"He that believeth not is condemned already" is indeed a quote from John 3.
"That Wicked" has problems!
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God IS impartial when it comes to salvation--yes--He is NOT a "respecter of persons" in that sense (in the ancient world, unrighteous judges were said to be "respecter(s) of persons" -- i.e. they showed partiality to those who were wealthy or politically well-connected). God accepts ALL who approach His Son in repentance and faith (I have already said this a number of times)--rich or poor (apparently the poor have an advantage when it comes to salvation), old or young, slave or free, man or woman, etc. But that does not stop Him from favoring certain groups of people--such as the Church/Bride of Christ, and true Israel. The Bible even tells us that God favors the martyrs for Christ. How are you able to instruct Him on who He favors?
The Bible does not say that. What of those martyred during the Great Tribulation? John saw them in heaven, and the angel accompanying John very clearly said that they were those martyrs who came out of the Great Tribulation. It appears that they will be honored in heaven and even after because it says that they will come to life and will rule with Christ.
The First Resurrection began with the resurrection of Christ (He is the "first fruit" of the harvest of the righteous--the "firstborn of many brethren"). That resurrection will continue until the time of the Second Resurrection. That is why the Bible tells us, in Revelation 20:6--> "Blessed and holy are those who share in the First Resurrection. For them, the Second Death holds no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ and will reign with Him a thousand years."
True.
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You asked me a question, but I can see by your replies that you are not ready to hear what I have to say, but instead spend your time showing
me, how dirty the water is, that you have.
VictoryinJesus
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Not speaking of the religious but of this World and those of it that love it. “They have their reward.” “Reward” Given of who freely and already? God causes it to rain on the righteous and the wicked. The New man born of God waits for His reward which Christ says is with Him. Again if “There shall be a falling away from faith” and the MoB is not already in this world then none have gotten victory over the mark as by your estimation the MoB is yet future. By your estimation how do fit in Revelation 20:4
[4] And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Then He returns in a flaming Fire? You say they reject the mark of the beast or take it by spending this allotted free government income then His return comes in a flaming Fire. And laugh at those who believe in a thousand year reign on earth at His return but fail to see there is no Reign of Christ in what you propose because there is no Mark or falling away yet. So where is the Reign of Christ? Where does He rule and in what Heart? “They have their reward” fits with seeking of vanity and corruption rather than Him. Paul said Mark them that go with the world.
What Great Tribulation??
Do you mean "THE" Great Tribulation, conjured up by the many "religious" false prophets?
Or do you mean "these are they that came out of great tribulation"? Rev. 7:14
Which of the above puts NO time frame of when
"great tribulation" shall take place in a person's life?
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OK, since you agree with that! Please explain to me who will be SAVED during "THE" Millennium, and what the purpose for "THE" Millennium is.
VictoryinJesus
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2 Timothy 4:10-11
[10] For Demas hath forsaken me, having loved this present world, and is departed unto Thessalonica; Crescens to Galatia, Titus unto Dalmatia. [11] Only Luke is with me. Take Mark, and bring him with thee: for he is profitable (in Spirit)to me for the ministry.
They returned to the world, many of them. It was already happening. If it is not already happening...the falling away then I must be deceived then.
Thank you for responding. Hopefully no hard feelings in it saddens me that we disagree here. But I am still appreciative of your post and insight and will continue to always read them.
I checked the Greek text on 7:14 and "the" (tes) is definitely used in the original.
Those mortals who are "blameless" before God's law will be saved during the Millennium, in a return to the strict observance of and adherence to the law of God--including worship at the Temple (they will also have the additional requirement of faith in the Messiah, of course). Even the Gentile nations will come to Jerusalem bearing gifts and receiving blessings at the Millennial Temple--"a house of prayer for all nations". Those who are left ("the survivors") in the Gentile nations will be required to attend the Feast of Tabernacles once a year. If they do not, no rain will fall on their land (Zechariah 14:16-17). Israelites were and will be required to "go up to Jerusalem" (i.e. to celebrate at the Temple) three times a year--Passover (Pesach), Pentecost (Shavuot) and Tabernacles (Sukkot). That is the meaning of Christ "ruling with a rod of iron"--that God's law will be strictly enforced and lawbreakers alone ("sinners" or "cursed"--see Isaiah 65:20) will die as young as 100. In Isaiah 65:22, God says, "In the future, my people will live as long as trees." All of this indicates that the pre-Flood, long life will return. Death will occur--but much less frequently--the prophet Isaiah said, in the same passage, that no longer will infants die when only a few days old. Those who are blameless before the law and who come to the Messiah in the faith that His Blood covers their remaining sin, will be resurrected to life, should they die during the Millennium. (That's actually the way the OT saints like Abraham, Isaac and Jacob were saved).
