s just your cults’ talking point.

The Galatians were being admonished by Paul for their desire to get circumcised and observe religious holidays according to the law:

If you have a bible, then you'll note that in Galatians 3, Paul is talking to the born again , and is asking them "who has bewitched" you, that you no longer exist in the right mind of Faith.

Now, whatever your obsession is with "circumcision", is really your own circular reasoning one track mind, bizarre situation.
You'd do well to read my Thread, as you are the very one im talking to , and that is why your flesh became active , as the Thread spoke to YOU>...and you ran in here to post something that is not related to Galatians 3.
And you'll do it again, Michiah-Mla.
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
“They” believe what the Bible says:

“Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.” (Philippians 2:12)

Obviously, if you dont discern the verse, you will believe that Salvation is something you DO, verses something that is Given by God, as 'the Gift of Salvation" that is ONLY Based on the Cross of Christ, .... John 14:6.
Heretics, the "bewitched" can never SEE Salvation, as the Cross, but can only TALK ABOUT WORKS, as they try to save themselves.
Hell is filled with these water baptized, religious, self savers.
=FILLED.
And they all "sound" just like you.
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
4,234
2,223
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
whatever your obsession is with "circumcision", is really your own circular reasoning one track mind, bizarre situation.

You are speaking to the Apostle Paul as I only quoted his writings to you.

if you dont discern the verse, you will believe that Salvation is something you DO, verses something that is Given by God, as 'the Gift of Salvation" that is ONLY Based on the Cross of Christ

The sinner repenting and believing doesn’t get saved by works. His faith alone converts him.

But once becoming a converted saint he certainly does work to remain saved.

“Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall” (2 Peter 1:10)

Heretics, the "bewitched" can never SEE Salvation, as the Cross, but can only TALK ABOUT WORKS

I saw salvation at the cross.

Now I honor it by working righteousness.

“This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.” (Titus 3:8)
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
But once becoming a converted saint he certainly does work to remain saved.

That's the devil's gospel of "works to be saved, and works to stay saved", you are teaching and have believed.

So, you dont understand that Jesus who saved you, is the only way you can stay saved.
You are "bewitched" OUT of this right understanding and correct faith.
Paul says you are "foolish" and "in the flesh".

""How foolish can you be? After starting your new lives in the Spirit, why are you now trying to become perfect by your own human effort?""""

""""How can you be so stupid? Do you think that by yourself you can complete what God's Spirit started in you?"""""

""""How can you be so foolish! You began by God's Spirit; do you now want to try to go to heaven by your own power?""""""

MIchiah,Ilma....You are trying to present yourself, as equal to the Cross, based on your self righteous works.
You do this because you dont believe that God's Salvation, that is Christ on the Cross, is the ONLY Salvation".

You have your own that you try to produce, as WORKS, to try to STAY SAVED., and that denies God's salvation.
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
4,234
2,223
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
Nope!

That the Apostle’s gospel!

Paul is an Apostle....Thats true. You got something right, finally.

Paul THE Apostle, said..........that THE Gospel......is "MY Gospel".

So, the Gospel that we are to believe and share, is Paul's.
Paul THE Apostle.
He was given it personally by Jesus., as well as Doctrine for the Church.
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
And Paul himself also said:

“…thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear: For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.” (Romans 11:20-21)

I was talking to a heretic here yesterday, who also likes to try to make the bible falsely teach that God's salvation is based on your self effort.
They were telling me that "Jesus will cut you off if you dont produce spiritual fruit and do good works".

See that?
That is a heretic teaching that God will dishonor the Cross, and the Blood Atonement, that is THE FREE GIFT of Salvation, never to be repented of, if you dont do good works to try to save yourself, and keep yourself saved.

So, as i told you in my Thread.
When you teach that you have to DO WORKS to complete the CROSS, you are a devil led heretic, who is "bewitched".
Your "understanding is darkened" Paul Teaches.
Jesus says...You are become a Dark Light.... Luke 11:35
And that is why, you can't BELIEVE that GOD who saved you, keeps you saved.
Philippians 1:6
You are fallen from this TRUTH........."bewitched by a cult or person", and you no longer BELIEVE THE TRUTH"". Paul teaches.

