Israel, the Church, and the Rapture

[friend of]

If the rapture is mid trib then why are people told to flee Jerusalem? It wouldn't matter where they physically are on earth at the time of the rapture

 

[Curtis]

If the rapture is mid trib then why are people told to flee Jerusalem? It wouldn't matter where they physically are on earth at the time of the rapture

The Jews, who are living in Judea are told to flee the area when the antichrist steps into their temple and desecrates it and commits the abomination of desolation by claiming to be God, since that’s the start of the great tribulation, and by claiming to be God, the Jews realize He’s not their messiah as they thought he was, but the false Messiah, the counterfeit Christ aka the antichrist, and things are going to get deadly.

 

[friend of]

The Jews, who are living in Judea are told to flee the area when the antichrist steps into their temple and desecrates it and commits the abomination of desolation by claiming to be God, since that’s the start of the great tribulation, and by claiming to be God, the Jews realize He’s not their messiah as they thought he was, but the false Messiah, the counterfeit Christ aka the antichrist, and things are going to get deadly.

But then the rapture happens according to you. So why go to the trouble of moving out of Jerusalem if they are just going to be raptured anyway?

 

[Curtis]

But then the rapture happens according to you. So why go to the trouble of moving out of Jerusalem if they are just going to be raptured anyway?

Because if you go to Judea, you don’t find a Christian city, you find Jews who keep the sabbath and will be involved in sacrifices of animals under the law of Moses in the temple that the antichrist goes into and stops the sacrifices in - thus they wont be raptured, because they aren’t Christians.

Any other questions?

Baruch HaShem Adonai.

 

[Truman]

That's very interesting to me!

:)

My idea is that someone who holds a strong distinction between the church and Israel will be pre-trib, while someone who considers them one and the same will see a later rapture, either pre-wrath or post-trib. So you hold still a partial distinction between the church and Israel, that they are somewhat the same, and somewhat different, and are somewhat pre-trib but somewhat not.

Does that make sense?

Am I on the right track?

Much love!

He'll be back, that's about as far as I go there. As far as the distinction between Israel and the church goes, it's almost like there's two covenants. I see like a fat, white Y, two branches of one thing. I'm describing something I saw in the Spirit.
Two years ago I thought I was an English-Canadian Christian. Now I am a descendent of a Levite who was taken into captivity by the Assyrian army. This matters a lot to me...it's who I am. It's a difficult transition. It's like I'm turning into someone I don't know...who is me. It can be confusing.
I was just looking through a book of Jewish surnames and wondered if there were any similar to mine, which is Coates. There was one...it was Coates! Then I remember a few times in my life when I was asked if I was Jewish. I was puzzled why someone would ask me that. I recently remembered that I have 2 close cousin families nearby...Chapman and Brown.
Then I remembered hearing long ago that my uncle, I think, was Jewish. Then I remembered that my brother-in-law is Obermeyer.
A musician I used to minister with. I never used to know anything about Jews. My dad used to say that religion was something you kept to yourself. He was, for most of his life, an atheist.
God has me at a place where a lot of things I thought were settled are once again open for consideration. Unsettling, and yet I feel His peace. Shalom.

 

[Taken]

The key of understanding is the fact that there is general tribulation for 3.5 years, then great tribulation for 3.5 years, and Jesus uses both terms in Matthew 24.

Jesus says, that after THE tribulation of those days, the day of the Lord and rapture will occur- confirming that the rapture is after the first half of the tribulation.

Then, Jesus also says that AFTER the mid trib event of the abomination of desolation in verse 15 occurs, there shall be GREAT tribulation - confirming that the last half of the tribulation, called the great tribulation, occurs after that mid trib AOD event.

So the account is THE tribulation - the first 3.5 years - followed by the DOL and the rapture: then the GREAT tribulation starts, right after the AOD/SOP mid trib event, the DOL, and rapture occurs.

That puts the son of perdition/abomination of desolation, the Day of the Lord, and the rapture right smack in the middle, between THE tribulation, and the GREAT tribulation.

Page 1 of 4

Agree there IS a KEY to Understanding Scripture, and that KEY is the Lord God, (not flesh and blood).

The discussion IS more about ORDER of Events, which IS given us IN Scripture.

You speak of a difference between a "General Tribulation and Great Tribulation", divided by timeframe.

