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Featured Rapture Ready For Partial Rapture?

Discussion in 'Eschatology & Prophecy Forum' started by Enow, Mar 7, 2020.

  1. Dcopymope

    Dcopymope Well-Known Member

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    Probably auto correct. For it to be a hacker, they would have to either compromise the website itself somehow, or gain control of your computer through a backdoor, like a rootkit.
     
  2. Enow

    Enow Well-Known Member

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    Well, I can hope it was auto correct. Thanks for the info.
     
  3. Paul Christensen

    Paul Christensen Well-Known Member

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    There are many types of Charismatics, so it is not quite fair to tar and feather them all with the same brush.

    Not all Charismatics are of the Kenneth Copeland, Creflo Dollar, Joel Osteen, Benny Hinn persuasion, whom I seriously doubt that they are even genuinely converted to Christ. They are the ones who draw the crowds, and that is a sure indication that they are not preaching the true gospel of Christ, because the real way to salvation through the gospel is narrow and relatively few find it. The real gospel does not draw the crowds. If you examine the preaching of these men, you will find that they don't preach the gospel at all, but teaching that assures people that they will be wealthy and be guaranteed to be healed if they put their pinch of financial "incense" on their altar (or in the money bucket). Self denial is not part of the "gospel" they preach.

    Most Charismatics and Pentecostals I know are part of small groups who abide by the Westminster Confession of Faith plus the continuance of the gifts of the Spirit. They are humble, godly folk who love the Lord and serve Him as faithful servants. These are the ones who don't draw the crowds because they are there to worship the Lord and not to entertain the masses who have tickling ears, heaping up for themselves teachers that suit their wants.
     
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  4. Dcopymope

    Dcopymope Well-Known Member

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    :) No problem
     
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  5. Keraz

    Keraz Well-Known Member

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    The issue of a 'rapture to heaven' for the Church is far from being accepted by many people who seriously study this belief. So believers in that idea cannot just assume that a rapture will happen.

    They say; We Christians are not appointed to wrath. And this is a true statement, but it doesn't in any way mean that God intends to remove His people to heaven, to avoid any hardships and testing to come.
    I have a list of 25 scriptures that say how the Lord will protect His people during His wrath.

    What people should consider, is what does God want of us Christians? What is our destiny?
    Jesus gave us a Commission; to spread the Gospel, Matthew 28:19-20
    Will He say; Nah, don't need to bother any more, come up here and do harp practice! Let the ungodly stew in their own juice.

    NO; we are His witnesses, Isaiah 43:8-13, John 15:27 and His Light to the nations, Isaiah 49:8, Matthew 5:14-16, also Ezekiel 39:27
    THAT is our task, our destiny and our great privilege.
     
  6. Enoch111

    Enoch111 Well-Known Member

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    Since the Rapture to Heaven is a biblical doctrine, those who do not accept it are essentially rejecting Bible truth in favor of human reasoning. When Enoch -- the 7th from Adam -- was raptured to Heaven, the Bible doctrine of the Rapture was already brought into existence.

    By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God. (Heb 11:5)

    Translated/translation occur three times in one verse to emphasize the truth of the Rapture. This expands on what was revealed in Genesis 5:23,24: And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty and five years: And Enoch walked with God: and he was not; for God took him.

    Only the Holy Spirit could reveal to Paul (when writing the epistle of the Hebrews) the meaning of "and God took him". As we can see that was a SUPERNATURAL act of God, who prevented Enoch from seeing death, and while he was alive he went to Heaven. So did Elijah. And Elijah was a man of like passions as we are, yet God sent a heavenly chariot with heavenly horses to take Elijah to Heaven. Another SUPERNATURAL event. And that is exactly what the Rapture of the Church will be.

    And since the Church is the Body and Bride of Christ, there cannot possibly be a *partial Rapture*. So that is FALSE DOCTRINE.
     
  7. Enow

    Enow Well-Known Member

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    Philip was transported from one place to another by the Spirit.

