Is baptism necessary for salvation?

[TonyChanYT]

Ephesians 2:

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast.

Is water baptism necessary for salvation?

Technically, no, because technically, baptism is a kind of ritualistic work. See also This water symbolizes baptism that now saves you.

Mark 16:

15 And he said to them, “Go into all the world and proclaim the gospel to the whole creation.

The great commission is the context.

16 Whoever believes and is baptized will be saved,

Is water baptism optional?

No, believers are commanded to be baptized. Belief and baptism go hand in hand together. Jesus commanded us to spread the good news and baptize people who believe. Looking at baptism as an outward sign of salvation accompanied by inward repentance and faith, then baptism does save.

but whoever does not believe will be condemned.

Belief is the key to salvation, not baptism. It does not say:

1. He who believes and is not baptized will be condemned
2. He who is not baptized will be condemned.

When a person believes, he should be baptized as soon as possible. Belief and baptism are a tightly knitted pair. If a person claims to believe but refuses to be baptized, then there is something wrong with his understanding of salvation.

Does baptism save?

Looking at baptism as an outward ritualistic work, it does not save anyone. However, looking at baptism as a sign of inward repentance and faith, then it does confirm salvation. God often uses external (physical) appearance to symbolize internal (spiritual) reality.

See also

• born of the Spirit
• When should you get baptized?

 

[St. SteVen]

Is water baptism necessary for salvation?

No.
This is a good question for this forum.
I'm surprised at how many on this form believe that water baptism is necessary for salvation.
Coming from the Acts 2:38 bunch, who claim no forgiveness of sins without baptism.

"And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ
for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." - Acts 2:38 ESV

Is water baptism optional?

I would say, "Yes."
A person should not be forced into water baptism.
They should be led by God.
And if for some reason they are not comfortable with it,
there are more important things to focus on.

In some cases it may be a family issue.
If someone was baptized as a child in another church,
being re-baptized may offend family members.

 

[amadeus]

Mt 3:13	Then cometh Jesus from Galilee to Jordan unto John, to be baptized of him.
Mt 3:14	But John forbad him, saying, I have need to be baptized of thee, and comest thou to me?
Mt 3:15	And Jesus answering said unto him, Suffer it to be so now: for thus it becometh us to fulfil all righteousness. Then he suffered him.

@TonyChanYT
@St. SteVen

Should being like him include being baptized also in water as he was?

1jo 3:2

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

 

[St. SteVen]

Should being like him include being baptized also in water as he was?

That's a good question.

We should consider:
- What was the PURPOSE of Jesus' baptism by John? And,,,
- What is the PURPOSE of our baptism by the church?

I'm amazed at the audacious claim by some that they want to live like Jesus did.

Seriously?
You want to wander homeless with a band of 12 misfits going from
town to town casting out demons, healing the sick and raising the dead.
And get yourself in enough trouble to be crucified?
Sure, why not? - LOL

 

[St. SteVen]

Looking at baptism as an outward ritualistic work, it does not save anyone.

This is a great point as well.
Especially for anyone/everyone that believes we are NOT saved by works.

Baptism is a religious ceremony,
And a religious ceremony SHOULD BE an outward sign of an inward reality,
Nothing more.

 

[amadeus]

That's a good question.

We should consider:
- What was the PURPOSE of Jesus' baptism by John? And,,,
- What is the PURPOSE of our baptism by the church?

Was it not as Jesus said to fulfill all righteousness?
as to why the various "churches" practice it we would have to look each of them. I've done some of what friend @TonyChanYT did visiting many church meetings of assorted churches. I did that until God stopped me.

I'm amazed at the audacious claim by some that they want to live like Jesus did.

Seriously?
You want to wander homeless with a band of 12 misfits going from
town to town casting out demons, healing the sick and raising the dead.
And get yourself in enough trouble to be crucified?
Sure, why not? - LOL

I have never gotten quite that literal in my desires or practices, but for some people it might really bring them closer to God. We need to be careful about being too critical of the precise way another follower of Christ is walking or trying to walk. We are not all the same member of the Body of Christ.

 

[St. SteVen]

Was it not as Jesus said to fulfill all righteousness?

Wasn't clear what that was in reference to. ??? And John resisted.
Why would John resist, if that was the understanding?
And Jesus being baptized wouldn't be for the same reason we would. ???
It's a curious thing.

