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according to your tradition not scripture
mt 7:7 ask and you shall receive
mt 5:7
Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy.
mt 5:8 Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God.
Mt 7:14
Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life...
Hebrews 10:36
For ye have need of patience, that, after ye have done they will of God, ye might receive the promise.
James 1:3
Knowing this, that the trying of your faith worketh patience.
James 1:4
But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.
mk 10:30
...in the world to come eternal life.
John 4:36
...gathereth fruit unto life eternal:
John 10:28
And I give unto them eternal life...
John 12:25
He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.
Romans 5:21
That as sin hath reigned unto death, even so might grace reign through righteousness unto eternal life by Jesus Christ our Lord.
Jude 1:21
Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life.
thks
And So is..""""And I will put enmity between thee and the woman, and between thy seed and her seed; it shall bruise thy head, and thou shalt bruise his heel.""
(that is found in Gen 3).
According to the fact that you post verses but can't explain them, you are discovered to be one more religious pretender. @faithhopecharity
See, You post multiple verses over and over, that you can't explain.
And that is what all religious heretics do......they come to the forum and they post verses, taken from a online concordance.
This is 100% typical of your type to do this to try to falsely prove that you can teach the Bible.
But in fact, you can't.
You're a pretender.
Now, go ahead and state what "traditions" im teaching that you disagree with.......as you just accused me of it. @faithhopecharity
Name one or 2..
Gray_Joy
Active Member
I refuse to entertain the Devil.
Which is why I have arrived at the decision not to enable dark spirits who speak from the pit.
For the faithful of ,in,Gods church here,
The Law of God was given to Moshe,Moses,by God. It is not the invention of Moses in the name of God.
That is Bible. And that is indeed dangerous to the evil that seeks to contradict that fact.
I agree that salvation is by grace through faith and not by our own works. No one can earn forgiveness, justification, or eternal life through keeping commandments, being baptized, confessing sins, or performing religious duties. Christ alone is the basis of our salvation, and His finished work on the cross is completely sufficient (Ephesians 2:8-9; Titus 3:5).
Where I would offer some caution is that Scripture does not present obedience as something entirely separate from saving faith. While obedience does not save us, genuine faith produces obedience as its fruit.
Jesus said, "If you love Me, keep My commandments" (John 14:15). He also said, "Why do you call Me 'Lord, Lord,' and not do the things which I say?" (Luke 6:46).
Likewise, James writes that faith without works is dead (James 2:17). James is not teaching salvation by works, but he is teaching that living faith manifests itself in a transformed life. The issue is not whether works save, but whether saving faith remains alone.
The apostles consistently taught both truths together:
We are justified by faith apart from works of the law (Romans 3:28).
We are created in Christ Jesus for good works (Ephesians 2:10).
God's grace teaches us to deny ungodliness and live godly lives (Titus 2:11-12).
We are saved through faith, yet faith works through love (Galatians 5:6).
Therefore, I believe we should be careful not to place obedience in opposition to faith. Obedience is not the root of salvation, but it is one of its fruits. The believer does not obey to earn God's acceptance but because he has already received God's acceptance in Christ.
I also believe we should be cautious about labeling all Christians who emphasize holiness, repentance, or perseverance as heretics. Scripture calls believers to contend for the faith, but it also calls us to speak the truth in love and to maintain unity where there is agreement on the gospel.
The biblical balance seems to be this: Christ alone saves, yet the Christ who saves also transforms. We trust in Christ alone for our justification, and because we trust Him, we seek to follow Him in obedience.
The only obedience that God requries of a SINNER to save them and keep them saved, is this....
"That you believe on Jesus, whom God sent".
Any other Obedience is connected to your discipleship, not your Salvation.
Reader......see if. you can catch this ....
= Discipleship is not Salvation.
= Discipleship is what you do after you are already SAVED., and you can do it , and not be saved at all.
A lot of people went to Hell today and found that out the hard way.
A.) Salvation is what Jesus finished on The Cross 2000 yrs ago, and is given to you as "the Gift of Salvation" if you will give God your faith in Christ".
See it?
