"Salvation" is the gift of Eternal Life - it's FOREVER.

[theefaith]

Good question!

Luke 1:35
And the angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Highest will overshadow you; therefore, also, that Holy One who is to be born will be called the Son of God.

John 3:6
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.

Hebrews 2:10
For it was fitting for Him, for whom are all things and by whom are all things, in bringing many sons to glory, to make the captain of their salvation perfect through sufferings.

1 Peter 1:13-25
Therefore gird up the loins of your mind, be sober, and rest your hope fully upon the grace that is to be brought to you at the revelation of Jesus Christ; 14 as obedient children, not conforming yourselves to the former lusts, as in your ignorance; 15 but as He who called you is holy, you also be holy in all your conduct, 16 because it is written, “Be holy, for I am holy.”

17 And if you call on the Father, who without partiality judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves throughout the time of your stay here in fear; 18 knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot. 20 He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you 21 who through Him believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God.

22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 24 because

“All flesh is as grass,
And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
The grass withers,
And its flower falls away,
25 But the word of the Lord endures forever.”

Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

​

And Jn 3:5

 

[theefaith]

The biblical mandate of God’s work of creation!

Water and the spirit!

First creation:

Gen 1:1 In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. 2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.

(water and the spirit)

Noah:

Gen 8:8 Also he sent forth a dove (representing the spirit) from him…

(Water and the spirit)

Red Sea:

Led thru the waters by the spirit.
Exodus 13:21
And the Lord went before them by day in a pillar of a cloud, to lead them the way; and by night in a pillar of fire, to give them light; to go by day and night:

(Water and the spirit)

Josuha

Joshua and the people of Israel crossing of the Jordan led by the spirit.

Joshua 1:1 Now after the death of Moses the servant of the Lord it came to pass, that the Lord spake unto Joshua the son of Nun, Moses’ minister, saying, 2 Moses my servant is dead; now therefore arise, go over this Jordan, thou, and all this people, unto the land which I do give to them, even to the children of Israel.

(Water and the spirit)

Prophecy of the new creation: (new covenant)

Ez 36:25 Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. 26 A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. 27 And I will put my spirit within you…
acts 2:38-39 “this promise”

(Water and the Spirit)

Baptism of Jesus

Jn 1:31 I come baptizing with water. 32 And John bare record, saying, I saw the Spirit descending from heaven like a dove, and it abode upon him.

(Water and the spirit)

New creation by water and the spirit

Jn 3:5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(Water and the spirit)

Christian sacrament of baptismal regeneration is by: WATER AND THE SPIRIT!


No one is born again by:

“the spirit alone”!
Or
“Faith alone”!

 

[Taken]

Yes, there is.
Right or wrong, there is indeed TWO very distinct teachings about OSAS in the church today.

You say you can't lose your salvation and will always keep believing.

What I say, is what Scripture teaches...
* A Man WHO Believes ON THE DAY OF HIS BODILY DEATH, SHALL BE SAVED, ON THAT DAY.
* He IS SAVED....AFTER His BODILY DEATH.
* No, he Doesn’t come back to life, and Become UNSAVED!
* He IS KEPT SAVED...BY THE POWER OF GOD.
* It is the SOUL that is being “RESTORED”.
* “RESTORED” is the SOUL, becoming what it was When God BLEW His breath of Life into a man......REMEMBER Gods saying;

Gen 1:
[31] And God saw every thing that he had made, and, behold, it was very good. And the evening and the morn

Remember God CREATED mans FORM from Dust...
AND Then MADE that form Alive?

Gen 2:
[3] And God blessed the seventh day, and sanctified it: because that in it he had rested from all his work which God created and made.

Remember Jesus saying.....NONE are Good?
Because of Disobedience, Men became SINNERS.
After Fulfillment of the LAW...and introducing Gentiles never under the Law...
Men were SINNERS...born in Sin....but forgiven yearly, by animal blood.
Men became SINNERS...Not Believing In God, In Christ Jesus.
The WHOLE of man, Body, soul, spirit.......is NATURALLY corrupt.

