Jerusalem Is The Whore, Mystery Babylon The Great Of Revelation Chapter 17

[Waiting on him]

John and Jesus aren't the two witnesses, it's that simple, save yourself the time

I was only trying to help you see that both John’s witnessed the same thing. It’s a strange thing to me, many here professing Christ, yet haven’t witnessed this.

 

[Earburner]

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Revelation 22:1-5KJV
1 And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.
2 In the midst of the street of it, and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits, and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the healing of the nations.
3 And there shall be no more curse: but the throne of God and of the Lamb shall be in it; and his servants shall serve him:
4 And they shall see his face; and his name shall be in their foreheads.
5 And there shall be no night there; and they need no candle, neither light of the sun; for the Lord God giveth them light: and they shall reign for ever and ever.

Literally speaking, you are very much a Literist. The Jews had the same problem, but you don't know why.
Here's the answer: Zechariah 4:6 and Johnn 16:13.

 

[Truth7t7]

I was only trying to help you see that both John’s witnessed the same thing. It’s a strange thing to me, many here professing Christ, yet haven’t witnessed this.

Nothing strange whatsoever, John and Jesus didnt fulfill the (Two Witnesses) as seen in Revelation 11:3-15

These are future prophets that will return, and bring all the plagues seen in the Revelation, a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

 

[Truth7t7]

Literally speaking, you are very much a Literist. The Jews had the same problem, but you don't know why.
Here's the answer: Zechariah 4:6 and Johnn 16:13.

I already explained that the "Future" Two Witnesses of Revelation 11 will pour the golden oil from themselves in "Plagues" upon the world, "Literally" a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Zechariah 4:12-14KJV
12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

 

[Waiting on him]

I already explained that the "Future" Two Witnesses of Revelation 11 will pour the golden oil from themselves in "Plagues" upon the world, "Literally" a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Zechariah 4:12-14KJV
12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Matthew 11:25 KJV
[25] At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.
Take note how Jesus addresses God the Father. That’s right LORD, this is also how He addressed Him in the messianic Psalms often.

 

[Waiting on him]

Now tell me how it is you call Jesus Lord, and He calls God Lord?

 

[Waiting on him]

I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth

 

[Davy]

Now tell me how it is you call Jesus Lord, and He calls God Lord?

If you don't believe Jesus of Nazareth is The Christ, which means God The Son, then you cannot claim to be a Christian. The Christian Faith requires that you believe Jesus Christ is part of The Godhead.

Heb 1:1-3
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by His Son, Whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by Whom also He made the worlds;

3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
KJV

 

[Waiting on him]

If you don't believe Jesus of Nazareth is The Christ, which means God The Son, then you cannot claim to be a Christian. The Christian Faith requires that you believe Jesus Christ is part of The Godhead.

Heb 1:1-3
1 God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by His Son, Whom He hath appointed heir of all things, by Whom also He made the worlds;

3 Who being the brightness of His glory, and the express image of His person, and upholding all things by the word of His power, when He had by Himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;
KJV

Ok, thanks.

 

[Earburner]

I already explained that the "Future" Two Witnesses of Revelation 11 will pour the golden oil from themselves in "Plagues" upon the world, "Literally" a remake of Moses/Aaron against Pharaoh of Egypt

Zechariah 4:12-14KJV
12 And I answered again, and said unto him, What be these two olive branches which through the two golden pipes empty the golden oil out of themselves?
13 And he answered me and said, Knowest thou not what these be? And I said, No, my lord.
14 Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by the Lord of the whole earth.

Both (2) JtB and Jesus had the Holy Spirit at BIRTH. That is how they were anointed.

As for anyone else, that I know of, there is no one else who was anointed with the Holy Spirit at birth, except JtB and Jesus.
Two more additional witnesses in the future, is an impossibility.
The prophecy calls for 2, not 4.

The key word in Zechariah 4:14 is "anointed" .

 

[Earburner]

Now, if anyone wants to remove two of the proposed four, I suggest that they DON'T mess up and disregard the two who really were annointed.

 

[Truth7t7]

Matthew 11:25 KJV
[25] At that time Jesus answered and said, I thank thee, O Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because thou hast hid these things from the wise and prudent, and hast revealed them unto babes.
Take note how Jesus addresses God the Father. That’s right LORD, this is also how He addressed Him in the messianic Psalms often.

Your response doesn't address my claim whatsoever

 

[Truth7t7]

Now, if anyone wants to remove two of the proposed four, I suggest that they DON'T mess up and disregard the two who really were annointed.

Claims in opinion that are wrong

 

[Earburner]

Claims in opinion that are wrong

KJV- Zechariah 4[14] Then said he, These are the two anointed ones, that stand by* the LORD of the whole earth.

So you are saying that JtB and Jesus did not have the anointing of the Holy Spirit (golden oil)** at birth, but instead you claim that the "two witnesses" described in Revelation 11, still to come future, are the only "two" who will be anointed at birth with the Holy Spirit (golden oil).

Now, because the prophecy of Zech. calls for only "two anointed ones", and not four, you have ruled that JtB and Jesus were not anointed with the Holy Spirit (golden oil) at birth.