I get your point. However, there is more to it than, Time-wise.
The WHO, reveals the ORDER, and WHAT and WHEN and WHY.

The WHAT, is Tribulation.
The WHY, is for Anger.
The ANGER, is for Rejection.
The REJECTION, results in WRATH.
The WRATH, is a Punishment UPON the PERSONS, WHO, REJECTED.

The WHO, (is SPIRIT vs MANKIND)
(Throughout History;
Some-Mankind....Accepts Spirit God
Some-Mankind....Rejects Spirit God
Some-Mankind....Accepts spirit satan
Some-Mankind....Rejects spirit satan
Some-Mankind....Accepts Spirit Christ Jesus
Some-Mankind....Rejects Spirit Christ Jesus)

The WHO, of Some-Mankind, BECOMES, the WHO, that IS "punished" for REJECTION...
OF....Spirit God, spirit satan, Spirit Christ Jesus.

The ORDER, of "introduction"... ON EARTH.
Gen 1 & 2
1st God
2nd satan (cast down before mankind creation)
3rd mankind

The ORDER of curse...
Gen 3
1st satan
2nd woman
3rd man

The Order of Trib GODS Wrath...OT
Gods Wrath UPON Earth & Inhabitants.
ALL Mankind, subject to Wrath & Tribulation?
(Entire World Population...
"EXCEPTING EIGHT" of Some Mankind).
THE EIGHT PERSONS...Noah & family.

The "WAY" /"HOW' of EXCEPTING (FROM Gods TRIB WRATH "UPON" the EARTH)...the Eight of mankind.

THE MAJOR FACTS...
Tribulation WRATH OF GOD, IS ALWAYS UPON the HABITAT of the thing (ie mankind). The thing (mankind)...IS thus Negatively Effected, when it's HABITAT IS DESTROYED.
Gen 7:4

Noah's Habitat WAS "THE FACE OF THE EARTH"...(Earth IS Dry Land)...
Noah, mankind, COULD NOT "BE" ON the FACE OF DRY LAND, WHILE GOD WAS DESTROYING, THE FACE OF DRY LAND!!!

SO the question IS: "HOW was Noah"...
"SAVED" from Destruction?

Scripture Reveals the Answer.
1) Noah WAS "LIFTED UP OFF the FACE OF THE EARTH".
2) What was "OF NOAH" WAS SAVED?
Answer, revealed....BODY, SOUL, SPIRIT, of Noah.
3) TO WHERE was Noah, LIFTED UP TO?
4) THE CLOUDS! 15 cubits ABOVE the Mountains tops. Gen 7:20
5) IN the Clouds...NOAH (& family, body, soul, spirit) WERE SAVED "FROM" Destruction "GODS WRATH and TRIBULATION was BEING EFFECTED "UPON" the Earth and it's inhabitants".

THAT ^ was the 1st Great Tribulation.
Scripture REVEALS...a 2nd (and LAST) Great Tribulation SHALL Occur.
Scripture ALSO reveals: Nothing NEW under the sun. WHAT WAS: shall be AGAIN!

 

[Taken]

Continued Page 2 of 4.

Remember...the ORDER of the curse...
Satan, woman, man.
Remember....
WHO is subject to the curse;
WHO is EXCEPTED FROM the curse; & WHY.
WHO...is the Spiritual POWER:
THAT....Delievers Wrath UPON "inhabitants",
"UPON" the Earth.

2nd (& LAST) GREAT TRIBULATION -
The WHO...ie. ~ spirits, with POWER of "their" Wrath. (FOR REJECTION)...

* 3rd SPIRIT REVEALED....Christ Jesus
(1 Cor 15:45)
* 2nd spirit revealed...satan
* 1st SPIRIT Revealed....God

Review (REVELATIONS)...
WHOSE... WRATH IS revealed;
1st?
THE LAMBS. (Rev 6:16)
Wrath UPON what? The EARTH.
WHAT INHABITANTS ARE ON the EARTH,
(BEING EFFECTED BY the WRATH of the LAMB ???)

As IN THE DAYS OF NOAH....(spirit Wrath)...
THE WRATH of the LAMB, IS "UPON" the INHABITANTS "UPON" the Face of the Earth...
WHO... REJECTED "THE LAMB" !

WHO - IS EXCEPTED....ie NOT SUBJECT TO THE LAMBS WRATH?
The VERY SAME (mankind) WHO...DID NOT REJECT the LAMB!

