Salvation Through Baptism ???

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marksman

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So let me ask, if someone is baptized in the name of the Father Son and the Holy Ghost, is this going to negate their Baptism/Salvation?

Matt 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:

And yes it has been debated forever, and it will go on forever. Its already been spoken of what Acts 2:38 means, but I would take it that you choose to interpret it as Baptism brings Forgiveness. I disagree and can quote you all the other times that Greek word means because of, which of course changes the understanding of that verse. Be baptized because of the remission of your Sins.

Matt 12:41 The men of Nineveh shall rise in judgment with this generation, and shall condemn it: because they repented at the preaching of Jonas; and, behold, a greater than Jonas is here.

Same Greek Word there as is for in Acts 2:38. Did the men repent BECAUSE OF the preaching of Jonas or did they repent (because of) the remission of sins,

If we take Acts 2:38 to be Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ (because of) the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. Then it takes on a different meaning and it lines up with what Peter preaches in his next 2 sermons, where he doesnt mention Baptism for Salvation, which is odd if he really is telling people they NEED to be Baptized in Water for Salvation.

Acts 3:19 Repent ye therefore, and be converted, that your sins may be blotted out, when the times of refreshing shall come from the presence of the Lord.

Acts 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

Seems Peter ought to have commanded this every time he preached if it was necessary for Salvation, but the one thing he always preached was believing in Jesus...

I don't think it is profitable to try and second guess Peter. There is enough evidence in scripture to build a solid foundation for what one believes in this matter.

You said; So let me ask, if someone is baptized in the name of the Father Son and the Holy Ghost, is this going to negate their Baptism/Salvation?

Check my post on the matter.

You said; I disagree and can quote you all the other times that Greek word means because of, which of course changes the understanding of that verse. Be baptized because of the remission of your Sins.

Disagree all you want. I don't need your opinion to know what I believe is the truth.

You said; (because of) the remission of sins, I have about 10 different versions of the bible and the original greek but not one of them says because of.

You said; Did the men repent BECAUSE OF the preaching of Jonas or did they repent IN ORDER TO the preaching of Jonas?

In order to the preaching of Jonas. Gobbledegook I am afraid.
 

Ernest T. Bass

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Reread my post. My point addressed the OP 'Salvation through Baptism?'. I addressed that point in relation to Paul. I never came close to saying we aren't to baptize.
We are put into Christ and He dwells in us through faith in the Gospel. Baptism visibly portrays that fact.
You posted "If baptizing saves, why does Paul state he doesn't even know who he baptized let alone state he was glad he baptized none of them? "

It appeared to me that your point was to try and use 1 Corinthians 1:14-18 as 'proof text' that baptism is not essential to salvation. My post was to show that 1 Cor 1:13-17 actually proves the necessity of baptism, that baptism is not an option but a requirement to salvation if one is to be "of Christ".
 
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You posted "If baptizing saves, why does Paul state he doesn't even know who he baptized let alone state he was glad he baptized none of them? "

It appeared to me that your point was to try and use 1 Corinthians 1:14-18 as 'proof text' that baptism is not essential to salvation. My post was to show that 1 Cor 1:13-17 actually proves the necessity of baptism, that baptism is not an option but a requirement to salvation if one is to be "of Christ".
From a drug derelict to a new creature in Christ through faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ and the baptism of the Holy Spirit..three months later I was water baptized. Are you saying I wasn't saved until three months after I came to Jesus and received a new nature through the new birth?
 

DPMartin

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Hi

ACTS 2:38
Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

So is baptism necessary in order to receive the Holy Spirit?

And is baptism necessary for salvation? If a person has accepted Jesus Christ by faith and has made a full repentance, yet have not become baptized.. are they saved.

baptism of the Holy Spirit is mandatory

Luk 3:15  And as the people were in expectation, and all men mused in their hearts of John, whether he were the Christ, or not; 
Luk 3:16  John answered, saying unto them all, I indeed baptize you with water; but one mightier than I cometh, the latchet of whose shoes I am not worthy to unloose: he shall baptize you with the Holy Ghost and with fire: 

hence these are the worlds of Jesus Christ Himself:

Joh 3:5  Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God. 
Joh 3:6  That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit. 
Joh 3:7  Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again. 
Joh 3:8  The wind bloweth where it listeth, and thou hearest the sound thereof, but canst not tell whence it cometh, and whither it goeth: so is every one that is born of the Spirit. 

baptism by water is a sign of repentance, which many do genuinely or not. but baptism by Holy Spirit is to receive the Life required that is of God through His Beloved Son to be in the Presence of God in God's Peace according to His will.
 
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Ernest T. Bass

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From a drug derelict to a new creature in Christ through faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ and the baptism of the Holy Spirit..three months later I was water baptized. Are you saying I wasn't saved until three months after I came to Jesus and received a new nature through the new birth?

