How to understand your sins.....now that you are born again.

[Kidron]

How to understand sin, now that you are a born again person.....

You first must understand your born again situation in relation to how God SEES YOU NOW that you are his.
Do you understand????
What matters is not how you think it should be, but rather how God says it IS.
Now,... you have to get that or you'll be the victim of every opinion led theology that is in the church and there is a lot of junk theology running loose in the pulpits and in the seminaries and online in these end times...

Now let me explain..
When you read your bible, you are to understand that you are to see yourself as IT sees you NOW, and not as you were BEFORE you were saved.
And right in here is where a New Christian usually takes a left turn early on.

Now, let me expose you to the other part of missing revelation whereby in general a New Christian makes a left turn and never again finds the right track...
Which is....you need to understand that while all scripture is given to you, its not all designed as doctrine for you.
In other words, scripture is all profitable and God breathed, but its not all literal to a believer's born again situation as >doctrine<.

For Example......
Are you a Hebrew?..
Are..............you........................a .....................HEBREW?
Probably not anyone here is a Hebrew.
I live in Israel and im not a Hebrew..;-)
Yet, there is a letter in your New Testament that is written to the HEBREWS..
This one letter, if not understood in the context of "written to the Hebrews", will in places really mess you up Doctrinally .
And you say..."but its in the bible, so why isnt it all for ME".
Well, have you ever read the verse in Timothy that tells you to "rightly divide" the word....2nd Timothy 2:15
This means you are to discern carefully when the bible is being literal or symbolic....figurative, or doctrinal......And if you dont learn to do this....if you dont find a teacher like me who has been taught the correct doctrinal interpretation of the New Testament, and instead you just jump in there and try to understand the word using your mind and your opinion, you will end up with all sorts of twisted interpretations of scripture that will leave you without any light or truth.
And that is because there is a Devil and he will take your bible and use it against you by bringing you into contact with people who he has led to misunderstand most of the New Testament.
The devil will also use your pride and your self-righteousness and your fear and your lack of experience with the word to confuse you and to twist you with the scriptures,
Listen,...The bible is not a toy...Its a very very sharp sword, its a high tech weapon, its a hot burning reality check..its light for life...and if you are not careful with it, you will get yourself in a theological mess that can last all your lifetime..
And what is more screwed up then a screwed up Christian?
Not much.
Really.
So be very careful with the letter to the Hebrews (and with James and Matthew), as this one letter (Hebrews) is used by the devil constantly to torture Christians with the idea they have lost their salvation, or can lose it.

Ok, now that the preamble is over,.... lets talk about sin and if we are "sinners" as this is the Thread's topic..
Lets keep this really simple.

1st.....Sin is only known as sin when there is God's LAW in effect which reveals it.
Do u understand?
So, When there is no LAW, there is no sin.....Romans 5:17
Now get that....!!
If you read Romans Chapter 7, you will discover that Paul explains very carefully that the Law was given so that sin would be understood as sin, as evil, as lust, as deception.
The law was not given to save you....as it cant,....(only Christ can save you).. ....The Law only reveals the holiness of God's standard for righteousness as compared to how far we are from them and from him.
Thats the idea and the reason.........thats the purpose of the Law.....so that the whole world would become guilty before God based on the LAW.....Romans 3:19
The Law is designed to show you what you are, in relation to what God is, so that you understand your lost and hopeless situation and your need for Jesus to solve it.
See it?

Now, are you a sinner?
Does God see you as a sinner?.
Absolutely not, if you are born again.
If you are born again, God sees you as a SON, as a Joint heir of himself and of Jesus.....Romans 8:17
And why does God no longer see you as a sinner?.
Its because the basis for seeing you as a sinner.......THE LAW....has been abolished......2nd Corinthians 11,13
And we are no longer under it..
We are , by the body of Christ, delivered from the Law.....Romans 4:15

Now look at Romans 4:7.......notice this verse, as its so so so so important for you to understand........it says that God does not "impute" or "charge" your sins to you anymore.
Never again.....
And the reason he doesn't, is because he has by the sacrifice of Jesus the Christ >eliminated the Law<, and because the Law is gone, there is no more basis for him to legally hold you accountable for your sins as Jesus has redeemed us from the curse of the law.....Galatians 3:13

God did something amazing........He came to earth and wrapped himself in human flesh and lived a sinless life which allowed him to abolish the law for you by meeting its standards as only the one who created it can obey it perfectly......And then he died for the legal punishment due the law for our sins according to his own judgment.
In other words, he judged himself on a cross for your sins, and in doing so he took the Law away from us forever so that we are no longer under its power to judge us as sinners.....Romans 7:4,6

So, what is the eternal effect of this regarding you????.......= God has replaced the Legal basis to see you as a sinner (the Law) with the righteous body of Christ which is the new covenant basis to see you right now....right now... as Forever RIGHTEOUS. ..This is the "gift of righteousness"...Romans 5:16,17.... is your ETERNAL STANDING with God according to HIM.
He cant see you any other way.
It is what you are in his eyes, in his understanding, in his redemption plan.
And THAT is what you have to grab and hold and cherish and adore.
God has recreated you by new birth to be just as righteous as he is, and this cant be undone by "sin" as there is now no basis for it..(The Law is Gone......>.)Romans 6:14
All that is left is your eternal Sonship position "in Christ" as a "Joint heir" of God, Romans 8:17 and that is never going to change once it has become yours by faith//new birth.