AND SO....."HOW are "THEY" SAVED...
FROM....the Lambs Wrath ?
* Nothing new under the sun.
* Same AS IN Noah's Day.
SAVED...(body, soul, spirit)...
LIFTED UP, from the FACE OF THE EARTH.
TO WHERE? The CLOUDS!

AND?????
IS ALL OF THE "ENTIRE" world POPULATION, then "DESTROYED"...OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH?

No. WHY NOT?
BECAUSE "mankind", WAS "MADE" DIVIDED.
"MADE" DIVIDED, HOW and BY WHOM?
* DIVIDED, BY Christ Jesus Himself...
* WHO was DIVIDED? Mankind, WHO believed ONLY IN GOD, and Mankind WHO believed IN God and His Christ, Jesus, the Lamb OF God.
* WHEN was the DIVISION? WHEN the Christ Arrived ON Earth and Provoked a DIVISION.
* WHY? To provoke the PEOPLE "OF GOD"...
Hebrews, Tribes, Jews, TO JEALOUSLY...that GENTILES WOULD ACCEPT....Gods Christ, WHEN the Jews themselves, could NOT BELIEVE, JESUS, was their Christ Messiah.
....Luke 12:51 ~ John 7:43 ~ Rom 11:11

 

[Taken]

Continued Page 3 of 4


The 2nd TRIBULATION BEGINS WITH the Lambs WRATH...
The FOCUS IS UPON, THOSE Expressly...WHO HAVE "REJECTED"......THE LAMB....
BUT HAVE NOT.....REJECTED.....GOD!

This REFLECTS, "your general Tribulation".
It "IS" general" in the sense, IT does NOT affect the ENTIRE WORLD Population.
It "is NOT" Really "general"....in the sense, IT IS SPECIFICALLY a WRATH, TOWARD the:
Hebrews, Tribes, Jews (whatever THEY call themselves)....WHO...ARE maintaining THEIR BELIEF IN GOD....BUT HAVE "REJECTED" the Holy One God SENT...ie "THEIR Christ the Lord Jesus Messiah...ie THEIR SALVATION".

THE LAMB...has THE BOOK, of 7 SEALS.
Every SEAL the LAMB OPENS reveals, A message TO THE ELECT of God....Gods PEOPLE, ISRAEL (Hebrews, Tribes, Jews).
* the Revealing...goes back to OT history...
WHEN God Ruled HIS PEOPLE and MEN "BEGGED" for a "MAN king ruler". God gave them reasons to NOT ask for a "MAN king ruler, as the gentiles had"....but Gods PEOPLE..."insisted"...AND as GOD IS JUST...He gives to men, what their heart desires....
* Follow the History...The Corruption of MEN rulers, the Oppression the Jews have SUFFERED, at the hands of MEN rulers...
* God comes to their RESCUE...and repeatedly, they fall, at the hands of MEN, experience a BIT of Comfort, (BY Gods Works), they they turn to exalting MAN).

God SENDS them SALVATION...Again, AT FIRST, they ACCEPT, then fall AGAIN, to MANS rulership, and IGNORE, what GOD has FREELY OFFERED TO GIVE THEM.

THE LAST GREAT TRIBULATION...IS ABOUT...
WHO (of some MANKIND)....
HAVE REJECTED...."SPIRIT POWER", WHOM "such SPIRIT"...HAS the "POWER AND AUTHORITY" TO CAUSE WRATH UPON those that DO THE REJECTING.

* A MAN "IN" CHRIST .... HAS ALREADY ACCEPTED....GOD and Gods Holy Christ, WHOM God SENT.

REVIEW the History...
Remember the REPEAT of History!
Study, the revealed NT Script.
A man "IN" full Acceptance OF GOD, of HIS Christ......IS NOT SUBJECT TO "spiritual caused" WRATH....
Of....God
Of....Christ Jesus
Of....satan.

REVIEW the History...
HOW..God "SAVED" Noah FROM Gods WRATH.
Study, the revealed NT Script.
IT IS THE SAME METHOD...
THE SAVED...body, soul, spirit...LIFTED UP "OFF THE FACE OF THE EARTH"..."TO THE CLOUDS"...

