Reasons Jews Reject Jesus

[amigo de christo]

Amen! Stay strong, rooted, with the full panoplia of YHVH-and our highest eulogy to our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus!--Hoshannah to the Ben Dovid [Moshiach]. JESUS Christ!

Persecutions are not new to the true lambs . They count the cost and see all loss for CHRIST as only gain .
They point only to CHRIST JESUS and love and embrace all truth , every word of the LORD .
I am so sad to see many have taken the false progessive all inclusive lie . But the lambs will not heed the voice
of false teachers nor prophets . They heed the voice of CHRIST and love and embrace all things He did teach .
All GOD inspired TRUTH in the scriptures . March on my friend . Many saints now sleep in Christ .
We have simply entered into their labors in Christ .

 

[Johann]

Persecutions are not new to the true lambs . They count the cost and see all loss for CHRIST as only gain .
They point only to CHRIST JESUS and love and embrace all truth , every word of the LORD .
I am so sad to see many have taken the false progessive all inclusive lie . But the lambs will not heed the voice
of false teachers nor prophets . They heed the voice of CHRIST and love and embrace all things He did teach .
All GOD inspired TRUTH in the scriptures . March on my friend . Many saints now sleep in Christ .
We have simply entered into their labors in Christ .

I have seen the movie-and the 3 Tribulation series-powerful indeed amigo.
Johann

 

[amigo de christo]

I have seen the movie-and the 3 Tribulation series-powerful indeed amigo.
Johann

 

[Jim B]

Persecutions are not new to the true lambs . They count the cost and see all loss for CHRIST as only gain .
They point only to CHRIST JESUS and love and embrace all truth , every word of the LORD .
I am so sad to see many have taken the false progessive all inclusive lie . But the lambs will not heed the voice
of false teachers nor prophets . They heed the voice of CHRIST and love and embrace all things He did teach .
All GOD inspired TRUTH in the scriptures . March on my friend . Many saints now sleep in Christ .
We have simply entered into their labors in Christ .

Are you being persecuted? If so, how, when, and where?

It's absurd to equate progressive thoughts with lies. That is the way the Pharisees thought about Jesus! They had their firm doctrine, rooted in conservatism, and couldn't accept Jesus as the progressive that He was.

 

[Johann]

It's absurd to equate progressive thoughts with lies. That is the way the Pharisees thought about Jesus! They had their firm doctrine, rooted in conservatism, and couldn't accept Jesus as the progressive that He was.

Leave the brother alone @Jim B as you are a member of the body of Christ, so is @amigo de christo --you have your God-given calling-same as amigo-what you are doing is goading him, which goes against the rules of this Forum.

And what you are doing is not Christ-like brother.

 

[Johann]

I’m not here to lecture, nor am I here to attend a lecture. I’m here for simple conversation.

In what way do you believe Jesus is God-although a created being and a concept in the mind of YHVH?

 

[Matthias]

In what way do you believe Jesus is God-although a created being and a concept in the mind of YHVH?

In the same way Moses is - figuratively.

 

[Johann]

In the same way Moses is - figuratively.

Explain

 

[Matthias]

Explain

See Exodus 7:1.

See also the concept of shaliach.

Jesus is his God agentivally / representationally.

 

[Johann]

See Exodus 7:1.

See also the concept of shaliach.

Jesus is his God agentivally / representationally.

And Hashem said unto Moshe, See, I have made thee as Elohim to Pharaoh: and Aharon thy brother shall be thy navi.
Thou shalt speak all that I command thee: and Aharon thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the Bnei Yisroel out of his land.
And I will harden the lev Pharaoh, and multiply My Otot and My Mofetim in Eretz Mitzrayim.

Mashiach ben David is greater than Moshe-is He not?

A shaliach (Hebrew: שליח, pl. שלוחים‎, shlichim/shluchim, literally "emissary" or "messenger") is a member of the Chabad Hasidic Jewish movement who promotes the practice of Judaism and/or Hasidism to those of Jewish background in locations around the world.

So if I understand you correctly-Jesus was/is only a messenger, correct?

 

[Matthias]

And Hashem said unto Moshe, See, I have made thee as Elohim to Pharaoh: and Aharon thy brother shall be thy navi.
Thou shalt speak all that I command thee: and Aharon thy brother shall speak unto Pharaoh, that he send the Bnei Yisroel out of his land.
And I will harden the lev Pharaoh, and multiply My Otot and My Mofetim in Eretz Mitzrayim.

