Reasons Jews Reject Jesus

[Matthias]

Jesus Christ, our great God and Savior is no typology @Matthias-you have deflected in most of what I have posted to you-And Messiah is greater than any "typology" and worthy of our highest worship and eulogies.

Do you even know what typology is?

I'm beginning to see loopholes in your link to me brother…

You’re not my brother.

... - and can be easily refuted-yet correction is not easily accepted.

If you don’t find something persuasive then don’t believe it.

You don’t believe agency explains how Jesus is God. I do.

Where does that leave us?

Me - with the same God who is the messiah’s God, the God of Israel.

You - with a deity who is not the messiah’s God, the Gods of Israel.

What about this-"Jesus Christ, our great God and Savior?" I want to see how you are going to "reason" this away, or surprise me, by concurring.

Do you acknowledge, as NT scholars and I do, that there are syntax issues with the text?

 

[Matthias]

That's all I wanted to know-

1Ti 3:16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.


1 ) "And without controversy" (kai homologoumenos) "And confessedly," beyond successful testamentary contradiction, as a case made out, sustained by incontrovertible legal evidence;

2) "Great is the mystery of godliness" (mega estin to tes eusebeias musterion) "Great is the mystery of piety, godliness." The term "mystery" is used to express both the divine and human aspects of the Christian faith in manifestation; of Jesus Christ, Col_1:27, "Christ in you.

a) "God was manifest in the flesh" (hos epanerothe en sarki) "Who was manifested in flesh." God in Christ, Joh_1:1; Joh_1:14; Gal_4:4-5; Heb_1:1-3. "God was in Christ reconciling the world to Himself," 2Co_5:10.
b) "Justified in the Spirit" (edikaiothe en pneumati) "Justified in (the) Spirit," in four ways:
1) begotten of the Holy Spirit, Luk_1:35; Mat_1:18; Mat_1:21;
2) when baptized, Mat_3:16; Joh_1:31-34;
3) announced His ministry, Luk_4:16-21;
4) when raised from the dead, Rom_8:11.
c) "Seen of angels" (ophthe angelois) "Was seen by angels, “ on four occasions:
1) at His birth, Luk_2:9-13;
2) at the end of His temptation, Mat_4:11;
3) at His resurrection, and
4) at His ascension, Act_1:9-11.
d) "Preached unto the Gentiles" (ekeruchthe en ethnesin) "Was heralded or preached among nations, Gentiles, peoples," on four occasions:
1) to the Samaritan woman, Joh_4:1-54;
2) to the Syrophoenecian woman, Mar_7:26;
3) to Cornelius' house, Act_10:1-48;
4) Paul, Act_13:46-48; Rom_1:14-16.
e) "Believed on in the world" (episteuthe en kosmo) "Was believed on in the world." Joh_4:39-42; Joh_1:11-12. Not only did the apostles and church believe on Him, but also many of the Samaritans, half-breed of races believed on Him as Savior and Lord.
f) "Received up into glory" (anelemphthe en dokse) "And was taken up in glory," to the glory He had with the Father before the world was; Joh_17:1; Joh_17:5; Luk_24:50-51; Act_1:9-11; Heb_1:3; Heb_10:12-13; 1Pe_3:22.

Great is this continuing mystery Of godliness or piety, as our Lord prepares a place for His own, Joh_14:1-2, and makes intercession and advocacy to the Father in behalf of every believer, Heb_7:25; 1Jn_2:1-2.


God manifested in the flesh The Vulgate’s translator, by leaving out the name of God, refers what follows to “the mystery,” but altogether unskillfully and inappropriately, as will clearly be seen on a bare perusal, though he has Erasmus on his side, who, however, destroys the authority of his own views, so that it is unnecessary for me to refute it.

All the Greek copies undoubtedly agree in this rendering, “God manifested in the flesh.” But granting that Paul did not express the name of God, still any one who shall carefully examine the whole matter, will acknowledge that the name of Christ ought to be supplied. For my own part, I have no hesitation in following the reading which has been adopted in the Greek copies. In calling the manifestation of Christ, such as he afterwards describes it, a “great mystery,” the reason is obvious; for this is “the height, depth, and breadth of wisdom,” which he has elsewhere mentioned, (Eph_3:18,) by which all our senses must unavoidably be overwhelmed.