Saint... if you have never understood this before........or if you have never before been taught this revelation that God no longer sees you as a sinner, and that all your imperfect acts you now commit, that once were called "sins", are no longer charged to you, ...then im sure you would want to lift your hands and thank your awesome God who has created a salvation that is so perfect and so pure that once its applied to you, its as if you have never sinned and never will again even tho you commit acts that you know are not pleasing to him and that previously and legally he once deemed as "sin"..
He has now created an eternal connection between you and him, that you cant mess up by your deeds, ever........and this is because God himself created the blood atonement lifeline, and in doing it this way, it prevents you from being able to disconnect from him ever again by your "sins"..

Isnt this good news????
Yes, amen. !!
And you need to tell people what our Awesome God has done for us all.


be blessed,


K

 

[haz]

Hi Kidron,

AMEN !! That is good news. Jesus truly set us free from sin (John 8:36). Christians are saints and not sinners.

Thanks for your post. You quoted good scriptures showing how Christ set us free from sin.

I hope you don't mind my adding a post below I had from another topic. It's supports your message how we are saints and not sinners. I believe the more scripture that is quoted showing what Jesus Christ did for us the better.

Many Christians see bad behavior/lifestyles as sin. Unfortunately this is incorrect. Man's traditional definitions of sin are ambiguous, hence there is much misunderstanding of scripture.
But, God has given us definitions which are the only ones to use to understand scripture.

God’s definitions of sin are basically covered by the following examples:

1: Mark 3:29 Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. This sin will not be forgiven. Christians do not commit this sin.

2: John 16:9 Unbelief in Jesus. This is the sin the world is convicted of. Christians do not commit this sin either.

3: 1John 5:17 “all unrighteousness is sin”. Christians are righteous in Christ so here we do not sin.

4: 1John 3:4 “Sin is transgression of the law”. This is breaking the 10 commandments resulting in a death penalty for transgression.
Christians cannot be accused of sin here as we are not under the law of sin and death.
The law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus sets free from the law of sin and death, (Rom 8:2).
Regarding the law of sin and death it should be noted that:
“whatever the law says it says to those who are under it” (Rom 3:19).
“the law was not made for a righteous person (Christians), but for…the ungodly and for sinners” (1Tim 1:9).
“where there is no law there is no transgression (SIN)” (Rom 4:15).

We know sin was dealt with once and for all on the cross.
And “Our old man is crucified with Christ, that the body of sin might be destroyed” Rom 6:6.
Hence we see in 1Pet 4:1“Therefore, since Christ suffered (crucified) for us in the flesh, arm yourselves also with the same mind (our old man crucified with him. Rom 6:6), for he who has suffered in the flesh (Rom 6:6) has ceased from sin”.

And note Rom 3:25: "Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past,"
It was only our past sins that were forgiven. That means there is no more forgiveness of sin after this as sin was finally dealt with.
And this confirms:
1Pet 4:1 that we have 'ceased from sin'.
1John 3:9 “Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed (Christ) remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God”.
Rom 6:2 asks “HOW shall we that are dead to sin, live in it any longer?”.

I might add, to avoid any misunderstanding, we still see Christians doing wrong (erroneously referred to as sin under man’s ambiguous definitions), but as sons of God we are chastised for our wrong.
King David's adultery and murder an example.

Finally, consider 1Pet 4:18 “If the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and sinner appear”.
Clearly there are 2 different groups described here.
Group 1: Righteous (and saved).
Group 2: Ungodly/Sinner (unsaved).
Either we are righteous (in Christ) OR we are sinners. We can't be both.

Truly Jesus set us free from sin (John 8:36). We are now saints and not sinners.

 

[Episkopos]

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.

The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.

Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.

Thanks

Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???

Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.

The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

 

[seekandfind]

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.

The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.

Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.

Thanks

Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???

Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.

The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

Amen Episcopal,

Paul went into detail about the renewing of the mind, through the washing of the water of the word and the purging of the old leaven that we may be a new lump.

1 Corinthians 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1 Corinthians 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.

He was talking to the church in that passage...

A REAL-ationship is always a two-sided thing. We do indeed have a part.

James 1:22 But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.

 

[haz]

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.

The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.

Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.

Thanks

Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???

Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.

The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

Hi Episkopis,

Your grace+works of the law doctrine you offer is not supported in scripture.

As you claim you still sin then according to your doctrine you will die. It seems that Christ is a stumbling block for you just as he was for physical Israel.

 

[Episkopos]

Hi Episkopis,

Your grace+works of the law doctrine you offer is not supported in scripture.

As you claim you still sin then according to your doctrine you will die. It seems that Christ is a stumbling block for you just as he was for physical Israel.

Is Jesus really what we want Him to be. Your argument shows that you are making Jesus to be as you wish Him to be...then critisize me for making Him harder to reach. What matters is the truth...not your take on it.

We are called to walk in the Spirit in order to overcome the flesh...this is not working by the law...but by divine power through faith. THAT is what the gospel is about.

 

[mark s]

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.

Hi Episkopos,

Again I'd like to draw you towards a Scripture based discussion. Again I will point out . . . I'm going to make simple statements directly supported by Scripture. You speak of "inventing schemes". I'm going to point to the Word.

The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.

Agreed. The soul that sins shall die. We, who have been born again, have died:

Galatians 2:20 ESV
(20) I have been crucified (Lit. "co-crucified") with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ who lives in me. And the life I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me.

Colossians 3:1-4 ESV
(1) If then you have been raised with Christ, seek the things that are above, where Christ is, seated at the right hand of God.
(2) Set your minds on things that are above, not on things that are on earth.
(3) For you have died, and your life is hidden with Christ in God.
(4) When Christ who is your life appears, then you also will appear with him in glory.

