Spotting Heretics

[Ferris Bueller]

I sincerely hope that the sum of all believers in your congregation teach your sheep what a SIN is. I also sincerely hope that when one of those sheep violates that teaching of Scripture, which is also the teaching of your congregation, that you will tell them that they have SINNED and treat them as a pagan or tax collector if they don't STOP sinning.......Just like Scripture says. I also hope whey you put it up to a vote and you 99% you have judged that the person has sinned that you treat the 1% as pagan/tax collectors also since they don't think it's a sin and ALSO disagree with your 'sum of all believers'.

Well, once again you demonstrate that you either have very low reading comprehension skills, or, you're fashioning my argument incorrectly in order to demean it. I'm going with the latter, lol. At this point I can't take you seriously anymore. I know it's impossible to argue with a narcissist with all their deceitful little ways they use to insure they stay right and superior in everyone's eyes, but it sure is fun to do on-line! I admit, I like taking narcissists to task on-line, lol. It's fun to watch them squirm.

 

[Philip James]

If we did not have that sin in our own life we would be inclined to overlook it; it wouldn't bother us.

Hello heartwashed,

Are you saying that I have been horrified and disgusted by the open display of unrighteousness that is a 'pride' parade, that means I am guilty of what they do?

That makes no sense to me ...

Pax et Bonum

 

[heartwashed]

Matthew 7:1-5, Luke 6:41-42

I believe that I have taken the beam out of my own eye and am therefore able to see clearly to take the speck out of yours.

Now, you were the one telling me to "judge righteous judgment"; and when I did, you brought back into the fray verses that I originally gave to you to ponder.

So, which one is it? Should we judge, or should we not judge?

Hello heartwashed,

Are you saying that I have been horrified and disgusted by the open display of unrighteousness that is a 'pride' parade, that means I am guilty of what they do?

That makes no sense to me ...

Pax et Bonum

It is a general principle that does not apply in every case.

In the instance of a "pride parade" you may be disgusted with them because, maybe, (heterosexual) lust is an issue in your own life and you revile against the "gay pride" because it is a deeper and more sinful version of what you allow in yourself and you see yourself crossing the line over into that if not for the grace of God.

 

[Marymog]

I believe that I have taken the beam out of my own eye and am therefore able to see clearly to take the speck out of yours.

Now, you were the one telling me to "judge righteous judgment"; and when I did, you brought back into the fray verses that I originally gave to you to ponder.

So, which one is it? Should we judge, or should we not judge?

I apologize heartwashed. I didn't know you had taken the beam out of your eye when you appeared to me you were judging me on what you thought was a pride filled post of mine. You are a righteous person.

Yes, we can judge. SHOULD we judge? I guess it depends on the situation.

Did you have the right or should you have interjected yourself into a conversation between myself and someone else to suggest that I was being judgmental and that my perceived judgment would be 'three times as evident on my own face'? No, you shouldn't have interjected yourself with your opinion. I do not think it was the right thing to do. But at least you are righteous some of the time!

 

[Marymog]

Well, once again you demonstrate that you either have very low reading comprehension skills, or, you're fashioning my argument incorrectly in order to demean it. I'm going with the latter, lol. At this point I can't take you seriously anymore. I know it's impossible to argue with a narcissist with all their deceitful little ways they use to insure they stay right and superior in everyone's eyes, but it sure is fun to do on-line! I admit, I like taking narcissists to task on-line, lol. It's fun to watch them squirm.

Hey Ferris.....Show me where I have gone wrong in my summary of what you believe, and I will concede AND apologize to you.

Here is what I believe you are saying: When my brother sins against me we are to you go to the congregation at our church and take the matter before the sum total of believers in the congregation. After the sum total of all believers have made their decision that my brother has sinned against me and if they still do not acknowledge their offending behavior (Scripture says SIN, not offending behavior) he is to be treated by the church as a pagan or tax collector. You do not believe that when one is treated as a pagan or tax collector that they are excommunicated, or kicked out, of that church congregation.

Where have I "fashioned your argument incorrectly"??????????? I know I have CORRECTLY pointed out that Scripture says SIN and not offending behavior. Soooooooooo where have I gotten it wrong? Am I not understanding your 'sum total of all believers' theory? When you say 'sum total of all believers' that TO ME sounds like you put it to a vote of all the members of your congregation and the majority rules. Am I wrong about THAT? Is that where I am 'fashioning your argument incorrectly'?

Mary

 

[Marymog]

Good grief, you'll do anything to be right, lol!

Lol....if pointing out that what you have written is not what Scripture says is doing anything to be right......then YES, I will do anything to be right kiddo.

 

[Johann]

Hey Ferris.....Show me where I have gone wrong in my summary of what you believe, and I will concede AND apologize to you.