Salvation is ABOUT the WHOLE of man;
The SOUL: is about Restoring to the soul (Pss 23:3) back to very good.
The BODY: is about a NEW Creature.
The SPIRIT: is about Receiving Gods Seed, for receipt of a born again Spirit of man,
Bodily Death is about Death of the OLD, so that a NEW creature CAN be born.

NONE of ^ THAT can a human man SEE with Human EYES.
NONE of ^ THAT CAN OCCUR UNTIL, a BODY DIES.
^^^ THAT IS WHY, ONCE a person IS SAVED, it means THEIR BODY HAS DIED, and THEY HAVE Received SALVATION.
^^^ THAT IT WHY IT IS ONCE, FOREVER, AND IS NEVER IN JEOPARDY ONCE RECEIVED.

That's the 'P' in TULIP, the original OSAS teaching of the Reformation.

TY. I think this requires a bigger response than I can do right now....
Less you want to come over, free up some of my time and help me mow a few acres...?

 

[Behold]

The faith that saves .

Faith does not save.
Only Jesus saves.

God saves "through faith".
God receives a BELIEVER's faith ONE TIME< when they first believe, to give the believer the new birth. .. .born again.
Its a supernatural exchange. God takes faith, and Give Righteousness.
Its a Divine Exchange where Jesus becomes the sin of the Believer, and the believer becomes.. ."made righteous".. ."THE righteousness of God, in Christ".
Being born again is proof the born again person is going to heaven, as they are now "in Christ' "one with God".
God is the savior, not faith.

 

[Behold]

Your unbelief and return to sin

Romans 4:8 says that God does not charge you with sin, if you are born again.

2 Corinthians 5:19 says that the Gospel that a real believer is to share is that God does not charge the BELIEVER with their sin, as God was in Christ in the world, on the Cross, redeeming them.

 

[Behold]

@Behold (Behold) He says you CAN fall away in unbelief.
.

Yes.
You are my example.
You have faith that Christ saves, but you have lost faith that Christ keeps you saved.
Your savior is "faith".. "If i hold unto MY FAITH, i keep myself from going to hell".
So, that is "lost faith"...or no faith in Christ, that is pretending to be faith in Christ.
If you have real faith, you would be on a Christian forum happily acknowledging that Jesus who saved you, keeps you saved.
But you can't, as your faith is now in your= "if i do this, i keep myself saved". "Here is what i must DO, to keep from going to hell".
That is not faith in Christ. That is faith in : SELF

= Legalism.

 

[ScottA]

And Jn 3:5

John 3:5
Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
​

I am not sure I understand your question...or rather how it is that you do not know that anyone who has been born into this world is already born of water.

Nonetheless, Jesus was referring to what has been since the creation of the world--which is: "Thus God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament; and it was so." Genesis 1:7

Since that time, that which is below is divided from that which is above, making what is below finite and that which is above infinite, the one subject to death and the other not. It is for this reason that we must also be born from above...and why the waters below have no life in them. This should have been made clear in Jesus' explanation to the woman at the well (John 4:1-26...notably soon after John 3:5). Even so, as Jesus said, we must be born of both--which if we are already born into this world, we are already born of the waters below.

 

[theefaith]

Faith does not save.
Only Jesus saves.

God saves "through faith".
God receives a BELIEVER's faith ONE TIME< when they first believe, to give the believer the new birth. .. .born again.
Its a supernatural exchange. God takes faith, and Give Righteousness.
Its a Divine Exchange where Jesus becomes the sin of the Believer, and the believer becomes.. ."made righteous".. ."THE righteousness of God, in Christ".
Being born again is proof the born again person is going to heaven, as they are now "in Christ' "one with God".
God is the savior, not faith.

grace saves!

now explain this first moment one believes they are saved in light of scripture
Mark 4:3-8
All had a pittance of faith
Why aren’t all saved?

first moment rom 13:11

11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

 

[theefaith]

John 3:5
Jesus answered, “Most assuredly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.
​

I am not sure I understand your question...or rather how it is that you do not know that anyone who has been born into this world is already born of water.