Romans 6:5-8 ESV
(5) For if we have been united with him in a death like his, we shall certainly be united with him in a resurrection like his.
(6) We know that our old self was crucified with him in order that the body of sin might be brought to nothing, so that we would no longer be enslaved to sin.
(7) For one who has died has been set free from sin.
(8) Now if we have died with Christ, we believe that we will also live with him.

We joined Jesus in His death, and His death is made our death. We have died, satisfying the requirement under the Law.

Romans 7:4-6 ESV
(4) Likewise, my brothers, you also have died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you may belong to another, to him who has been raised from the dead, in order that we may bear fruit for God.
(5) For while we were living in the flesh, our sinful passions, aroused by the law, were at work in our members to bear fruit for death.
(6) But now we are released from the law, having died to that which held us captive, so that we serve not under the old written code but in the new life of the Spirit.

Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.

Thanks

The true Gospel?

Hebrews 10:11-18 ESV
(11) And every priest stands daily at his service, offering repeatedly the same sacrifices, which can never take away sins.

This speaks of a repeating cycle of sin then reconciliation, sin then reconciliation, always having to "get right" with God, again and again and again.

(12) But when Christ had offeredfor all time a single sacrifice for sins, he sat down at the right hand of God,
(13) waiting from that time until his enemies should be made a footstool for his feet.
(14) For by a single offering he has perfected for all time those who are being sanctified.

By a single sacrifice, Jesus dealt with sins once for all. By a single sacrifice, we who are being sanctified have been perfected for all time.

(15) And the Holy Spirit also bears witness to us; for after saying,
(16) "This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, declares the Lord: I will put my laws on their hearts, and write them on their minds,"
(17) then he adds, "I will remember their sins and their lawless deeds no more."
(18) Where there is forgiveness of these, there is no longer any offering for sin.

What an amazing grace!!! There is no further sacrifice, because are sins have been sent away! All of them! Past, present, future, all of them.

Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???

Saved from our sins . . .

Ephesians 2:1-3 ESV
(1) And you were dead in the trespasses and sins
(2) in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience--
(3) among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.

. . . and from the Father's wrath against sin. (also see below, Romans 5:9)

Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.

All are reconciled to God:

2 Corinthians 5:19 ESV
". . . that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation."

While we were still His enemies, God reconciled us to Himself:

Romans 5:8-10 ESV
(8) but God shows his love for us in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us.
(9) Since, therefore, we have now been justified by his blood, much more shall we be saved by him from the wrath of God.
(10) For if while we were enemies we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, now that we are reconciled, shall we be saved by his life.

We must receive that reconciliation:

Romans 5:11 ESV
More than that, we also rejoice in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, through whom we have now received reconciliation.

2 Corinthians 5:19-20 ESV
(19) that is, in Christ God was reconciling the world to himself, not counting their trespasses against them, and entrusting to us the message of reconciliation.
(20) Therefore, we are ambassadors for Christ, God making his appeal through us. We implore you on behalf of Christ, be reconciled to God.

The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

John 1:11-13 ESV
(11) He came to his own, and his own people did not receive him.
(12) But to all who did receive him, who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God,
(13) who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God.

We have already died in Christ, been born of God, having crucifed the flesh. This has all happened for those who have believed and received.

You can neither add to, nor subtract from your salvation by grace.

Romans 11:6 ESV
(6) But if it is by grace, it is no longer on the basis of works; otherwise grace would no longer be grace.

Grace or works, one or the other, never both.

Love in Christ,
Mark

How to understand sin, now that you are a born again person.....

Hi Kidron,

Just to address one small matter . . .

1st.....Sin is only known as sin when there is God's LAW in effect which reveals it.
Do u understand?
So, When there is no LAW, there is no sin.....Romans 5:17

This would be more correctly stated as, when there is no Law, sin is not imputed.

Romans 5:13 ESV
(13) for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.

Sin is still sin . . .

Romans 5:12-14 ESV
(12) Therefore, just as sin came into the world through one man, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all sinned--
(13) for sin indeed was in the world before the law was given, but sin is not counted where there is no law.
(14) Yet death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over those whose sinning was not like the transgression of Adam, who was a type of the one who was to come.

Everyone sinned, so everyone died, even though they did not break God's commandment, "Do not eat of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil". But until the Law was given, their sins were not counted against them. But sin was still sin, and sin kills.

But that aside . . .

So, what is the eternal effect of this regarding you????.......= God has replaced the Legal basis to see you as a sinner (the Law) with the righteous body of Christ which is the new covenant basis to see you right now....right now... as Forever RIGHTEOUS. ..This is the "gift of righteousness"...Romans 5:16,17.... is your ETERNAL STANDING with God according to HIM.
He cant see you any other way.

Amen!!!

The most wonderful news there could be!!! Truly the Gospel!

Love in Christ,
Mark

 

[Kidron]

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.

The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.

Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.

Thanks

Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???

Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.

The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

There's no end to the unreality. Since when does Jesus pull the wool over the eyes of the Father so He cannot see our true condition? It is a human invention that has to make God change instead of us. WE are to change...God changeth not!!!!! Please refrain from inventing schemes that change God.
The soul that sins...it shall die. Nothing can change that. God doesn't bend His own rules.
Now find out the truth of how this seemingly impossible state of affairs fits in with the true gospel...and STOP seeking a humanly acceptable deniability scheme that lets us sin and get away with it.
Thanks
Ask yourself this...Does Jesus save us from His Father...or from our sins???
Jesus died for the SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD. So if this makes God blind to sin...THEN ALL ARE JUSTIFIED. This is called universalism. Or else you can claim that God has favourites (us 4 and no more) but this directly contradicts the word. No human scheme can explain the truth.
The truth is that we have a part to play in the plan of God. Those that believe and are willing to come under grace (by dying to our old lives) receive the power to become sons of God and overcome sin in the flesh.