THE RAPTURE...IS EXPRESSLY: IN REGARD TO; (some) MEN ON EARTH;
WHO....have EXPRESSLY ACCEPTED;
GOD and Gods Christ...
THAT "THEY" are EXPRESSLY...
NOT SUBJECT TO "ANY" spiritual caused; WRATH!
"THEY Expressly are WHO, IS LIFTED UP, off the Face of the Earth!" 1 Thes 5:9

The Hebrews, Tribes, Jews.....WHO "have" KEPT their Belief IN GOD...but WHO "have" REJECTED....Gods Christ the Lord Jesus, their Messiah, their Salvation... SHALL SUFFER THE WRATH of the LAMB!

THEY (JEWS) are SENT...DURING THE TRIBULATION...Gods Servants...(JEWS) to TEACH THEM, (that which they (mankind Jews) STOPPED teaching for nearly 2,000 years)...that Jesus IS THEIR CHRIST MESSIAH.

AFTER suffering the Wrath of the LAMB DURING the Tribulation...they (many Jews), BEGIN ACCEPTING, JESUS, as their CHRIST MESSIAH.

THEY BECOME....
"soul Saved",
"spirit Quickened"
and "bodily KILLED!"

* THEY...."saved soul, quickened spirit"...IS RISEN "UP" to Heaven...
* What YOU ARE CALLING A MID-TRIB "RAPTURE", but isn't, BECAUSE:
THEIR DEAD BODY, Remains "ON EARTH"...
WHICH IS The SAME...that presently occurs...
FOR ANY MAN IN Christ, WHOSE...BODY DIES, and "his" saved soul, quickened spirit, rises up to Heaven.

* IT is NOT a MID-TRIB "RAPTURE".
BECAUSE...their DEAD BODY "REMAINS ON EARTH"...
Same as today, of ANY man IN Christ, whose BODY DIES....ONLY their Saved soul and Quickened spirit, rises UP to Heaven....THEIR DEAD BODY...remains on EARTH....to BE "RESURECTED"...(not raptured) AFTER the 1,000 year reign of Jesus' earthly Kingdom.

Scripture reveals the Wrath of the Lamb...
Occurs 1st...opening of the SEALS...
It is Spiritual Wrath, FROM THE LAMB, upon those WHO REJECTED HIM.

Scripture reveal during the TRUMPS....
Another spiritual Wrath, FROM satan, upon those WHO REJECT HIM. (Rev 12:12)
The Conflict: men accepting Christ...effects, men rejecting satan...the result...satan's anger....wrath...killing bodys of men...WHILE their soul and spirit has been SAVED.

Scripture reveals:
Men IN Christ...before the Trib BEGINS...are risen UP...OFF the face of the EARTH-
(REVIEW THE HISTORY...HOW LONG WAS NOAH, IN the Ark, BEFORE THE RAIN BEGAN? 7 DAYS. Noahs FEET no longer ON the EARTH! Noah Already SECURE, BEFORE THE RAIN BEGAN! BEFORE the Tribulation commenced...Noah was already IN the ark, as we are IN Christ. Gen 7: 4 & 10).
(Changed body, Saved soul, Quickened spirit);
Raised to the Clouds...same as in Noah's day.
* Last part of Great TRIB...what is LEFT ON EARTH...IS
* "DEAD BODY'S"...
(of those ... who died believing IN God
(Of those ... to whom Christ was given and they accepted during the Trib)
* AND living Body's of Men who reject...BOTH God and CHRIST Jesus...
AND THUS commences the VIALS... which are POURED OUT UPON the Earth...
Called Gods WRATH, UPON MEN WHO, REJECTED HIM.
* This Wrath IS "greater"....BECAUSE...
It IS "Gods Anger" MIXED WITH...Gods "Revenge"...called Gods CUP of INDIGNATION.

 

[Taken]

Page 4 of 4

You mix...Rapture (of body, soul, spirit) of a man...Entirely, committed to God & Christ...
BEFORE the Tribulation Begins...rising UP to the clouds...

with men WHO, "before the Tribulation, are Committed to God....but not Christ"....and WHO during the Tribulation, become "committed to Christ". (Their body, being KILLED, remaining on earth, their soul and spirit, rising up to heaven)....and later their body is risen up.

Same as some men, MIX, (with the Rapture) the "resurection" of BODY"S after the Tribulation and spiritual WRATH...(of the Lamb, of satan, and of God)....as being POST Trib "RAPTURE"....no not the rapture...that is Resurection...of Dead Body's.