Here is what I believe you are saying: When my brother sins against me we are to you go to the congregation at our church and take the matter before the sum total of believers in the congregation. After the sum total of all believers have made their decision that my brother has sinned against me and if they still do not acknowledge their offending behavior (Scripture says SIN, not offending behavior) he is to be treated by the church as a pagan or tax collector. You do not believe that when one is treated as a pagan or tax collector that they are excommunicated, or kicked out, of that church congregation.

Where have I "fashioned your argument incorrectly"??????????? I know I have CORRECTLY pointed out that Scripture says SIN and not offending behavior. Soooooooooo where have I gotten it wrong? Am I not understanding your 'sum total of all believers' theory? When you say 'sum total of all believers' that TO ME sounds like you put it to a vote of all the members of your congregation and the majority rules. Am I wrong about THAT? Is that where I am 'fashioning your argument incorrectly'?

Mary

αμαρτησει
G264
V-FAI-3S
ἁμαρτάνω
to miss the mark


Part of Speech: Verb
Tense: Future
Voice: Active
Mood: Indicative
Person: third [he/she/it]
Number: Singular


until seven times? Which was, as he might think, a large number; and especially, since it was double the number of times, that the Jewish doctors set for forgiveness: for thus they say (d),
"A man that commits a sin, the "first" time they pardon him; the "second" time they pardon him; the "third" time they pardon him: the "fourth" time they do not pardon, according to Amo_2:6.''
Again,
"he that says I have sinned, and I repent, they forgive him "unto three times", and no more (e).''
(d) T. Bab. Yoma, fol. 36. 2. Mainion. Hilch. Teshuba. c. 3. sect. 5. (e) Abot. R. Nathan, c. 40. fol. 9. 3.

I would say offensive behavior is a sign of immaturity or not being saved at all.
Shalom
J.

 

[Johann]

Well, once again you demonstrate that you either have very low reading comprehension skills, or, you're fashioning my argument incorrectly in order to demean it. I'm going with the latter, lol. At this point I can't take you seriously anymore. I know it's impossible to argue with a narcissist with all their deceitful little ways they use to insure they stay right and superior in everyone's eyes, but it sure is fun to do on-line! I admit, I like taking narcissists to task on-line, lol. It's fun to watch them squirm.

Fun to watch "them" squirming?
Are you not squirming for posting this on-line?

J.

 

[Marymog]

Leaders in the church (the body of Christ) are administrators and teachers.

Ok....So the leaders in your church are "administrators and teachers". That is helpful and I appreciate it.

So, in regard to our discussion, when a brother sins against you and you take that sin (what you call offending behavior) to what you call the sum total of all believers in the church you are attending; what role do the "teachers" have in making the final decision if the person should be treated as a pagan or tax collector? Does their vote count the same as the administrators vote? The member who found Christ 1 year ago and just joined the congregation 9 months ago; his vote counts the same as the teacher and administrators vote? How does the pagan/tax collector decision process work in your church?

Respectfully asking, Mary

 

[Michiah-Imla]

@Marymog

Are you a woman?

If so, what does the Bible say about your place regarding teaching men?

Are Catholic women encouraged to obey those ordinances?

 

[Marymog]

@Marymog

Are you a woman?

If so, what does the Bible say about your place regarding teaching men?

Are Catholic women encouraged to obey those ordinances?

Hello Michiah,

First off you seemed to be pre-disposed as to think that there are "ordinances" from the bible that a woman should be following of which you think I am not following, or I have violated. Would you care to list those "ordinances" so that we can discuss each one of them individually?

I see myself as Priscilla from the NT. You look upon me as lower than her. Do you know who she was?

Bible Study Mary

 

[Michiah-Imla]

I see myself as Priscilla from the NT.

Very well.

Priscilla was married.

She didn’t do any teaching or had authority over a man.

The only time we see Priscilla correcting a man is under this circumstance:

When someone was preaching an incomplete gospel (Acts of the Apostles 18:26). And that is done while under the authority of her husband in his presence face to face, not by letters.

She was also a helper of an Apostle in her husband’s presence (Romans 16:3).

As far as I can tell @Ferris Bueller is not preaching an incomplete gospel here. And I wonder if your husband is actually monitoring and approving your postings here. So you have no biblical authority to challenge him here.

And your behavior here is not an example of being a “helper” of an Apostle. This kind of work is done offline under your husband’s supervision. Not on an internet chat board/forum.

 

[Michiah-Imla]

Would you care to list those "ordinances"

“Bible Study Mary” I am confident that you know those ordinances and have already “studied” a way around them…

 

[Marymog]

“Bible Study Mary” I am confident that you know those ordinances and have already “studied” a way around them…

Hiy Michiah,

You can assume I know the same ordinances that you know, and you can assume that I have studied my way around them...but you don't KNOW that. So let's stop assuming things and stick with facts.