Apparently the wool has been pulled over your eyes..

I think it would be very interesting for you to explain your understanding of Salvation.
Very interesting indeed.

Now...the fact is, the truth is, the bottom line is.........Sins, our sins, all of our sins....= have been paid for by the atoning Blood sacrifice of Christ on the cross.
"God made him to be SIN FOR US"...is what your bible explains to you.

So, Why do you think Jesus came?........so that you can pay for your sins later and brag about it?

Ive good news for you.
Jesus died for your sins, and rose again.
This is called the "GOSPEL".
And we as believers have been given the very righteousness of Christ as OUR JUSTIFIED POSITION in God's family.
Amazing isnt it?
God has, through Christ, give you the exact same righteousness as HE HAS..
Thats your born again position.
And this position as a sinless Son of God, is the reason that you are right now seated in heavenly places "in Christ".....Ephesians 2:6.

The very instant a person repents and turns to Christ and sincerely says........"Yes, i BELIEVE,".......then zoom, ..........................gone, are all your sins.......forever.
As Christ has now become your sin bearer..
He takes them, dies for them, so that you dont have to.
Remarkable isn't it?

You are in Christ and Christ is in you.
Both are sinless, both are "one", and the reason is.......God has accepted the death of Christ as the full punishment you deserve for your lifetime of sins.
And if you are born again, then all your sins have been paid for, have been pardoned by, the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ.
This is all your sins..........gone..........as if you never sinned.....Including the ones you will commit today, next week, and in the year 2025, if Jesus tarries.
This is good news isnt it?
Isnt it good news to realize that God does not hold you accountable ever again for your sins, but instead has held his Son accountable for them all.???
Yet for some reason, you want to come here and dispute and argue against the grace of God that is freely given and accepts no works by YOU as a part of his plan of Salvation
Listen, Jesus paid for them, all of them....so that you dont have to..
Now get that down pat.
When we take Christ by faith, God takes us for eternity.......and the "gift of righteousness" has become our "Christian standing" forever.
When we take Christ by faith God takes us for as long as he lives.
And how long does God live?
Thats how long you are saved, ...and it cant be undone and it cant be lost, as God will never take back from you what he died to give you for FREE.

And your "job" Episkopos is not to argue against the grace of God openly in public, but rather to believe it- and rejoice in it- and share it with others.

And by the way..
There is no "universal salvation" :wacko: ......but there is a free gift of salvation offered universally. = Amen.
Perhaps this is what you were trying to explain?
However, for all who would take the free gift of God's righteousness by faith, and are born again.........their sin debt has been eliminated forever.



K

 

[Episkopos]

Apparently the wool has been pulled over your eyes..

I think it would be very interesting for you to explain your understanding of Salvation.
Very interesting indeed.

Now...the fact is, the truth is, the bottom line is.........Sins, our sins, all of our sins....= have been paid for by the atoning Blood sacrifice of Christ on the cross.
"God made him to be SIN FOR US"...is what your bible explains to you.

So, Why do you think Jesus came?........so that you can pay for your sins later and brag about it?

Ive good news for you.
Jesus died for your sins, and rose again.
This is called the "GOSPEL".
And we as believers have been given the very righteousness of Christ as OUR JUSTIFIED POSITION in God's family.
Amazing isnt it?
God has, through Christ, give you the exact same righteousness as HE HAS..
Thats your born again position.
And this position as a sinless Son of God, is the reason that you are right now seated in heavenly places "in Christ".....Ephesians 2:6.

The very instant a person repents and turns to Christ and sincerely says........"Yes, i BELIEVE,".......then zoom, ..........................gone, are all your sins.......forever.
As Christ has now become your sin bearer..
He takes them, dies for them, so that you dont have to.
Remarkable isn't it?

You are in Christ and Christ is in you.
Both are sinless, both are "one", and the reason is.......God has accepted the death of Christ as the full punishment you deserve for your lifetime of sins.
And if you are born again, then all your sins have been paid for, have been pardoned by, the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ.
This is all your sins..........gone..........as if you never sinned.....Including the ones you will commit today, next week, and in the year 2025, if Jesus tarries.
This is good news isnt it?
Isnt it good news to realize that God does not hold you accountable ever again for your sins, but instead has held his Son accountable for them all.???
Yet for some reason, you want to come here and dispute and argue against the grace of God that is freely given and accepts no works by YOU as a part of his plan of Salvation
Listen, Jesus paid for them, all of them....so that you dont have to..
Now get that down pat.
When we take Christ by faith, God takes us for eternity.......and the "gift of righteousness" has become our "Christian standing" forever.
When we take Christ by faith God takes us for as long as he lives.
And how long does God live?
Thats how long you are saved, ...and it cant be undone and it cant be lost, as God will never take back from you what he died to give you for FREE.

And your "job" Episkopos is not to argue against the grace of God openly in public, but rather to believe it- and rejoice in it- and share it with others.

And by the way..
There is no "universal salvation" :wacko: ......but there is a free gift of salvation offered universally. = Amen.
Perhaps this is what you were trying to explain?
However, for all who would take the free gift of God's righteousness by faith, and are born again.........their sin debt has been eliminated forever.