Now listen.,
The faith issue that a lot of Christian have, is that they do not understand that Salvation is not their Discipleship.
So, they try to combine The Cross of Christ with "and now my obedience is also required to be saved and stay saved".
See that?
This is what is referred to as "adding to the finished work of Jesus"......your Obedience, in the form of BEHAVIOR.
And to teach that is to deny The Cross, as now you are placing yourself, and your deeds, as equal to what Jesus has accomplished by His Shed Blood and Death, and God knows you will never be able to equal it, or even approach it with your "obedience" striving.
So, Never teach this, as this offends The Cross, and insults God's Grace.
You dont want to be that one, at all, and you certainly dont want to be committing that Cross denying Heresy, on a Public so called "christian" Forum, even if you are safe from being banned if you do it.
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@Behold. I agree we are not saved by works, and no one adds anything to the finished work of Christ (Eph 2:8–9).
But Scripture doesn’t reduce “obedience” to a single act of belief detached from repentance and submission to Christ. Faith is consistently described as obedient faith (Rom 1:5), not mere mental agreement.
Jesus is “the author of eternal salvation to all who obey Him” (Heb 5:9), and John 3:36 links belief and obedience rather than separating them.
So I don’t see a biblical basis for splitting “salvation” and “obedience” into two unrelated categories. Saving faith receives Christ fully, not only as Savior but also as Lord.
Works don’t save, but the faith that saves is never alone or passive.
Our faith is counted by God as Christ's Righteousness, imputed to us.
Salvation is a ""Gift""" from God, that requires believing faith to receive it, = our "faith is counted by God, as (Christ's) Righteousness".....imputed to us.
Sinners, were not being OBEDIENT to God all their lifelong sinning life, and then one day in one MOMENT, God saved them.. "through faith" "while we were YET SINNERS" and only because we Trusted in Christ.
Faith is Christ real or its not.
God looks inside a sinners heart and when He sees genuine faith, He accepts it and saves them, eternally.
The obedience that God will accept to accept you and keep you, is......>"Believe on Jesus Whom God Sent".
So, if you have been obedient to that directive, once in your life, then God has given you HIS "Gift of Salvation".
Receivng the gift of eternal life has one condition.........its : "all who believe in me, i give unto you eternal life and you shall never perish".(never go to hell). Jesus promises.
So, we see that the OBEDIENCE is simply FAITH in Christ....given to God., once.
That's it, as that is what causes God to give us HIS : "The GIFT of Salvation".
God sees our Faith in Christ, that is in our HEART where He can see it, and He accepts it and applies the Blood Atonement to us, which forgiives our sin, and then God gives us the New Birth, and we become a Born again "new Creation in Christ".. as "one with God".
And God began this this for us, "while we were YET SINNERS"... and He completes it for us and will be faithful to complete it.
Philippians 1:6
Now....also Notice this verse..."But to those that worketh not, but believeth on GOD who = justifies the ungodly, their = faith is counted (by God) for righteousness.".
So the only obedience we find regarding becoming a born again Christian, is "our FAITH is counted by God"
Now, after you are saved, then your discipleship is now begun, and that is when you "present your body as a living sacrifice to God"., and that is when you "deny yourself, and carry your Cross".....as that is your DISCIPLESHIP that begins after you are saved "while we were yet sinners".
Your verse says that if you believe you are saved and if you dont you are damned.
This verse is connected to John 3:36
So, your verse is describing the eternal effect and end result of saving faith, vs, being a Christ rejector.
If by "obedience" you mean.....>"Faith in Christ"......then that is correct.
The "Split" is between ..........Discipleship and Salvation, as one of those is what you do, and the other is What God provides to a believer as a GIFT.
And there is a heresy that teaches that unless you make Jesus Lord of your Life, God wont save you, and you are not really saved.
So, this is the error of "LordShip Salvation" that wild eyed heretics like John MacAuther taught to his deceived followers.
Now, let me show you this...
"Every knee shall bow and every tongue shall confess that Jesus is Lord"......and that means the DEVIL and his Angels, and every unbeliever, and of course all Christians.