Go ahead and keep proving it again and again, Michiah-Ilma.
This helps the Believers who are not "bewitched" SEE what it means to have become deceived and "fallen from Grace'"
 
Last edited:

Robert Gwin

Well-Known Member
Mar 19, 2021
5,646
1,336
113
68
Central Il
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
-

Here is how a born again believer becomes : '"""bewitched.""""

Here is the verse..

Paul teaching..... Galatians 3:3

""How foolish can you be? After starting your new lives in the Spirit, why are you now trying to become perfect by your own human effort?""""

""""How can you be so stupid? Do you think that by yourself you can complete what God's Spirit started in you?"""""

""""How can you be so foolish! You began by God's Spirit; do you now want to try to go to heaven by your own power?""""""


So,
I really dont have to explain much, to you., as a 9 yr old could understand those verses, and if you are over 20, and can't, then you are the very One the verse is talking about.

See, if you can't understand Paul, in that verse, is explaining that a born again believer, at FIRST, understood that God has saved them, and that is for eternity.....and then, you lost that understanding... your faith was corrupted and subverted, and now you are trying to STAY SAVED... by self effort. By Works.. by commandments.... by SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS.

See that?
And who is that? ???
Its anyone who believes they can lose their Salvation.
As when you believe that, you are the very one who is trying to go to heaven by trying NOT to lose your salvation.
This means You are absolutely not trusting in Christ to keep you saved.
Your faith is BROKEN.
You "started in the Spirit", but you are now in the 'mind of the flesh".
You are literally the same carnal mind as found in an unbeliever.

As the unbelievers, (never born again) always BELIEVE that if they do more good works than bad works in their life, then God will accept them based on them doing more Good = Works..
This is a carnal mind (darkened) that is trying to get God's acceptance based on their SELF effort.
JUDE describes this mind this self effort as "the Error of Cain".
And that is what Paul is describing as the darkened mind of a person who is born again, but now believes they can lose their salvation.
Its the same carnal mind that is found in an Unbeliever who also believes in Works.....
You, are trying to keep yourself saved by the same WORKS that an unbeliever believes they can do, and will go to heaven.
See that?
That is the SAME Carnal MIND, in both the unbeliever, and the BELIEVER.

Paul says that if you have that mind, (if you believe you can lose your Salvation) you are "bewitched" = by someone.

""who has bewitched you, that you no longer obey THE TRUTH" ??

And that is always a scripture quoting heretic who will convince you that you are responsible to keep yourself saved.
They will break your faith in Christ, as that is their demonic ministry.
They will cause you (bewitch you) to BELIEVE THAT You have to work to stay saved and that you can lose your salvation.
And once you are deceived by their Cross Rejection LIES, you are become "fallen from Grace" "Foolish", and "in the flesh"... "bewitched".

Listen to me now...

If you do not believe that Jesus Keeps you SAVED....that GOD keeps you saved... Philippians 1:6 ..then what do you believe keeps you saved?

You believe YOU HAVE TO DO IT, and that is why you believe you can lose your salvation.
A devil deceived deceiver has bewitched you ...= to get you to put the responsibility of going to heaven on yourself.
You are now nailed to the Cross of your own Self Righteousness.
They have ruined your faith.
They have caused you to "fall from Grace".

You are now, = "in the flesh"... "Bewitched". "Fallen From Grace".

Obviously born again Christians are not bewitched sir. If they become such, they are no longer born again Christians, and in fact cannot receive salvation. Heb 6:4-6
 
  • Like
Reactions: Reggie Belafonte

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
Obviously born again Christians are not bewitched sir. If they become such, they are no longer born again Christians, and in fact cannot receive salvation. Heb 6:4-6

The Galatian Christians, some of them, had "fallen from Grace".

An unbeliever can't do that, Robert, as they have no SALVATiON to begin with..
 

