Sabbath-Keeping

[Barrd]

Why do you hate them so much, is their sin any worse than yours, or is it you would rather God look at them so He cant see you??? You are no better than them in Gods eyes, all sin is worthy of death, even yours...

I am not the one saying that my sin is any better than anyone else's sin...as I recall, it was you who was condemning OTHER sinners to the fire...but not your own. Not only were molesting priests and killer nuns on your list...but honest Christians who are striving to obey God's law also made it, while YOU, of course, still in your own unrepentant sin, remain safe and whole. Uh huh....

I have admitted that I have sinned...even named my sin...and spoke of how I have repented, not once, but many times. No one is more aware than I am that I am not perfect.
However, the difference is that I REPENTED...my sin hurt me...it haunted me, until I went to my knees and begged forgiveness...and more...for divine help and guidance to put that sin behind me. I tell you this in open forum...yes, I sinned. And it hurt me, and it hurt the people that I love.

As to why I hate sin...well, sin is what put my Lord on the cross, isn't it? Jesus...as innocent as dew and as harmless as a daisy...suffered horrible torture and died, hanging from a cruel cross...for our sins.

Gays, however, seem almost proud of their sin...I mean, "gay pride"??? Proud of something that God has called an abomination? That takes some nerve...to parade your sin in God's face, as it were...
They have managed to force their way in, and are now "legal" in all fifty United States.
They have done reprehensible things...forcing people to serve them, when they were told that their Christianity forbids them from it.
Consider the case of the Christian baker who refused to bake a wedding cake for a couple of lesbians. They recommended another baker who would have been happy to give them what they wanted, but no....it had to be THAT baker...the one whose Christian ethics forbade him to participate. And they sued, and then got all bent out of shape when the Christian bakers took their troubles to the internet...
It's bad enough that you insist on languishing in your own sin, even though you know very well that God has called it an abomination.
Must you drag everyone else into the cess pool with you?

 

[Barrd]

Why do you hate them so much, is their sin any worse than yours, or is it you would rather God look at them so He cant see you??? You are no better than them in Gods eyes, all sin is worthy of death, even yours...

Listen to what you said here:

ALL SIN IS WORTHY OF DEATH

Yes, Mjr, you are quite right....ALL SIN.
Not just mine, or some raping priest or killer nun...
But YOUR SIN AS WELL.

Do you understand?

YOUR SIN IS WORTHY OF DEATH

I know that you hear that hissing whisper, "thou shalt not surely die"...same old lie God's people have been hearing since the Garden.
But God says differently.
Unless you repent, you will not inherit eternal life.

It's not rocket science...

 

[heretoeternity]

Pursue them all you like, it wont make one dot of difference except you have cast aside Grace the only way to salvation, and why is it that the law keepers are the ones that will "deliberately " break them without them, dont you have Love..??

If you are truly saved by God's grace, then you will want to keep His Commandments (God's law)...as Paul said in Romans "do we sin more so grace abounds? God forbid" and "do we make void the law through faith? God forbid, we establish the law"....and in Hebrews...God's says "I will write my laws on their hearts and minds, and I will be their God, and they will be my people"...
If you are one of God's people, then He will write His law on your heart and mind to make easy to keep...if you do not believe in and follow God's law, what spirit are your following? It is sure not God's Holy spirit!

 

[mjrhealth]

If you are truly saved by God's grace, then you will want to keep His Commandments (God's law)...

YEs you will walk in love as Christ did and not as teh pharisees who always condemned Him because He always put Love first.

Bard you dont have to shout it doesnt change anything but make you an angry person.

Hating sin does not make one perfect. The law will not and cannot perfect you it can only Kill you, thats all it ever did and will ever do.