Mashiach ben David is greater than Moshe-is He not?

A shaliach (Hebrew: שליח, pl. שלוחים‎, shlichim/shluchim, literally "emissary" or "messenger") is a member of the Chabad Hasidic Jewish movement who promotes the practice of Judaism and/or Hasidism to those of Jewish background in locations around the world.

So if I understand you correctly-Jesus was/is only a messenger, correct?

Jesus is greater than Moses. He is, as many NT scholars have said, “the new Moses”.

For reference, if interested. An article written by a colleague of mine in the ministry.

The Principle of Agency in the New Testament - One God Worship

As we learned in The Principle of Agency in the Old Testament, an agent is one who has been "authorized to act for or in the place of another." In Hebraic

onegodworship.com

Jesus is more than just a messenger. He is, as the NT states, a saviour born for us. He is the messiah, the son of the living God.

 

[Johann]

Jesus is greater than Moses. He is, as many NT scholars have said, “the new Moses”.

For reference, if interested. An article written by a colleague of mine in the ministry.

The Principle of Agency in the New Testament - One God Worship

As we learned in The Principle of Agency in the Old Testament, an agent is one who has been "authorized to act for or in the place of another." In Hebraic

onegodworship.com

Jesus is more than just a messenger. He is, as the NT states, a saviour born for us. He is the messiah, the son of the living God.

Thanks for the link/s-
There is only one God (Deuteronomy 4:35, 39; 6:4; Isaiah 45:5, 14; Mark 12:29; John 5:44; Romans 16:27; 1 Timothy 2:5; Jude 1:25)
God’s revealed name is Yahweh (YHWH) (Exodus 3:15; 15:3; Jeremiah 16:21)
The one God is the Father (John 17:3; John 8:54; 1 Corinthians 8:6; Galatians 1:1; Ephesians 4:6)
God is Spirit (John 4:24; Matthew 10:20)
God is holy, compassionate and loving (Exodus 33:18-19; 34:5-7; Leviticus 19:2; 20:26; Psalm 78:38; Micah 7:18; John 3:16; Romans 5:5, 8, 39; 1 Peter 1:16; 1 John 3:1; 1 John 4:8, 16)
God created the world (Isaiah 37:16; 43:21; 44:24; 45:12, 18; Nehemiah 9:6; Matthew 19:4, 6; Acts 4:24; Revelation 14:7)
God is eternal, immortal, invisible (1 Timothy 1:17; 6:16; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12)
God is all powerful, all knowing and unlimited in His presence (Job 11:7; Psalm 139:2-8; Matthew 19:26; Luke 1:37; 1 John 3:20)
God sent His son, Jesus the Christ/Messiah, to redeem mankind from the penalty of sin. It was God the Father’s will and His plan (John 3:15-17; John 6:38; 7:28; 8:32; Acts 4:28-31)

Now what do you make of this-

(5) For unto us a yeled is born, unto us ben is given; and the misrah (dominion) shall be upon his shoulder; and Shmo shall be called Peleh (Wonderful), Yoetz (Counsellor), El Gibbor (Mighty G-d), Avi Ad (Everlasting Father), Sar Shalom (Prince of Peace).

It would seem that in this link Jesus is somehow "lower" albeit not inferior to YHVH?
Just a messenger/malack?
Which goes diametrically opposite to what stands written re the Mashiach in the Pauline letters.
Correct?
I also notice, at a cursory reading-that Scripture references re Jesus's deity is absent-why?

 

[Matthias]

