Scripture with Scripture

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Essential Doctrines?


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amadeus

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I am 73. I have had a stroke, one knee replaced, lost the tip of one thumb, and they tell me I will be effectively blind in about two years. (My computer is set to a "ZOOM" of 150% for everything.)

But, my wife and I both hit the "Y" three times a week. They have classes there that really help.
We tried joining an exercise place for a while, but the monthly fee was a bit too much to handle on our fixed income so we stopped it some time ago. We still try to walk regularly but the heat is too much for us to walk long during the summer.

For many years my wife suffered terribly from chronic asthma which frequently was complicated by other problems as a result of the steroids she took for 20 years to control the asthma. The steroids destroyed her immune system. Every winter she was hospitalized not less than twice for pneumonia or bronchitus but finally at 67 she is stabilizing [artificial immunity treatments weekly] and able to go places with me other than medical facilities. She's been off the steroids for a couple of years now.


I cannot complain much for myself compared to you or my wife. I have my problems, but compared to so many others I am blessed.

Several weeks ago we lost a dear widowed sister in the Lord here who had been legally blind since we met her about 5 years ago. Her vision problem was degenerative I guess like yours. We tried to help her with a special stand to hold her super large print Bible in place so she could read. She had special lamp with a large magnifying glass to enlarge it even further, but for the last couple of years before death she was unable to read at all. She watched no television as she could not see it and couldn't operate the controls to even listen.

We suggested a recorded Bible she could listen to... but dementia and loss of hearing were setting in. She could never remember how to operate the player for the Bible CDs or to adjust the volume... She did not usually complain but once in while she would let it be known she was really ready to go... She was a people person but she was losing her ability to connect.


We would visit with her periodically and she loved it as we usually talk about the Lord and pray with her.

She was a wonderful lady but that is all finished now. She was 93 when she passed on.

I am sorry to hear about your eyesight. Hopefully you will be able to adjust as it gets more severe. We will be keeping you in prayer.
 
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Harvest 1874

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Non-Catholics can agree on this but *Holy Tradition* frequently trumps Scripture for Catholics.

One would hope so, but frequently Scriptures are not provided to back up what is being said.

This could become quite extensive, but the key doctrine is the Doctrine of Christ: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God [Theos] was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory. (1 Tim 3:16 KJB).

There are quite a few here who cannot believe that Jesus is God. And without that fundamental belief, all else falls apart. In fact, the apostle John tells us that the way to distinguish between the spirit of truth and the spirit of error (also called the spirit of antichrist) is this litmus test -- "Has Jesus Christ come in the flesh?" which translates into "Did God the Word become Man as Jesus of Nazareth?" (John 1:1).

The Trinity is a fundamental doctrine (error) of orthodoxy, and those of us who don’t share this doctrine are accused of all manner of heresy.

First of all we do believe in the divinity of Christ despite what our accusers say, that is that following his sacrifice on the cross and subsequent resurrection he was highly exalted to the divine nature the same nature or divinity as that possessed by the Father.

We also believe that our Lord was prior to his becoming flesh (Theos) a god or mighty one, and that even now he is Theos a god or mighty one, but we don’t believe nor have we ever believed that he is Ho Theos, THE mighty one, the Almighty Himself.

As for your statement that 1 John 4:3 is a litmus test, that indeed it is, however it does not translate as you suggest, but to the contrary it wholly contradicts the doctrine of the Trinity altogether.

By this test all so-called “Orthodox” doctrines are condemned because none believe that our Lord literally came in the flesh, preferring to believe that the Lord whom they claim is also the Father Jehovah God, that he merely pretended to die on the cross, as he is immortal and cannot die, this would have been a ruse or deception, a lie which is impossible for God.

Therefore, “Whoever transgresses (commits willful sin) and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ (most importantly the doctrine of the ransom) does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son (two distinct individuals). If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine (does not believe that Christ was made flesh for the purpose of becoming our ransom), do not receive him into your house nor greet him.” 3 John 9, 10

It is not our wish to get into a debate with any on the Trinity here as that is not specifically what this thread is about, there are plenty of threads arguing the Trinity on this forum for that particular discussion, one which we have found to be a waste of consecrated time, seeing as most are adamantly convinced of their position and are not likely to concede they may be in error.
 

epostle

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***

Many claim that it was their organization that gave us the Bible. But I disagree. The Holy Spirit gave us the Bible. To think that God could not give us His words is saying that God does not exist or is powerless to control the things of this world.
We know the Holy Spirit gave us the Bible. What you are saying is the Holy Spirit had no need of people to discern authentic inspired books from the fake books (Gospel of Thomas, Epistle of Barnabas etc.), or write them in the first place, the complicated process of canonizing the books never happened, all because God is powerless to superintend people to compile and canonize His written word??? I don't think so.
The Catholic Church has nothing against you, Richard.
.+..
In 397 AD, the Catholic Church gave a definitive decision as to which writings and books should be admitted into the Bible and which should be rejected, and every book which is in the Protestant New Testament today, was put there by Pope Siricus and the Catholic Bishops in the year 397 AD.