God has chosen water baptism as the point HE saves, baptism is the point God removes the body of sin (Col 2:11-13), baptism is the point the blood of Christ washes away sins (Rev 1:5; John 19:34; Romans 6:3-5) baptism is how one obeys the gospel of Christ to keep from being in flaming fire (2Thessalonians 1:8), no one is 'of Christ' (1 Corinthians 1:12-13) until baptized. So no one is saved until baptized.

No verse says anyone today is 'spirit baptized'. That is a man made idea evidently used to find a way to get around the necessity of water baptism.
 
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Blood-Soaked
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God has chosen water baptism as the point HE saves, baptism is the point God removes the body of sin (Col 2:11-13), baptism is the point the blood of Christ washes away sins (Rev 1:5; John 19:34; Romans 6:3-5) baptism is how one obeys the gospel of Christ to keep from being in flaming fire (2Thessalonians 1:8), no one is 'of Christ' (1 Corinthians 1:12-13) until baptized. So no one is saved until baptized.

No verse says anyone today is 'spirit baptized'. That is a man made idea evidently used to find a way to get around the necessity of water baptism.
They say a man blind from birth has no conception of what color looks like.
 

Bible_Gazer

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Baptism is the gateway into the kingdom of God.
John 3:3-7
3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born again, he cannot see the kingdom of God.
4 Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother's womb, and be born?
5 Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
7 Marvel not that I said unto thee, Ye must be born again.


so if we are not born again by these baptism, can we really understand completely without it.
Without the Holy Ghost baptism are we spiritualyl minded ?
Are we spirit led or not ?

1 Corinthians 2:14
14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him:
neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.


Here there is something to be said how baptism makes us a new person to life.
How do we get rid of first Adam and get into the New Adam ?
Romans 6:3-4
3 Know ye not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into his death?
4 Therefore we are buried with him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.
2 Corinthians 5:17
17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

It seem to me baptism changes a person's being.
agree or disagree ?
 

Ezra

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baptism FOLLOWS salvation the doctrine of justification has nothing in it about water baptism when one places emphasis on water baptism for salvation. it takes away the atonement and redemption
 

Ezra

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It seem to me baptism changes a person's being.
agree or disagree ?
DISAGREE the most important baptism is the baptism of the spirit . For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we are Jews or Gentiles, whether we are bond or free, and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. regeneration Born of the spirit
 

Bible_Gazer

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Bible_Gazer said:
It seem to me baptism changes a person's being.
agree or disagree ?

DISAGREE the most important baptism is the baptism of the spirit . For by one Spirit are we all baptized into one body, whether we are Jews or Gentiles, whether we are bond or free, and have been all made to drink into one Spirit. regeneration Born of the spirit

I meant the whole baptism to being a new being.
There is a reason for us to be changed from the old into the new.
 

Ernest T. Bass

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They say a man blind from birth has no conception of what color looks like.


Acts 2:38 "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."

1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

I can take the above verses literally at face value, grammatically, contextually and easily see they all show baptism is necessary to being saved.

Why is it other people are blind to what I can see so clearly?
 
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Acts 2:38 "Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost."

Mark 16:16 "He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned."

1 Peter 3:21 "The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:"

I can take the above verses literally at face value, grammatically, contextually and easily see they all show baptism is necessary to being saved.

Why is it other people are blind to what I can see so clearly?

Anyone can play 'pick and choose'...

John 5:24 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Acts 2:21 (KJV) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Acts 15:11 (KJV) But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Romans 10:13 (KJV) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

John 3:16 (KLV) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Are you sure you want to play that game?
 
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marksman

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Anyone can play 'pick and choose'...

John 5:24 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Acts 2:21 (KJV) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Acts 15:11 (KJV) But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Romans 10:13 (KJV) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

John 3:16 (KLV) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Are you sure you want to play that game?

Isn't that what you have done. Pick and choose. You have missed out any verse that includes baptism. I would say that is picking and choosing.
 
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prism

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Isn't that what you have done. Pick and choose. You have missed out any verse that includes baptism. I would say that is picking and choosing.
Exactly my point. I was mimicking Ernest Bass as he only showed verses that seemed to indicate baptism as a necessity.
 

marksman

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Exactly my point. I was mimicking Ernest Bass as he only showed verses that seemed to indicate baptism as a necessity.

Your post does not make that clear and as posters cannot always mind read it is not a good methodology.
 

prism

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Your post does not make that clear and as posters cannot always mind read it is not a good methodology.
My post was directed to Ernest, I'll let him decide how clear it was.
 

marksman

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My post was directed to Ernest, I'll let him decide how clear it was.
In a public forum, your post is directed to everyone who reads it. If you want it for one person only you should go to the section that allows you to do that. Known as the InBox
 

Enow

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Thank you all, in providing a wealthy spread of information on this topic of baptism. From what I've gathered "baptism" is not essential for salvation.. however, it is certainly a commitment of dedication to God by faith unto obidiance.