Thanks for the link/s-
There is only one God (Deuteronomy 4:35, 39; 6:4; Isaiah 45:5, 14; Mark 12:29; John 5:44; Romans 16:27; 1 Timothy 2:5; Jude 1:25)
God’s revealed name is Yahweh (YHWH) (Exodus 3:15; 15:3; Jeremiah 16:21)
The one God is the Father (John 17:3; John 8:54; 1 Corinthians 8:6; Galatians 1:1; Ephesians 4:6)
God is Spirit (John 4:24; Matthew 10:20)
God is holy, compassionate and loving (Exodus 33:18-19; 34:5-7; Leviticus 19:2; 20:26; Psalm 78:38; Micah 7:18; John 3:16; Romans 5:5, 8, 39; 1 Peter 1:16; 1 John 3:1; 1 John 4:8, 16)
God created the world (Isaiah 37:16; 43:21; 44:24; 45:12, 18; Nehemiah 9:6; Matthew 19:4, 6; Acts 4:24; Revelation 14:7)
God is eternal, immortal, invisible (1 Timothy 1:17; 6:16; John 1:18; 1 John 4:12)
God is all powerful, all knowing and unlimited in His presence (Job 11:7; Psalm 139:2-8; Matthew 19:26; Luke 1:37; 1 John 3:20)
God sent His son, Jesus the Christ/Messiah, to redeem mankind from the penalty of sin. It was God the Father’s will and His plan (John 3:15-17; John 6:38; 7:28; 8:32; Acts 4:28-31)

Now what do you make of this-

(5) For unto us a yeled is born, unto us ben is given; and the misrah (dominion) shall be upon his shoulder; and Shmo shall be called Peleh (Wonderful), Yoetz (Counsellor), El Gibbor (Mighty G-d), Avi Ad (Everlasting Father), Sar Shalom (Prince of Peace).

It would seem that in this link Jesus is somehow "lower" albeit not inferior to YHVH?
Just a messenger/malack?
Which goes diametrically opposite to what stands written re the Mashiach in the Pauline letters.
Correct?
I also notice, at a cursory reading-that Scripture references re Jesus's deity is absent-why?

The God of Israel himself doesn’t have a deity. He is the deity.

The messiah himself has a deity. His deity is the God of Israel.

Jesus is a prophet. In fact, he is the prophet like Moses whom his / their God promised to raise up from among the people (Deuteronomy 18:15,18).

 

[amigo de christo]

Are you being persecuted? If so, how, when, and where?

It's absurd to equate progressive thoughts with lies. That is the way the Pharisees thought about Jesus! They had their firm doctrine, rooted in conservatism, and couldn't accept Jesus as the progressive that He was.

my persecution is mild compared to what many lambs endured and still endure through the ages .
Mine is mostly verbal . Nothing compared to what is also coming upon all true lambs
who conformed not to progressive all inclusive lies . JESUS wasnt progressive . Lie number one .
If you think JESUS contradicted the law you dead wrong . Dead wrong .
Progressivism is of the devil and it will and may it be , a cold day in the lake of hades fore i say otherwise .
JESUS wasnt progressive . PEROID . The apostels were not progressive . false ones are progressive .
So please repeat after me progressivism is false . I, say your name , , shall not partake of its lies .

 

[Matthias]

The God of Israel isn’t a prophet. Will you claim that one of your Gods of Israel* is the prophet like Moses, @Johann?

* Gods of Israel. Dead giveaway for
those with discernment.

 

[Johann]

The God of Israel himself doesn’t have a deity. He is the deity.

The messiah himself has a deity. His deity is the God of Israel.

Jesus is a prophet. In fact, he is the prophet like Moses whom his / their God promised to raise up from among the people (Deuteronomy 18:15,18).

Christ Jesus just a prophet?-what about Prophet, Priest and King?

Jesus didn't receive worship in His short ministry on earth?
Worship means “reverence paid to a divine being.” If Jesus was offered and accepted worship, then by doing so He was confirming His divinity. This is important because there are those who deny the deity of Christ, relegating Him instead to a lesser position than God. Yes, Jesus accepted worship. As the second Person of the Trinity, He was and still is worshiped.

From the beginning of Jesus’ life, we see examples of Him being worshiped. As soon as the Magi laid eyes on the infant Christ, “they bowed down and worshiped Him” (Matthew 2:11). The Bible records the initial response Jesus received when He made His triumphal entry into Jerusalem: “So they took branches of palm trees and went out to meet him, crying out, ‘Hosanna! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, even the King of Israel!’” (Matthew 21:9; John 12:13) The word hosanna is a plea for salvation and an expression of adoration. This word used by the crowd is definitely a form of worship.

Just after Jesus amazed the disciples by walking on water, “those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God’” (Matthew 14:33). Two more memorable examples of Jesus accepting worship occurred just after His resurrection. Some of the women (Matthew 28:8-9; Mark 16:1; Luke 24:10) were on their way to tell the disciples of the resurrection when Jesus met them on their way. When they realized it was He, they “came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him” (Matthew 28:9).

