Once Saved Always Saved

[Behold]

Again, I do not teach that there are any magical properties in the waters of baptism, so that "water' saves a man.

Ill quote you,

This is post #11, from my "Discerning the Water Cults".

justbyfaith wrote :

"""""""It is your choice to not believe in the power of baptism to save a man.

"""""""

And your post # 20.

"""Good, and I will let you believe that you don't need to be baptized in water (even though it could be to your eternal destruction).""""


Notice that you teach that eternal destruction is related to not being water baptized.

 

[justbyfaith]

You teach that YOU can lose your salvation.
This means that YOU take responsibility to keep yourself saved.

How is that salvation by works?

Once you decided that, YOU nailed yourself to the Cross

See Galatians 2:20, Galatians 5:24.

 

[Behold]

How is that salvation by works?

.

Anything that isn't Jesus doing it, is "works', and works are rejected by The Cross.
That means everything you teach.

 

[Wrangler]

Anything that isn't Jesus doing it, is "works', and works are rejected by The Cross.

Except for universalism not being correct doctrine. If internal ‘works’ were not required, there would be no need to advocate to keep the faith.

 

[GRACE ambassador]

If you have been
perfected for ever, will you not continue in His goodness for ever?

Of course I will, Because:

"For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but
of power, and of love, and of a SOUND MIND."

But, there a still those SAVED {carnal} saints who do not understand this
yet, Having Eternal Life IN CHRIST, BUT, WILL be DENIED "rewards!"
Bible Example {FOR OUR learning!}!:

THE formicator in the carnal Corinthian assembly of SAVED saints!
Will this one be "denied" Eternal Life "for Not Continuing in goodness, being
cut off" OR have Eternal Life, but "cut off" from Receiving rewards?
What Saith The Scripture {as Paul ASKED Many times}?:

"To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that
the spirit may be SAVED in The {JUDGMENT} Day of the LORD JESUS."
(1 Corinthians 5 : 5 KJB!)

JUDGMENT Seat Of CHRIST!:

Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall
receive his own reward according to his own labour. For we are labourers
together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

According to The GRACE of God Which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid The Foundation, and another buildeth
Thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth Thereupon.

For other foundation can no man lay than That Is Laid, Which Is
JESUS CHRIST. Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold,
silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

Every man's work shall be made manifest: for The {JUDGMENT} Day
shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall
try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which
he hath built Thereupon, he Shall Receive a reward.

If any man's work shall be burned, he SHALL SUFFER LOSS:
But he himself SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire."
(1 Corinthians 3 : 8-15 KJB!)

WHY do Most criticize/Deny Verse 15? Isn't that UNbelief?

I must perceive wrongly that all you critics agree that
UNbelief = ETERNAL CONDEMNATION, do you not?

 

[justbyfaith]

Anything that isn't Jesus doing it, is "works', and works are rejected by The Cross.
That means everything you teach.

And everything that you teach must be false; since in denying indwelling sin, you re deceiving yourself and the truth is not in you (1 John 1:8).

See, two can play at that game.

 

[Tong2020]

Clearly, Jesus and Paul taught that a man can lose his salvation.

In Luke 8:13, Jesus speaks of people who "believe for a while" (are saved according to the previous verse and Ephesians 2:8-9) and in time of temptation fall away.

In Romans 11:20-22, Paul speaks of those who "stand by faith" and declares that if they do not continue in God's goodness (which means to stay obedient to the leadings and promptings of the Holy Spirit), they will be "cut off".

A careful reading of those scriptures, in the context of grace through faith, and using the lens of grace through faith, and not works, is suggested.

Tong
R2793

 

[justbyfaith]

Anything that isn't Jesus doing it, is "works', and works are rejected by The Cross.

See Ephesians 2:10. I think that that verse refutes your position on this rather profoundly.

 

[justbyfaith]

Of course I will, Because:

"For God hath not given us the spirit of fear; but
of power, and of love, and of a SOUND MIND."

But, there a still those SAVED {carnal} saints who do not understand this
yet, Having Eternal Life IN CHRIST, BUT, WILL be DENIED "rewards!"
Bible Example {FOR OUR learning!}!:

THE formicator in the carnal Corinthian assembly of SAVED saints!
Will this one be "denied" Eternal Life "for Not Continuing in goodness, being
cut off" OR have Eternal Life, but "cut off" from Receiving rewards?
What Saith The Scripture {as Paul ASKED Many times}?:

"To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that
the spirit may be SAVED in The {JUDGMENT} Day of the LORD JESUS."
(1 Corinthians 5 : 5 KJB!)

JUDGMENT Seat Of CHRIST!:

Now he that planteth and he that watereth are one: and every man shall
receive his own reward according to his own labour. For we are labourers
together with God: ye are God's husbandry, ye are God's building.