Nonetheless, Jesus was referring to what has been since the creation of the world--which is: "Thus God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament; and it was so." Genesis 1:7

Since that time, that which is below is divided from that which is above, making what is below finite and that which is above infinite, the one subject to death and the other not. It is for this reason that we must also be born from above...and why the waters below have no life in them. This should have been made clear in Jesus' explanation to the woman at the well (John 4:1-26...notably soon after John 3:5). Even so, as Jesus said, we must be born of both--which if we are already born into this world, we are already born of the waters below.

still the scripture does not say born of water and born again by the spirit alone!

but born again ///// BY water and the spirit!

or by the action of both water and the spirit and that’s why in Jn 3:22 they immediately go to the river (water) and baptized!

mk 16:16 baptism
And Jn 4:1 baptism
Acts 2:38-39 baptism

so on and on it goes baptism baptism baptism

born again is baptimal regeneration!


A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)


A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 2:1&5 brought to life in baptism
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!




“Faith alone”

Questions

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

Faith alone” unbiblical!

WATER AND THE SPIRIT!
Baptismal regeneration is the biblical mandate!!!

 

[ScottA]

still the scripture does not say born of water and born again by the spirit alone!

but born again ///// BY water and the spirit!

or by the action of both water and the spirit and that’s why in Jn 3:22 they immediately go to the river (water) and baptized!

mk 16:16 baptism
And Jn 4:1 baptism
Acts 2:38-39 baptism

so on and on it goes baptism baptism baptism

born again is baptimal regeneration!


A sacrament is an oath! A sacred promise from God! Ez 36:25-27
Acts 2:38-39 (this promise)


A sacrament is an outward sign for all men including infants And a gift from God to help us see what he does inwardly and invisibly by his grace!

As grace Washes our souls in the merits of Jesus blood from original and personal sin, so the outward action of washing is visible!

without the outward action the inward action cannot take place!

Jn 3:5 Titus 3:5 water and washing
acts 22:16 wash away your sin!

Jn 3:5 Born again BY water and the spirit! Not by “faith alone”!

They did not go to Jerusalem and preach “accept Christ as you’re personal Lord and savior “

They went to the river (water) and they baptized! Jn 3:22

A covenant requires an outward sign of the inward action of grace!

Ez 36:25 I will sprinkle you with clean water and you shall be made white as snow.

Acts 22:16 washing away your sins.

Eph 4:5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism.

1 pet 3:21 baptism saves you.

You cannot enter on you’re own or by faith alone!

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

Heb 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,


Baptism!

God breathed life into Adam, gen 2:7 and we received this life from our fathers!

Christ breathed on the apostles our spiritual fathers, we receive the new covenant life of God’s grace from them thru faith & baptism! Jn 20:21-23 Mk 16:16 acts 8:36-38 eph 2

Born again! Born from above!

'The Father has set his seal' on Christ (John 6:27) and also seals us in him (cf. 2 Corinthians 1:22; Ephesians 1:23, 4:30). Because this seal indicates the indelible effect of the anointing with the Holy Spirit in the sacrament of Baptism,

Baptism indeed is the seal of eternal life." 87 The faithful Christian who I has "kept the seal" until the end, remaining faithful to the demands of his Baptism, will be able to depart this life "marked with the sign of faith," 88 with his baptismal faith, in expectation of the blessed vision of God - the consummation of faith - and in the hope of resurrection.

St. Paul tells the faithful at Ephesus that they have been “sealed with the promised Holy Spirit.” This is in terms of an indelible character imprinted on the soul in the sacraments of baptism and confirmation. It is not as if this invisible mark is simply decorative. Rather, through it, we are enabled to participate in Christ’s mission and in his offices of priest, prophet, and king. Eph 1:13

Sealed by God eph 1:13 sealed by God (ez 36:25-27) in the ark of salvation by baptism just as Noah was sealed by God in the ark of the flood gen 7:16

1 Pet 3:20 Which sometime were disobedient, when once the longsuffering of God waited in the days of Noah, while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water.

21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!
(Ark of Noah a type of the church, member of Christ and his church and salvation by baptism!)
(Outside the ark of Noah none were saved, outside the church (the ark of salvation) none are saved!)

Sealed in the ark, sealed in the church the ark of salvation by God thru baptism!



Christ instituted the holy church for the salvation of all men, (repent and believe the gospel, with the institution of the sacraments to convey grace to sanctify souls!


Effects of faith & baptism!