Jesus never gave you grace to obey teh law, what is grace

H2580
חן
chên
khane
From H2603; graciousness, that is, subjectively (kindness, favor) or objectively (beauty): - favour, grace (-ious), pleasant, precious, [well-] favoured.

and

favour
ˈfeɪvə/
noun
noun: favour; noun: favor; noun: party favour; plural noun: party favours; plural noun: party favor; plural noun: party favors
1.
approval, support, or liking for someone or something.
"training is looked upon with favour by many employers"

synonyms:

approval, approbation, commendation, esteem, goodwill, kindness, benevolence, friendliness


"she looked on him with favour"




verb
verb: favour; 3rd person present: favours; past tense: favoured; past participle: favoured; gerund or present participle: favouring; verb: favor; 3rd person present: favors; past tense: favored; past participle: favored; gerund or present participle: favoring
1.
feel or show approval or preference for.
"slashing public spending is a policy that few politicians favour"

synonyms:

advocate, recommend, advise, subscribe to, approve of, look on with favour, be in favour of, support, back, champion;


campaign for, stand up for, argue for, press for, lobby for, urge, promote, espouse, endorse, sanction, vouch for;
informalplug, push

"the party favours reform of the electoral system"






What has that to do with the law.

In all His Love

 

[ATP]

What is the seal that is placed upon us by the Holy Spirit? It's found in Isaiah 8:16 KJV:

"BIND UP THE TESTIMONY, SEAL THE LAW AMONG MY DISCIPLES."

Those who deliberately break the Ten Commandments with no intention of learning to walk in accordance with them are not sealed with anything of God because that which God seals His disciples is the law, according to the Bible.

Choosing OT scripture with the word seal in it is not proper exegesis. Find me one scripture in the NT where it says God's seal can be broken. Give me a challenge.

 

[ATP]

The Bible has this to say about those who teach OSAS which promises eternal life to those who choose to continue breaking the Ten Commandments:

"Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life:" - Ezekiel 13:22 KJV

Grace is proffered only to them who daily surrender their will to God, though they may often have to weep at the foot of the Cross in repentance because of missteps in their learning to "walk as He walked".

Conversely, there is absolutely no grace for the stubborn, rebellious, recalcitrant, deliberate sinner who claims that He has Jesus as his Savior yet refuses to make Him his Lord.

This has nothing to do with losing salvation.
It's about false prophets leading people astray.
And life here is not referring to salvation, it's about sin and how sin brings death.
You're always in the OT. Why?

 

[Barrd]

YEs you will walk in love as Christ did and not as teh pharisees who always condemned Him because He always put Love first.

Christ also walked in obedience to His Father. That's what Love does.
If you are truly saved by God's grace, you will also walk in obedience. You will want to lead a life that is pleasing to Him...not sicken Him with your sin.
When you do sin, as I did, you will repent, and you will turn from that sin.

Bard you dont have to shout it doesnt change anything but make you an angry person.

Hating sin does not make one perfect. The law will not and cannot perfect you it can only Kill you, thats all it ever did and will ever do.

First of all, I never said I was perfect. Do pay attention. I said I am not perfect.
i am shouting, because you will not listen. Your sin is also worthy of death...just as mine is. You will not see the Kingdom of Heaven, you will not receive the gift of eternal life.
Now, if I didn't care, I'd just shrug my shoulders and walk away. Whatever...if that person just insists on condemning himself to a sinner's hell, it's none of my business, right?
But I can't do that.

Oh, and btw....God hates sin. Did you know that?
Yes, God is capable of hate:
Pro 6:16 These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him:
Pro 6:17 A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood,
Pro 6:18 An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief,
Pro 6:19 A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.

Psa 5:4 For thou art not a God that hath pleasure in wickedness: neither shall evil dwell with thee.
Psa 5:5 The foolish shall not stand in thy sight: thou hatest all workers of iniquity.

And He says that homosexuality is an abomination. Do you know what that means?
From Dictionary.com

ABOMINATION

[uh-bom-uh-ney-shuh n]




noun 1.
anything abominable; anything greatly disliked or abhorred.

2.
intense aversion or loathing; detestation:
He regarded lying with abomination.


3.
a vile, shameful, or detestable action, condition, habit, etc.:
Spitting in public is an abomination.





Synonyms



2. hatred. 3. corruption, depravity.

