Obsessed with Rome

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JimParker

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Could someone please explain why, in every Christian forum, there are always two or three people who are obsessed with (indeed possessed by) a need to attack the Roman Catholic Church and to demonize the head of that church, the pope.

They usually have a storehouse full of quotes and scriptures, all taken out of their historical, cultural, political, and literary context, to "prove" that their obsession is, not only reasonable, but, important. And, being convinced that they are doing an important work for the glory of God, they zealously carry out what they apparently believe is their calling and gift of the Holy Spirit.

Does not this obsession fly in the face of Jesus' words?

Mat 7:1- 5

Judge not, that you be not judged. For with the judgment you pronounce you will be judged, and the measure you give will be the measure you get.

Why do you see the speck that is in your brother's eye, but do not notice the log that is in your own eye? Or how can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when there is the log in your own eye? You hypocrite, first take the log out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to take the speck out of your brother's eye.


Rather than spending so much energy making sure that every real and imagined wrong ever committed by any pope be broadcast to the whole world, would it not be better to pursue the virtue of humility and to "work out your own salvation with fear and trembling;"? (Phl 2:12)

Is not the choice to encourage hatred and despising against the RCC very much like the arrogance of the Pharisee in Jesus' parable of the Pharisee and the tax collector?

Luke 18:10-14

Two men went up into the temple to pray, one a Pharisee and the other a tax collector. The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, 'God, I thank thee that I am not like other men, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even like this tax collector. I fast twice a week, I give tithes of all that I get.'

But the tax collector, standing far off, would not even lift up his eyes to heaven, but beat his breast, saying, 'God, be merciful to me a sinner!'

I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other; for every one who exalts himself will be humbled, but he who humbles himself will be exalted."


Can anyone explain why the obsessive love of this anti-Christian behavior (John 17:20-21) designed to perpetuate the demonically-inspired divisions in the Body of Christ, which is the Church, is so important to so many people who call themselves "Christian"?

Jesus said that a kingdom divided against itself will not stand yet these people are obsessed (possessed?) with a need to perpetuate the sorrowful division of the church into warring factions. (Mat 12:25, Luke 11:17) Should we not, rather, be weeping for this rebellion against the will of the Lord Jesus Christ being perpetuated?

Paul's instruction concerning divisive people was quite clear.

Tit 3:10 Warn a divisive person once, and then warn them a second time. After that, have nothing to do with them.

Can anyone explain why, rather than praying for those who take such pride in this sin, it is tolerated among Christians? (Or why it is tolerated in "Christian forums")

Anyone?

And, no, I have no interest in anyone's excuses for insisting on perpetuating this sin against the body of Christ so please don't recite the mantra of the evils of the RCC 'cause I won't give them any more attention than they deserve.
 

pom2014

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The hate of catholics has been going on by protestants for centuries.

The humanists have now made illegal to chop each other into bits. So they now castrate through words.

It's hatred by tradition. My pappy hated them and his pappy and his pappy and do on. These people because it's what you're supposed to do.
 

aspen

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Jim, I thought Catholicism was a cult. I didn't attack Catholics, but I pitied them and completely ignored what they had to say because I was ignorant about what they believed and what the church taught. All it took was for me to meet one educated Catholic and then diving into two years of study to recognize my error. After RCIA, I decided to join the church and have been transformed through prayer. My life is not easy, but becoming Catholic has definitely been a beautiful road. As frustrating as it can be to watch people stuck in their own ideas about the Church, I cannot judge what I once was.
 

River Jordan

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aspen said:
Jim, I thought Catholicism was a cult.
My mom and her mom were taught that as well. Seems pretty odd and hateful to me. I'm not a Catholic, but a cult? Seriously? :huh:
 

aspen

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One more observation, when I was Protestant, my thought process was dialectic in nature, which meant that argument was the royal road to truth. When I encounter anyone, Protestant catholic our other who did not share my exact understanding of scripture, or a saving relationship with Jesus, I would argue my position. Unfortunately, I would also ignore all people's viewpoints which were similar enough to, because I didn't want to waste my time converting the converted.

The result, of course was a life of intellectual sparing and no fellowship. Very lonely and frankly for based. I am only talking about my experience, not the experience of Protestants in general.
River Jordan said:
My mom and her mom were taught that as well. Seems pretty odd and hateful to me. I'm not a Catholic, but a cult? Seriously? :huh:
I know, it seems weird to me now, but it is the tent revival, Jonathan Edwards history of ours in this country.
When you are in the hands of an angry God, there is nothing more important than righteous indignation
 

FHII

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I've noticed that, but I've also noticed that every forum also has one or two caholic that believes he church has never done any wrong, EVER. And wr have you apoearently.

Historically, Catholics would do well to simply admit to the fact that the Catholic chuch has some evil and sordid history. What's your response? "Well, protestants ain't much better!"?

No, they aren't. So what? Does that excuse wrongdoings?

The history is there. Overblown? Under reported? Doesn't matter. But some Catholics would do well to stop believing that nothing but rainbows and flowers come out of the Vatican's rear end!