Ez 36:25-27 washed in baptism, with a new heart and the Spirit
Jn 3:5 born again in baptism
Mk 16:16 faith & baptist
Acts 2:38 repentance & baptism
Acts 8:36-38 faith & baptism
Acts 22:16 baptism washes away sin
Rom 6:3 died with Christ
Col 2:12 risen with Christ
1 cor 12:13 baptized into the church
Gal 3:27 by baptism put on Christ
2 Tim 1:10 brought to life
2 cor 5:17 new creation
Eph 1:13 sealed by the Holy Spirit
Eph 2:1&5 brought to life in baptism
Eph 4:5 one baptism
Eph 5:26 faith and baptism
Titus 3:5 baptismal regeneration
1 pet 1:2 washed in Christ’s blood
1 pet 2:9 the kingdom of light
1 pet 3:20-21 baptism saves us!

“Faith alone” accomplishes nothing!
1 cor 13:2 even all faith (alone) without charity avails NOTHING!!!

Faith and baptism!

Scripture says none of the things about “Faith alone”!

2 Peter 1:11
For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

The Christian sacrament of baptism is the Initiation into the new covenant and must be ministered to you by the apostles!




“Faith alone”

Questions

where does scripture says we have died with Christ by “faith alone”?

Rom 6:3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?

where does scripture say we are members of Christ and his church by “faith alone”?

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

where does scripture says we put on Christ by “faith alone”?

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Where does scripture say our sins are washed away by “faith alone”?

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

where does scripture say we are saved or justified by “faith alone”?

1 pet 3:21 The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us!

The only reference in scripture to “faith alone” is James 2:24 NOT BY “FAITH ALONE”?

2 pet 1: 11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

How can you enter by your own if it must be ministered to you? Baptism is done unto you, “not do it yourself by faith alone”

Jn 3:5 born again by faith alone?

Where is “Accept Christ as your personal lord & savior” is found in scripture?

They did not go preaching this line but went immediately to the river and baptized Jn 3:22

Acts 22:16
And now why tarriest thou? arise, and be baptized, and wash away thy sins, calling on the name of the Lord.

1 Corinthians 12:13
For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we be Jews or Gentiles, whether we be bond or free; and have been all made to drink into one Spirit.

Galatians 3:27
For as many of you as have been baptized into Christ have put on Christ.

Eph 4:5 one baptism

Why don’t it say one teeny tiny little act of “faith alone”???

When we first believed we are saved?

Romans 13:11
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.

How can salvation be nearer than when we first believed if you’re saved by believing?

1 pet 1:9 Receiving the end of your faith, even the salvation of your souls.

Matt 24:13 endures to the end Shall be saved.

How can salvation happen when we first believed if it’s the end?

If salvation is by “faith alone” then faith would be the greatest!
1 cor 13:13 charity is the greatest!

Even all faith much less “faith alone” without charity avails nothing!
1 cor 13:2

Faith alone” unbiblical!

WATER AND THE SPIRIT!
Baptismal regeneration is the biblical mandate!!!

No--it is you who have put the two together when the scriptures do not, but in fact state the first birth as one that ought to be obvious, then also stating the other that is not.

And since you insist on mixing the two, making a religion out of that which was created only to teach you by example--so shall it be measured to you.

 

[theefaith]

No--it is you who have put the two together when the scriptures do not, but in fact state the first birth as one that ought to be obvious, then also stating the other that is not.

And since you insist on mixing the two, making a religion out of that which was created only to teach you by example--so shall it be measured to you.

really?

John 3:5
King James Version

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition

5 Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
English Standard Version

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
Wycliffe Bible

5 Jesus answered, Truly, truly, I say to thee, but a man be born again of water, and of the Holy Ghost, he may not enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

any other versions you use?

 

[ScottA]

really?

John 3:5
King James Version

5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
Douay-Rheims 1899 American Edition

5 Jesus answered: Amen, amen I say to thee, unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Ghost, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
English Standard Version

5 Jesus answered, “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born of water and the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

John 3:5
Wycliffe Bible

5 Jesus answered, Truly, truly, I say to thee, but a man be born again of water, and of the Holy Ghost, he may not enter into the kingdom of God.