K

Your understanding is a common fable...magic Jesus comes to absolve you to sin as you wish (without trying to of course ) This is totally unbiblical of course.

 

[Kidron]

Your understanding is a common fable...magic Jesus comes to absolve you to sin as you wish (without trying to of course ) This is totally unbiblical of course.

Your understanding is a common fable...magic Jesus comes to absolve you to sin as you wish (without trying to of course ) This is totally unbiblical of course.

The apostle Paul gave us the doctrine of .."justification by faith alone".. which you are calling "unbiblical".
Jesus gave it to him, and Paul gave it to the body of Christ.
So, if you dont like my theology, you definitely dont like theirs......(as you've admitted).

Now, Episkopos i'll ask you a simple question.
What sin...that you commit, >after you are saved<, ...past, present, or future.........has the Blood of Christ and the sacrifice of Christ not paid for already????..
Take your time with your list.
Good luck.

And i notice you didnt give us an answer regarding my previous post's question that asked you to define "Salvation" according to your viewpoint regarding what it is and what it does for us.
(take your time with that also)........(we'll wait).


K

 

[Episkopos]

The apostle Paul gave us the doctrine of .."justification by faith alone".. which you are calling "unbiblical".
Jesus gave it to him, and Paul gave it to the body of Christ.
So, if you dont like my theology, you definitely dont like theirs......(as you've admitted).

Now, Episkopos i'll ask you a simple question.
What sin...that you commit, >after you are saved<, ...past, present, or future.........has the Blood of Christ and the sacrifice of Christ not paid for already????..
Take your time with your list.
Good luck.

And i notice you didnt give us an answer regarding my previous post's question that asked you to define "Salvation" according to your viewpoint regarding what it is and what it does for us.
(take your time with that also)........(we'll wait).


K

\

Here is what the bible actually says...


Rom_3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

You cannot be forgiven ahead of time for future sins. Men seek to take advantage of a merciful God, but He will not be used like that by men.

Heb_10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Try understanding the truth..

Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Gal 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.

 

[Kidron]

\

Here is what the bible actually says...

Still waiting for you to explain your perspective on Salvation.
I see you are still taking your time.
We are still here.........no worries.


Rom_3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;

Absolutely correct
"Sins that are past", and the reason is, the law was abolished by the death of Christ and where no law is, there is no sin charged, ...(go and read my Thread for an update)
God no longer charges "sin" to a born again believer any longer, as he has no legal right to do it because he has come in the Flesh and died for them ALL... Romans 3:8, "blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sins......= all Christians.
Let me explain...
When you sin, God has already paid for it.
Let me say it again..
When you sin....God has already forgiven them ALL based on the finished work, the atonement of Jesus, by the blood of Christ.
Christ has shed his blood already for all of a Christian's lifetime of sins.
All of them are under the blood, washed away by the blood, and eternally forgiven because OF the shed blood of Christ.



You cannot be forgiven ahead of time for future sins. Men seek to take advantage of a merciful God, but He will not be used like that by men.


If all of your sins are not forgiven, then none of them are, and you are still in them.
Did you never read 1st Corin 15:17 that explains that if Christ is not risen you are in your sins, and notice why you are not.....
Because of Faith.......not because of your lifestyle or good deeds or your opinion.
WE are righteous in the eyes of the Almightly based on what God did for us on the Cross, PERIOD!!! and nothing we do in our personal lifestyle, bad or good, has anything to do with it.....ever.
Here is the thing Episkopos,......The blood of Christ has created a redemption that abolished the law, pardoned us for eternity, and cant be undone once its applied to us.
And one more thing that you need to understand.....which is, Christ died in your PAST, so, the past is not the current, Is it???? and so, what happened on the cross over 2000 years ago has the power to take care of sinners in the future, and in this we come to understand that what Christ did long ago, takes care of not only our now, but our future as well. = all your sins are paid for.........past, present, and future.
Christians are as sinless in the eyes of God as Christ is sinless in the eyes of God.
We could not be "in Christ" unless we were sinless.
Thats a fact.




Heb_10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,

Typical....
Are you such a head full of theological errors to actually think to tell us that your sins you committed today were not committed willfully?
You would not try to make us believe you didnt sin today............right?
Now, go ahead and try in your next rant to prove that your sins were not committed this week and next according to your desires, that is to say willfully committed because you wanted to do them.
Let me put it to you straight...........If you want to use "if we sin willfully" as your proof text, then you have actually committed this very verse with your personal daily sin filled existence, unless you want to tell us that all your sins are committed without any knowledge that you were sinning at the time.
If i were you, id stay away from the book of Hebrews for a while, before you realize what you are actually saying., because, running to a letter written to the "Hebrews" to try to prove your lack of understanding of the words ....."justification", "faith", "propitiation", and "redemption" is really not helping your argument, now is it?
And as i wrote here recently.......anytime someone is twisted in their theology, it always always always always manifests as a refusal to accept the FREE Grace of God.
And the offender always 100% of the time runs to Hebrews, James, and Matthew, in that order, to try to convince the believers they can lose their salvation or that the believer has to operate a... "good works, confessing sins, + the Cross"... type of lifestyle > to be saved< instead of trusting completely in the finished atonement that was purchased for you and offered to you for FREE.
Salvation, in case you didnt know Episkopos, is a free Gift.....Romans 5:16,17






Try understanding the truth..


I did more then that.........i explained it....(see my Thread for an update)


Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Gal 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.