Then there is the case of Thomas, who didn’t believe Jesus had risen from the dead despite the other disciples’ testifying to that fact. It had been about a week since the resurrection, and Thomas still doubted it. Jesus, knowing Thomas doubted, appeared to him and showed him the nail marks in His hands and feet and the wound in His side. How did Thomas respond? “Thomas said to him, ‘My Lord and my God!’” (John 20:28). In none of these instances do we see Jesus telling those worshiping Him to stop, as did mere men and even angels who were being worshiped wrongly by others (Acts 10:25–26; Revelation 19:9–10).

We continue to offer worship to Jesus today by offering ourselves to Him as a living sacrifice—offering ourselves to God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to do with as He sees fit (Romans 12:1–2). Jesus said, “God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24). We worship God in spirit and truth by obedience to His commands. Worship is not solely about bowing to Jesus, throwing palm branches at His feet, or singing and shouting about our love for Him. Worship is about knowing Him, communing with Him, serving Him, and trusting in Him.

Context for Revelation 4 & 5; 19:1-8

Both of these passages detail scenes of Christ’s worship in heaven. Revelation 5 records John’s vision in heaven just before the Lamb opens the scroll containing the seven seals of judgment to be poured out upon the earth.

Revelation 19:1-6 comes after these judgments, before the return of Christ to the earth to wage war against His enemies (last week’s passage.) It opens with the praise of God for condemning the “great prostitute,” Babylon, which was seen in Revelation 18. Babylon historically is thought to be the empire of Rome. In the future Babylon is believed to be the world system in rebellion against God.

What say you?

 

[Jim B]

my persecution is mild compared to what many lambs endured and still endure through the ages .
Mine is mostly verbal . Nothing compared to what is also coming upon all true lambs
who conformed not to progressive all inclusive lies . JESUS wasnt progressive . Lie number one .
If you think JESUS contradicted the law you dead wrong . Dead wrong .
Progressivism is of the devil and it will and may it be , a cold day in the lake of hades fore i say otherwise .
JESUS wasnt progressive . PEROID . The apostels were not progressive . false ones are progressive .
So please repeat after me progressivism is false . I, say your name , , shall not partake of its lies .

I really doesn't matter what you say, as everyone is able to express their thoughts, whether they be right or wrong.

The truth: Jesus was progressive! Clearly, He intended to improve human society through both teaching and action. He clearly opposed the traditions of the conservative Pharisees and Sadducees, which had distorted God's teachings and burdened the people in ways they couldn't bear.

One of the main things that struck me when I first believed was how Jesus was a social and political activist who wasn't afraid to challenge the existing power structure.

The apostles were progressive! Why do you think that they were opposed, challenged, beaten, imprisoned, etc? Because they agreed with the status quo? They presented a new, radical teaching and were punished for doing so.

Finally progressivism is most definitely not "of the devil". Why do you worship conservatism?

 

[amigo de christo]

The God of Israel isn’t a prophet. Will you claim that one of your Gods of Israel* is the prophet like Moses, @Johann?

* Gods of Israel. Dead giveaway for
those with discernment.

The prophet MOSES pointed to the creator not the created . And HE SPOKE of CHRIST JESUS .
Moses , faithful as HE was , was created . The WORD of GOD , YEAH its not created . IT CREATES .
But go ye and learn what that means . There is but one savoir of MANKIND .
with man this is impossible , but not WITH GOD . GOD IS THE SAVOIR of mankind .
HIS WORD is the Savoir of mankind . AND HIS WORD became flesh and dwelt among them .
Before abraham was , THE WORD WAS . And nothing was , that is , that was not created by THE WORD .
GOD SPOKE and it was . GOD is HIS WORD , HE IS HIS SPIRIT . Go and learn this quickly .
There was but one plan predetermined of GOD . That GOD would save the world .
Not through man but through HIMSELF .
Look closely at the law . real closely . SEE deeper than the letter , see not with the eyes of men .
What did GOD tell the isralites concering the levitcal preisthood .
HE said , no man that has any blemish , not a dwarf , not even a mole on his skin could be the priest that offered
up the sacrfices to GOD .
NOW look deeper . Ask yourself a dire important question .
HOW DOES GOD look upon man . Go to and behold what GOD told the prophet , the judge o israel named samuel .
Samuel came to annoint the KING of israel . He thought surely this first born son with goodly stature
was the man who was to be KING . BUT GOD said , THIS IS NOT HE .
LOOK not on the OUTWARD appearance . TAKE HEED TO THIS MY FRIEND for GOD is showing us something ,
LOOK not on the outward appearance , FOR GOD looketh upon that which is on the INSIDE .
THAT IS THE ONE TRUE HIGH PREIST OF GOD as well . HE MUST BE WITHOUT SPOT OR BLEMISH ON THE INSIDE .
I Know . how on earth can man be without any sin on the inside . the perfect heart .
HE cant . The ONLY ONE Who is RIGHTEOUS PEROID IS GOD .
Now you know who had to get the job done as the HIGH PRIEST . GOD .
HIS WORD became flesh . Living in a body capable of all temptions , YET WITHOUT EVER ONCE SINNING .
THAT BE GOD ALONE that could do that pard . The created cannot save , but the creator CAN save the created .
WHICH BY HIS WORD he did create . GOD SPOKE and it was . AND JESUS IS HIS WORD and the WORD is GOD