According to The GRACE of God Which is given unto me, as a wise masterbuilder, I have laid The Foundation, and another buildeth
Thereon. But let every man take heed how he buildeth Thereupon.

For other foundation can no man lay than That Is Laid, Which Is
JESUS CHRIST. Now if any man build upon This Foundation gold,
silver, precious stones, wood, hay, stubble;

Every man's work shall be made manifest: for The {JUDGMENT} Day
shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall
try every man's work of what sort it is. If any man's work abide which
he hath built Thereupon, he Shall Receive a reward.

If any man's work shall be burned, he SHALL SUFFER LOSS:
But he himself SHALL BE SAVED; yet so as by fire."
(1 Corinthians 3 : 8-15 KJB!)

WHY do Most criticize/Deny Verse 15? Isn't that UNbelief?

I must perceive wrongly that all you critics agree that
UNbelief = ETERNAL CONDEMNATION, do you not?

The carnal believer in the Corinthian church, steps had to be taken in order for his spirit to be saved on the day of the Lord Jesus. Those steps being intended to lead him to repentance; without which his spirit will not be saved.

 

[justbyfaith]

A careful reading of those scriptures, in the context of grace through faith, and using the lens of grace through faith, and not works, is suggested.

Why don't you start a new thread and do a teaching on that subject? I will be all ears.

 

[Tong2020]

Don't you know that the Bible says your 'believing' is not a work of self righteous merit? Why do people think the works gospel is defined by you doing anything at all, even believing, in order to earn salvation? How did it get this bad in the church?

It’s misleading to say that I am saved because I believed. Rather, I am saved because Jesus Christ saved me.

Besides, the former points and glorifies the man, while the latter points and glorifies Jesus Christ, the Savior.

Tong
2794

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
No matter how you wish to paraphrase that, you can not take away that the given that the one who calls or ask in the name of the LORD is a believer or have faith in the LORD.

Nevertheless, no one can come to the LORD except through faith in Jesus Christ; and @Blood Bought 1953's paraphrase doesn't include that basic truth in what it says.

It remains, those who calls on the name of the LORD are believers and have faith in God and in Jesus Christ.

Tong2020 said: ↑
Whatever and however you may call it, any enabling of one dead could be nothing but a quickening or making alive.

If anyone followed this conversation, let them know that such a thing is heresy; for it implies that a person can reject Christ and yet be saved. In that a person who is drawn to Christ and yet reject Christ; but your doctrine says that in being drawn, they were regenerated (born again). Therefore the person who is drawn to Christ but rejects Christ will go to heaven even though they rejected Christ.

If anyone did, he will find that the fallen man who is in a state of death, is dead to God and to the things of the Spirit of God, must first be quickened and made alive by God to have faith in God and call on Him.

And no one is saying that that a person can reject Christ and yet be saved. Al least that is not coming from me.

<<<but your doctrine says that in being drawn, they were regenerated (born again).>>>

That is not what I said. I did not even mentioned anything about “born again”. That’s you concluding, not me.

Tong2020 said: ↑
Read verse 13. John describes there who are the them that believe in verse 12.

Nevertheless, believing and receiving come first.

Not in my reading of scriptures. What comes first is the election of God. God is first as also He is the last.

Tong
R2795

 

[Tong2020]

One time, I tried to go back and read every past post in a long thread like this one. I never made it! So I won't try to read every single post in this one.

That being said, I want to respond to what Pearl said.



You may not be able to be unborn but you can still die.

Its true that Peter was restored when he saw the error of his ways but it was Jesus Himself who said Matthew 10:33


33 But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.


But what if a believer sins and doesn't see the error of their ways? What if they don't repent? Does God not warn them?

Romans 11:22

22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.

Those who were born of God, though they may dies, they will live.

Regarding Romans 11:22, a careful reading of that passage in Romans 11, is in order.

Tong
R2796

 

[Taken]

ONCE SAVED....is the Context that a requirement has been fulfilled.

Scriture reveals the requirement;

Rom 10
[9] That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
[10] For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.

No one has Scripturally proved that ONCE a person IS SAVED...that they can LOSE their RECEIVED Gift of Salvation.

 

[justbyfaith]

It’s misleading to say that I am saved because I believed.

No, it isn't. We have access by faith into this grace wherein we stand (Romans 5:1-2) and we are saved by grace through faith (Ephesians 2:8-9).

Believe is the verb for the noun faith.

It remains, those who calls on the name of the LORD are believers and have faith in God and in Jesus Christ.