\

I\Exactly.
If , after you have known and believed that Faith alone in the redemptive work of Christ on the cross saves you, and then later you fall from this understanding of grace....Galatians 5:4,,, and return back to the law to try to live a life of deeds for salvation, you have made yourself a transgressor of the law and have spit on the Grace of God at the same time....
Paul says you are "in the flesh".

Here is what the bible actually says...

Still waiting for you to explain your perspective on Salvation.
I see you are still taking your time.
We are still here.........no worries.

Rom_3:25 Whom God hath set forth to be a propitiation through faith in his blood, to declare his righteousness for the remission of sins that are past, through the forbearance of God;


Absolutely correct
"Sins that are past", and the reason is, the law was abolished by the death of Christ and where no law is, there is no sin charged, ...(go and read my Thread for an update)
God no longer charges "sin" to a born again believer any longer, as he has no legal right to do it because he has come in the Flesh and died for them ALL... Romans 3:8, "blessed is the man to whom the Lord will not impute sins......= all Christians.
Let me explain...
When you sin, God has already paid for it.
Let me say it again..
When you sin....God has already forgiven them ALL based on the finished work, the atonement of Jesus, by the blood of Christ.
Christ has shed his blood already for all of a Christian's lifetime of sins.
All of them are under the blood, washed away by the blood, and eternally forgiven because OF the shed blood of Christ.

You cannot be forgiven ahead of time for future sins. Men seek to take advantage of a merciful God, but He will not be used like that by men.


If all of your sins are not forgiven, then none of them are, and you are still in them.
Did you never read 1st Corin 15:17 that explains that if Christ is not risen you are in your sins, and notice why you are not.....
Because of Faith.......not because of your lifestyle or good deeds or your opinion.
WE are righteous in the eyes of the Almightly based on what God did for us on the Cross, PERIOD!!! and nothing we do in our personal lifestyle, bad or good, has anything to do with it.....ever.
Here is the thing Episkopos,......The blood of Christ has created a redemption that abolished the law, pardoned us for eternity, and cant be undone once its applied to us.
And one more thing that you need to understand.....which is, Christ died in your PAST, so, the past is not the current, Is it???? and so, what happened on the cross over 2000 years ago has the power to take care of sinners in the future, and in this we come to understand that what Christ did long ago, takes care of not only our now, but our future as well. = all your sins are paid for.........past, present, and future.
Christians are as sinless in the eyes of God as Christ is sinless in the eyes of God.
We could not be "in Christ" unless we were sinless.
Thats a fact.



Heb_10:26 For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,


Typical....
Are you such a head full of theological errors to actually think to tell us that your sins you committed today were not committed willfully?
You would not try to make us believe you didnt sin today............right?
Now, go ahead and try in your next rant to prove that your sins were not committed this week and next according to your desires, that is to say willfully committed because you wanted to do them.
Let me put it to you straight...........If you want to use "if we sin willfully" as your proof text, then you have actually committed this very verse with your personal daily sin filled existence, unless you want to tell us that all your sins are committed without any knowledge that you were sinning at the time.
If i were you, id stay away from the book of Hebrews for a while, before you realize what you are actually saying., because, running to a letter written to the "Hebrews" to try to prove your lack of understanding of the words ....."justification", "faith", "propitiation", and "redemption" is really not helping your argument, now is it?
And as i wrote here recently.......anytime someone is twisted in their theology, it always always always always manifests as a refusal to accept the FREE Grace of God.
And the offender always 100% of the time runs to Hebrews, James, and Matthew, in that order, to try to convince the believers they can lose their salvation or that the believer has to operate a... "good works, confessing sins, + the Cross"... type of lifestyle > to be saved< instead of trusting completely in the finished atonement that was purchased for you and offered to you for FREE.
Salvation, in case you didnt know Episkopos, is a free Gift.....Romans 5:16,17





Gal 2:17 But if, while we seek to be justified by Christ, we ourselves also are found sinners, is therefore Christ the minister of sin? God forbid.
Gal 2:18 For if I build again the things which I destroyed, I make myself a transgressor.


I\Exactly.
If , after you have known and believed that Faith alone in the redemptive work of Christ on the cross saves you, and then later you fall from this understanding of grace....Galatians 5:4,,, and return back to the law to try to live a life of deeds for salvation, you have made yourself a transgressor of the law and have spit on the Grace of God at the same time....
Paul says you are "in the flesh".
So, Episkopos you really dont have a clue that Galatians 1:6-9 was written to you, about you, and your theology.???
You dont realize that the letter to the Galatians was written by Paul, as a response to YOUR Theology that was running around even in Paul's time, that you are exactly preaching here on this forum?
You are the Galatian Christian that Paul is writing about.
Dont believe it?
Read the letter.
Get a reality check and change asap.



K

........................

 

[Episkopos]

........................

Statements such as this show a complete disregard for the truth.. You said

.The blood of Christ has created a redemption that abolished the law,

This is the very opposite of what Jesus said. He came not to abolish the law but fulfill the law. And grace causes us to fulfill the law in Christ and He in us. Notice this...

2Co 5:21 For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.

The law is not sinful...men are. Should we destroy the law so that sinners can hide their sins without any form of detection? God forbid! Are we coming to the light or looking to hide in darkness? There are lawless people here that think that is what Jesus did. The law is perfect. Men cannot follow it. So Jesus came to help us fulfill the law by dying for our past lives and being resurrected in order to impart new life... a life that overcomes sin and fulfills the law. Behold all things are become new....a new nature and a new power to do the commandments of God.
That is the gospel.

