No Righteousness of Obeying The Ten Commandments

[Jim B]

If I may respond here:

You wrote

I don't think it's about dying to righteousness of obeying the law. It's about dying to dead works without faith


And if we are careful to obey all this law before the Lord our God, as he has commanded us, that will be our righteousness.” Deut6:25

Under the old covenant, righteousness of obeying the law was in place(officially)

But under the new covenant:

21 But now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known, to which the Law and the Prophets testify. 22 This righteousness is given through faith in[h] Jesus Christ to all who believe Romans3:20-22

Note but now apart from the law the righteousness of God has been made known. This righteousness is through faith in Christ

So under the old covenant righteousness of obeying the law was in place, under the new covenant it has been removed. So figuratively speaking, we do die to the law where righteousness is concerned. Believers must die to righteousness of obeying the law and live by righteousness of faith in Christ. You quoted

Romans 3:31

31 Do we then make void the law through faith? Certainly not! On the contrary, we establish the law.

That is a great scripture. Paul did not state the law itself had been removed/what is written in it, only righteousness of obeying it had been removed:

For Christ is the end of the law unto righteousness(not full stop) to every one that believeth. Romans10:4

I will write another post directly relating to your verse.

You wrote:

The law is not void but fulfilled through faith. I don't think Christians should simply ignore the law because sin is lawlessness (1 John 3:4).

Absolutely, the law/what is written in the law is not void, only righteousness of obeying it is void. You cannot ignore what is within you, the law is now in your heart. Through faith(in Christ) we obey.

You wrote:

‘’True faith results in obedience to the law through the power of the Holy Spirit’’

Absolutely!


You wrote:

‘’The law points us to Christ and Christ leads us to fulfilling the laws demands through love and other fruit of the Spirit.’’


Wonderfully put

Great post! Welcome to the forum!

 

[GRACE ambassador]

In regards to Romans 3:31, that verse is part of a much larger section of verses. Reading a verse in isolation, without verses associated with it, can give a misleading understanding of the verse:

Amen! And A Very Warm Welcome to the Board. I Also have this
learning Concept as Rule # 5 in Bible study Rules.

Please Be Very RICHLY Encouraged, Enlightened, Exhorted, And Edified In
The LORD JESUS CHRIST, And In His Word Of Truth, Rightly Divided!

Bible Answer To Confusing church Bewilderment!

GRACE And Peace...

 

[Wynona]

Absolutely, the law/what is written in the law is not void, only righteousness of obeying it is void. You cannot ignore what is within you, the law is now in your heart. Through faith(in Christ) we obey.

Yes, I was struggling with how to word things but that is a great way to say it.

 

[Windmillcharge]

That is correct. Once the New Covenant was instituted, the Old Covenant was (and is) no longer in effect for Christians. (Of course, most of the "books" of the Bible are in the Old Testament).

If you believe that the Old Testament applies to you, you had better start sacrificing some animals for forgiveness of your sins.

You are throwing the baby out with the bath water.

Jesus fulfilled All the requirements of both the ceremonial and the moral law. They no longer apply to us as binding.

But
Jesus said that heaven and earth will pass away before even a punctuation mark is removed from the law.

Paul argued and debated for the authority of Jesus from the Old Testament.

Jesus put a test on us as to whether we love him. That of our obedience to, what his commands, which are the ten commandments.


We are not bound to keep them, we don't even have to read the OT, though that deminishes our knowledge of God, how do we live, by the indewlling spirit maybe, how do we test the prompting of that spirit, if it is about how we act, we test it by the ten commandments.

 

[Jim B]

You are throwing the baby out with the bath water.

Jesus fulfilled All the requirements of both the ceremonial and the moral law. They no longer apply to us as binding.

But
Jesus said that heaven and earth will pass away before even a punctuation mark is removed from the law.

Paul argued and debated for the authority of Jesus from the Old Testament.

Jesus put a test on us as to whether we love him. That of our obedience to, what his commands, which are the ten commandments.