Summary: Athanasius first lists our present 27 New Testament books as such in 367. Disputes still persist concerning several books, almost right up until 397, when the Canon is authoritatively closed.
The Bible is a fruit of the Church, a church is not the fruit of the bible. It is a historical fact that the Bible came from the Catholic Church, but the Church does not claim to own the truths within it.
 

Willie T

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We tried joining an exercise place for a while, but the monthly fee was a bit too much to handle on our fixed income so we stopped it some time ago. We still try to walk regularly but the heat is too much for us to walk long during the summer.

For many years my wife suffered terribly from chronic asthma which frequently was complicated by other problems as a result of the steroids she took for 20 years to control the asthma. The steroids destroyed her immune system. Every winter she was hospitalized not less than twice for pneumonia or bronchitus but finally at 67 she is stabilizing [artificial immunity treatments weekly] and able to go places with me other than medical facilities. She's been off the steroids for a couple of years now.


I cannot complain much for myself compared to you or my wife. I have my problems, but compared to so many others I am blessed.

Several weeks ago we lost a dear widowed sister in the Lord here who had been legally blind since we met her about 5 years ago. Her vision problem was degenerative I guess like yours. We tried to help her with a special stand to hold her super large print Bible in place so she could read. She had special lamp with a large magnifying glass to enlarge it even further, but for the last couple of years before death she was unable to read at all. She watched no television as she could not see it and couldn't operate the controls to even listen.

We suggested a recorded Bible she could listen to... but dementia and loss of hearing were setting in. She could never remember how to operate the player for the Bible CDs or to adjust the volume... She did not usually complain but once in while she would let it be known she was really ready to go... She was a people person but she was losing her ability to connect.


We would visit with her periodically and she loved it as we usually talk about the Lord and pray with her.

She was a wonderful lady but that is all finished now. She was 93 when she passed on.

I am sorry to hear about your eyesight. Hopefully you will be able to adjust as it gets more severe. We will be keeping you in prayer.
Have you looked into any of the insurances that offer FREE Silver Sneakers membership?
 

amadeus

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Have you looked into any of the insurances that offer FREE Silver Sneakers membership?
By insurance you mean what? We have Medicare as well as my federal retirement Health insurance which for health care is better than anything we could get anywhere else. I have not heard the term "Silver Sneakers" before. If I talked to some of the multitude of people calling all of the time maybe they would have mentioned it, but there are too many of them to sift through.
 
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Willie T

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By insurance you mean what? We have Medicare as well as my federal retirement Health insurance which for health care is better than anything we could get anywhere else. I have not heard the term "Silver Sneakers" before. If I talked to multitude of people maybe they would have mentioned it, but there are too many of them to sift through.
If you have "Tri-Care", I am pretty sure you already have it. Check with your agent, and jump on that fantastic deal if you can.
 

zipzaddle

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How often do we base out theology on just a few verses...
1.) Can we agree that the Scriptures take precedence over our own personal opinions or traditions?
2.) Do we search the Scriptures diligently to support our beliefs?
3.) What are the basic doctrines of the Bible that you must hold to in order to be a Christian, according to the Scriptures?

Holy Spirit is the truth.
1Co 12:3 ... that no person can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Spirit.
The others being false.
1Co 12:2 ... carried away unto these dumb idols (imaginations), as you were led (to believe).

A personal decision to learn the truth. If there is enough desire to learn the truth then the Truth will be found. If a person understands the soul lives on after the body dies and at present [now] is yearning for the Truth they will find the Holy Place. But meanwhile they have many places to look, much to try and hopefully one day they find The Truth.

Is there anybody that knows the truth completely? Seems all of us are working to complete ourselves to be perfect as our Father in heaven is. The distractions of the world hinder. The more distraction the more incoherent the church becomes. Study to show "yourself" approved. The church is second and will never agree fully until Jesus comes back.

I believe it is the obstacles such as this that mature a Christian. For me it is not "how can I change it", but "how do I have peace with it" and "what do I need to learn to have that peace".