    Acts 8:39 And when they were come up out of the water, the Spirit of the Lord caught away Philip, that the eunuch saw him no more: and he went on his way rejoicing.40 But Philip was found at Azotus: and passing through he preached in all the cities, till he came to Caesarea.

    So let us look at that verse and compare with another verse where Enoch was not taken to.

    Hebrews 11:5 By faith Enoch was translated that he should not see death; and was not found, because God had translated him: for before his translation he had this testimony, that he pleased God....

    John 3:13 And no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.

    1 Peter 3:18 For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit:

    1 Corinthians 15:50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
    51 Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed,...

    So where did he go? Will he be one of the 2 witnesses at Jerusalem that will die and raise from the dead and ascend during the great tribulation? It seems plausible since scripture says neither Enoch nor Elijah that have been taken spectacularly are not in Heaven yet but they are allowed to ascend to be part of the firstfruits of the resurrection somewhen in the middle of that great tribulation.

    We will know for sure when we come face to face with Jesus Christ.

    There are vessels unto honor and there are vessels unto dishonor that are both in that great house. 2 Timothy 2:20 and yet by purging ourselves by departing from iniquity is how one become a vessel unto honor to be received by the Bridegroom, and yet the vessels unto dishonor are what? Those whom have not departed from iniquity for not being ready and thus cast off in getting stripes per the knowledge for not being ready in Luke 12:40-49

    This is not a loss of salvation but of being disqualified from being vessels unto honor to attend the Marriage Supper held in His honor in Heaven.

    This is where the vessels unto dishonor comes from for why the Lord would deny them because of being workers of iniquity for why they are left behind. Paul spoke of that risk that could happen to himself in 1 Corinthians 9:24-26 and that is why discipleship and running that race by looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin is NOT for salvation, but for obtaining the high prize of our calling which is to be that vessel unto honor in His House which is the eternal glory that comes with our salvation in Christ Jesus ( 2 Timothy 2:10-13 & 2 Timothy 2:18-21 )
     
  8. Keraz

    Keraz Well-Known Member

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    You and probably everyone you know, believe in the 'rapture'. But as I say; very many Christians do not.
    So a 'rapture' is not my Christian doctrine and will never be, as I know from the Bible what it is that the Lord requires of us. Going to live in heaven, isn't an option for us, as we fulfil our duties for our Lord on earth.

    My concern is for all who hold to being removed before any tribulation happens, as that leaves them unprepared for what will happen.
     
  9. Enow

    Enow Well-Known Member

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    If the being ready for the rapture means to abide in Him and His words, then it doesn't matter for then He will help them face the fire coming on the earth and the coming great tribulation as a result.

    But if believers are looking for time of the great tribulation to when they will get serious in their relationship with the Lord, they run the risk of being caught with their pants down and left behind as a result when the pre great tribulation rapture comes.
     
  10. Keraz

    Keraz Well-Known Member

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    I run no risk of being 'left behind'.
    Because there is no such thing as a 'pre Great Tribulation rapture'. The Bible prophets just do not predict such a thing.

    But we do have many Promises of God, for our protection and help, as we go through all that must happen before Jesus Returns.
    Wouldn't it be better for you and all who think they will be 'raptured', to know the truth and be prepared for soon to happen events?
     
  11. Enow

    Enow Well-Known Member

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    And yet the call to be ready or else, applies more to the pre great tribulation rapture than for the end of the great tribulation where saints are being persecuted and the cares of this life will hardly be a snare or for any saint to be overcharged with.

    I believe that since Jesus is faithful that He will keep the souls of His saints that suffer the coming fire on the earth and the coming great tribulation too.
     
  12. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    In this you ascribe our eternal salvation to the vagaries of our moods.

    Not a very useful statement. I can say just as well, no, the problem is that you don't understand justification and a new creation. But again, how useful is that?

    Luke 21 is towards the Jews who will find themselves in the great tribulation, and they are admonished to pray that they be worthy/have strength to flee from these things, and stand before the Son of Man. Ascribing this to the gentile church - a mystery that had not been revealed - will produce confusion.

    This whole thing about the gentile church, a mystery not yet revealed, I wonder how many realize the significance of that.