Let us now examine the various clauses in their order. He could not have spoken more appropriately about the person of Christ than in these words, “God manifested in the flesh.” First, we have here an express testimony of both natures; for he declares at the same time that Christ is true God and true man. Secondly, he points out the distinction between the two natures, when, on the one hand, he calls him God, and, on the other, expresses his “manifestation, in the flesh.” Thirdly, he asserts the unity of the person, when he declares, that it is one and the same who was God, and who has been manifested in the flesh.

Thus, by this single passage, the true and orthodox faith is powerfully defended against Arius, Marcion, Nestorius, and Eutyches. There is also great emphasis in the contrast of the two words, God in flesh How wide is the difference between God and man! And yet in Christ we behold the infinite glory of God united to our polluted flesh in such a manner that they become one. (67)

See NET trinitarian commentary on the 1 Timothy passage.

I cut to the chase after that. I’m opposed to Arius, Marcion, Nestorius and Eutyches.

 

[Johann]

"great is the mystery of godliness" "Mystery" in Paul's writings often refers to the Gentile mission (cf. Eph. 2:11-3:13), which may be a key to 1 Tim. 3:16.

This introduces an early confessional statement or a Christian hymn. Another of these is found in 2 Tim. 2:11-13. The structural pattern might be

1. A B C D E F (revealed truths about Christ)

2. AB, BA, AB (contrast between earth and heaven or humiliation and exaltation)

3. ABC, ABC (revealed truths about Christ and His church)

Chiastic Patterns within the Bible are becoming more apparent to modern scholarship. The Companion Bible published by Kregel in 1990 and Kenneth E. Bailey's Poet and Peasant use this approach extensively.

Paul seems to quote one verse of an early hymn or possibly church liturgy. This verse emphasizes Jesus' humanity and His world-wide ministry. It does not contain Paul's three major theological emphases: (1) the cross; (2) the resurrection; and (3) the Second Coming. Paul quotes several sources in I, 2 Timothy and Titus which explain the unique vocabulary and distinct use of theological terms used differently in either Pauline writing.

NASB"He who was revealed in the flesh"
NKJV"God was manifested in the flesh"
NRSV"He was revealed in flesh"
TEV"He appeared in human form"
NJB"He was made visible in the flesh"

This speaks of the Incarnation (birth) of Jesus Christ at Bethlehem: His life, teachings, death, and resurrection, which fully reveal the Father (cf. John 1:14-18). There is also the strong inference of His pre-existence (cf. John 1:1-5; 8:57-58; 2 Cor. 8:4; Phil. 2:6; Col. 1:17). This is the central truth of the Gospels about Jesus Christ, that He was fully God and fully human (cf. John 1:14; Phil. 2:6-8; Col. 1:14-16; 1 John 4:1-6).

There is a later Greek manuscript variant in which the relative pronoun hos (MSS א, A, C, F, G; UBS4 gives this an "A" rating [certain]) is changed to theos. This later change may have occurred

1. with the confusion over OC (the abbreviations in uncial Greek for who) read as H C (the abbreviation in uncial Greek for "God") or

2. as a purposeful theological change by later scribes (cf. MSS אc, Ac, C2, and D2) wanting to make the text more specific against the adoptionist heresies (cf. Bart D. Ehrman, The Orthodox Corruption of Scripture, pp. 77-78)





NASB"Was vindicated in the Spirit"
NKJV, NJB"Justified in the Spirit"
NRSV"vindicated in spirit"
TEV"was shown to be right by the Spirit"

This phrase has been understood in several ways.

1. Does it mean vindicated or justified (i.e., shown to be just)?

2. Does this mean that the Holy Spirit was active in Jesus' ministry (NASB)?]

3. Does it mean that Jesus' spirit was affirmed by the Father (cf. Matt. 3:17; 17:5) while Jesus lived as a human being (NRSV)?

Some theologians see "Spirit" as referring to Jesus' divinity, which was vindicated by His resurrection (cf. Rom. 1:4; 1 Pet. 3:18).

