Perpetual virginity of Mary!

[Renniks]

don’t make stupid assumptions! God is uncreated and eternal, Mary is a created human, saved by the grace of God by the merits of Jesus Christ! If you were a Christian you would apologize?

gen 3:15 enmity means total war and She crushes his head, none of his works are found in Her, Lk 1:49 He that is mighty has done great things to me,
Plural, one is the conception of Jesus by the HS, what’s the other?

You said Mary is sinless. Only God is sinless. I am a Christian.
The other

don’t make stupid assumptions! God is uncreated and eternal, Mary is a created human, saved by the grace of God by the merits of Jesus Christ! If you were a Christian you would apologize?

gen 3:15 enmity means total war and She crushes his head, none of his works are found in Her, Lk 1:49 He that is mighty has done great things to me,
Plural, one is the conception of Jesus by the HS, what’s the other?

The other could be all kinds of things...something as simple as thanking God for breath and life... but this is poetry, why are you trying to create some doctrine from poetry?
If Mary is saved by grace like us then she was a sinner like us.

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

That's hilarious!

In what way is it hilarious? Be specific. Especially when mocking other posters.

Romans 9:14-24English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

14 What shall we say then? Is there injustice on God's part? By no means! 15 For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” 16 So then it depends not on human will or exertion,[a] but on God, who has mercy. 17 For the Scripture says to Pharaoh, “For this very purpose I have raised you up, that I might show my power in you, and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.” 18 So then he has mercy on whomever he wills, and he hardens whomever he wills.

19 You will say to me then, “Why does he still find fault? For who can resist his will?” 20 But who are you, O man, to answer back to God? Will what is molded say to its molder, “Why have you made me like this?” 21 Has the potter no right over the clay, to make out of the same lump one vessel for honorable use and another for dishonorable use? 22 What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, 23 in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory— 24 even us whom he has called, not from the Jews only but also from the Gentiles?


Ephesians 1:3-11English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

Spiritual Blessings in Christ

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us in Christ with every spiritual blessing in the heavenly places, 4 even as he chose us in him before the foundation of the world, that we should be holy and blameless before him. In love 5 he predestined us[a] for adoption to himself as sons through Jesus Christ, according to the purpose of his will, 6 to the praise of his glorious grace, with which he has blessed us in the Beloved. 7 In him we have redemption through his blood, the forgiveness of our trespasses, according to the riches of his grace, 8 which he lavished upon us, in all wisdom and insight 9 making known[b] to us the mystery of his will, according to his purpose, which he set forth in Christ 10 as a plan for the fullness of time, to unite all things in him, things in heaven and things on earth.

11 In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will,


Romans 8:28-30English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

28 And we know that for those who love God all things work together for good,[a] for those who are called according to his purpose. 29 For those whom he foreknew he also predestined to be conformed to the image of his Son, in order that he might be the firstborn among many brothers. 30 And those whom he predestined he also called, and those whom he called he also justified, and those whom he justified he also glorified.


Ephesians 2:8-10English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

8 For by grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, 9 not a result of works, so that no one may boast. 10 For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.


Colossians 2:13English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

13 And you, who were dead in your trespasses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made alive together with him, having forgiven us all our trespasses,


Titus 3:5English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

5 he saved us, not because of works done by us in righteousness, but according to his own mercy, by the washing of regeneration and renewal of the Holy Spirit,

2 Timothy 2:25English Standard Version (ESV) Written by the Apostle Paul

25 correcting his opponents with gentleness. God may perhaps grant them repentance leading to a knowledge of the truth,

1 Peter 1:3English Standard Version (ESV)

Born Again to a Living Hope

3 Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! According to his great mercy, he has caused us to be born again to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,



Ezekiel 36:25-26English Standard Version (ESV)

25 I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean from all your uncleannesses, and from all your idols I will cleanse you. 26 And I will give you a new heart, and a new spirit I will put within you. And I will remove the heart of stone from your flesh and give you a heart of flesh.


Deuteronomy 30:6English Standard Version (ESV)

6 And the Lord your God will circumcise your heart and the heart of your offspring, so that you will love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul, that you may live.


Acts 13:48English Standard Version (ESV)

48 And when the Gentiles heard this, they began rejoicing and glorifying the word of the Lord, and as many as were appointed to eternal life believed.

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

What sin does the Bible say that Mary committed?