I have never gotten quite that literal in my desires or practices, but for some people it might really bring them closer to God. We need to be careful about being too critical of the precise way another follower of Christ is walking or trying to walk. We are not all the same member of the Body of Christ.

Right.
We tend to be pretty quick to tell others how it should be done.
My personal favorite is non-tongue speakers instructing tongues-speakers on how it should be done. - LOL
As if they are some sort of experts on the subject qualified to correct the other.

 

[amadeus]

Wasn't clear what that was in reference to. ??? And John resisted.
Why would John resist, if that was the understanding?
And Jesus being baptized wouldn't be for the same reason we would. ???
It's a curious thing.

John did not understand as perhaps we also do not understand. God has share many things with me... but certainly not all. John simply did understand that Jesus was greater and why would the greater require such an apparent reversal of roles, the servant versus the Master?

Mt 4:11

Then the devil leaveth him, and, behold, angels came and ministered unto him.

But then...

Mr 10:45

For even the Son of man came not to be ministered unto, but to minister, and to give his life a ransom for many And... Mr 10:43 But so shall it not be among you: but whosoever will be great among you, shall be your minister:

Right.
We tend to be pretty quick to tell others how it should be done.
My personal favorite is non-tongue speakers instructing tongues-speakers on how it should be done. - LOL
As if they are some sort of experts on the subject qualified to correct the other.

There's a whole lot of that going on within this forum... but as Solomon wrote, every man is right in his own eyes.

 

[Grailhunter]

Sometimes I think that there are people that would question if faith is required to get to Heaven. LOL

It is probably easier to cut to the chase and ask; Is repentance and water baptism and the Bread and Wine Ritual required to get to Heaven? Then site the exact words that actually say that repentance and water baptism and the Bread and Wine Ritual are not required to get to Heaven? The actual words. Find in the Bible word for word that they are not required.

 

[marks]

Sometimes I think that there are people that would question if faith is required to get to Heaven. LOL

I ran into someone a week or so again, here on this forum, who said that faith is not required, because infant baptism saves, and babies don't know to believe, so they are saved fully apart from faith. I questioned about this very point, and the response was, we are guilty of original sin apart from ourselves (we didn't do it, nor did we have a choice), therefore we can be justified from it apart from ourselves, apart from our own choosing.

Much love!

 

[TonyChanYT]

as to why the various "churches" practice it we would have to look each of them. I've done some of what friend @TonyChanYT did visiting many church meetings of assorted churches. I did that until God stopped me.

Interesting, brother. What got you started? What got you to stop?

At the beginning about 3 years ago, I was being rather systemic in visiting churches in Toronto, from downtown outward by TTC transit. At this point, I have been to about 80% of them. I am not as motivated now because the rest are rather far away. I have been revisiting some of my favorite ones and I am thinking about settling down on one that I would call home church

 

[GRACE ambassador]

op: Is water baptism necessary for salvation?:
Depends which 'economy' of God that one is in - ie:

Three Different Baptisms to prayerfully / Carefully consider:​

In God's Previous Context Of Prophecy / Covenants / Law for
( the "lost sheep" of the house of ) Israel, in Yesterday's economy!:

►►► The Twelve Were Sent to { water } baptize! ◄◄◄

The Two Main (of 12 ) baptismS =

A) water, For remission of sins / induction into Israeli "priesthood!":
(Matthew_3:5-6; Mark_1:4; Luke_3:3; John_1:31; Luke 7:29-30 = Yes, For remission of sins!)
(Acts_10:37 Matthew_28:19; Mark_16:16; Acts_2:38 = Yes, For remission of sins!, 22:16;
Ezekiel_36:25; Isaiah 52:15)

+

B) With The Holy Spirit, Poured Out By CHRIST, for power, signs And wonders!
(Isaiah_44:3; Matthew_3:11; Mark_1:8, 16:17-18;
Luke_24:49; Acts_2:17-18, 38, 8:15-17, 11:16)

Prophecy/Covenants/Law for Israel!