Here is a update for you reader.........Jesus is LORD, even if you dont believe it, and dont want it.
And here is another update...
Most of the people who use forums, own a TV, and watch Cable... and 99% of them have watched some Cable program that has sex and more of it, in the show.......yet they watched it.
"Game of Thrones" comes to mind.........as most of the world seemed to be watching that one, and that means a lot of Christians were tuned in for 7 yrs.....
So, were they obeying Jesus as """Lord""", when they were watching that sensuality and sexuality?
No., not quite.
So, be careful of people who talk to you about "Jesus is Lord", and "Lordship Salvation" who really dont understand what that actually means.
What works were you doing for God, on the day that God saved you. ???
Can we see your list of works @Angelina ?
In Deuteronomy 5:31-33, Moses wrote down everything that God spoke to him without departing from it, which is why the Law of Moses is called the Law of God in verses like Nehemiah 8:1-8, Ezra 7:6-12, and Luke 2:22-23.
Agreed.
Everything in the Law of Moses is either in regard to how to love God or how to love our neighbor, which is why Jesus said in Matthew 22:36-40 that those are the greatest two commandments and that all of the other commandments hang on them, so the position that we should obey the greatest two commandments is also the position that we should obey the rest of the 611 commandments. For example, if we love God and our neighbor, then we won't commit murder, theft, idolatry, and adultery, but we also won't commit kidnapping, rape, and favoritism, and so forth for the rest of the Law of Moses.
Chris set a sinless example for us to follow of how to fulfill the Law of Moses and those who are in Christ are obligated to walk in the same way that he walked (1 John 2:6).
It is by the Law of Moses that we have knowledge of what sin is (Romans 3:20), so the position that we should sin no more is the position that we should obey the Law of Moses, which is the opposite of saying that parts of it are for Jews only and not relevant for Christians. Christ spent his ministry teaching his followers to obey the Law of Moses by word and by example and following what Christ taught is relevant for Christians.
The Bible never refers to the Ten Commandments as being the moral or and never states that God's other laws are not moral laws. It don't see how you can switch between saying that that some of God's laws are not relevant for Christians to speaking against those who say that God's laws are no longer valid.
Jesus said that man shall not live by word alone but by every word that comes from the mouth of God (Matthew 4:4).
Why do you keep telling that Lie? @Soyeong ??
In fact some of Moses Law has nothing to do with Love or God.....nothing.
you dont know this because you've never read all of Moses' 613 laws.
Have you ever actually read a NT?
Do you actually own a bible..??
If you need one, then PM me with your address and i'll send you a really good one.
np.
Ive given away Bibles all over this world.
Now listen up.. @Soyeong
The #17 Moses law, is dealing with circumcision.....and the #21 is dealing with putting a JEWISH Mezuzah on your doorpost.
And you dont have one on yours, so you are not keeping Moses law, you foolish religious child clown.
So, why dont you run along with your Moses Law obsession , and stop annoying the adults here on the forum, who want to learn some bible.
You are exaclty nothing but in their way @Soyeong
@Behold, I agree with you on what is foundational: salvation is a gift, not earned, and no one is justified by works of the Law (Eph 2:8–9; Rom 4:5). That is not in dispute.
But the disagreement here is not whether salvation is by grace; it is about how the New Testament defines saving faith itself.
You are consistently defining faith as a single, isolated moment of belief and then separating everything else (repentance, obedience, submission, perseverance) into a different category called “discipleship.” But the problem is that Scripture does not make that clean separation in its definition of faith.
Romans 1:5 speaks of “obedience of faith,” not obedience after faith as something unrelated.
Hebrews 5:9 says salvation is to “all who obey Him,” which cannot be reduced to a one-time mental act without changing the meaning of “obey.”
John 3:36 places belief and disobedience in direct contrast, not as two unrelated categories.
James 2 directly rejects the idea that a “faith” with no works is real or saving.
So the real question is not whether works save; they don’t.
The question is: Are we allowed to redefine “faith” into a momentary mental assent that exists independently of repentance, surrender, and obedience to Christ, when the apostles consistently describe faith as living, active, and responsive to Him?