Mary was never told that she is/was without sin. Moreover, the Bible says this:

Romans 3:21-24
21 But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

I think you are the one making things up.

You haven't even come close to showing that. I provide exegetically sound scripture.

 

[Marymog]

Did Jesus come to "reform" the ways of the Jews who were supposed to be following the laws God gave to Moses?

"Then came to Jesus scribes and Pharisees, which were of Jerusalem, saying,
Why do thy disciples transgress the tradition of the elders? for they wash not their hands when they eat bread.
But he answered and said unto them, Why do ye also transgress the commandment of God by your tradition?" Matt 15:1-3

Now not all traditions are evil. But if a tradition causes a person to transgress the commandment of God, which way should he go?

Hi Amadeus,

It would be nice if all Christians would agree on which traditions from the Jesus and the Apostles we should keep. But we can not agree and therein lies a big part of the problem. You ask "which way should we go?". My Answer: I don't know of any tradition that effects our salvation so I am not really sure it matters if we hold fast to traditions or not. Unless you know of a tradition that if one does not hold to it they will potentially loose their salvation?

Mary

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

don’t make stupid assumptions! God is uncreated and eternal, Mary is a created human, saved by the grace of God by the merits of Jesus Christ! If you were a Christian you would apologize?

gen 3:15 enmity means total war and She crushes his head, none of his works are found in Her, Lk 1:49 He that is mighty has done great things to me,
Plural, one is the conception of Jesus by the HS, what’s the other?

I'm a member on most Christian forums. I have never found one that would allow this "don’t make stupid assumptions!" kind of posting. It's name calling and certainly does not show your church in a good way. By the time this happens, it's evident that you cannot answer serious questions from the Bible. I will show some charity and give you the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

we can’t help it if the catholic teaching matches the Bible?

There may be things that you can't help, but properly exegeting scripture is problematic. The Catholic church makes up all kinds of things that are not biblical. Holy days of obligation, purgatory, absolution, another Christ, transubstantiation. I could go on for quite some time. It's a prolific state of guess work.

 

[theefaith]

You said Mary is sinless. Only God is sinless. I am a Christian.
The other

The other could be all kinds of things...something as simple as thanking God for breath and life... but this is poetry, why are you trying to create some doctrine from poetry?
If Mary is saved by grace like us then she was a sinner like us.

only God is sinless in His nature! Mary was created without original sin, and always remained faithful Lk 1:28 full of grace Lk 1:45 faithful
Matt 12:50 rev 12:1 clothed with the sun refers to Grace.

you can be save after sin or preserved from sin both are saved both have a savior

 

[theefaith]

Mary was never told that she is/was without sin. Moreover, the Bible says this:

Romans 3:21-24
21 But now the righteousness of God has been manifested apart from the law, although the Law and the Prophets bear witness to it— 22 the righteousness of God through faith in Jesus Christ for all who believe. For there is no distinction: 23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus,

All have sinned, including Mary right?
1) This verse can be seen as a generalization, like Matt 3:5.
2) Paul is quoting the OT all have sinned accept my people.
No matter what it’s not absolute, Jesus, children under the age of reason, mentally ill or anyone without free will are Not Included!!! And Mary is not included! Gen 3:15 enmity, Lk 1:28 full of grace and blessed!

and Mary is the ark of the new covenant!

God dwelt in Mary’s womb for 9 months, remember the ark was incorruptible wood covered with pure gold signifying Mary’s immaculate purity!
read exodus or any place in the Old Testament where something came into contact with God or was consecrated to the service of God it had to be pure and Holy!
In the ark was the word of God!
In Mary the new ark is the living Word!
In the ark was the mana!
In Mary was the bread come down from heaven!
Bethlehem means house to of bread!

Sinless yes! Gen 3:15 I will put enmity between thee and the woman, none of satan’s works are found in her!

I guess it ok for Satan to accuse Our Lord of being the son of a sinner?

 

[theefaith]

I'm a member on most Christian forums. I have never found one that would allow this "don’t make stupid assumptions!" kind of posting. It's name calling and certainly does not show your church in a good way. By the time this happens, it's evident that you cannot answer serious questions from the Bible. I will show some charity and give you the benefit of the doubt.

On the contrary he was flaming and goading from his bias. I give respect and even thank Hod for your faith

 

[Eternally Grateful]

Mary's song is in the OT. Jesus had not been born except in the sense of being with God before the foundation of the world.