Provided that you reaize that the name of the LORD is "Jesus Christ of Nazareth" (Acts of the Apostles 4:10-12)

If anyone did, he will find that the fallen man who is in a state of death, is dead to God and to the things of the Spirit of God, must first be quickened and made alive by God to have faith in God and call on Him.

No; he will find that that is a perversion of what it says in John 1:12; that you have to switch the verse around in its sentence structure in order to make it fit your doctrine.

It does not say, "To as many as became the sons of God, to them He gave the power to believe in and receive Him."

It says the opposite.

John 1:12.

And no one is saying that that a person can reject Christ and yet be saved. Al least that is not coming from me.

You sure?

<<<but your doctrine says that in being drawn, they were regenerated (born again).>>>

That is not what I said. I did not even mentioned anything about “born again”. That’s you concluding, not me.

What, then, is your belief on this issue? Did you not say this,

If anyone did, he will find that the fallen man who is in a state of death, is dead to God and to the things of the Spirit of God, must first be quickened and made alive by God to have faith in God and call on Him.

Not in my reading of scriptures. What comes first is the election of God. God is first as also He is the last.

Election is according to foreknowledge (Romans 8:29, 1 Peter 1:2 (kjv)).

Those who were born of God, though they may dies, they will live.

Regarding Romans 11:22, a careful reading of that passage in Romans 11, is in order.

Start a new thread and give the teaching.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

It’s misleading to say that I am saved because I believed. Rather, I am saved because Jesus Christ saved me.

So, those who do not believe is because Christ did not save them?

Your logic here is faulty.

We are indeed saved because we believe the gospel.

 

[Charlie24]

There IS a Difference between,
* A man believing and continuing belief, by his own "confidence" ( his own power ).
(Yes, this man receives, blessings, during his continued Belief.)
* And a man believing and DECLARING his Heartful Belief unto the Lord, who thereafter MAKES Changes in the man, and the man is KEPT in Belief, by the Power of God.

The Latter was Offered, and I Accepted the Latter. I freely, knowingly, and willfully submitted my WHOLE Life (body, soul, spirit)...UNTO the Lord.

No man has greater Power than the Lord.
No man can Undo what the Lord God has CHANGED regarding my WHOLE Life.

You can remain in your own confidence, IF that is what you choose. That has zero effect on me.

God asks very little of us, but demands that we believe on His Son!

If that ceases for whatever reason, God will NOT force you to do so!

This is the reason the book of Hebrews was written with all its warnings!

 

[Tong2020]

Tong2020 said: ↑
It’s misleading to say that I am saved because I believed. Rather, I am saved because Jesus Christ saved me.

So, those who do not believe is because Christ did not save them?

Your logic here is faulty.

We are indeed saved because we believe the gospel.

God had chosen a people to be His people, to whom he will give eternal life. He gave them to the Son, to raise them up at the last day. In John 10, Jesus refers to them as His sheep.

<<<So, those who do not believe is because Christ did not save them?>>>

Of course, as we know not for certain the hearts of man. That when say the gospel is preached to a crowd, some believes and others not. But whether those who believe are true believers or not, I can’t say. And whether those who did not believe, I also can’t say if later they will. So, I could not really give you a correct answer to your question.

Instead, let me share to you what the Good Shepherd says about that. Now Jesus is the Good Shepherd. He said than He knows His sheep. He said to some of them who don’t believe Him:

“you do not believe, BECAUSE you are not of My sheep”

Tong
R2798

 

[Behold]

Except for universalism not being correct doctrine. If internal ‘works’ were not required, there would be no need to advocate to keep the faith.

God gives Jesus credit for Salvation, for causing it, and for supplying it, and its then maintained and finished by God.
Philippians 1:6

"universalism" is the false teaching, the heresy, that the atonement is applied to everyone, simply because they are breathing.
Thats not the case.

God has one "work" that we are to do, that is required, before he will APPLY the Salvation that Jesus alone gained for us, 2000 yrs ago.

And what is that "work"?

The "work of GOD, is to believe on Jesus, whom God sent".

"all who call on the name of Jesus, shall be saved"

Repentance that God accepts, is to turn from unbelief to Belief in Jesus.

Or as Jesus put it, "if you do not BELIEVE I Am He, (savior & Messiah), then you will die in your SINs".

 

[Behold]

And everything that you teach must be false; since in denying indwelling sin, you re deceiving yourself and the truth is not in you (1 John 1:8).

See, two can play at that game.

Playing games, is why you are on a Christian forum.
Games like teaching that water saves, then denying you said it.
I quoted you, because you are a liar.
Want to lie again?
Will that be one more "accident", and not "willful" when you do?
Go right ahead. Im use to watching you do it.
We all are...

Also, You have the indwelling sin.
You've told us.
I dont.
I have indwelling Christ.