The false doctrine can be frustrating and gets worse as time goes on. But Jesus said he wants to do the weeding so I let him do the job. One job I don't have to do, yeah. For me it just becomes a distraction that takes time away from more important things.
 
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amadeus

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Jun2u

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I have not heard the term "Silver Sneakers" before.

I have no knowledge about Medicare but under HMO, Silver Sneakers can also be found under HealthCarePartners, and can be reached at HealthCarePartners.com.
 
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amadeus

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I have no knowledge about Medicare but under HMO, Silver Sneakers can also be found under HealthCarePartners, and can be reached at HealthCarePartners.com.
Thanks! I found a toll free number for my federal supplement to ask about fitness program discounts. Unfortunately the information I need must come from a person and on the weekend, only the computer is talking.
 
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Enoch111

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We also believe that our Lord was prior to his becoming flesh (Theos) a god or mighty one, and that even now he is Theos a god or mighty one, but we don’t believe nor have we ever believed that he is Ho Theos, THE mighty one, the Almighty Himself.
Do you see the error of calling Jesus " a god"? There are no other true gods, Satan is the "god" of this world, but he is in fact the Adversary of God, hence a false god, and all the other false gods of the heathen are demons (devils).

So you can either believe that Jesus is indeed God (Theos), with the Father and the Holy Spirit, or you can reject His deity (which you evidently do).

The reason the one true God is called Elohim ( plural) is because of the triune Godhead. And we see this already in Genesis 1:26:And God (Elohim) said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

If there was only one divine Person, this would make absolutely no sense. But there is a whole host of Scriptures to support this.
 
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Mjh29

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Do you see the error of calling Jesus " a god"? There are no other true gods, Satan is the "god" of this world, but he is in fact the Adversary of God, hence a false god, and all the other false gods of the heathen are demons (devils).

So you can either believe that Jesus is indeed God (Theos), with the Father and the Holy Spirit, or you can reject His deity (which you evidently do).

The reason the one true God is called Elohim ( plural) is because of the triune Godhead. And we see this already in Genesis 1:26:And God (Elohim) said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.

If there was only one divine Person, this would make absolutely no sense. But there is a whole host of Scriptures to support this.

Within the Holy Trinity, each person is completely separate, yet not separate gods. They all partake in the essence that makes up god, and are all one God, yet each is a distinct personality withing the essence. Trinity-Is-IsNot.jpg
 
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Reggie Belafonte

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The Trinity is a fundamental doctrine (error) of orthodoxy, and those of us who don’t share this doctrine are accused of all manner of heresy.

First of all we do believe in the divinity of Christ despite what our accusers say, that is that following his sacrifice on the cross and subsequent resurrection he was highly exalted to the divine nature the same nature or divinity as that possessed by the Father.

We also believe that our Lord was prior to his becoming flesh (Theos) a god or mighty one, and that even now he is Theos a god or mighty one, but we don’t believe nor have we ever believed that he is Ho Theos, THE mighty one, the Almighty Himself.

As for your statement that 1 John 4:3 is a litmus test, that indeed it is, however it does not translate as you suggest, but to the contrary it wholly contradicts the doctrine of the Trinity altogether.

By this test all so-called “Orthodox” doctrines are condemned because none believe that our Lord literally came in the flesh, preferring to believe that the Lord whom they claim is also the Father Jehovah God, that he merely pretended to die on the cross, as he is immortal and cannot die, this would have been a ruse or deception, a lie which is impossible for God.

Therefore, “Whoever transgresses (commits willful sin) and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ (most importantly the doctrine of the ransom) does not have God. He who abides in the doctrine of Christ has both the Father and the Son (two distinct individuals). If anyone comes to you and does not bring this doctrine (does not believe that Christ was made flesh for the purpose of becoming our ransom), do not receive him into your house nor greet him.” 3 John 9, 10

It is not our wish to get into a debate with any on the Trinity here as that is not specifically what this thread is about, there are plenty of threads arguing the Trinity on this forum for that particular discussion, one which we have found to be a waste of consecrated time, seeing as most are adamantly convinced of their position and are not likely to concede they may be in error.
Jesus is not the Father, he is the only begotten Son and no one comes to the Father but through the Son, so the Holy Spirit is that that we pick up as to who Christ Jesus truly is Emmanuel 'God with us' because that who Jesus is, he came down for us.

Now no one can know the Father, but through his begotten Son who with the Holy Spirit can be enlightened to see God the Father. so anyone who claims to not to acknowledge Jesus as our God is of Satan and that's clear.