People forget, the lord or God of Israel was Jesus preincarnat

 

[Eternally Grateful]

gen 3:15 enmity none of satans works are in Her, and without Her being conceived immaculate without original sin Jesus would have contracted original sin thru Her.

Jesus was conceived immaculate not Mary

the egg Of the woman is not tainted with origional sin, that’s why no seed of man could tough the egg, because in adam (through him) all die,

 

[Renniks]

only God is sinless in His nature! Mary was created without original sin, and always remained faithful Lk 1:28 full of grace Lk 1:45 faithful
Matt 12:50 rev 12:1 clothed with the sun refers to Grace.

you can be save after sin or preserved from sin both are saved both have a savior

It just gets worse, now you have Mary born without any sinful inclination.
28 And having come in, the angel said to her, “Rejoice, highly favored one, the Lord is with you; [e]blessed are you among women!”
Don't see anything about full of grace...

. 45 Blessed is she who [h]believed, for there will be a fulfillment of those things which were told her from the Lord.”

Don't see anything about faithful.

Matt 12;50 For whosoever shall do the will of my Father which is in heaven, the same is my brother, and sister, and mother.

Well, that certainly doesn't bode well for Mary being substantially different than any Christian.

12 A great sign appeared in heaven: a woman clothed with the sun, with the moon under her feet and a crown of twelve stars on her head.

Some think the woman is Israel. Some think the woman is the church. I agree. Because the true Church is Israel. But that's another discussion..

 

[Eternally Grateful]

If you are a serious studier of the Bible you will know that there are many beliefs that are not explicitly stated in the Bible but are based on a build up of evidence. The demand for a verse that explicitly states "X" or "Y" is a copout from examining the evidence.

Much evidence has been given for the belief in the perpetual virginity of Mary. If all you have in opposition to that is that the Bible speaks of brothers (and sisters) of Mary then you only have flimsy evidence. Let's review this "brothers" evidence.

Here are 8 points to consider.
1. There is no genealogy in the Bible that goes past Jesus.

2. Nowhere does the Bible say that Mary had other children.

3. There are different kinds of brothers (and sisters) - full blood brothers, half brothers, adoptive brothers. If a man and woman marry and both have children by a previous marriage they will be regarded as brothers and sisters even though they have no genetic relationship. The actual relationship of these “brothers” to Jesus cannot be established unless a genealogy is given, and it is not.

Secondly the word brother can be used in a very loose sense. In Aramaic there is no word for cousin and the word for brother (aha) would include cousin or even nephew. Whilst Greek does include a word for cousin but it is quite possible to translators/writers just used the Greek adelphos to replace the Aramaic aha. Moreover the Greek word for brother (adelphos) was also used very loosely for various degrees of kinship.

In the Greek translation of the Old Testament (the LXX) the word adelphos is used for Lot’s nephew (Gen 14:14). Other similar examples can be given.

Paul says in Col 4:7 & 9
“Tychicus, my beloved brother [adelphos]……..together with Onesimus, a trustworthy and beloved brother [adelphos]”. We know from the letter to Philemon that Onesimus was actually a runaway slave, not Paul’s brother (or cousin).

4. An important argument from a theological perspective is that always, when a birth is announced by an angel of a son, it is a matter of an only son.

• Isaac (Gen 18:10)
• Samson (Judges 13:4)
• John the Baptist (Lk 1:13)

If these were figures of the Messiah, it would be illogical that they would be only sons, and the one represented by them were not like them.

5. There is no mention of other children when we might expect there to be.
a) When Luke tells us about the family in Nazareth, he only mentions three persons, not more. (Lk 2:41-52) When Jesus was lost in the temple, Joseph and Mary did not return with other sons. If one were lost, surely they would not leave the others (if there were any) at risk of losing them as well.

b) John tells us that Mary was at the wedding at Cana (John 2) and Jesus was also invited with his disciples. Surely any other children of Mary would have been there (it would have been rude not to invite them) but John mentions none.

6. At the cross Jesus, asks John to look after Mary. If there had been other children Jesus would not have done that.

7. In John 7:3-4 we read So his brothers said to him, “Leave here and go to Judea, that your disciples may see the works you are doing. For no man works in secret if he seeks to be known openly. If you do these things, show yourself to the world.” In that culture it would have been very disrespectful for younger brothers to speak to an elder like that. That implies the brothers were older than Jesus and therefore not Mary's children.