It is not "certainly a commitment of dedication to God". This is just another step of surrendering to Jesus Christ in trusting Him as our Good Shepherd and not just as our Savior. Water baptism is just water baptism; an ordinance for new believers to follow after having been saved in showing a public witness of trusting Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd to help us to follow Him. It is done by faith by the believer or it is not done by faith but by the believer resorting to his or her own power in following Him by keeping that commitment or promise to do so.
 

mailmandan

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Anyone can play 'pick and choose'...

John 5:24 (KJV) Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life.

Acts 2:21 (KJV) And it shall come to pass, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.

Acts 15:11 (KJV) But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

Romans 10:13 (KJV) For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved.

John 3:16 (KLV) For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

Are you sure you want to play that game?
Amen! What certain people do is isolate their pet verses, build doctrine on them, then ignore the context and the rest of scripture, which does not line up with their biased interpretation of those pet verses. Such people also fail to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching their conclusion on doctrine and are only interested in trying to force scripture to "conform" to their biased church doctrine. The end result is salvation by faith + works.
 
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Enow

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Amen! What certain people do is isolate their pet verses, build doctrine on them, then ignore the context and the rest of scripture, which does not line up with their biased interpretation of those pet verses. Such people also fail to properly harmonize scripture with scripture before reaching their conclusion on doctrine and are only interested in trying to force scripture to "conform" to their biased church doctrine.

You spoken the truth but you did not apply it here to his false teaching below.

The end result is salvation by faith + works.

Titus 3:4 But after that the kindness and love of God our Saviour toward man appeared, 5 Not by works of righteousness which we have done, but according to his mercy he saved us, by the washing of regeneration, and renewing of the Holy Ghost; 6 Which he shed on us abundantly through Jesus Christ our Saviour; 7 That being justified by his grace, we should be made heirs according to the hope of eternal life.

Salvation by faith without works, but Paul did say what works were for as good and profitable unto men.

8 This is a faithful saying, and these things I will that thou affirm constantly, that they which have believed in God might be careful to maintain good works. These things are good and profitable unto men.

So what we build on that foundation will be judged, but that foundation laid by Jesus Christ cannot be removed and neither can that seal of adoption, which is why we are to live a life of repentance in living as His disciples. Salvation & discipleship which is running that race by faith in Jesus Christ as our Good shepherd, looking to the author & finisher of our faith to help us lay aside every weight & sin is still placing confidence in Christ Jesus to finish as we are the works of His hands whereby the crowns we receive are His crowning achievements in us for why we shall cast them at His feet.

Saved believers can be disqualified and become castaways if found in unrepentant iniquity when the Bridegroom comes and thus left behind, but they will be resurrected after the great tribulation as vessels unto dishonor in His House, testifying to the power of God in salvation for all those that believe in Him, even in His name.

1 Corinthians 3:15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire. 16 Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you? 17 If any man defile the temple of God, him shall God destroy; for the temple of God is holy, which temple ye are.

Revelation 2:21 And I gave her space to repent of her fornication; and she repented not. 22 Behold, I will cast her into a bed, and them that commit adultery with her into great tribulation, except they repent of their deeds. 23 And I will kill her children with death; and all the churches shall know that I am he which searcheth the reins and hearts: and I will give unto every one of you according to your works.

So don't run that race to obtain salvation, unless you wind up denying Him as your Savior because you are saved, but run that race by faith in Him as our Good shepherd to obtain the eternal glory that comes with our salvation of being received as that vessel unto honor in His House to attend the Marriage Supper in Heaven held in His honor since no flesh shall glory in His Presence by their works.

1 Corinthians 3:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;15 Lest any should say that I had baptized in mine own name.16 And I baptized also the household of Stephanas: besides, I know not whether I baptized any other.17 For Christ sent me not to baptize, but to preach the gospel: not with wisdom of words, lest the cross of Christ should be made of none effect. 18 For the preaching of the cross is to them that perish foolishness; but unto us which are saved it is the power of God..........26 For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:........ 29 That no flesh should glory in his presence. 30 But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption: 31 That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

Works are good and profitable unto men when we apply our faith in Him to finish His work in us to His glory for that is how we shall receive the crowns, but if we don't look to Him to accomplish that alone resting in Him all His promises to us, but to ourselves as to our religious flesh to save ourselves, then it is not of faith in Him, but religious works voids that faith in Him as our Savior when we are saved. Only as saved believers, can we have hope to run that race by faith in Jesus Christ for the high prize of our calling in living that reconciled relationship with God thru Jesus Christ as a vessel unto honor in His House.