We are not bound to keep them, we don't even have to read the OT, though that deminishes our knowledge of God, how do we live, by the indewlling spirit maybe, how do we test the prompting of that spirit, if it is about how we act, we test it by the ten commandments.

Of course God's law still exists. Ask any Jew! It applies to all who have not been saved through accepting Christ's sacrifice; it does not apply to Christians!

Romans 7:4, "So, my brothers and sisters, you also died to the law through the body of Christ, so that you could be joined to another, to the one who was raised from the dead, to bear fruit to God."

Galatians 2:19, "For through the law I died to the law so that I may live to God."

Galatians 2:21, "I do not set aside God’s grace, because if righteousness could come through the law, then Christ died for nothing!"

Galatians 3:10,-11 "For all who rely on doing the works of the law are under a curse, because it is written, “Cursed is everyone who does not keep on doing everything written in the book of the law. Now it is clear no one is justified before God by the law, because the righteous one will live by faith."

In fact, read the book of Galatians and learn why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!

 

[Davy]

A neighbor on this site is specifically someone seeking to correct and be corrected in the doctrine of Christ by the Scriptures.

This witness is true. Wherefore rebuke them sharply, that they may be sound in the faith;

Once you've played the hate card several times, it wears thin. It can only cover your childish lack of response for so long.

I.e. "You're mean!" is for children, not adult neighbors.

Lawless sinners know nothing of the things of God, especially the love of God, unless they repent and receive Him with power to become His sons.

Your rejection of power of Jesus to be obedient to God 100% of the time, is lukewarm hypocrisy at worst, and the ignorance of the wrongly instructed at best.

Stop hating God some of the time, and start loving Him all of the time:

Blessed are they that keep judgment, and he that doeth righteousness at all times.

Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

Christian behavior is not trying to 'understand' why some naming Christ preach against obeying God 100% of the time. That is only for those seeking to please men and not serve Christ.

So, just repent and you'll begin to love the correction of the Lord and not cry about it as mean 'hate-speech'.

It is hypocritical to claim a believer on Jesus Christ that is not 100% free of sin is not really a Christian. Because God's Word declares that WE ALL fall short of the glory of God, because of sin, that also applies to a believer on Jesus in their future walk. Apostle John explained this in 1 John 1. I recommend all believers on Christ to heed John.

 

[robert derrick]

It is hypocritical to claim a believer on Jesus Christ that is not 100% free of sin is not really a Christian.

Preaching it and not doing it would be the hypocrisy. But, even if the precher is found a hypocrite, the preaching is still true:

All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

The Son makes 100% free first, that there may be 100% free of sinning with the flesh.

Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.

Because God's Word declares that WE ALL fall short of the glory of God, because of sin, that also applies to a believer on Jesus in their future walk.

Prophesying future sinning is not good.

Because God's Word declares that WE ALL fall short of the glory of God, because of sin, that also applies to a believer on Jesus in their future walk.

Misquoting Scripture also is not good.

All have sinned, not all are sinning.

And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

That is 100% pure in heart.

I recommend all believers on Christ to heed John.

John did not prophecy future sinning, but said 'If' a man sin, not 'when'.

He also said while a man is sinning, he is of the devil, and cannot be born of God.

I exhort all believers of Christ to heed Jesus and take thought for now and today, not for tomorrow, when enduring temptation and overcoming sinning now and today.

 

[robert derrick]

I suggest we all take a second to remember the glory of this thread title:

It is now unrighteous to obey God's commandments.

We can also add a prophecy from one that agrees: Thou shalt sin in future.

Well, no one likes a lukewarm sinner and child of disobedience.

So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

 

[Windmillcharge]

why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!

You really do not understan do you.
Where have I said what you are claiming.

Why have you not read and understood what Jesus said about loving him and obeying him.

 

[Jim B]

You really do not understan do you.
Where have I said what you are claiming.

Why have you not read and understood what Jesus said about loving him and obeying him.

What are you talking about?

I wrote: read the book of Galatians and learn why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!" That is perfectly clear.

BTW, I have read and understood what Jesus said about loving him and obeying him (even though that is off-topic). Your claim is both false and irrelevant.