8. Finally there indications in scripture that the brothers and sisters referred to in Mt 13:55 (and the equivalent in other gospels) are not Jesus brothers in any genetic sense.

Mark says that at the foot of the cross was “Mary the mother of the younger James and of Joses [Joseph], and Salome” This was obviously not Mary the mother of Jesus, so there is another Mary with sons called James and Joseph.

Matthew similarly says of the women at the foot of the cross “Among them were Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Joseph” (Mt 26:56)

Luke says that at the tomb were “Mary Magdalene, Joanna, and Mary the mother of James” (Lk 24:10)

John says “Standing by the cross of Jesus were his mother and his mother’s sister, Mary the wife of Clopas, and Mary of Magdala.” (Jn 19:25). Now this could mean that Jesus’ mother’s sister was there (whatever is meant by “sister”) and Mary the wife of Clopas or they were the same person, but either way there were at least three Mary’s at the cross – Mary the mother of Jesus, Mary the wife of Clopas and Mary of Magdalene. Now Mary the mother of James and Joseph could have been a fourth or she could have been Mary wife of Clopas (let's call her Mary Clopas) Either way Mary the mother of Jesus was not the mother of James and Joseph mentioned as Jesus’ brothers. And since they were listed first, neither was Simon and Judas, since if the were they would hardly have been listed after non-brothers.

The Church historian Eusebius quoting from Hegesippus (110-180 AD) writes
After the martyrdom of James and the conquest of Jerusalem which immediately followed, it is said that those of the apostles and disciples of the Lord that were still living came together from all directions with those that were related to the Lord according to the flesh (for the majority of them also were still alive) to take counsel as to who was worthy to succeed James. They all with one consent pronounced Symeon, the son of Clopas, of whom the Gospel also makes mention; to be worthy of the episcopal throne of that parish. He was a cousin, as they say, of the Saviour. For Hegesippus records that Clopas was a brother of Joseph.

So Symeon (Simeon, Simon) was the cousin of Jesus, and Mary Clopas was therefore the sister-in-law of Mary the mother of Jesus. Again note the loose use of relationships. Mary Clopas is referred to as Mary’s “sister” in Jn 19:25 when she is actually her sister-in-law.

In the book of Jude he says “Jude, a slave of Jesus Christ and brother of James” (Jude 1:1) So Jude (or Judas) is probably the brother of James the son of Clopas.

Then also Luke when listing the apostles says James, son of Alpheus. But the Aramaic Alpheus can be rendered in Greek as either Alpheus or Clopas. So again James, the “brother” of the Lord is probably the son of Clopas.

Yet non of this proves Mary had no children

just because something CAN mean something does not mean it has to.

joseph did not know his wife until

there is absolutely no need to even proclaim this in scripture unless Joseph eventually consummated their marriage,

mary and Joseph did not die after Jesus was born, so using the example until her death does not fit, because once you die it is impossible to do anything

 

[Eternally Grateful]

The verse you quote in no way proves your claim that sin comes through a man's seed.

Your quote refers to death coming through Adam not sin.
True, sin came through Adam "Therefore as sin came into the world through one man and death through sin, and so death spread to all men because all men sinned" (Rom 5:12), however your quote does not say that.

Death came through sin - the sin of Adam.

Neither 1Cor 15:20-22 nor Rom 5:12 onwards say that sin or death is transmitted via the man's seed.

Except you forget, we are dead because of sin.

it is Adams sin which kills, that is passed by the man, that’s why Gen 3 said the savior would come through her seed not Adams, Adams seed did not touch Jesus,

 

[theefaith]

There may be things that you can't help, but properly exegeting scripture is problematic. The Catholic church makes up all kinds of things that are not biblical. Holy days of obligation, purgatory, absolution, another Christ, transubstantiation. I could go on for quite some time. It's a prolific state of guess work.

why do you believe the Virgin birth? Wow that’s catholic dogma? And refers to Mary? I’m not anti-Bible for it is the word of God, but it does say Joseph is the father of Jesus? How do you have both the Virgin birth and the father Of Jesus?
Lk 2:48 Jn 1:45

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

why do you believe the Virgin birth? Wow that’s catholic dogma? And refers to Mary? I’m not anti-Bible for it is the word of God, but it does say Joseph is the father of Jesus? How do you have both the Virgin birth and the father Of Jesus?
Lk 2:48 Jn 1:45

I believe the virgin birth because I read my Bible.