Michiah-Imla

Well-Known Member
Oct 24, 2020
4,234
2,223
113
Northeast USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
you ran in here to post something that is not related to Galatians 3.

I quoted from Galatians!

The same book you used as the OP!

I just showed the full context.

You read “justified by the law” as doing self-righteous works. Whereas in the scripture it was directed only at those desiring circumcision and observations of days, months, times, and years.
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
I
You read “justified by the law” as doing self-righteous works. Whereas in the scripture it was directed only at those desiring circumcision and observations of days, months, times, and years.

It was a broken faith, that no longer Trusted in Christ, that led the Galatians back into the "flesh".

To be "in the mind of the Flesh" ..subsequent to being born again....is to be "bewitched", having a carnal mind of the flesh, that Paul teaches is.... "having begun in the Spirit", you are NOW trying to be accepted by God, based on WORKS". = "flesh".

This can be :

Anything that you DO, to try to be saved or stay saved.

Like this list.

1.) Enduring to the end
2.) Water Baptism
3.) Commandment Keeping
4.) Trying to keep the Law of Moses
5.) Good works, and trying to be like Christ.

See all those? That is SELF EFFORT to try to stay saved, and go to Heaven , in place of Real FAITH in Christ to keep you saved and get you into heaven.
 

L3astAm0ngManyB13ss3d

Well-Known Member
Mar 22, 2022
2,017
2,436
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I would so put Behold in ignore and bury it near the equator and never remember this one again.

However he stays out in the open and I can converse with some of those he seemingly hates & antagonizes. Otherwise I would lose some of the word shared in truth by the believers.

I see all the arrogance and vitriol spread without any of the love of Christ.

Are we not his emissaries, to carry HIS gospel ?

I cannot communicate with hobby horsers. Galloping on about the same ole same ole.

Salvation losers! Lol what terminology!

Discount ALL THE CONDITIONS TO FOLLOWING GOD, yes sir !

You don't trust God, IF you recognize your faith can be ship-wrecked, if you turn back to the life of darkness or if you follow a different pathway. Well then you never were one of us..........such BALDERDASH !!!!!!!


A menace.
 

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
I would so put Behold in ignore and bury it near the equator and never remember this one again.

What you will notice regarding preaching Truth, in Christ, is that the Higher I Lift up the Cross against the Devil's owned, the angrier and the more hateful the heretic will yell about it.
Happens every time i post about Jesus on the Cross as "the GIFT of Salvation".

See,...= the more i give Christ all the credit due Him alone for the Salvation that He accomplished by Death on THE CROSS, the more offended the deceived heretics become who are trying, by PRIDE, to work their way into heaven on their way to Hell.
Believe it.

Notice that : L3astAm0ngManyB13ss3d.

If you do, it'll be a real eye opening experience for you.
I guarantee it.
Just watch and see.
 

amigo de christo

Well-Known Member
Sep 12, 2020
12,616
20,489
113
50
San angelo
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
The Galatian Christians, some of them, had "fallen from Grace".

An unbeliever can't do that, Robert, as they have no SALVATiON to begin with..
Rather odd that paul warned the church of BELIEVERS to NOT DO SUCH THINGS .
How come warning the church TODAY about not doing such things is LEGALSIM . OOPS .
Somethings went wrong my friend and BIG TIME TOO .
Are you not the same man that once wrote that even if a BELIEVER stopped BELIEVING HE Is STILL saved .
Something is going wrong my friend .
IF JESUS , paul and others WARNED the CHURCH it HAD TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST , GUESS WHAT I AM GONNNA DO
and IT IS NOT LEGALSIM to DO SO . You all act like its a sin to even warn and remind folks WE MUST CONTINUE IN CHRIST TO THE END .
YET the apostels and CHRIST himself , WARNED EVEN HIS OWN as did the apostels warn the church .
BUT TODAY that is called legalism and not trusting in CHRIST .
YET CHRIST SAID IT , THE APOSTELS SAID IT . SO WHO is trusting in CHRIST . THOSE WHO ACTUALLY BELIEVE HIM
and warn as HE DID and as the apostels did . NEVER have i seen the delusion i see today in most folks .
WE BETTER MAKE SURE ITS JESUS WE FOLLOW and not men IS ALL I CAN SAY .
 