 

[Jim B]

I suggest we all take a second to remember the glory of this thread title:

It is now unrighteous to obey God's commandments.

We can also add a prophecy from one that agrees: Thou shalt sin in future.

Well, no one likes a lukewarm sinner and child of disobedience.

So then because thou art lukewarm, and neither cold nor hot, I will spue thee out of my mouth.

For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ.

That is not what the thread title says. It says that there is no righteousness of obeying the ten commandments. That is entirely true! If you put yourself under the law, there is no righteousness. In fact, it's spiritual death and a denial of Christ.

 

[Windmillcharge]

What are you talking about?

I wrote: read the book of Galatians and learn why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!" That is perfectly clear.

BTW, I have read and understood what Jesus said about loving him and obeying him (even though that is off-topic). Your claim is both false and irrelevant.

All my posts in this thread have been about showing that we love Jesus by how we obey his commandments.

Jesus's commandments are the ten commandments, he gave them.

 

[Jim B]

All my posts in this thread have been about showing that we love Jesus by how we obey his commandments.

Jesus's commandments are the ten commandments, he gave them.

I repeat: read the book of Galatians and learn why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!" That is perfectly clear.

The Bible says that God (the Father) gave the ten commandments to Moses.

Exodus 20:1-2 -- 18-21,
God spoke all these words: 2 “I, the Lord, am your God, who brought you from the land of Egypt, from the house of slavery. --
"All the people were seeing the thundering and the lightning, and heard the sound of the horn, and saw the mountain smoking—and when the people saw it they trembled with fear and kept their distance. 19 They said to Moses, “You speak to us and we will listen, but do not let God speak with us, lest we die.” Moses said to the people, “Do not fear, for God has come to test you, that the fear of him may be before you so that you do not sin.” The people kept their distance, but Moses drew near the thick darkness where God was."

There is nothing here (or anywhere in the Bible) that says that Jesus (the Son) gave the ten commandments.

 

[robert derrick]

That is not what the thread title says. It says that there is no righteousness of obeying the ten commandments. That is entirely true! If you put yourself under the law, there is no righteousness. In fact, it's spiritual death and a denial of Christ.

The righteousness of obeying the commandments of God is not being under the law, but is being under grace, To be obeying His commandments with a purified heart and love for His law and doing it:

I hate and abhor lying: but thy law do I love.

Now, while I agree we are not to obey as law of Christ, all the ten commandments as first written on the mount, since the Sabbath is not commanded by Christ, the spirit of the thread is that keeping the commandments and doing the law of God is somehow sinful and in 'denial of Christ'.

Being under the law to do the works of the law, is to be burdened by having to do the law with the flesh, while the heart remains unclean.

The works of the law without faith is cursed and unjustified by Christ, but The works of faith to do the law is blessed and justified of God.

And so, a true title of Scripture would be: Obeying the commandments of Christ without faith, is not righteousness of God.

But, the muddled title and spirit of the one posting it says, Obeying the commandments of God is not right.

So, you can clear it all up: Are them obeying the commandments of Christ doing His righteousness?

 

[Davy]

Preaching it and not doing it would be the hypocrisy. But, even if the precher is found a hypocrite, the preaching is still true:

All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.

If the Son therefore shall make you free, ye shall be free indeed.

The Son makes 100% free first, that there may be 100% free of sinning with the flesh.

Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.



Prophesying future sinning is not good.



Misquoting Scripture also is not good.

All have sinned, not all are sinning.

And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength: this is the first commandment.

That is 100% pure in heart.



John did not prophecy future sinning, but said 'If' a man sin, not 'when'.

He also said while a man is sinning, he is of the devil, and cannot be born of God.

I exhort all believers of Christ to heed Jesus and take thought for now and today, not for tomorrow, when enduring temptation and overcoming sinning now and today.

Such an idiotic post of one who thinks he can be his OWN Christ!

That's what the OCCULTISTS are taught, that they can be THEIR OWN CHRIST, because they teach a separation between the 'man' Jesus, and the Office of The Christ. They believe the Christ Spirit Jesus was given at His baptism, and that it left Him when He died on the cross! They falsely teach that EVERYONE can obtain The Christ Spirit, what they also call 'Christ Consciousness'! They are LIARS and children of the devil!