We are called to cease from our works and turn to the living God and become renewed through the Spirit in order to remain in Christ and live through Him doing exactly as He has done here on earth.

As He IS so are WE in this world. We have THIS treasure in earthen vessels.

 

[Prentis]

You have twisted the scriptures to fit your delusion, Kidron.

[sup]16 [/sup]For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. (2 Pet.1)

You teach a scheme whereby man is excused, and remains powerless.

But as Paul and Peter agree, the kingdom is in power, and not in word. The gospel is that we can now walk as he walked in the same life, in reality, and cease from sin to live unto God. Anything less than that is a powerless scheme whereby men are trying to save their own skin... But those who seek to save their life will lose it.

 

[jiggyfly]

You have twisted the scriptures to fit your delusion, Kidron.

[sup]16 [/sup]For we have not followed cunningly devised fables, when we made known unto you the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but were eyewitnesses of his majesty. (2 Pet.1)

You teach a scheme whereby man is excused, and remains powerless.

But as Paul and Peter agree, the kingdom is in power, and not in word. The gospel is that we can now walk as he walked in the same life, in reality, and cease from sin to live unto God. Anything less than that is a powerless scheme whereby men are trying to save their own skin... But those who seek to save their life will lose it.

Can you show any examples in scripture where any believers in the new covenant accomplished this? Do you personally know anyone who walks just as Jesus did? How about yourself, is your walk the same as Jesus' was?

 

[haz]

Hi Kidron,

You are already no doubt aware of Episkopis' doctrine and style of discussion, but I'll offer my understanding of his false doctrines and his position as it may be of help.

Episkopis' doctrine is to bring people under works of the law and any who reject his doctrine he labels as "lawless" and believing fables, etc. Also he offers little to no scripture to support his doctrine as he claims there is no point. But it seems he does consider his owns words of more power or impact than God's word.

Episkopis admits he still sins and faces death for it. He is in fact lawless, being guilty of all the law (James 2:10). He is a transgressor/sinner (Gal 2:18). And, he argues for others here to turn to unbelief and be under the law just as he is, joining him in his lawlessness/sin.
He admits he does not walk in the Spirit and personally he knows of nobody today who does. This is at odds with the NT however where believers walked in the Spirit and were referred to as saints, righteous, holy, etc.

Episkopis' doctrine is lukewarm (Rev 3:16) mixing grace and works of the law. But this cannot be as Rom 11:6 says.

 

[Episkopos]

Hi Kidron,

You are already no doubt aware of Episkopis' doctrine and style of discussion, but I'll offer my understanding of his false doctrines and his position as it may be of help.

Episkopis' doctrine is to bring people under works of the law and any who reject his doctrine he labels as "lawless" and believing fables, etc. Also he offers little to no scripture to support his doctrine as he claims there is no point. But it seems he does consider his owns words of more power or impact than God's word.

Episkopis admits he still sins and faces death for it. He is in fact lawless, being guilty of all the law (James 2:10). He is a transgressor/sinner (Gal 2:18). And, he argues for others here to turn to unbelief and be under the law just as he is, joining him in his lawlessness/sin.
He admits he does not walk in the Spirit and personally he knows of nobody today who does. This is at odds with the NT however where believers walked in the Spirit and were referred to as saints, righteous, holy, etc.

Episkopis' doctrine is lukewarm (Rev 3:16) mixing grace and works of the law. But this cannot be as Rom 11:6 says.

Episkopos sure would seem like a bad dude according to this proof!

Can you show any examples in scripture where any believers in the new covenant accomplished this? Do you personally know anyone who walks just as Jesus did? How about yourself, is your walk the same as Jesus' was?

This is the thing...nobody is going to wear a sign around their neck that says...Hey! I'm walking in Christ alone and no longer sinning!!! Someone who doesn't sin is not going to go around claiming this. If fact the proof we are looking for vanishes as it is being declared. So this is something we must accept by faith...that others are more advanced (if our egos let us) than us. A child can accept this...

As humans we can only see the outside actions of a person. But God looks at the heart and the real condition of a person. We can't see that. God's law looks into the secret parts of the heart. It is the bible that testifies that we are to be perfect as God is perfect. This is not made up...it can be actually read in the bible. Therefore, rather than seeking proof, which God will never provide us with without faith first, let us look at what the bible says...without watering down the message.

Christians are supposed to walk by faith...not be cynical and doubting. Does anyone believe they have entertained angels by inviting strangers to the table anymore? The bible says that this is possible! Why doubt and ask if anyone actually ever experienced this??? Where is the childlike acceptance of what the bible testifies to?

A sinner asumes that everyone is just like him...to one with a dark eye everything is dark.

To the one who has faith in God ALL things are possible. One either has this faith...or not.

 

[us2are1]

How did you become a born again person?

What gospel did you believe to be saved?

Only the gospel of Christ can save anyone.

Here are the elementary principals of Christ that you must know, understand and accept to the doing of them to be saved. From here you must move on to perfection by serving no one but God through Christ.

1 repentance from dead works.
2 Faith toward God.
3 Doctrine of baptisms
4 Doctrine of laying on of hands
5 Doctrine of resurrection of the dead
6 Doctrine of eternal judgment




Hebrews 6
1 Therefore, leaving the discussion of the elementary principles of Christ, let us go on to perfection, not laying again the foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God,
2 of the doctrine of baptisms, of laying on of hands, of resurrection of the dead, and of eternal judgment.

2 Peter 2
19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.

 

[Prentis]

Episkopos sure would seem like a bad dude according to this proof!