    Paul taught about the gentile church as revealing a musterion, a mystery. In the Greek, this is something unknown and unknowable except by revelation.

    In that Paul revealed these things that were up to that time mysteries, this means these things Were Not revealed before. Luke 21 is not a passage about the rapture of a gentile church.

    Much love!
    Mark
     
  13. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Paul told that church to excommunicate that believer in that circumstance. There are guidelines in the Bible for whom we should and should not fellowship with.

    However, if we form our doctrines of justification on that, then confusion will result. Our acceptance by God is not based on our works.

    Much love!
     
  14. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Hi CL,

    I don't understand your question.

    ?
     
  15. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Yet you've said before that if you commit unintentional sins, that you are forgiven of them, and not condemned or corrupted, isn't that right?

    Much love!
     
  16. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Hi n2thelight,

    I'd rather say that so long as we are in this flesh, we are capable of sin, and liable to sin in some way at some time. But I don't believe that we must sin, and in fact, I believe that we are capable of not sinning by the power of God.

    I think that the corruption that is in our flesh will war with us until the day we die, and are resurrected incorruptible. But in the meantime, when we abide in Christ we do so without sin. And as we mature in Christ, our sin grows less and less.

    Continuously living in an actively held faith results in continued righteousness. When we falter in our faith, sin is the result, as all that is not of faith is sin.

    We have two states of living, either walking in the Spirit, or walking according to the flesh. Either living our new life, or living as if we were not born again.

    Much love!
     
  17. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    This is not salvation by grace through faith. This is performance based salvation and I very much disagree with this teaching.

    We are to forgive as We Have Been Forgiven.

    I know this has been mentioned before, but as I ask that you would consider the reality of this statement, Forgive others, even as you have been forgiven by God in Christ.

    Much love!
     
  18. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member

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    You said: "When we walk in the Spirit I don't think we commit any sins."

    1 John 1:7 But if we walk in the light as He is in the light, we have fellowship with one another, and the blood of Jesus Christ His Son cleanses us from all sin.

    You are right, we do not commit willful sins. So what kind of sins is Jesus continuing to cleanse?
     
  19. marks

    marks Well-Known Member

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    Romans 7
    20 Now if I do that I would not, it is no more I that do it, but sin that dwelleth in me.
    21 I find then a law, that, when I would do good, evil is present with me.
    22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man:
    23 But I see another law in my members, warring against the law of my mind, and bringing me into captivity to the law of sin which is in my members.
    24 O wretched man that I am! who shall deliver me from the body of this death?
    25 I thank God through Jesus Christ our Lord. So then with the mind I myself serve the law of God; but with the flesh the law of sin.

    If we are to believe this passage . . . do we believe this passage? If we are to believe what is written here, then let's believe what is written.

    upload_2020-3-16_14-42-28.png

    "am slaving" here is "present active", which is to say, in the writer's timeline, "I'm doing this now". If we're going to believe what it says, that's what it says. Isn't it? Am I wrong about this? Does it says, "I served", past tense?

    That's how Paul wrote elsewhere, such as Ephesians 2,

    2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
    3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.

    Here there is no ambiguity, and I believe that Romans 7 is equally unambiguous.

    Much love!
     
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  20. CharismaticLady

    CharismaticLady Well-Known Member

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    You think works is works, just like you think sin is sin. I don't. I see the differences in God's eyes written in His Word.

    There are two kinds of works, just as there are two kinds of sins. The difference in either is the Spirit.

    Those without the Spirit, can only use their own strength and perform self-righteousness. That is what God is against.

    Whose with the Spirit, can only perform true righteousness by the Spirit who gives them strength.

    Those without the Spirit are still bent towards sin, and sin willfully because they love darkness. They bear no true fruit and their branch is lopped off.

    Those with the Spirit are no longer bent towards sin because they have been born again of the Spirit. They have no desire to knowingly commit sin against the God they love, but they are not perfect and are still able to commit trespasses. They produce fruit, but Jesus prunes them to produce more fruit.
     
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