 

[Jim B]

The righteousness of obeying the commandments of God is not being under the law, but is being under grace, To be obeying His commandments with a purified heart and love for His law and doing it:

I hate and abhor lying: but thy law do I love.

Now, while I agree we are not to obey as law of Christ, all the ten commandments as first written on the mount, since the Sabbath is not commanded by Christ, the spirit of the thread is that keeping the commandments and doing the law of God is somehow sinful and in 'denial of Christ'.

Being under the law to do the works of the law, is to be burdened by having to do the law with the flesh, while the heart remains unclean.

The works of the law without faith is cursed and unjustified by Christ, but The works of faith to do the law is blessed and justified of God.

And so, a true title of Scripture would be: Obeying the commandments of Christ without faith, is not righteousness of God.

But, the muddled title and spirit of the one posting it says, Obeying the commandments of God is not right.

So, you can clear it all up: Are them obeying the commandments of Christ doing His righteousness?

To whom did Jesus say "obey my commandments"? To His disciples, but they were not yet Christians! They were Jews who had to rely on the law because the Holy Spirit had not yet been given. John 14:15-17, “If you love me, you will obey my commandments. Then I will ask the Father, and he will give you [future tense] another Advocate to be with you forever— the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot accept, because it does not see him or know him. But you know him, because he resides with you and will be in you." Then, a little farther on, He says, "But when he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all truth. For he will not speak on his own authority, but will speak whatever he hears, and will tell you what is to come." John 16:13

You either follow commandments (which are external) or you're guided by the Holy Spirit (who is internal). You can't be guided by commandments and be guided by the Holy Spirit.

Answer this: why did God send the Holy Spirit?

 

[robert derrick]

Such an idiotic post of one who thinks he can be his OWN Christ!

That's what the OCCULTISTS are taught, that they can be THEIR OWN CHRIST, because they teach a separation between the 'man' Jesus, and the Office of The Christ. They believe the Christ Spirit Jesus was given at His baptism, and that it left Him when He died on the cross! They falsely teach that EVERYONE can obtain The Christ Spirit, what they also call 'Christ Consciousness'! They are LIARS and children of the devil!

When you get your sinning tootsies stepped on, a simple ouch will suffice.

The great prophet for future sinning has such strange fire.

Occult? Obtaining the Christ Spirit?

Sounds like stuff from Davy Jone's locker

 

[robert derrick]

To whom did Jesus say "obey my commandments"? To His disciples, but they were not yet Christians! They were Jews who had to rely on the law because the Holy Spirit had not yet been given.

No Scripture speaks of relying on the law of God, but doing it.

To whom did Jesus say "obey my commandments"?

And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.

You either follow commandments (which are external) or you're guided by the Holy Spirit (who is internal). You can't be guided by commandments and be guided by the Holy Spirit.

Answer this: why did God send the Holy Spirit?

Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment.

Beginning internally, we then go external: we cleanse within the platter first.

Now that you see the error of your own carnal doctrine, you might want to learn the truth of the Spirit.

Answer this: why did God send the Holy Spirit?

And we are his witnesses of these things; and so is also the Holy Ghost, whom God hath given to them that obey him.

To obey Him.

The Holy Spirit is given for power to become sons of God keeping His commandments, beginning with the first.

 

[robert derrick]

I repeat: read the book of Galatians and learn why those who rely on the law cannot be Christians!" That is perfectly clear.

Neither are them that transgress the law.

Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning.

That is perfectly clear.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

As followers of Jesus and partakers of the redemption price he paid for ALL sins, we no longer concern ourselves of the 613 laws given to the Israelite. Nor in my opinion the 10 commandments, for Jesus himself said this
Mark 12:30-31
And thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all your heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind, and with all thy strength; this is the first commandant.
And the second is like ,namely this Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself
THERE IS NONE OTHER COMMANDMENT GREATER THAN THESE