"Seen by angels" The angels longed to know what God was doing with fallen mankind (cf. 1 Cor. 4:9; Eph. 2:7; 3:10; 1 Pet. 1:12). However, it may refer to the angels' ministering to Jesus, either at His temptation experience (cf. Matt. 4:11; Mark 1:13), in the Garden of Gethsemane (cf. Luke 22:43, which is a questionable text), or immediately after the resurrection (cf. Luke 24:4,23; John 20:12).

This phrase is so short and ambiguous that several theories have been offered by commentators and all are merely speculation:

1. angels ministering to Jesus (above)

2. angels beholding His ascension (godly angels and/or fallen angels cf. 1 Pet 3:19-20,22)

3. angels beholding His exalted heavenly enthronement



"Proclaimed among the nations" This is the worldwide preaching of the gospel (cf. Luke 24:46-47) which would have been extremely shocking to the Jews of the first century, but this is really the whole point (cf. Matt. 28:18-20). This is the mystery of godliness (cf. Eph. 2:11-3:13).

NASB, NKJV"Believed on in the world"
NRSV, TEV,
NJB"believed in throughout the world"

Not only was it a universal message, but there was a universal response, and now the Church is made up of both Jew and Gentile (cf. Eph. 2:11-3:13). This has always been God's plan. The one true God has fulfilled His promise of Gen. 3:15. Personal repentance and faith in the gospel now, in this life, opens heaven for "whosoever" (cf. John 1:12; 3:16; Rom. 10:9-13).

"Taken up in glory" This seems to refer to His ascension. It is surprising that Jesus' death, resurrection, and return are left out, but if this was a Christian hymn, quoted possibly only in part, then it is understandable. Also, exactly which rhythmic (chiastic) pattern is followed determines one's interpretation (cf. 1 Tim. 3:16). This hymn/creed linked to the opening statement would powerfully refute Gnosticism. The man Jesus was glorified (cf. chiastic pattern #2)! However, following the NRSV the last three lines may refer to the Church (cf. chiastic pattern #3).
Utley

 

[Matthias]

There are thousands of books and articles on David typology, most written by people who believe that Jesus is literally God. David typology does no damage whatsoever to their theological position, nor to mine.

 

[Matthias]

What is biblical typology? | GotQuestions.org

What is biblical typology? What are the different types that are specifically mentioned in the Bible?

www.gotquestions.org

Let them accept or reject their own sources but let them not be ignorant.

 

[Johann]

You’re not my brother.

Great-no need for further communication-you don't have to waste your time, and I don't have to waste my time-but thanks for the opportunity to extol Jesus Christ, the real Messiah-the very YHVH of the Old Testament-the "Ehyeh-Asher-Ehyeh”.
Worthy to receive all worship and TO Whom every knee SHALL bow and every tongue SHALL confess that Jesus is LORD.

I'm familiar with typologies and Textual Variants-no need to "educate" me.
You have a blessed day

 

[Matthias]

Great-no need for further communication

I told you previously that we aren’t brothers. You either didn’t believe me, didn’t understand me, or didn’t read it.

Remember: You sought me out; I didn’t seek you out.

-you don't have to waste your time, and I don't have to waste my time-but thanks for the opportunity to extol Jesus Christ, the real Messiah-the very YHVH of the Old Testament-the "Ehyeh-Asher-Ehyeh”.
Worthy to receive all worship and TO Whom every knee SHALL bow and every tongue SHALL confess that Jesus is LORD.

I'm familiar with typologies and Textual Variants-no need to "educate" me.
You have a blessed day

 

[Johann]

See NET trinitarian commentary on the 1 Timothy passage.

No need for me to see the Net Trinitarian Commentary-familiar with Textual Variants and "typologies"

 

[Matthias]

No need for me to see the Net Trinitarian Commentary-familiar with Textual Variants and "typologies"

* So much for “no need for further communication” *

Then you already know that it (as well as other trinitarian commentaries - which I’ve quoted elsewhere) - supports my position on the question.

Feel free to seek me out any time. Or don’t.

 

[Johann]

I told you previously that we aren’t brothers. You either didn’t believe me, didn’t understand me, or didn’t read it.

Remember: You sought me out; I didn’t seek you out.