 

[Matthias]

Christ Jesus just a prophet?-what about Prophet, Priest and King?

Jesus didn't receive worship in His short ministry on earth?
Worship means “reverence paid to a divine being.” If Jesus was offered and accepted worship, then by doing so He was confirming His divinity. This is important because there are those who deny the deity of Christ, relegating Him instead to a lesser position than God. Yes, Jesus accepted worship. As the second Person of the Trinity, He was and still is worshiped.

From the beginning of Jesus’ life, we see examples of Him being worshiped. As soon as the Magi laid eyes on the infant Christ, “they bowed down and worshiped Him” (Matthew 2:11). The Bible records the initial response Jesus received when He made His triumphal entry into Jerusalem: “So they took branches of palm trees and went out to meet him, crying out, ‘Hosanna! Blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord, even the King of Israel!’” (Matthew 21:9; John 12:13) The word hosanna is a plea for salvation and an expression of adoration. This word used by the crowd is definitely a form of worship.

Just after Jesus amazed the disciples by walking on water, “those who were in the boat worshiped him, saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God’” (Matthew 14:33). Two more memorable examples of Jesus accepting worship occurred just after His resurrection. Some of the women (Matthew 28:8-9; Mark 16:1; Luke 24:10) were on their way to tell the disciples of the resurrection when Jesus met them on their way. When they realized it was He, they “came to him, clasped his feet and worshiped him” (Matthew 28:9).

Then there is the case of Thomas, who didn’t believe Jesus had risen from the dead despite the other disciples’ testifying to that fact. It had been about a week since the resurrection, and Thomas still doubted it. Jesus, knowing Thomas doubted, appeared to him and showed him the nail marks in His hands and feet and the wound in His side. How did Thomas respond? “Thomas said to him, ‘My Lord and my God!’” (John 20:28). In none of these instances do we see Jesus telling those worshiping Him to stop, as did mere men and even angels who were being worshiped wrongly by others (Acts 10:25–26; Revelation 19:9–10).

We continue to offer worship to Jesus today by offering ourselves to Him as a living sacrifice—offering ourselves to God, through faith in Jesus Christ, to do with as He sees fit (Romans 12:1–2). Jesus said, “God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth” (John 4:24). We worship God in spirit and truth by obedience to His commands. Worship is not solely about bowing to Jesus, throwing palm branches at His feet, or singing and shouting about our love for Him. Worship is about knowing Him, communing with Him, serving Him, and trusting in Him.

Context for Revelation 4 & 5; 19:1-8

Both of these passages detail scenes of Christ’s worship in heaven. Revelation 5 records John’s vision in heaven just before the Lamb opens the scroll containing the seven seals of judgment to be poured out upon the earth.

Revelation 19:1-6 comes after these judgments, before the return of Christ to the earth to wage war against His enemies (last week’s passage.) It opens with the praise of God for condemning the “great prostitute,” Babylon, which was seen in Revelation 18. Babylon historically is thought to be the empire of Rome. In the future Babylon is believed to be the world system in rebellion against God.

What say you?

I say you misread my post.

The messiah is a prophet, priest and king.

 

[Matthias]

David, like Moses, is a type of Christ.

Those who worshipped David (1 Chronicles 29:20) thought what about him?