The reasons for the Millennium:
One extremely vital reason for the Millennial Kingdom is to fulfill God’s so-far-unfulfilled promises to Israel. All unconditional promises God has made with Abraham and Israel will come to fruition during the Millennial Kingdom. It is unthinkable that God would allow His promises to go without being fulfilled--prophecy would be overturned. For example, the Land He promised Abraham extended from the "River of Egypt" on the west to the Euphrates River on the east. But Israel has NEVER occupied all the land God promised Israel, even at the peak of Joshua’s conquest or Solomon’s rule. In the future, Israel will occupy those lands--Ezekiel outlines all of that in great detail, in the latter chapters of his Book.
Another reason for the Millennial Kingdom is to silence God's critics by giving mortal men ideal conditions (and even with Satan bound), with Christ Himself governing the earth with a "rod of iron." It will prove that the unregenerate nature of mortal man will always leave him susceptible to deception, ingratitude and rank rebellion. Rebelliousness will apparently grow throughout the Millennium, as new generations are born. As soon as Satan is “let out of jail,” he is able to lead one last rebellion against God and Christ. And then fire comes down from heaven and burns up all the rebels, followed closely by the Second Resurrection to Final Judgment.
All through history there have been those who believed God and those who did not. This is not due to any circumstance--whether prosperity, health or lack of them. Some people make a decision to believe God, and some do not. The Millennial Reign of Christ will prove, for all time, that, even with health, peace, prosperity and justice over all the earth, some mortal humans will still choose to turn away from God. At the Final Judgment, no one will be able to accuse God of being unjust or to say that if circumstances had been better, faith would have been the outcome. After the Final Judgment, only those immortals who have been washed (purified) in the Blood of Jesus will be able to be citizens of the New Jerusalem. All unbelievers (those who "died in their sins") will be in either the "outer darkness" or in the Lake of Fire.
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I did not find the word "THE" Great Tribulation in the
KJV_Strongs(i)
14G2532AndG2046I said[G5758] G846unto himG2962, SirG4771, thouG1492knowest[G5758] G2532. AndG2036he said[G5627] G3427to meG3778, TheseG1526are they[G5748] G2064which came[G5740] G1537out ofG3173greatG2347tribulationG2532, andG4150have washed[G5656] G846theirG4749robesG2532, andG3021madeG4749themG846 G3021white[G5656] G1722inG129the bloodG721of the Lamb
Rev. 7:14 καὶ εἴρηκα αὐτῷ κύριέ σὺ οἶδας καὶ εἶπέν μοι οὗτοί εἰσιν οἱ ἐρχόμενοι ἐκ τῆς θλίψεως τῆς μεγάλης καὶ ἔπλυναν τὰς στολὰς αὐτῶν καὶ ἐλεύκαναν στολὰς αὐτῶν ἐν τῷ αἵματι τοῦ ἀρνίου
From: Textus Receptus Greek
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Rev. 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
From: KJV
From: Textus Receptus Greek
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Rev. 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
From: KJV
Rev. 7:14 καὶ εἴρηκα αὐτῷ κύριέ σὺ οἶδας καὶ εἶπέν μοι οὗτοί εἰσιν οἱ ἐρχόμενοι ἐκ τῆς θλίψεως τῆς μεγάλης καὶ ἔπλυναν τὰς στολὰς αὐτῶν καὶ ἐλεύκαναν στολὰς αὐτῶν ἐν τῷ αἵματι τοῦ ἀρνίου
From: Textus Receptus Greek
.
Rev. 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
From: KJV
From: Textus Receptus Greek
.
Rev. 7:14 And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation, and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb.
From: KJV
Victory,
I am very hard to offend!!