Thanks for the opportunity to "correct" your misunderstanding of who Yeshua is-it is very apparent you have no clue re Church History and what Judaism promulgate.
Adieu

 

[Johann]

Then you already know that it (as well as other trinitarian commentaries - which I’ve quoted elsewhere) - supports my position on the question.

Selective reasoning-circular reasoning.

 

[Matthias]

* The man obviously either doesn’t know or doesn’t believe that, among other things, I’m a retired professor who taught, wrote and lectured on Church history. That’s his problem, not mine.

Read widely. Read deeply. Read thoughtfully. Read critically.

Read Church history. *

 

[Johann]

* The man obviously either doesn’t know or doesn’t believe that, among other things, I’m a retired professor who taught, wrote and lectured on Church history. That’s his problem, not mine.

Read widely. Read deeply. Read thoughtfully. Read critically.

Read Church history. *

In the Greek order, and God was the Word, which is followed by Anglo-Saxon, Wyc., and Tynd. But θεὸς, God, is the predicate and not the subject of the proposition. The subject must be the Word; for John is not trying to show who is God, but who is the Word. Notice that Θεὸς is without the article, which could not have been omitted if he had meant to designate the word as God; because, in that event, Θεὸς would have been ambiguous; perhaps a God. Moreover, if he had said God was the Word, he would have contradicted his previous statement by which he had distinguished (hypostatically) God from the word, and λόγος (Logos) would, further, have signified only an attribute of God. The predicate is emphatically placed in the proposition before the subject, because of the progress of the thought; this being the third and highest statement respecting the Word - the climax of the two preceding propositions. The word God, used attributively, maintains the personal distinction between God and the Word, but makes the unity of essence and nature to follow the distinction of person, and ascribes to the Word all the attributes of the divine essence. “There is something majestic in the way in which the description of the Logos, in the three brief but great propositions of Joh_1:1, is unfolded with increasing fullness” (Meyer).


Was with God (ἦν πὸς τὸν Θεὸν)
Anglo-Saxon vers., mid Gode. Wyc., at God. With (πρός) does not convey the full meaning, that there is no single English word which will give it better. The preposition πρός, which, with the accusative case, denotes motion towards, or direction, is also often used in the New Testament in the sense of with; and that not merely as being near or beside, but as a living union and communion; implying the active notion of intercourse. Thus: “Are not his sisters here with us” (πρὸς ἡμᾶς), i.e., in social relations with us (Mar_6:3; Mat_13:56). “How long shall I be with you” (πρὸς ὑμᾶς, Mar_9:16). “I sat daily with you” (Mat_26:55). “To be present with the Lord” (πρὸς τὸν Κύριον, 2Co_5:8). “Abide and winter with you” (1Co_16:6). “The eternal life which was with the Father” (πρὸς τὸν πατέρα, 1Jn_1:2). Thus John's statement is that the divine Word not only abode with the Father from all eternity, but was in the living, active relation of communion with Him.

So, while you worship an "It" I worship the living Yeshua.

# An excerpt from your link with which I have major arguments with--

In like manner, the Greek language assigns a gender to nouns. In John 1, “Word” or logos in Greek is assigned a male gender, and thus masculine pronouns. But when translating the pronouns that correspond to logos into English, we would replace “he” and “him” with the pronoun “it.” In other words, instead of saying in John 1:2 “He was in the beginning with God” we would translate the phrase, “it was in the beginning with God.” Because in English, “word” (like “book” in Spanish) is never a “he.” Trinitarian translators, however, failed to follow this basic translation principle. Instead they retained the masculine pronoun used in Greek in order to emphasize their bias that “word” or logos is the pre-incarnate Jesus. It is important to note that there is nothing in the text that would grammatically require them to keep the masculine pronoun. In fact, no other place in Scripture is “word,” (i.e. logos) translated as “he” or “him.” It is never a person. The translators always exchange the masculine pronoun for “it.”

End of dialogue.

 

[Johann]

There are thousands of books and articles on David typology, most written by people who believe that Jesus is literally God. David typology does no damage whatsoever to their theological position, nor to mine.

Your theological position, far as I can tell, after perusing your link-is the same as JW's in their eisegeses on John 1:1-and no clue what ancient rabbinical rabbis wrote re the Messiah.
But Professor-we are all fallible.
--and when a person begins with "Ha-ha's" it is an indicative they are lost-groping-not thinking clearly, analytically.