Out of courtesy and respect I have posted the verses you suggested. But I did more, because I have said before every verse has a context.

Luke 2:40-46
English Standard Version

40 And the child grew and became strong, filled with wisdom. And the favor of God was upon him.

41 Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the Feast of the Passover. 42 And when he was twelve years old, they went up according to custom. 43 And when the feast was ended, as they were returning, the boy Jesus stayed behind in Jerusalem. His parents did not know it, 44 but supposing him to be in the group they went a day's journey, but then they began to search for him among their relatives and acquaintances, 45 and when they did not find him, they returned to Jerusalem, searching for him. 46 After three days they found him in the temple, sitting among the teachers, listening to them and asking them questions.


John 1:40-45
English Standard Version

40 One of the two who heard John speak and followed Jesus was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother. 41 He first found his own brother Simon and said to him, “We have found the Messiah” (which means Christ). 42 He brought him to Jesus. Jesus looked at him and said, “You are Simon the son of John. You shall be called Cephas” (which means Peter).

43 The next day Jesus decided to go to Galilee. He found Philip and said to him, “Follow me.” 44 Now Philip was from Bethsaida, the city of Andrew and Peter. 45 Philip found Nathanael and said to him, “We have found him of whom Moses in the Law and also the prophets wrote, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.”

Has it occurred to you that Jesus was still a young boy when others named Joseph as his father? I guess not. Jesus certainly had not been crucified, so no one except for his earthly parents would know about his virgin birth.

Why can you not do this for yourself? One doesn't need to be a biblical scholar to see this. I believe you are earnest and completely capable of exegeting scripture properly. Follow the Bible. It will only benefit you.

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

All have sinned, including Mary right?

1) This verse can be seen as a generalization, like Matt 3:5.
2) Paul is quoting the OT all have sinned accept my people.
No matter what it’s not absolute, Jesus, children under the age of reason, mentally ill or anyone without free will are Not Included!!! And Mary is not included! Gen 3:15 enmity, Lk 1:28 full of grace and blessed!

C'mon, you can do better than this! You're quick to point to scripture if you think it will back up Catholic thought. But not so much when I demonstrate that you don't know the proper way to interpret scripture. Yet still, I know you are more than capable.

and Mary is the ark of the new covenant!

So you say.

God dwelt in Mary’s womb for 9 months, remember the ark was incorruptible wood covered with pure gold signifying Mary’s immaculate purity!
read exodus or any place in the Old Testament where something came into contact with God or was consecrated to the service of God it had to be pure and Holy!
In the ark was the word of God!
In Mary the new ark is the living Word!
In the ark was the mana!
In Mary was the bread come down from heaven!
Bethlehem means house to of bread!

This is the machinations of sinful men. The ramblings of mad-men. No scripture to support it.

From Got Questions:

Question: "What is the Immaculate Conception?"

Answer: Many people mistakenly believe that the Immaculate Conception refers to the conception of Jesus Christ. Jesus’ conception was most assuredly immaculate—that is, without the stain of sin—but the Immaculate Conception does not refer to Jesus at all. The Immaculate Conception is a doctrine of the Roman Catholic Church in regards to Mary, Jesus’ mother. The official statement of the doctrine reads, “The blessed Virgin Mary to have been, from the first instant of her conception, by a singular grace and privilege of Almighty God, in view of the merits of Christ Jesus the Savior of Mankind, preserved free from all stain of original sin” (Pope Pius IX, Ineffabilis Deus, December 1854). Essentially, the Immaculate Conception is the belief that Mary was protected from original sin, that Mary did not have a sin nature and was, in fact, sinless.

Catholics celebrate the Feast of the Immaculate Conception of the Blessed Virgin Mary on December 8. Within Eastern Orthodoxy, December 9 is the date of the Feast of the Conception by St. Anne of the Most Holy Theotokos. (Anne is Mary’s mother, according to tradition.) The Eastern Church does not hold to the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception, although they do consider Mary “all-holy,” that is, she never committed a sin.