If your definition is correct, then these passages must all be reinterpreted away from their plain sense. But if these passages are taken at face value, then “faith” in the New Testament is never presented as something detached from obedience.
No one here is adding works to salvation. The issue is whether we are using the New Testament’s definition of faith or substituting a reduced one and then building theology around it.
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The way to love God is by embodying His character traits, so the way to love justice is by being a doer of justice, the way to love holiness is by being a doer of God's instructions for how to be holy as He is holy, and so forth. In other words, the goal of all of the 613 laws is to teach us how to love different aspects of God's character traits, which is why the Bible repeatedly states in both the OT and the NT that the way to love God is by obeying His commandments. Yes, I've read the NT and own multiple Bibles, which is why I opposed to interpreting it as speaking against following Christ's example of obedience to what God has commanded. I have been circumcised and I have Mezuzahs on all of my doorposts, so again you are a false accuser. However, the fact that followers of Christ should follow his example of obedience to what God has commanded is true regardless of what I happen to be doing. God wanted His children to repent and to return to obedience to His law all throughout the Bible, and even Jesus began his ministry with that Gospel message (Matthew 4:15-23), so the Bible should not be interpreted as speaking against obeying God. I give you sound doctrine: do not forsake the Law of Moses (Proverbs 4:2).
Yes, faith is a single moment in time when you trusted in Christ.
Can you name the day and year you did this?
And if you did, then God saw this faith in your heart, and your "faith was counted by God as (Christ's) Righteousness" imputed to you.
We dont persevere to be saved........we TRUST in Christ to be saved.
Also, the "repentence" that God accepts is not you turning from sin........its you turning from UNBELIEF to FAITH in Christ.
When you repent (turn from) or (change you mind)........from unbelief to FAITH in Christ, then God accpets your faith to accept you and save you.
Sure it does.
Its only the people who dont understand that Salvation is Jeus on The Cross 2000 yrs ago who will argue that "its more then that".
Our "faith is counted by God as (Christ's) righteousness,"" imputed to us.
= " Even as Abraham BELIEVED GOD, and His FAITH was counted by God as Righteousness".
= no works.
nothing else, just faith in Christ alone is what God demands and accepts to accept you and save you.
We are to Obey this....
"The will of God is that you believe on Jesus whom =God sent"".. and if you will, God will give you "the Gift of Salvation" and "The Gift of Righteousness" and "the Gift of Etermal life".
James 2 says that a Christian can have dead faith...........so, they are already a Christian.
It does not say that they have dead salvation as the heretics teach.
Also, James says, that "i'll show YOU my faith, by my works"..
He does not say.....>"i'll show God my faith by my works" and that is because God sees faith in your heart.........he doesn't need your works as proof.
"Faith comes by hearing" and this hearing comes when you hear the Gospel.
Its the Holy Spirit who reveals the Truth of Jesus in your heart, and Paul teaches this as "coming to the knowledge of the truth".. and from there, you take a step of faith and believe it, or your dont.
Its up to the person to BELIEVE, once they have been shown the truth of John 14:6 by the Holy Spirit.
All who believe shall be saved... and all who dont are found here John 3:36
Salvation is not based on common sense, its based on Faith in Christ.
If you try to "common sense" the bible, you'll end up theologically confused and beyond.
Notice that "its the foolishness of Preaching that saves those who believe '".
The reason God did it this way......= Jesus on The Cross, is so that you get no credit for it.
Or as Abraham stated..........you can do works, but all of this before God is a fail., as God only accepts our faith to save us
"(God's) Grace throgh FAITH".. without works, or deeds of the Law".
Then simply state that the faith you gave God is the only reason that He would save you and keep you saved., as you are not yet able to say that, as you keep wanting to try to prove that its more then that, when in fact its not. @Angelina
You are doing the "substituting and reducing"........im only teaching Paul's Doctrine that is : "justification by faith".. (alone).
In your last post you stated that keeping moses law is how you "love God".