You want me to show you rabbinical links to confirm my position?

End of dialogue.

 

[Matthias]

Those who have read my posts should easily recall that, where the subject is addressed, I have written in opposition to the JW position on John’s prologue, as I have also done in regard to their theological position on Christ and God in general - on Christianity Board and elsewhere.

I advise wise readers who are interested in the matter to read them for himself or herself. I direct unwise readers who are interested not to bother; listen instead to what @Johann tells you about them.

To disinterested readers, be they wise or unwise, I recommend ignoring the whole thing. It truly is a waste of their time.

 

[Johann]

Mr-Ha-ha

Jesus’ Claim to Be God. Jesus claimed to be God, both directly and by necessary implication from
what he said and did. Jesus Claimed to Be Yahweh. Yahweh (YHWH; sometimes appearing in English
translations as “Jehovah” or in small capital letters as “Lord”)is the special name given by God for himself
in the Old Testament. It is the name revealed to Moses in Exodus 3:14, when God said, “I AM WHO I AM.”
Other titles for God may be used of humans, such as Adonai (“Lord”) in Genesis 18:12, or false gods, such
as elohim (“gods”) in Deuteronomy 6:14. Yahweh, however, only refers to the one true God. No other
person or thing was to be worshiped or served (Exodus 20:5), and his name and glory were not to be
given to another. Isaiah wrote, “This is what the Lord says... I am the first, and I am the last; apart from
me there is no God” (Isaiah 44:6) and, “I am the Lord; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another,
or my praise to idols” (Isaiah 42:8).

Jesus claimed to be Yahweh. He prayed, “And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own
self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was” (John 17:5). But Yahweh of the Old
Testament said, “my glory will I not give to another” (Isaiah 42:8). Jesus also declared, “I am the first and
the last” (Revelation 1:17)—precisely the words used by Jehovah in Isaiah 42:8.
He said, “I am the good shepherd” (John 10:11), but the Old Testament said, “Yahweh is my
shepherd” (Ps. 23:1). Further, Jesus claimed to be the judge of all people (Matthew 25:31f.; John 5:27f.),
but Joel quotes Jehovah as saying, “for there I will sit to judge all the nations on every side” (Joel 3:12).
Likewise, Jesus spoke of himself as the “bridegroom” (Matthew 25:1) while the Old Testament
identifies Jehovah in this way (Isaiah 62:5; Hosea 2:16). While the Psalmist declares, “The Lord is my
light” (Ps. 27:1), Jesus said, “I am the light of the world” (John 8:12).

Perhaps the strongest claim Jesus made to be Yahweh is in John 8:58, where he says,
“Before Abraham was, I am.” This statement claims not only existence before Abraham, but equality with
the “I AM” of Exodus 3:14. The Jews around him clearly understood his meaning and picked up stones to
kill him for blaspheming (cf. John 8:58 and 10:31–33). The same claim is made in Mark 14:62 and John
18:5–6.

Jesus Claimed to Be Equal with God. Jesus claimed to be equal with God in other ways. One
was by claiming for himself the prerogatives of God. He said to a paralytic, “Son, your sins are forgiven”
(Mark 2:5–11). The scribes correctly responded, “Who can forgive sins but God alone?” So, to prove that
his claim was not an empty boast he healed the man, offering direct proof that what he had said about
forgiving sins was true also.
Another prerogative Jesus claimed was the power to raise and judge the dead: “I tell you the truth,
a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who
hear will live... and come out—those who have done good will rise to live, and those who have done evil
will rise to be condemned” (John 5:25, 29). He removed all doubt about his meaning when he added, “For
just as the Father raises the dead and gives them life, even so the Son gives life to whom he is pleased to
give it” (John 5:21). But the Old Testament clearly taught that only God was the giver of life (Deuteronomy
32:39; 1 Samuel 2:6) and the one to raise the dead (Ps. 2:7) and the only judge (Deuteronomy 32:35; Joel
3:12). Jesus boldly assumed for himself powers that only God has.
Jesus also claimed that he should be honoured as God. He said that all men should “honour the
Son just as they honour the Father. He who does not honour the Son does not honour the Father, who

Lloyd De Jongh

sent him” (John 5:23). The Jews listening knew that no one should claim to be equal with God in this way,
and again they reached for stones (John 5:18).