And before anyone tells you that the KJV "mistranslated" the Hebrew, here it is from Strong's concordance:

H8441 (Strong)

תֹּעֵבַה תּוֹעֵבַה

tô‛êbah tô‛êbah

to-ay-baw', to-ay-baw'

Feminine active participle of H8581; properly something disgusting (morally), that is, (as noun) an abhorrence; especially idolatry or (concretely) an idol: - abominable (custom, thing), abomination.

Total KJV occurrences: 11



But Jesus taught us about love, didn't He?
Yes, He did. And who is it that the Lord Jesus Christ loves? It seems that He takes after His Father:

Joh 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

Joh 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
Joh 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

And Jesus did lay down His life for His friends, didn't He?
But who are His friends?

Joh 15:14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

We call Him "Master"...but I think we have forgotten what that word means. I think our awe of the absolute power and authority of God has grown weaker over the years, until today we have forgotten what it really means to "fear" God.

Jesus never gave you grace to obey teh law, what is grace

H2580
חן
chên
khane
From H2603; graciousness, that is, subjectively (kindness, favor) or objectively (beauty): - favour, grace (-ious), pleasant, precious, [well-] favoured.

and

favour
ˈfeɪvə/
noun
noun: favour; noun: favor; noun: party favour; plural noun: party favours; plural noun: party favor; plural noun: party favors
1.
approval, support, or liking for someone or something.
"training is looked upon with favour by many employers"
synonyms: approval, approbation, commendation, esteem, goodwill, kindness, benevolence, friendliness


"she looked on him with favour"



verb
verb: favour; 3rd person present: favours; past tense: favoured; past participle: favoured; gerund or present participle: favouring; verb: favor; 3rd person present: favors; past tense: favored; past participle: favored; gerund or present participle: favoring
1.
feel or show approval or preference for.
"slashing public spending is a policy that few politicians favour"
synonyms: advocate, recommend, advise, subscribe to, approve of, look on with favour, be in favour of, support, back, champion;


campaign for, stand up for, argue for, press for, lobby for, urge, promote, espouse, endorse, sanction, vouch for;
informalplug, push

"the party favours reform of the electoral system"





What has that to do with the law.

In all His Love

Look again at your definition of "favour"...

 

[mjrhealth]

Look again at your definition of "favour"...

I dont have to I get plenty of it from my Lord and My God and guess what, without all the rules and regulations that mankind has tried to force upon others. It is so sad that so many worship the "unknown God".

Now i shall leave you all to yourselves. Have fun.

 

[Phoneman777]

Choosing OT scripture with the word seal in it is not proper exegesis. Find me one scripture in the NT where it says God's seal can be broken. Give me a challenge.

ATP, stick with one point at a time. We can discuss whether it can be broken after we figure out what the seal is first.

Have you ever heard of the concept that the OT is the NT concealed and the NT is the OT revealed?

This OT verse is a Messianic prophecy, where Jesus' disciples (like me) are to be sealed with the law. Do you understand? If you're not keeping the Ten Commandments, then the Holy Spirit hasn't sealed you with anything.

 

[zeke25]

DOnt have to worry about me zeke,

I know who my father is,

My sheep hear my voice, you know the one....

Pity soo few people event regard Him or listen to Him...

Have you had any 2nd thots regarding your acceptance of gays into the kingdom of God? Or, have I misinterpreted your stance from so long ago when you first brought it up in another thread?

 

[Phoneman777]

This has nothing to do with losing salvation.
It's about false prophets leading people astray.
And life here is not referring to salvation, it's about sin and how sin brings death.
You're always in the OT. Why?

Because Jesus was always in the OT. It was about eternal life, of course.