RAPTURE is "ONLY" about separating, men "IN CHRIST; committed TO GOD, TO CHRIST, THROUGH CHRIST...FROM THE Face of the EARTH... BEFORE, the (unknown to mankind), the DAY, the Tribulation and Wrath of the Lamb, BEGINS, the seven years OF....SPIRITUAL WRATH UPON the EARTH...and ALL OCCUPANTS< --- > UPON THE EARTH.

IF YOU ARE dwelling ON the FACE of the EARTH...WHEN the Lamb Begins OPENING the SEALS, to UNLEASH HIS WRATH...YOU WILL BE SUBJECT TO His WRATH

Luke 21;
[35] For as a snare shall it come on all them that dwell on the face of the whole earth.

THE ONLY EXCEPTIONS....of those UPON the EARTH...
NOT SUBJECT to Spiritual WRATH while "THEY ARE SENT" UPON the EARTH...IS:
* Two Witness for ONLY 3.5 years. (Then they are Bodily killed, and their body remains ON Earth).
* 144,000 SENT...(whose forehead bears the SEALED NAME of God), and A lamb...which NONE are revealed...bodily killed.

Yes... the Raptured are soul, spirit, bodily changed and saved...BEFORE the Trib.
Yes... souls are saved during the Trib.
Yes... spirits are quickened during the Trib.
No... body's are not saved during the Trib.
Yes... the SENT 144,000 and A lamb are excepted from Bodily death while upon the earth during the Trib.

IF you study the History BEFORE trying to
Teach the FUTURE... you would discover the ORDER and WAY of God has NOT CHANGED. THE SAVED are ALWAYS Excepted FROM SPIRITUAL WRATH.

 

[Taken]

He'll be back, that's about as far as I go there. As far as the distinction between Israel and the church goes, it's almost like there's two covenants.

There ARE TWO covenants.
* The First given the Hebrews, Tribes, Jews.
* The Second given (the Same), but by then, Hebrew, Tribes...were all calling themselves; JEWS.
* Later, as God had prepared, the Gentiles were included in the Second Covenant, primarily by and through Saul/Paul's commission, for which the Lord Appointed him, and he agreed.

The thing about EACH Covenant...IS:
To whom the Covenant (a PROMISE from God)....was OFFERED....HAD to be Accepted by the People.

The First...was Accepted by Moses' People.
And the Acceptance, was passed down to the Hebrews and TRIBES.

The Second....was Accepted by SOME Jews, not others, which caused a Divide among the Jews, that lingers to this DAY.
Some Jews ... continue under the First
Covenant...and OT LAWS...(hard to accomplish, since they have no Temple for Sacrifice, and thus the desire to rebuild a Temple).
Some Jews...in Jesus' Day and IN this day Accepted the Promise of the Second Covenant.
* In Jesus' day, some began calling them;
"Christians".
* In Jesus' day, Jesus called them Converted.
* In this day, they call themselves, "Messianic Jews".
~ AS THE GENTILES, began Accepting the OFFERING of the Second Covenant...
* In Jesus' Day, they were being called "Christians".
* In this Day, some still call themselves "Christians"...Some are more specific, identifying with Jesus' calling of "Converted"...and call themselves "Born Again Christians", or "Converted IN Christ."
* In Jesus day, and today...not ALL Gentiles Accept, the Offered new Covenant.

The Major difference of the OLD and NEW Covenant....IS:
WHO it was Offered to.
WHO Accepted it.
WHAT it means.
* The OLD, was a Promise of Salvation, at the time of a persons PHYSICAL DEATH...."IF" the person....REMANED FAITHFUL TO GOD.
* The NEW, was/is a Promise of Salvation, WHILE the Individual is Still Bodily ALIVE...but OFFERS his BODY to a spiritual Death, FOR his sacrifice FOR Heartful trust, belief, and commitment TO GOD, and The ONE God SENT...Christ the Lord Jesus.
It is a man LAYING DOWN HIS LIFE, FOR the Word of God....
( the same thing has happened in history and shall happen during the trib. Men laying down their body's physical life, for the Word of God.....Physical laying down ones life for a belief, is called martyrdom....(or a HERO, in the case of a military serviceman)...

If you ARE a JEW, and have become Converted IN Christ....the correct term is born again Christian, or Converted IN Christ....and IF you desire to KEEP your Jewish identity revealed..Messianic Jew; is acceptable and widely known.