Jesus Claimed to Be Messiah-God. Even the Qur’an recognizes that Jesus was the Messiah
(sura 5:17, 5:75). But the Old Testament teaches that the coming Messiah would be God himself. So, when
Jesus claimed to be that Messiah, he was also claiming to be God. For example, the prophet Isaiah (in 9:6)
calls the Messiah, “Mighty God.” The psalmist wrote of Messiah, “Your throne, O God, will last for ever and
ever” (Ps. 45:6; cf. Hebrews 1:8). Psalm 110:1 records a conversation between the Father and the Son:
“The Lord (Yahweh) says to my Lord (Adonai): ‘Sit at my right hand.’”
Jesus applied this passage to himself in Matthew 22:43–44. In the great messianic prophecy of
Daniel 7, the Son of Man is called the “Ancient of Days” (vs. 22), a phrase used twice in the same passage
of God the Father (vss. 9, 13). Jesus also said he was the Messiah at his trial before the high priest. When
asked, “Are you the Christ [Greek for “Messiah”], the Son of the Blessed One?” Jesus responded, “I am....
And you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of the Mighty One and coming on the clouds of
heaven.” At this, the high priest tore his robe and said, “Why do we need any more witnesses?... You have
heard the blasphemy!” (Mark 14:61–64). There was no doubt that in claiming to be Messiah, Jesus also
claimed to be God (see also Matthew 26:54; Luke 24:27).

Continue-

 

[Johann]

Jesus Claimed to Be God by Accepting Worship. The Old Testament forbids worshiping
anyone other than God (Exodus 20:1–4; Deuteronomy 5:6–9). The New Testament agrees, showing that
humans refused worship (Acts 14:15), as did angels (Revelation 22:8–9). But Jesus accepted worship on
numerous occasions, showing he claimed to be God. A healed leper worshiped him (Matthew 8:2), and a
ruler knelt before him with a request (Matthew 9:18). After he stilled the storm, “those who were in the
boat worshiped him saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God’”(Matthew 14:33). A group of Canaanite women
(Matthew 15:25), the mother of James and John (Matthew 20:20), the Gerasene demoniac (Mark 5:6), all
worshiped Jesus without one word of rebuke. The disciples worshiped him after his resurrection
(Matthew 28:17). Thomas saw the risen Christ and cried out, “My Lord and my God!” (John 20:28). This
could only be allowed by a person who seriously considered himself to be God. Not only did Jesus accept
this worship due to God alone without rebuking those who gave it, but he even commended those who
acknowledged his deity (John 20:29; Matthew 16:17).

Jesus Claimed to Have Equal Authority with God. Jesus also put his words on a par with
God’s. “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago.... But I tell you...” (Matthew 5:21, 22) is
repeated over and over again. “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore, go
and make disciples of all nations...” (Matthew 28:18–19). God had given the Ten Commandments to
Moses, but Jesus said, “A new commandment I give you: Love one another” (John 13:34). Jesus said, “until
heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means
disappear from the Law” (Matthew 5:18), but later Jesus said of his words, “Heaven and earth will pass
away, but my words will never pass away” (Matthew 24:35). Speaking of those who reject him, Jesus said,
“that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day” (John 12:48). There is no question that
Jesus expected his words to have equal authority with God’s declarations in the Old Testament.

Lloyd De Jongh

Jesus Claimed to Be God by Requesting Prayer in His Name. Jesus not only asked
people to believe in him and obey his commandments, but he asked them to pray in his name. “And I will
do whatever you ask in my name.... You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it” (John 14:13–
14). “If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you”
(John 15:7). Jesus even insisted, “No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). In response
to this, the disciples not only prayed in Jesus’ name (1 Cor. 5:4), but prayed to Christ (Acts 7:59). Jesus
certainly intended that his name be invoked both before God and as God in prayer.
In view of these clear ways in which Jesus claimed to be God, any unbiased observer of the Gospels
should recognize that Jesus of Nazareth did claim to be God in human flesh. He claimed to be identical to
Yahweh of the Old Testament