So no one can fathom God the Father but through his only begotten Son.

Jesus showed us and he is the Light for Man, he is our Sheppard and we are his Sheep, so if we turn from him the wolfs will devour us, many in Christianity now do not look to Jesus at all truly, they are on about social gospel, they are only on about there church and just mans works and stupid man mad doctrines, such do not follow Christ Jesus at all, they are like the Golden Calf mob who had the Government as there God, who will provide for them and lead them, just like the People who played there games so as to kill Jesus Christ. because they did not want him, they have not the Holy Spirit in them and just as Saul did not have the Holy Spirit until he became Paul.

All people are blind to Christ Jesus who are not Born Again, water Baptised do not know who Jesus Christ truly is, because they have not the Holy Spirit, they only have some faith and that can be as is said about the seeds and sower, so such can loose there faith because they never truly was total faith that can move mountains, so they look outside of Jesus for there faith and embrace man made filth like Socialism and such pathetic rubbish that has noting to do with Jesus Christ at all.
Socialism is just like the works of the Golden Calf mob, where the government is above you, not God, the works of Socialism is not under Grace at all, they may claim to bringing in the Kingdom but they do not want God in it and that's clear to see. free for all Capitalism is Satanic as well.
But Satan the one who leads astray the whole world works to bastardise Capitalism giving such power to evil people who only use it to serve madness and the Socialist works to play silly buggers as well, so that your eyes are always averted to the reality's and then we get disunity and that's how Satan works to dived and conquer, turning Nations upside down.
Two of the biggest workers of Satan are the extreme Right wing and the extreme left wing, fact is they are both mates that work only to mislead the majority with all their game plays, billions of your tax money goes into fooling you with there game plays.

Without the Truth of the Trinity you only have Satan at your door and anyone who slanders that Trinity is of Satan or a fool.
The 3 are all one in the same but of different identity's.

I have seen some make claims of what the trinity is like JW it was pathetic and totally stupid nonsense that was like a 4yo may believe, I was like you have to be joking that's straight out slander, Devil you ! no Christian Church claims such rubbish as that at all.
 

bbyrd009

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A yes or no question: Is there a God?
There cannot be a maybe to this.
so you say, but then you cannot ezackly prove your position there, can you. actually that is not even true to a point now, imo God can be proven, but let's nevermind that part for now bc you do not know the proof anyway prolly. There is a "maybe" to that right now, for practical purposes iow, and there would remain one anyway if i am looking for say an Old Man in a White Beard with a Crown and a Gown and God felt like channelling a Flower Pot right then, right? Someone could say "God is, for sure, no kidding, in the next room right now" and i would walk in and see a flower pot and go "nuh uh" right.

So, the arrow in this vid might be considered Absolute Truth, but i guess it works for God too prolly, although i always considered the archer for that role. We are the moose of course, although that is prolly not very complimentary to the moose :D
our vignette culminates @ 1:45
and previous comments lead me to assume that i need to state that the moose does not see the hunter nor the arrow,
and that the hunter is not hunting meese that day
 

bbyrd009

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Even so! Of the many pastors I have had over the years, looking back there is only one that I am certain was called by God as a minister and he missed a lot of steps. The ones who never had the calling they took are another thing altogether. I am glad that I don't have to judge them. God has led me on, but the pain and damage done to many who submitted themselves sincerely would a heavy burden if they ever understood that it was theirs to carry.
ha i guess that seems true and right, huh. but the pain and damage are also the best teachers i guess, prolly for the teachers too, when their turn comes for pain and damage?
 

bbyrd009

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By insurance you mean what? We have Medicare as well as my federal retirement Health insurance which for health care is better than anything we could get anywhere else. I have not heard the term "Silver Sneakers" before. If I talked to some of the multitude of people calling all of the time maybe they would have mentioned it, but there are too many of them to sift through.
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=senior+yoga
https://www.google.com/search?q=sen...ome..69i57.10643j1j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8
learn a routine, put on your Barnum hat and go give classes like a boss! :D
or give it away and get put in grateful ppls wills lol, your choice.
i say it like this bc you will not be able to give this away for free
at least in my experience
 

amadeus

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ha i guess that seems true and right, huh. but the pain and damage are also the best teachers i guess, prolly for the teachers too, when their turn comes for pain and damage?
Yes, perhaps it would be best for us if we prayed that God grant us a little more pain and damage so as to be taught the better, eh...?
Not so easy to pray such a prayer. Then people will ask me why I pray often in an unknown tongue.
 
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