I in turn would be willing to move on from such ddiscussion on history.

My big concern and one fight I will not pass on is correct doctrine. I don't agree with most Catholic doctrine and will not back down unless you can prove me wrong with the bible.

And I gotta say, I don't think some Catholics take doctrine that seriously.
 

ATP

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Catholics are misguided, just like every denomination in general. They lack relationship with the creator.
 

aspen

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Well, FHII,

All Church history contain atrocities; no reasonable person denies it. The Catholic Church does not deny it. If atrocity disqualified churches from teaching truth, the truth of God would be unknowable apart from nature. Pretending that the church did not assemble the bible in the first place is denying history. It is sort of like convincing yourself that Protestantism proceeded Catholicism - it is magical thinking.

Now, as far as the truth of scripture - scripture absolutely contains truth - it is authoritative within Christianity. This does not mean that it is supposed to be interpretated literally. A non-literal interpretation does not exclude truth.

Frankly, it is impossible to convince a student of math who only accepts numbers as 'real math' about the truth of algebra. No offense. I consider all Trinitarian Churches to be part of the Body - some happen to be more narrow in their teaching


ATP,

hmm, so I do not know God?

I think His going to be surprise to hear your opinion
 

justaname

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The only answer I have is because humanity is beset in sin.
 

JimParker

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FHII said:
I've noticed that, but I've also noticed that every forum also has one or two caholic that believes he church has never done any wrong, EVER. And wr have you apoearently.

Historically, Catholics would do well to simply admit to the fact that the Catholic chuch has some evil and sordid history. What's your response? "Well, protestants ain't much better!"?

No, they aren't. So what? Does that excuse wrongdoings?

The history is there. Overblown? Under reported? Doesn't matter. But some Catholics would do well to stop believing that nothing but rainbows and flowers come out of the Vatican's rear end!

I in turn would be willing to move on from such ddiscussion on history.

My big concern and one fight I will not pass on is correct doctrine. I don't agree with most Catholic doctrine and will not back down unless you can prove me wrong with the bible.

And I gotta say, I don't think some Catholics take doctrine that seriously.
<one or two caholic that believes he church has never done any wrong, EVER. And wr have you apoearently.>>

I have never taken that position and I have never encountered anyone who has.

<<Does that excuse wrongdoings?>>

Please go back and read the original post. You're off topic.

<<I don't agree with most Catholic doctrine>>

Then start a discussion and concisely state the doctrines you do not agree with and why.

That's not the topic of this thread.

<<And I gotta say, I don't think some Catholics take doctrine that seriously.>>

Actually, you don't "gotta say." You can keep that opinion to yourself rather than judging God's servants. Remember, according to the way you judge, you will be judged.
 

FHII

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aspen said:
. No offense. I consider all Trinitarian Churches to be part of the Body - some happen to be more narrow in their teaching

Well thaty's good to know. I appreciate you telling me that, cause I am not a Trinitarian nor do I attend a Trinitarian Church. So if that's what you believe.... great.
 

aspen

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I am not going to derail the thread, but that it troubling news, FHII. Perhaps we could discuss it further on an old trinitarian thread. I'll go read what you believe about from old posts
 

JimParker

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ATP said:
Catholics are misguided, just like every denomination in general. They lack relationship with the creator.
Please try to stay on topic.

Your personal opinion about theology would make a good topic of discussion IN ANOTHER THREAD.
 

ATP

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aspen said:
ATP,

hmm, so I do not know God?

I think His going to be surprise to hear your opinion
Man was the one who created names of denominations to satisfy their beliefs. God is love and not religion. You can be born again and call yourself whatever you want. My denomination is born again.
 

FHII

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Jim, first off I'm glad you haven't taken the position that there are catholic who believe their church hasn't done anything wrong. That's good. I've read a lot of your posts and suppose I must've missed you pointing out or admitting the faults of the church.

I noted the protestants aren't clear from wrongdoing either, and you believed that was off topic. Well, first off I'd like you to tell me exactly what is the point you are trying to make. I was under the impression due to your opening question that you wanted to know why some people on forums are so hard against the Catholic church. If so, then I gave you my answer. In that answer I thought it necessary and proper to note that protestants (by the way, I'm not a protestant) were guilty as well. It was indeed part of my answer that I believe addresses your question.

As for my opinion on whether Catholics take doctrine seriously: I will indeed post my opinion and if you don't like it, then don't reply. By the way, not taking doctrine seriously is on of the reasons many people are against them, so it is a pertinent opinion.
 

aspen

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Yet every word is scripture is preached in the Mass.....this does not happen in most protestant/evangelical churches
 

FHII

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aspen said:
Yet every word is scripture is preached in the Mass.....
Huh? What do you mean?
 

aspen

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Every scripture is preached at mass on three year cycle. Except the genealogy verses
 

FHII

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Doubt it, but it doesn't matter. You are off topic.
 

aspen

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The point you were trying to make is that Catholics do not value scripture - I simply responded to you false assertion. It is a fact that the Catholic Church covers all scripture with the the exception of genealogy every three years - you uninformed option about is irrelevant.