Alleged Counter-claims of Christ. In spite of these repeated claims to be God, some critics take
certain statements of Jesus as denials of deity. Two such incidents are commonly used: In one, a rich
young ruler came to Jesus and addressed him as “Good teacher.” But Jesus rebuked him, saying, “Why do
you call me good? No one is good—except God alone” (Mark 10:17–18; see Mark 10:17–27; cf. parallels
Matthew 19:16–30; Luke 18:18–30).
Notice, however, that Jesus did not deny that he was God; he asked the young man to examine the
implications of what he said. Jesus was saying, “Do you realize what you are saying when you call me
good? Are you really saying that I am God?” Of course, the man did not realize the implications of either
his statements or what the law was really saying, so Jesus was forcing him into a very uncomfortable
dilemma. Either Jesus was good and God, or he was evil and human, for each human is evil and does not
deserve eternal life.
The 2nd supposed counterexample is found in John 14:28, where Jesus said, “My Father is greater
than I.” How can the Father be greater if Jesus is equal to God? The answer is that, as a man, Jesus
subordinated himself to the Father and accepted limitations inherent with humanity. So, as man the
Father was greater. Further, in the economy of salvation, the Father holds a higher office than does the
Son. Jesus proceeded from the Father as a prophet who brought God’s words and a high priest who
interceded for his people. In nature of being as God, Jesus and the Father are equals (John 1:1; 8:58;
10:30). An earthly father is equally human with his son but holds a higher office. So, the Father and Son
in the Trinity are equal in essence but different in function. In like manner, we speak of the president of
a nation as being greater in dignity of office, but not in character.

Jesus cannot be said to have considered himself less than God by nature.
Jesus is equal ... Jesus is subordinate ...
In His divine nature In His human nature
In His divine essence In His human function
In His divine attributes In His human office
In His divine character In His human position

End of dialogue

 

[amigo de christo]

Jesus Claimed to Be God by Accepting Worship. The Old Testament forbids worshiping
anyone other than God (Exodus 20:1–4; Deuteronomy 5:6–9). The New Testament agrees, showing that
humans refused worship (Acts 14:15), as did angels (Revelation 22:8–9). But Jesus accepted worship on
numerous occasions, showing he claimed to be God. A healed leper worshiped him (Matthew 8:2), and a
ruler knelt before him with a request (Matthew 9:18). After he stilled the storm, “those who were in the
boat worshiped him saying, ‘Truly you are the Son of God’”(Matthew 14:33). A group of Canaanite women
(Matthew 15:25), the mother of James and John (Matthew 20:20), the Gerasene demoniac (Mark 5:6), all
worshiped Jesus without one word of rebuke. The disciples worshiped him after his resurrection
(Matthew 28:17). Thomas saw the risen Christ and cried out, “My Lord and my God!” (John 20:28). This
could only be allowed by a person who seriously considered himself to be God. Not only did Jesus accept
this worship due to God alone without rebuking those who gave it, but he even commended those who
acknowledged his deity (John 20:29; Matthew 16:17).

Jesus Claimed to Have Equal Authority with God. Jesus also put his words on a par with
God’s. “You have heard that it was said to the people long ago.... But I tell you...” (Matthew 5:21, 22) is
repeated over and over again. “All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore, go
and make disciples of all nations...” (Matthew 28:18–19). God had given the Ten Commandments to
Moses, but Jesus said, “A new commandment I give you: Love one another” (John 13:34). Jesus said, “until
heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means
disappear from the Law” (Matthew 5:18), but later Jesus said of his words, “Heaven and earth will pass
away, but my words will never pass away” (Matthew 24:35). Speaking of those who reject him, Jesus said,
“that very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day” (John 12:48). There is no question that
Jesus expected his words to have equal authority with God’s declarations in the Old Testament.