(WATER AND THE SPIRIT)

any other versions you use?

Okay...I will humor you:

Choose what ever bible version you prefer, but what is your take away-- How many types of birth are named regarding mankind?​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

You have faith that Christ saves, but you have lost faith that Christ keeps you saved.

No I haven't lost faith that God keeps me saved.
God's power protects me for the salvation that is to be revealed. And he does that through my faith:

"3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time." 1 Peter 1:5​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

"If i hold unto MY FAITH, i keep myself from going to hell"

The blood of Christ, accessed through faith, keeps me from going to hell.
You really need to get the argument right.

 

[ScottA]

No I haven't lost faith that God keeps me saved.
God's power protects me for the salvation that is to be revealed. And he does that through my faith:

"3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time." 1 Peter 1:5​

When is it that you consider to be "the last time?"

 

[Ferris Bueller]

your faith is now in your= "if i do this, i keep myself saved". "Here is what i must DO, to keep from going to hell".
That is not faith in Christ. That is faith in : SELF

= Legalism.

I'm surprised that you think Paul was teaching a self-righteous gospel of legalism:

"1Now, brothers, I want to remind you of the gospel I preached to you, which you received, and in which you stand firm. 2By this gospel you are saved, if you hold firmly to the word I preached to you. Otherwise, you have believed in vain."
1 Corinthians 15:1-2
​

And before you even think about going there, here's the potential vanity of their faith that he's talking about:

"14 ...if Christ has not been raised, our preaching is worthless, and so is your faith." 1 Corinthians 15:14​

 

[Ferris Bueller]

When is it that you consider to be "the last time?"

The return of Christ.

 

[ScottA]

No I haven't lost faith that God keeps me saved.
God's power protects me for the salvation that is to be revealed. And he does that through my faith:

"3Blessed be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! By His great mercy He has given us new birthb into a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead, 4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time." 1 Peter 1:5​

When is it that you consider to be "the last time?"

The return of Christ.

Here is the biblical definition of the "last time":

And if you call on the Father, who without partiality judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves throughout the time of your stay here in fear; 18 knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot. 20 He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you 21 who through Him believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God. 1 Peter 1:17-21
​

The same Peter you quoted in 1 Peter 1:5 (still in context) continues on stating that the last times began 2,000 years ago. Which begs the question, based on your response that it is also "The return of Christ"...

1. What have you been waiting for, and why have you been carrying on like it's only coming "someday?"
2. And, how come you have not tried to reconcile just how it could even be possible that both are true--that the "last time" started 2,000 years ago which according to your own answer that time is "the return of Christ?"

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Here is the biblical definition of the "last time":

And if you call on the Father, who without partiality judges according to each one’s work, conduct yourselves throughout the time of your stay here in fear; 18 knowing that you were not redeemed with corruptible things, like silver or gold, from your aimless conduct received by tradition from your fathers, 19 but with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot. 20 He indeed was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you 21 who through Him believe in God, who raised Him from the dead and gave Him glory, so that your faith and hope are in God. 1 Peter 1:17-21
​

The same Peter you quoted in 1 Peter 1:5 (still in context) continues on stating that the last times began 2,000 years ago. Which begs the question, based on your response that it is also "The return of Christ"...

1. What have you been waiting for, and why have you been carrying on like it's only coming "someday?"
2. And, how come you have not tried to reconcile just how it could even be possible that both are true--that the "last time" started 2,000 years ago which according to your own answer that time is "the return of Christ?"

4and into an inheritance that is imperishable, undefiled, and unfading, reserved in heaven for you, 5who through faith are shielded by God’s power for the salvation that is ready to be revealed in the last time.1 Peter 1:4-5. ​

As we can see, he's speaking of that which is "reserved in heaven for you". We don't have the fullness of salvation and the inheritance now. We will receive that when Jesus returns.

 

[Ferris Bueller]

Romans 4:8 says that God does not charge you with sin, if you are born again.

2 Corinthians 5:19 says that the Gospel that a real believer is to share is that God does not charge the BELIEVER with their sin, as God was in Christ in the world, on the Cross, redeeming them.

Yes, God does not charge sin to the BELIEVER, not unbelievers as you say God does.