Notes:
* to stand firm; to take a stand; to hold one's ground.
** see Zechariah 4:12, Matthew 25:3-8 and Romans 8:9

 

[Mark51]

“Babylon” or “Babylon the Great,” referred to in Revelations, is figurative because it does not have a physical location.(Revelations 1:1) It is described as a woman/harlot that rides the symbolic seven-headed beast-a symbol of political world powers. She is described to be a city that has a kingdom over the kings of the earth. (Revelations 17:1-6, 15, 18) Her other identified characteristics is her drunkenness “with the blood of the holy ones.” (Revelations 18:24) Furthermore, because of her influences over governments by misleading them by her spiritualist practices, she either directly or indirectly persecuted/killed those in opposition to her spiritual fornication and false religious practices/doctrines. Compare what God’s considers prostitution (spiritual): Exodus 34:12-16; Isaiah 1:21; Jeremiah 3:6-10. 13; Ezekiel 16:15-17, 20-38; Revelations 18:3, 4; 9-11; 15-19. This apostasy has not gone unnoticed and judgment is awaiting her and of those that worship her.-Revelations 17:16; 18:2, 4, 5. In summary “she” is the world empire of false religion. See Revelation 18:23.

 

[Earburner]

Babylon” or “Babylon the Great,” referred to in Revelations, is figurative because it does not have a physical location.(Revelations 1:1) It is described as a woman/harlot that rides* the symbolic seven-headed** beast-a symbol of political world powers. She is described to be a city that has a kingdom over the kings of the earth. (Revelations 17:1-6, 15, 18) Her other identified characteristics is her drunkenness “with the blood of the holy ones.”*** (Revelations 18:24)

It is readily apparent that you are not referencing or learning from the WORDS of the KJV Bible. The word is NOT "rides" , but rather "carrieth"

As for the 7 heads, see Daniel and count the heads on each of the 4 Beasts-
Babylon- 1 head
Medio- Persia- 1 head
Grecian- (Alex the Great)1 head
Grecian- (Hellenistic kingdoms)- 4 heads
That totals to be 7 heads.
Note: Jerusalem was established 700 years BEFORE Babylon!! It therefore has been OVER all the heads of the 4 worldly beast empires.
The 8th head (which is of the 7 heads), was the 4th Beast, which began as the Roman Empire, and down through the centuries, it has evolved into numerous stages, and now is in it's final stage of the Financial Empire of the Banking Elite.

So, Jerusalem (Israel) of today, that was destroyed in 70AD is back, BUT is being "carried" by the 10H Beast today, which is that Global Financial Empire, that we all are tied in with.
After WW2, the Rothchild family, who are of great wealth of the "Banking Elite", established an agreement with the country of England, to buy the land of Israel back for the Jews to live in.

***The Beast "carries"/controls the "fallen" woman, NOT the other way around, as a "rider" who would be in control.

And by the way, its not "the holy ones" , but rather all that are slain (killed/murdered) on the earth- 24 And in her was found the blood of prophets, and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth.

 

[Earburner]

The key to understanding what (not who) the "Sea Beast with 10H" of Rev. 13 is, a conglomoration from the remnants of the 3 previous Beast empires before, as shown in Daniel 7.
Rev. 13[1] And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
[2] And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.
That is the Roman Empire!

[3] And I saw one of his heads as it were wounded to death; and his deadly wound was healed: and all the world wondered after the beast.
Now, which of the heads was wounded to death, and was healed?
The clue to us is the 8th head. The Beast is a conglomoration, a compilation of the 7 heads (governments) of the previous 3 Beasts.
In other words, its make up is from all of the 3 beasts prior to it. It became the 4th Beast of Daniel, the Roman Empire, and was/is the 8th head, as shown in Revelation 17[11] And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition* [destruction]*.
The length of time for this Beast is very long, because it has evolved into many forms over the centuries, since its beginnings as the 4th Beast in Daniel. They are:
1. The Roman Empire, then split into
2. The Roman Catholic church, then dispersed into
3. Europe (EU), and has now generated out of itself
4. The Global Financial Empire, of which shall acquire for its well being and protection, a world army, to be formed out of 10 countries, aka the 10 horns.

*So, when was the Beast, the 8th head, wounded by a sword (war-"perdition") and did live/survive?
Ans. When it was in the stage as Europe, enduring WW1&2.

 

[Earburner]

Your claim is a fairytale, Christian's dont represent the (New Earth)

You don't understand. Every person who repents towards God the Father, through Christ the Son, and is born again,is a "lively stone" (mansion) of God's Spiritual "House", aka Heavenly Jerusalem, of which on the Day of Christ's return and our resurrection, they will be with Him in the Air.

 

[Truth7t7]

You don't understand. Every person who repents towards God the Father, through Christ the Son, and is born again,is a "lively stone" (mansion) of God's Spiritual "House", aka Heavenly Jerusalem, of which on the Day of Christ's return and our resurrection, they will be with Him in the Air.

Ok, if you want to put a symbolic representation of the Church

However,there will be a "Literal" destruction in fire of this heaven and earth, and a complete New Creation in the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem

 

[Earburner]

Ok, if you want to put a symbolic representation of the Church

However,there will be a "Literal" destruction in fire of this heaven and earth, and a complete New Creation in the New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem

"Lively stones" resurrected into Immortality, is the New Earth in which God the Father, who is a Spirit, desires to dwell. It is His entire intention and reason of why we were created.

God the Son did not sacrifice Himself to die for this planet earth or any new planet earth, He died for each of us. Hence the reason and truth of Romans
8:8-9.
HE is ensuring to us now and Himself, that WE ARE HIS OWN, when we bring ourselves to Him in faith, to recieve the gift of His sealing work of the indwelling of His Holy Spirit.
We were made FOR GOD, not any planet, old or new.