Lloyd De Jongh

Jesus Claimed to Be God by Requesting Prayer in His Name. Jesus not only asked
people to believe in him and obey his commandments, but he asked them to pray in his name. “And I will
do whatever you ask in my name.... You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it” (John 14:13–
14). “If you remain in me and my words remain in you, ask whatever you wish, and it will be given you”
(John 15:7). Jesus even insisted, “No one comes to the Father except through me” (John 14:6). In response
to this, the disciples not only prayed in Jesus’ name (1 Cor. 5:4), but prayed to Christ (Acts 7:59). Jesus
certainly intended that his name be invoked both before God and as God in prayer.
In view of these clear ways in which Jesus claimed to be God, any unbiased observer of the Gospels
should recognize that Jesus of Nazareth did claim to be God in human flesh. He claimed to be identical to
Yahweh of the Old Testament

Alleged Counter-claims of Christ. In spite of these repeated claims to be God, some critics take
certain statements of Jesus as denials of deity. Two such incidents are commonly used: In one, a rich
young ruler came to Jesus and addressed him as “Good teacher.” But Jesus rebuked him, saying, “Why do
you call me good? No one is good—except God alone” (Mark 10:17–18; see Mark 10:17–27; cf. parallels
Matthew 19:16–30; Luke 18:18–30).
Notice, however, that Jesus did not deny that he was God; he asked the young man to examine the
implications of what he said. Jesus was saying, “Do you realize what you are saying when you call me
good? Are you really saying that I am God?” Of course, the man did not realize the implications of either
his statements or what the law was really saying, so Jesus was forcing him into a very uncomfortable
dilemma. Either Jesus was good and God, or he was evil and human, for each human is evil and does not
deserve eternal life.
The 2nd supposed counterexample is found in John 14:28, where Jesus said, “My Father is greater
than I.” How can the Father be greater if Jesus is equal to God? The answer is that, as a man, Jesus
subordinated himself to the Father and accepted limitations inherent with humanity. So, as man the
Father was greater. Further, in the economy of salvation, the Father holds a higher office than does the
Son. Jesus proceeded from the Father as a prophet who brought God’s words and a high priest who
interceded for his people. In nature of being as God, Jesus and the Father are equals (John 1:1; 8:58;
10:30). An earthly father is equally human with his son but holds a higher office. So, the Father and Son
in the Trinity are equal in essence but different in function. In like manner, we speak of the president of
a nation as being greater in dignity of office, but not in character.

Jesus cannot be said to have considered himself less than God by nature.
Jesus is equal ... Jesus is subordinate ...
In His divine nature In His human nature
In His divine essence In His human function
In His divine attributes In His human office
In His divine character In His human position

End of dialogue

This is the whores religion . The lambs must contend for the true faith my friend .

 

[Marvelloustime]

yep . great is the MYSTERY OF GODLINESS . GOD WAS MANIFEST IN THE FLESH . JOHN reminds us of this .
And GOD was the WORD . the WORD was manifest in the flesh .
POINT TO CHRIST JESUS till the last and final breath . He who honors the SON honors the FATHER who sent HIM .

 

[Marvelloustime]

Many will come with all sorts of ology and gies . But they have come to directly attack the diety of Christ and cannot be heeded .
What man could not do GOD DID for man . That all who would believe in HIM would be saved .
Man cannot live up to the glory of GOD . But GODCAN . HE IS HIS OWN GLORY and JESUS IS THE GLORY OF GOD .
Doing what man could not do . To bring man to GOD . to reconcile man unto GOD .
But he whose faith is not in GOD will never please GOD . And if ones faith is not in CHRIST , WELL ITS NOT IN GOD .
We cant cliam to have faith in GOD and yet have no faith in HIS WORD .
Abraham believed GOD . IF GOD said something , Abraham believed it .
Abraham even had the very gospel preached to him . And in thy seed shall all nations of the world be blessed .
And in thy seed , not as of many , but as of one . THAT IS JESUS CHRIST . Abraham rejoiced to see my day .
HE SAW IT . HE SAW IT and HE rejoiced . YE are not yet even fifty years old
and yet you have seen abraham . David nor any other prophet could have ever said such a thing .
David never saw abraham . Joshua never saw abraham . not even moses saw abraham .YET
JESUS says before ABRAHAM was ......................I AM . Before the world ever was , JESUS WAS AND IS .
I am the first and the last , i am alpha and omega . How come GOD didnt correct JESUS when he told this to the church .
Exactly . GOD IS HIS WORD . IF we deny HIS WORD WE DENY GOD HIMSELF .