Maybe you should consider that you dont know what you are talking about, and you add nothing to this forum but your confusion @Soyeong .
Why dont you give that up for a while?
@Behold, None. I wasn't saved by works, and I never argued that I was.
The question isn't what works I was doing when God saved me. The question is whether the faith that saves is living or dead.
James says a faith with no works is dead (James 2:17). You keep asking me about works before salvation, but James is asking about the nature of faith itself.
You are speaking against followers of Christ following his example of obedience to what God has commanded, so perhaps you should take your own advice. Again, the Bible repeatedly states in both the OT and the NT that the way to love God is by obeying His commandments, so you can deny that all you like, but I'm going to stick with what the Bible says.
@Behold,
I have repeatedly agreed that we are justified by grace through faith apart from works. The question has never been whether faith saves. The question is what kind of faith Scripture is describing.
You say faith is a single moment in time. Yet the New Testament repeatedly speaks of believing, abiding, continuing, enduring, obeying, and walking by faith. Faith certainly has a beginning, but Scripture does not reduce it to a moment detached from the life that follows.
You also keep redefining every passage about obedience as merely "believe once." But that is the very point under discussion.
When Hebrews 5:9 says Christ is the source of eternal salvation to those who obey Him, you define obedience as one moment of belief.
When James says faith without works is dead, you redefine it as a saved person with inactive faith.
When John 3:36 contrasts believing the Son with disobeying the Son, you redefine disobedience as merely unbelief.
So the question remains:
Are these passages teaching your definition of faith, or are you bringing your definition of faith to these passages?
I fully agree that salvation is God's gift received through faith. What I do not see is where Scripture teaches that saving faith is merely a one-time act that can be separated from repentance, obedience, and perseverance. The apostles consistently describe faith as living, active, and transformative, not merely as a past decision.
@Behold, I have never disputed justification by faith. The question is whether your definition of faith is the same definition used by the apostles.
Simply repeating "justification by faith alone" does not answer the passages under discussion. Paul teaches justification by faith apart from works of the Law. Amen.
James teaches that faith without works is dead. Amen.
Hebrews teaches that Christ is the source of eternal salvation for those who obey Him. Amen.
John contrasts believing the Son with disobeying the Son. Amen.
Rather than explaining these passages on their own terms, you repeatedly redefine obedience, perseverance, and repentance as nothing more than a one-time act of belief.
So the question remains:
Where does the New Testament define saving faith as a one-time event that is completely separable from repentance, obedience, and perseverance?
I agree that we are justified by faith. What I do not see is where the apostles define faith in the reduced way that you are proposing.
Hebrews, John, James etc are not our Apostles for today.
That role was uniquely given by Christ to Paul & no other.
If you disagree then you are disagreeing with Scripture & not me.
....
Who did Christ select as the Apostle & Minister to the Gentiles ?
Acts 9:15
But the Lord said unto him, Go thy way: for he is a chosen vessel unto me, to bear my name before the Gentiles, ...
Rom 11:13
For I speak to you Gentiles, inasmuch as I am the apostle of the Gentiles...
Rom 15:16
That I should be the minister of Jesus Christ to the Gentiles, ministering the gospel of God...
+++
The other Apostles agreed & knew who taught who
Gal 2:2
And I went up by revelation, and communicated unto them that gospel which I preach among the Gentiles,....
Gal 2:7
But contrariwise, when they saw that the gospel of the uncircumcision was committed unto me, as the gospel of the circumcision was unto Peter;
Gal 2:9
And when James, Cephas, and John, who seemed to be pillars, perceived the grace that was given unto me, they gave to me and Barnabas the right hands of fellowship; that we should go unto the heathen, and they unto the circumcision.
++++
What is the role of an Apostle/Minister ?
To teach THEIR audience.
BUT NOW there are NO SEPARATE audiences ALL are equal :-
Gal 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.
Gal 6:15
For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
1 Cor 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.
Col 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
++++
How are believers 'today' saved, sealed, justified, made righteous ?
By the SAVING Gospel that applies today.
Gal 1:11-12
11But I certify you, brethren, that the gospel which was preached of me is not after man.