 

[zeke25]

Zeke,
You want to brag about your position in the Body of Christ...but I tell you that the Body already has a Head, and it is not you.
I do not claim to be any more than perhaps a toenail...but you seem to think you are some big important bit...and, poor fella, no one really appreciates your function.
If I had to say just which part of the body that sounds like, I'm thinking you would probably be disgusted.
Think about it.

the barrd,

You are offended and now tell one lie after another to cover your offense. You bear false witness continuously with your venomous posts. Your mind runs wild with all the awful things you would like to think that I think. You are not a mind reader. I'm definitely thru with you now. You have nothing further to say that is edifying to the Body of Christ. Repent.

zeke25

zeke25

 

[ATP]

ATP, stick with one point at a time. We can discuss whether it can be broken after we figure out what the seal is first.

Have you ever heard of the concept that the OT is the NT concealed and the NT is the OT revealed?

This OT verse is a Messianic prophecy, where Jesus' disciples (like me) are to be sealed with the law. Do you understand? If you're not keeping the Ten Commandments, then the Holy Spirit hasn't sealed you with anything.

Not only does the NT seal give us a timeline of how long we are sealed, but the NT also says once we believe we have eternal life. What more proof do you need?

Because Jesus was always in the OT. It was about eternal life, of course.

Yeah, the spirit of Jesus was in the OT.
Jesus body being crucified and resurrecting is in the NT.
Do you understand the difference,
and the seriousness of what we're discussing.

 

[heretoeternity]

ATP you are reading a lot of your own flawed interpretation into the scriptures..you have obviously been the victim of a lot of false teachings from the pagan roman system..time to stick with the word of God, whether you want to go to old or new Testament....remember in Revelation 12 and 14 salvation is for those "who have the testimony of Jesus AND FOLLOW GOD'S COMMANDMENTS"

 

[ATP]

remember in Revelation 12 and 14 salvation is for those "who have the testimony of Jesus AND FOLLOW GOD'S COMMANDMENTS"

Hello heretoeternity. Thank you for response. I believe that the NT is not referring to the commandments of men or the law. It is about the injunctions of faith, love, and obedience. John and the other apostles never use "the law" to express the rule of Christian obedience: he uses it as the Mosaic law. The NT works off of Grace Salvation, not works. In the NT Jesus already died and had been resurrected, thus pouring out His Grace and Holy Spirit at Pentecost. Love is what is preached.

Gal 5:6 NIV For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

Col 3:13 NIV Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.

ATP you are reading a lot of your own flawed interpretation into the scriptures..you have obviously been the victim of a lot of false teachings from the pagan roman system..time to stick with the word of God, whether you want to go to old or new Testament..

Well, it's important to decipher Mosaic language in OT and Grace language in NT. I am sticking with the Word of God and respectfully so, and the Word tells me that once I believe I have eternal life. These scriptures are not from pagan rituals or systems, rather it is straight from the spirit of Jesus Christ.

Not only that, the word "believe" and "eternal life" are both in the same sentence. Which means they are equal in respect.

Lastly, once we believe we are marked with an eternal seal of God Eph 1:13 NIV, and we can be confident in approaching God knowing that we have eternal life 1 John 5:14 NIV. What are we believing in hereto? Might it be Rom 10:9 NIV.

John 3:14-15 NIV Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.

John 3:16 NIV For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

John 5:24 NIV “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

John 6:40 NIV For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

John 6:47 NIV I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life.

Acts 13:46-48 NIV Then Paul and Barnabas answered them boldly: "We had to speak the word of God to you first. Since you reject it and do not consider yourselves worthy of eternal life, we now turn to the Gentiles. 47 For this is what the Lord has commanded us: " 'I have made you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring salvation to the ends of the earth.' " 48 When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed.