This is the thing...nobody is going to wear a sign around their neck that says...Hey! I'm walking in Christ alone and no longer sinning!!! Someone who doesn't sin is not going to go around claiming this. If fact the proof we are looking for vanishes as it is being declared. So this is something we must accept by faith...that others are more advanced (if our egos let us) than us. A child can accept this...

As humans we can only see the outside actions of a person. But God looks at the heart and the real condition of a person. We can't see that. God's law looks into the secret parts of the heart. It is the bible that testifies that we are to be perfect as God is perfect. This is not made up...it can be actually read in the bible. Therefore, rather than seeking proof, which God will never provide us with without faith first, let us look at what the bible says...without watering down the message.

Christians are supposed to walk by faith...not be cynical and doubting. Does anyone believe they have entertained angels by inviting strangers to the table anymore? The bible says that this is possible! Why doubt and ask if anyone actually ever experienced this??? Where is the childlike acceptance of what the bible testifies to?

A sinner asumes that everyone is just like him...to one with a dark eye everything is dark.

To the one who has faith in God ALL things are possible. One either has this faith...or not.

Amen!

If one is still in unbelief after hearing the word of God, man can add nothing to it.

1 Peter 4 Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; [sup]2 [/sup]That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God.

Does anyone believe the testimony of Peter here? Or the testimony of John, that those who proclaim to know the Lord should walk as he walked?

Joshua and Caleb, though they saw the giants, and no visible sign of any victory, and though it had not been done before, believed the word of the Lord, that he would give the land into their hands.

If we are asking for more than God's word, we still walk in unbelief.

 

[Kidron]

Hi Kidron,

You are already no doubt aware of Episkopis' doctrine and style of discussion, but I'll offer my understanding of his false doctrines and his position as it may be of help.

Episkopis' doctrine is to bring people under works of the law and any who reject his doctrine he labels as "lawless" and believing fables, etc. Also he offers little to no scripture to support his doctrine as he claims there is no point. But it seems he does consider his owns words of more power or impact than God's word.

Episkopis admits he still sins and faces death for it. He is in fact lawless, being guilty of all the law (James 2:10). He is a transgressor/sinner (Gal 2:18). And, he argues for others here to turn to unbelief and be under the law just as he is, joining him in his lawlessness/sin.
He admits he does not walk in the Spirit and personally he knows of nobody today who does. This is at odds with the NT however where believers walked in the Spirit and were referred to as saints, righteous, holy, etc.

Episkopis' doctrine is lukewarm (Rev 3:16) mixing grace and works of the law. But this cannot be as Rom 11:6 says.

Episkopis' doctrine is to bring people under works of the law and any who reject his doctrine he labels as "lawless" and believing fables, etc. Also he offers little to no scripture to support his doctrine as he claims there is no point. But it seems he does consider his owns words of more power or impact than God's word.

Episkopis admits he still sins and faces death for it. He is in fact lawless, being guilty of all the law (James 2:10). He is a transgressor/sinner (Gal 2:18). And, he argues for others here to turn to unbelief and be under the law just as he is, joining him in his lawlessness/sin.
He admits he does not walk in the Spirit and personally he knows of nobody today who does. This is at odds with the NT however where believers walked in the Spirit and were referred to as saints, righteous, holy, etc.

Episkopis' doctrine is lukewarm (Rev 3:16) mixing grace and works of the law. But this cannot be as Rom 11:6 says.

Yes, Episkopis, is typical of someone who, if they are saved, and im not saying they are not, nor am i saying they are..., is certainly mentally locked up in extreme legalism.
Ive not read their reply today, so, im hoping they have the courage to answer my question i posed to them 2 or 3 times about "salvation".
If they answered it, good for me, im certainly looking forward to hearing how they explain God's gift of Salvation now that ive discovered how deeply legalistic they are in their theology
And also,...there is one thing about it that has to be considered.
The Grace of God, as provided by the Cross, is a free Gift., and you cant receive it if you are trapped inside the type legalistic mindset that Episkopis has locked themselves into.

God set up the system of salvation based on Him dying for you, and providing it for free.
So, if a person cant understand this, and cant accept it, then how can they possess it?
If a person refuses to allow God's gift to be freely given and never earned, then how can they believe according to the truth?

This is why i keep asking Episkopis to explain his understanding of Salvation, so that i can see exactly what im dealing with , tho, im certain i already know.

If you were to find out all that he believes, i would wager a Mars bar and a Pepsi that Episkopis believes you can lose your salvation.
I would wager that Mars bar and a cold Pepsi that he would tell you that "no one can know for certain if they are going to heaven until after they die".
He believes that "only those who endure to the end can be saved".
He believes that water baptism saves you.
He believes that faith alone in the shed blood of Christ is not Salvation but rather its the cross and our "Living it", "confessing our sins", and so forth that defines salvation.
Episkopis, is not someone who is familiar with the gift of righteousness, nor is he familiar with our position "in Christ".
I wonder what part Mary plays in his theology...
It would be very interesting to find out what denomination he belong to,.(Legalistic Episcopalian)?????? as im certain this is where his issue accepting the free gift of salvation all began.

For my money, i could not ask for a better type to show up on my Thread.
He is exactly the extreme legalistic type that a faith based born again Christian who reads this thread needs to become exposed to, because in this any Christian who is interested in sound NT doctrine can learn what to avoid, why to avoid it, and how.
For me, its always interesting to read the scriptures one of these types uses to prove their mindset.
I can always count on the book of Hebrews to play a huge role in their mixed up theological mess.




K