12For I neither received it of man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
1 Cor 15:1-4
1Moreover, brethren, I declare unto you the gospel which I preached unto you, which also ye have received, and wherein ye stand;
2By which also ye are saved, if ye keep in memory what I preached unto you, unless ye have believed in vain.
3For I delivered unto you first of all that which I also received, how that Christ died for our sins according to the scriptures;
4And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:
Eph 1:13
13In whom ye also trusted, after that ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after that ye believed, ye were sealed with that holy Spirit of promise,
++++
The PERFORMANCE conditions :-
Titus 3:
5Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost;
Gal 2:
16Knowing that a man is not justified by the works of the law, but by the faith of Jesus Christ, even we have believed in Jesus Christ, that we might be justified by the faith of Christ, and not by the works of the law: for by the works of the law shall no flesh be justified.
Rom 3:
28Therefore we conclude that a man is justified by faith without the deeds of the law.
Eph 2:
8For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9Not of works, lest any man should boast.
Rom 4:
5But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is counted for righteousness.
Rom 5:
1Therefore being justified by faith, we have peace with God through our Lord Jesus Christ:
++++
Your 'deeds'/works/behavior/performance only decide your eternal rewards/loss
Rom 14:10
10But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.
1 Cor 3:10-15
10According to the grace of God which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid the foundation, and another buildeth thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth thereupon.
11For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ.
12Now if any man build upon this foundation gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;
13Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.
14If any man's work abide which he hath built thereupon, he shall receive a reward.
2 Cor 5:10
10For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.
@PeterAndroz, I agree that Paul was uniquely appointed as the apostle to the Gentiles. Scripture clearly teaches that.
What I do not see is where Scripture teaches that the writings of James, John, Hebrews, Peter, or even the words of Jesus are no longer doctrinally relevant to believers today.
In fact, Paul himself repeatedly appeals to the teaching of Christ and affirms the unity of the apostolic message.
The Jerusalem apostles extended fellowship to Paul because they recognized the same gospel of grace at work, not because they were preaching contradictory doctrines of salvation (Gal. 2:7-9).
Further, if Hebrews, James, and John are not for the Church, why are they included in the New Testament canon given to the Church? Why does Paul teach that "all Scripture is God-breathed and profitable" (2 Tim. 3:16)?
The issue under discussion is not whether we are justified by faith apart from works. I fully agree with that.
The issue is whether the apostles collectively define saving faith as a living faith that produces obedience, or whether faith is merely a one-time act that can be separated from repentance, perseverance, and fruit.
Appealing to Paul does not solve that question, because Paul himself speaks of "the obedience of faith" (Rom. 1:5; 16:26), faith working through love (Gal. 5:6), and the necessity of continuing in the faith (Col. 1:23).
The apostles are not at odds with one another. The challenge is to harmonize all of Scripture, not to set one apostle against another.
What I do not see is where Scripture teaches that the writings of James, John, Hebrews, Peter, or even the words of Jesus are no longer doctrinally relevant to believers today.
In fact, Paul himself repeatedly appeals to the teaching of Christ and affirms the unity of the apostolic message.
The Jerusalem apostles extended fellowship to Paul because they recognized the same gospel of grace at work, not because they were preaching contradictory doctrines of salvation (Gal. 2:7-9).
Further, if Hebrews, James, and John are not for the Church, why are they included in the New Testament canon given to the Church? Why does Paul teach that "all Scripture is God-breathed and profitable" (2 Tim. 3:16)?
The issue under discussion is not whether we are justified by faith apart from works. I fully agree with that.
The issue is whether the apostles collectively define saving faith as a living faith that produces obedience, or whether faith is merely a one-time act that can be separated from repentance, perseverance, and fruit.
Appealing to Paul does not solve that question, because Paul himself speaks of "the obedience of faith" (Rom. 1:5; 16:26), faith working through love (Gal. 5:6), and the necessity of continuing in the faith (Col. 1:23).
The apostles are not at odds with one another. The challenge is to harmonize all of Scripture, not to set one apostle against another.
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