2nd chance: Are you Michiah-Imla, a confident man of Scripture, going to take the opportunity to teach a woman?

Patient Mary

 

[Michiah-Imla]

you don't KNOW that

I do know.

“Bible Study Mary”

Unless you are a liar and aren’t “Bible Study Mary”…

What Bible is missing the ordinances for the woman?

 

[Marymog]

Very well.

Priscilla was married.

She didn’t do any teaching or had authority over a man.

The only time we see Priscilla correcting a man is under this circumstance:

When someone was preaching an incomplete gospel (Acts of the Apostles 18:26). And that is done while under the authority of her husband in his presence face to face, not by letters.

She was also a helper of an Apostle in her husband’s presence (Romans 16:3).

As far as I can tell @Ferris Bueller is not preaching an incomplete gospel here. And I wonder if your husband is actually monitoring and approving your postings here. So you have no biblical authority to challenge him here.

And your behavior here is not an example of being a “helper” of an Apostle. This kind of work is done offline under your husband’s supervision. Not on an internet chat board/forum.

Thanks for your opinion Michiah.

I will continue to be like Priscialla who explained to a man the way of God more accurately. Or Junia was of note among the apostles! Or like a daughter of Philip who was a prophet. I will be like Euodia and Syntyche who have contended for the gospel at the side of Paul, along with Clement of Rome and the rest of Paul's coworkers whose names are in the book of life. I will be like Phoebe, who was a servant of the church in Cenchreae in a manner worthy of the saints. She was a benefactor to Paul and many others.

You have read about those women in Scripture? Have you not?

If I do anything that those women didn't do that is a violation of Scripture.....let me know. Because repeating Scripture and repeating the teachings of The Church is not me teaching another man! It is simply repeating!

Otherwise, keep your opinions to yourself kiddo.

 

[Marymog]

I do know.

“Bible Study Mary”

Unless you are a liar and aren’t “Bible Study Mary”…

What Bible is missing the ordinances for the woman?

3rd chance Michiah: Are you Michiah-Imla, a confident man of Scripture, going to take the opportunity to teach a woman?

 

[Michiah-Imla]

@Marymog

You behave more like this type of woman…

“Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants…” (Revelation 2:20)

And you give occasion to the enemy to blaspheme God’s word by being actively disobedient to it.

So @Marymog

“…be discreet, chaste, keepers at home, good, obedient to their own husbands, that the word of God be not blasphemed.” (Titus 2:5)

Because disobedient woman are like this:

“And withal they learn to be idle, wandering about from house to house; and not only idle, but tattlers also and busybodies, speaking things which they ought not. …For some are already turned aside after Satan.” (1 Timothy 5:13-15)

 

[Marymog]

@Marymog

You behave more like this type of woman…

“Notwithstanding I have a few things against thee, because thou sufferest that woman Jezebel, which calleth herself a prophetess, to teach and to seduce my servants…” (Revelation 2:20)

And you give occasion to the enemy to blaspheme God’s word by being actively disobedient to it.

“And withal they learn to be idle, wandering about from house to house; and not only idle, but tattlers also and busybodies, speaking things which they ought not. …For some are already turned aside after Satan.” (1 Timothy 5:13-15)

Well, I gave you 3 chances to take the opportunity to teach a woman. Strike three....Your out! You failed.

So now I will be like Priscilla, Junia, Euodia, Syntyche and Phoebe! Since we are not in church, there is no violation of Scripture here (1 Corinthians 14:34). Since I have been permitted to do what I am doing, there is no violation of Scripture here (Colossians 3:18).

Your men have taught you that a women can not to teach a man. According to scripture, that is a false teaching by your men. Your men taught you wrong!

If you were taught properly OR just took the time to read the passage you quoted, you would see that Jezebel, not the men of the church, called herself a prophet. That is why she was accused of seducing! If the men of the church considered her a prophet, she would not have been accused of seducing.

So, it appears YOU are actively being disobedient to what Scripture says by falsely claiming to know what Scripture says. In Scripture a person like you is called a false prophet.

Thank you for your opinion. As for me, my household and my church, we will continue to serve the Lord and adhere to Scripture. I do not serve you and adhere to your opinions.

Respectfully,

Mary, Priscilla, Junia, Euodia, Syntyche and Phoebe!

 

[Michiah-Imla]

@Marymog

Christ nor any of the Apostles appointed any women for public preaching.

None!

You take one occasion in scripture that isn’t doctrinal to go beyond your doctrinal role as a Christian woman.

Your high handed behavior here is abominable.

Stop equating yourself with woman in the Bible, you are far removed from them in conduct.