L3astAm0ngManyB13ss3d

Well-Known Member
Mar 22, 2022
2,017
2,436
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Rather odd that paul warned the church of BELIEVERS to NOT DO SUCH THINGS .
How come warning the church TODAY about not doing such things is LEGALSIM . OOPS .
Somethings went wrong my friend and BIG TIME TOO .
Are you not the same man that once wrote that even if a BELIEVER stopped BELIEVING HE Is STILL saved .
Something is going wrong my friend .
IF JESUS , paul and others WARNED the CHURCH it HAD TO CONTINUE IN CHRIST , GUESS WHAT I AM GONNNA DO
and IT IS NOT LEGALSIM to DO SO . You all act like its a sin to even warn and remind folks WE MUST CONTINUE IN CHRIST TO THE END .
YET the apostels and CHRIST himself , WARNED EVEN HIS OWN as did the apostels warn the church .
BUT TODAY that is called legalism and not trusting in CHRIST .
YET CHRIST SAID IT , THE APOSTELS SAID IT . SO WHO is trusting in CHRIST . THOSE WHO ACTUALLY BELIEVE HIM
and warn as HE DID and as the apostels did . NEVER have i seen the delusion i see today in most folks .
WE BETTER MAKE SURE ITS JESUS WE FOLLOW and not men IS ALL I CAN SAY .





IF this is the apostasy, IT is uglier than I could have imagined.

This isn't JUST loss of faith nor a turning away from but it's delusional, full of anger & hatred, twisted gnarled scriptures that are lies, tactical armory in the weapon of the tongue, to destroy, wild, vengeful and ect.ect.

Has there been NO helmet of the hope of salvation worn ? [1 Thess 5:8 ] Are thoughts being taken captive now to the point ppl cannot think on these things, [2 Cor.10:5 ; Phil4:8 ]

HELP US HOLY SPIRIT TO BE OVERCOMERS !
 
  • Like
Reactions: amigo de christo

Behold

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2020
8,823
2,803
113
Netanya or Pensacola
Faith
Christian
Country
Israel
Are you not the same man that once wrote that even if a BELIEVER stopped BELIEVING HE Is STILL saved .
.

Im LITERALLY the same one who teaches that if you are born again, you are always born again.
That if Christ, who is God's Salvation is IN YOU< then you are going to heaven, no matter how you THINK later, or behave today.

Why?, because God has ACCEPTED the Faith of the Born again, and God's promise is that if you Give Him your Faith in Christ, God Himself will be faithful to COMPLETE the Salvation of all the Born again, and Jesus will finish their faith...

Philippians 1:6
Hebrews 12:2

Salvation is now what YOU DO... Its What Christ DID on the Cross that God uses to forgive, redeem, and justify and sanctify, all who will believe.
You dont seem to understand this, and at some point you are going to have to understand.
Now is the accepted time, Now is the day of Salvaton.

Listen,
Salvation, is not based on trying to believe......Its based on God accepting your faith the instant you place it in Christ.
Being Born AGAiN is PROOF God has SAVED YOU.....SAVED YOU... and once you are saved, you are kept saved, as God is faithful to complete your Salvation.
Its His responsibility to get you into Heaven, as its His CHRIST who died to accomplish this Eternal Salvation that is the only reason you will go to heaven, amigo de christo.

You and others here, seem to think you are going to hit eternity and tell God all about your works.
CAIN tried that, in Genesis, and God told Him to GET OUT.
He is the SAME GOD, and people who are like CAIN, committing the "error of Cain" are still trying to argue with the CROSS.
That's a fail, and Hell is continuing to be filled with people who tried to go to heaven by works, and water baptism, and commandment keeping.

Hear me yet?