God Bless,
Taken

 

[Truman]

I am what I am, a child of the great, "I Am," by the blood of the Lamb, the Lamb who was slain.
I'm precious in His sight, the apple of His eye, I am fearfully and wonderfully made.
This matters most, which I'm sure we can agree on. :)

 

[marks]

First off...the word church, carries a duo meaning.

So when I say "church", I mean as opposed to "Christendom". Church for me = ecclesia, the assemply.

I see Israel, to whom anyone could join, and the church, as one continuous congregation that had a change in the covenant with God.

I see that we don't join Israel, rather, in the current day, both Israelites and Gentiles are baptized into Christ.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

I happen to have the idea that there will be a pre-trib rapture. I also think that Israel is a distinct nation chosen by God, and that God will continue to fulfill His promises to Jacob's children.

I know a number of people who are not pre-trib in their understanding of when the rapture will occur, and who also see in some fashion that the Church is now Israel.

Is there anyone who sees Israel and the Church separately as I do, and who is not pre-trib?

Much love!

In other words, you are asking folks here that believe in a FALSE Pre-trib Rapture theory LIKE YOU DO, to discuss with you pre-trib's FALSE BELIEF that Israel and the Church are separate.

It's not hard to decipher what you're up to, which really is just looking for a chance here to push false ideas you've picked up from the Pre-trib Rapture school.



Ephraim's seed was prophesied to become "a multitude of nations" in Genesis 48. Ephraim is where God's Birthright wound upon, which began with Abraham. Ephraim became the head tribe over the ten northern tribes of Israel. The ten northern tribes were scattered among the Gentiles first. Then ten tribes migrated out of their Assyrian captivity westward, into Asia Minor and Europe, becoming eventually the western Christian nations. That is where The Gospel was received on national scales after the majority of Jews in Jerusalem rejected Jesus Christ. Those western Christian nations, MAKING UP MOST OF CHRIST'S CHURCH in early Christian history, fulfilled the "multitude of nations" prophecy!!!

So HOW can Pre-trib liars preach a separation of those ten tribe Israelites from Christ's Church that became Christians in early western Christian history of Asia Minor and Europe??? It's a silly contradiction to try and separate those Christian Israelites from Christ's Church!!!

That ignorance just shows more of how many Christian brethren are very lacking in Bible study and in Christian history!

Much TOUGH love!

 

[friend of]

That ignorance just shows more of how many Christian brethren are very lacking in Bible study and in Christian history!

Yes. Everyone except you, apparently

 

[marks]

It's not hard to decipher what you're up to, which really is just looking for a chance here to push false ideas

Actually, you did miss what I was doing.

No matter.

You've answered my question in spite of yourself. You blend the church and Israel, and you are not pretrib. That holds to the pattern.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Yes. Everyone except you, apparently

Then there is the lack of good manners, of cogent arguments, stuff like that.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

Yes. Everyone except you, apparently

You got something real to say, or do you just go around running your mouth like an idiot, thinking others that study for themselves like I do might be impressed with your smart remarks?

 

[Davy]

Actually, you did miss what I was doing.

No matter.

You've answered my question in spite of yourself. You blend the church and Israel, and you are not pretrib. That holds to the pattern.

Much love!

You're right, I definitely am NOT on men's false doctrine of a Pre-trib Rapture, a theory that was first preached in a Christian church in 1830's Great Britain.

You're also right that I agree with God's Word that His Israel is... Christ's Church!

That means even those born of the seed of Israel MUST become members of Christ's Church to be saved. Thing is, probably the majority of Israelites already have believed on Jesus Christ, you just listen to men's doctrines more than studying God's Word for yourself to be able to know that fact. John Darby in 1830s Britain is who came up with that separation between Israel and the Church idea. Other Bible scholars later, like E.W. Bullinger in the 1880's, and Scofield, etc., also took up Darby dispensationalist ideas, and since then another group like Stam have created what is called Hyper-Dispensationalism, claiming that only Paul's Epistles are relevant to the Christian Church, which of course is yet another false tradition of men stacked upon previous false traditions like the false Pre-trib Rapture theory.

 

[friend of]

Darby didn't invent pre rapture mate

 

[friend of]

You got something real to say, or do you just go around running your mouth like an idiot, thinking others that study for themselves like I do might be impressed with your smart remarks?

Yes if there is one thing I'm keenly intent on doing on this forum it is definitely impressing you!