Rightly Divided (2 Timothy 2:15) From “Things That Differ” (online)

In God's Other Distinctive Context ( Today's economy! ) of:

Mystery / Grace! (Romans - Philemon) =​

our "apostle to the Gentiles" for The Body Of Christ, Currently!:

►►► Paul Was Not Sent to { water } baptize! Why Not?: ◄◄◄

Today, Paul's "But Now":

Only One Baptism = "By" The One Spirit = God's Operation ( For Forgiveness of sin! ),
Spiritually Identifying members In (The One Body Of) Christ!!
(Ephesians 4:5; Colossians_2:12; Galatians_3:27;
Romans_6:3-4; 1 Corinthians 12:13 KJB)

------------------------------------------------------

Conclusion: I believe "God's One Baptism 'By The One Holy Spirit' For The One Body of Christ,
Today, Under Grace / Mystery" Replaces Both:

"water baptism And The Baptism With The Holy Spirit, which were/will be under
God's Other program of prophecy / Covenants / Law for Israel!"

Who is willing to "give an account To God," for changing His One Baptism Into two?
Or Even? [ Blaspheming The One Holy Spirit? ] by marrying It ↑ into one With water?

Amen.

This have also been Very Helpful:

Water That Divides!!
-------------------------
More study:

Divider Poll
+
13 Bible baptisms

Amen.

 

[amadeus]

Interesting, brother. What got you started? What got you to stop?

At the beginning about 3 years ago, I was being rather systemic in visiting churches in Toronto, from downtown outward by TTC transit. At this point, I have been to about 80% of them. I am not as motivated now because the rest are rather far away. I have been revisiting some of my favorite ones and I am thinking about settling down on one that I would call home church

For many years I attended an assembly that had services starting at 4:30 PM on Sundays. That left my Sunday mornings free so I got in the habit of visiting other places on Sunday mornings. Eventually as our pastor and his wife chased people away the home church for me finally closed it doors. Before that happened we, my wife and I, were attending another place about 50 miles away. After doing that for a couple of years we finally moved our residence to the town where the church was located. We attended there until 2018 when our old pastor a wonderful man of God was forced to retire. We left when he did.

Then began my regular search among other places to attend. This continued until March of 2020 when most of the assemblies stopped live services due to COVID-19. By the time that was over and I might have been ready to start searching again, I was diagnosed with lung cancer. During that period, I was physically unable to attend any more. Now I am cancer free, thank the Lord, but I am unable to drive a car and no one in my family is willing or able to drive me... so I mostly stay home and get what I can from Internet services and my own private times with God...

 

[Grailhunter]

Sometimes I think that there are people that would question if faith is required to get to Heaven. LOL

It is probably easier to cut to the chase and ask; Is repentance and water baptism and the Bread and Wine Ritual required to get to Heaven? Then site the exact words that actually say that repentance and water baptism and the Bread and Wine Ritual are not required to get to Heaven? The actual words. Find in the Bible word for word that they are not required.

So then if you cannot find it....and you won't....You are back to....Why do you call me 'Lord, Lord,' and not do what I tell you? Everyone who comes to me and hears my words and does them, I will show you what he is like: he is like a man building a house, who dug deep and laid the foundation on the rock. Luke 6:46-49

 

[TonyChanYT]

Depends which 'economy' of God that one is in - ie:

Define economy of God

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Define economy of God

= Dispensation or administration of God

 

[TonyChanYT]

= Dispensation or administration of God

Can you support your definition with a verse?

 

[GRACE ambassador]

Can you support your definition with a verse?

4 Passages:

1Co_9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

Eph_1:10 That in the dispensation of the fulness of times He might gather together in one all things in Christ, both which are in heaven, and which are on earth; even in Him:

Eph_3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:

Col_1:25 Whereof I am made a minister, according to the dispensation of God which is given to me for you, to fulfil the word of God;

Amen.

 

[TonyChanYT]

1Co_9:17 For if I do this thing willingly, I have a reward: but if against my will, a dispensation of the gospel is committed unto me.

Actually, that is a mistranslation. See A DISPENSATION of the gospel is committed unto me

 

[St. SteVen]

New topic to check out. Are you in exile?

In exile from the church - disconnected from what?

Whether by personal decision, or being forced out, some (or many?) are exiled from the institution of the church. I did some quick research to see if there are any statistics on Christians leaving the church. Wanting to know if it really is just SOME, or if it is MANY. (probably many, but...)...

www.christianityboard.com