Eph 1:13-14 NIV And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

1 John 5:13-14 NIV I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14This is the confidence we have in approaching God:

 

[Barrd]

the barrd,

You are offended and now tell one lie after another to cover your offense. You bear false witness continuously with your venomous posts. Your mind runs wild with all the awful things you would like to think that I think. You are not a mind reader. I'm definitely thru with you now. You have nothing further to say that is edifying to the Body of Christ. Repent.

zeke25

zeke25

You don't remember telling me all about your special "function"?
I seem to recall you telling me how the word "church" wasn't in the Bible (doh), and how that wouldn't "resonate" with me. Also, there is no such thing as "afternoon" nor does a Jewish day begin at sundown...these are some of the misconceptions it is your "function" to correct. But no one appreciates you.
I remember asking you how long it would be before you started attacking me, since I didn't agree with you either. Let's see...two days? Gosh, it seems like I've known you so much longer...
And now you say I'm lying about you. Show me where I have lied...oh, but you're "through with me". Just as well....you and I both know that you cannot show any such thing.
I will pray for you. Perhaps God will help you sort yourself out.
Meantime, I'm counting on you to keep your promise...you're through with me. No more insulting posts...that'll be nice, thank you...

 

[zeke25]

Beware of wolves in sheep clothing.

 

[Barrd]

Hello heretoeternity. Thank you for response. I believe that the NT is not referring to the commandments of men or the law. It is about the injunctions of faith, love, and obedience. John and the other apostles never use "the law" to express the rule of Christian obedience: he uses it as the Mosaic law. The NT works off of Grace Salvation, not works. In the NT Jesus already died and had been resurrected, thus pouring out His Grace and Holy Spirit at Pentecost. Love is what is preached.

Gal 5:6 NIV For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.

Col 3:13 NIV Bear with each other and forgive one another if any of you has a grievance against someone. Forgive as the Lord forgave you.


Well, it's important to decipher Mosaic language in OT and Grace language in NT. I am sticking with the Word of God and respectfully so, and the Word tells me that once I believe I have eternal life. These scriptures are not from pagan rituals or systems, rather it is straight from the spirit of Jesus Christ.

Not only that, the word "believe" and "eternal life" are both in the same sentence. Which means they are equal in respect.

Lastly, once we believe we are marked with an eternal seal of God Eph 1:13 NIV, and we can be confident in approaching God knowing that we have eternal life 1 John 5:14 NIV. What are we believing in hereto? Might it be Rom 10:9 NIV.

John 3:14-15 NIV Just as Moses lifted up the snake in the desert, so the Son of Man must be lifted up, 15 that everyone who believes in him may have eternal life.

John 3:16 NIV For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life.

John 5:24 NIV “Very truly I tell you, whoever hears my word and believes him who sent me has eternal life and will not be judged but has crossed over from death to life.

John 6:40 NIV For my Father’s will is that everyone who looks to the Son and believes in him shall have eternal life, and I will raise them up at the last day.”

John 6:47 NIV I tell you the truth, he who believes has everlasting life.

Acts 13:46-48 NIV Then Paul and Barnabas answered them boldly: "We had to speak the word of God to you first. Since you reject it and do not consider yourselves worthy of eternal life, we now turn to the Gentiles. 47 For this is what the Lord has commanded us: " 'I have made you a light for the Gentiles, that you may bring salvation to the ends of the earth.' " 48 When the Gentiles heard this, they were glad and honored the word of the Lord; and all who were appointed for eternal life believed.

Eph 1:13-14 NIV And you also were included in Christ when you heard the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation. When you believed, you were marked in him with a seal, the promised Holy Spirit, 14who is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance until the redemption of those who are God’s possession—to the praise of his glory.

1 John 5:13-14 NIV I write these things to you who believe in the name of the Son of God so that you may know that you have eternal life. 14This is the confidence we have in approaching God:

ATP, these are all great verses.
But you do know that there are loads of other verses in the Bible, right?
Verses that tell us that faith without works is dead for instance.
Verses that talk about obedience, and how we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.

To understand what salvation is all about, you will need to read the entire Bible...not just a small handful of verses.

 

[Barrd]

Beware of wolves in sheep clothing.

Now that is good advice.
Thank you.

 

[ATP]

Verses that tell us that faith without works is dead for instance.

That passage has nothing to do with losing your salvation though. It is simply stating a fact about faith without works.

2 Tim 3:1-5 NIV But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God--5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.

Rom 1:16 NIV For I am not ashamed of the gospel, because it is the power of God that brings salvation to everyone who believes: first to the Jew, then to the Gentile.