The Immaculate Conception is not a virgin birth. Catholics believe Mary was conceived the normal way, but God made her immune from imputed or inherited sin. For as long as she’s been in existence, Mary has been free of sin. This allowed her to be the “second Eve” to give birth to the “second Adam” (see 1 Corinthians 15:45). Overshadowed by the Holy Spirit (Luke 1:35), Mary was a pure and holy “ark,” fit to carry the Son of God. As the ark of the Lord in Moses’ day carried the elements of the Old Covenant within it, so Mary carried the Author of the New Covenant within her.

The Roman Catholic Church bases its teaching of the Immaculate Conception on tradition along with a couple passages of Scripture. One is Genesis 3:15, the protoevangelium. There, God speaks to the serpent: “I will put enmity between you and the woman, and between your offspring and hers.” Catholics point to the fact that the conflict between the serpent and the woman is equal to the conflict between the serpent and the woman’s Offspring, and they explain this by saying the woman (Mary) must be as equally sinless as her Offspring (Christ). The other passage cited by Catholics in support of the Immaculate Conception is Luke 1:28, “The angel went to her and said, ‘Greetings, you who are highly favored! The Lord is with you.’” The Greek word translated “highly favored” can be rendered “favored with grace”; thus, according to Catholic dogma, Mary had a superabundance of grace, rendering her sinless, and that’s why God chose her to bear His Son.

The Roman Catholic Church argues that the Immaculate Conception is necessary because, without it, Jesus would have received His flesh from one who was herself a slave to the devil, whose works Jesus came to destroy (1 John 3:8). Mary, as the mother of the Redeemer, needed for her flesh to be free from the power of sin, and God gave her that privilege. From her time in the womb, Mary was sanctified because of her special role in bringing the Son of God incarnate into the world.

One problem with the doctrine of the Immaculate Conception is that it is not taught in the Bible. Even Catholics admit that Scripture does not directly teach the Immaculate Conception. The Bible nowhere describes Mary as anything but an ordinary human female whom God chose to be the mother of the Lord Jesus Christ. Mary was undoubtedly a godly woman (Luke 1:28). Mary was surely a wonderful wife and mother. Jesus definitely loved and cherished His mother (John 19:27). But the Bible gives us no reason to believe that Mary was sinless. In fact, the Bible gives us every reason to believe that Jesus Christ is the only Person who was not “infected” by sin and never committed a sin (see Ecclesiastes 7:20; Romans 3:23; 2 Corinthians 5:21; 1 Peter 2:22; 1 John 3:5).

The doctrine of the Immaculate Conception is neither biblical nor necessary. Jesus was miraculously conceived inside Mary, who was a virgin at the time. That is the biblical doctrine of the virgin birth. The Bible never hints that there was anything significant about Mary’s conception. Mary is not an exception to the Bible’s statement that “all have sinned” (Romans 3:23). Mary needed a Savior just like the rest of us (Luke 1:47).

Sinless yes! Gen 3:15 I will put enmity between thee and the woman, none of satan’s works are found in her!

This has already been refuted.

I guess it ok for Satan to accuse Our Lord of being the son of a sinner?

I didn't say that and you don't get to imply that I did.

 

[Spurgeon's Girl]

On the contrary he was flaming and goading from his bias. I give respect and even thank Hod for your faith

The other poster may have engaged in wrong doing, but it doesn't matter. Jesus said this: In Matthew 5:38–39, Jesus says, “You have heard that it was said, ‘Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth.’ But I tell you, do not resist an evil person. If anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to them the other cheek also.”

We all get frustrated and lose our tempers, but there are unbelievers who lurk on forums. What kind of example are we setting for them?

 

[amadeus]

Matt 23 Jesus commands the successors of Moses to be obeyed!

Kingdom authority: (keys) vs 13
Kingdom power: (bind & loose) vs 4
Taken from Israel given to the church: Matt 21:43 to Peter, the apostles, and their successors. Matt 16:18 matt 18:18

Peter, and the apostles, and their successors sent by Christ!
Matt 28:19 Jn 13:20 Lk 10:16 Jn 8:32 Jn 13:20 Jn 16:13 Jn 20:21-22 eph 2:20

Again you did not answer my questions. If you don't know the answers, why continue to pursue this? God does not expect any of us to know all of the answers. Perhaps you should stop insisting that you are standing on anything but your own faith. How could I argue with that? God does not save only those who are able to pass sort of a theological examination. He, I believe, is more concerned with what is in a person's heart.