My point about the clear/dirty water is, when it comes hearing the thoughts of God in HIS words, too many Christians are instead believing what their churches teach/say, and then hold it forth to others, as if it were the truth of God's thoughts.
My focus in reading God's word is strictly by Isa. 55:8-9 and John 14:23.
Do I listen to others? Yes! But when I hear the memories of "pulpits" winding up in their head, to tell me what they were taught by them, all I hear is their Religion.
LCT said I don't sound like a Methodist!
Of course I don't! Being born again of His Spirit, I don't live by that Religion or anyone else's. Can I agree with what is being preached? Yes! But not everything I hear, is of the Lord, from that pulpit. I do know when Religion is speaking and when the Lord is speaking in others.
Am I perfect and without error? Of course not! But I have learned quite alot that is True, and for that, it is His "clear water" that I try to interject, and displace the errors that are in so many "glasses".
As for "a falling away" (from faith), in that time, it will be VERY NOTICEABLE!
Jesus said this, being very concerned:
Luke 18[8] I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?
Jesus said this, being very concerned:
Luke 18[8] I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Nevertheless when the Son of man cometh, shall he find faith on the earth?
I checked the Greek text on Bible Hub. All but one of the translations (including the NASB--which is considered the most accurate Greek to English translation) said "the". I then checked the Greek text and all but the KJV had "the" (Gr. tes) Since nearly all of the Book of Revelation deals with the time of the End, it seems safe to say that the "martyrs" of Rev. 7:14 are those out of the Great Tribulation (the "time of Jacob's trouble") since their numbers are being added to and since they were beheaded. There have been actually very few Christian martyrs who have been beheaded, going back through the past 20 centuries. The most common methods of execution were to be burned at the stake (I won't go into the more gruesome ones) drowned, or starved. Compared to the other methods of how they were martyred in the past, beheading was a mercy--it was typically over quickly. So, since John mentions that the martyrs he saw had been beheaded--it was probable that it was projecting forward far into the future and that their numbers were being added to, indicate that it is the time of the End.
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In the light of modern language scholarship (which relies on many archeological discoveries of the 20th century and beyond) there is no particular benefit from the Textus Receptus or the Westcott-Hort version. Really, thinking that the "Textus Receptus" is the most authentic is just not the case. There isn't just one Textus Receptus you know. Here is an analysis from a consensus of modern language scholars. Westcott & Hort vs. Textus Receptus: Which is Superior?
Here is a pertinent excerpt:
"To this may be added the testimony of Sir Frederic G. Kenyon, the pre-eminent British authority on New Testament manuscripts at the turn of the twentieth century. In discussing the differences between the traditional and the Alexandrian text-types, in the light of God's providential preservation of His word, he writes,
'We may indeed believe that He would not allow His Word to be seriously corrupted, or any part of it essential to man's salvation to be lost or obscured; but the differences between the rival types of text is not one of doctrine. No fundamental point of doctrine rests upon a disputed reading: and the truths of Christianity are as certainly expressed in the text of Westcott and Hort as in that of Stephanus.' " (Stephanus one of the most commonly used Textus Receptus translations).
The New American Standard is probably the most conservative of the Greek to English translations and it is considered, by many, to reflect the true spirit of the New Testament and is lauded. It is always my "go-to" when I want to go deep into a passage. The NLT, on the other hand, gives the breadth of the narrative sweep that is lacking in some of the translations and I often use that as well. The NASB says, "the" great tribulation.
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VictoryinJesus
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Have to remember This is in Luke. Before faith come on the earth in deed by the outpouring of the Spirit of God. Hebrews 4:2 For unto us was the gospel preached, as well as unto them: but the word preached did not profit them, not being mixed with faith in them that heard it .
The Son of man was standing before them on earth ...Luke 19:42-44
[42] Saying, If thou hadst known, even thou, at least in this thy day, the things which belong unto thy peace! but now they are hid from thine eyes. [43] For the days shall come upon thee, that thine enemies shall cast a trench about thee, and compass thee round, and keep thee in on every side, [44] And shall lay thee even with the ground, and thy children within thee; and they shall not leave in thee one stone upon another; because thou knewest not the time of thy visitation.
Matthew 16:2-3
[2] He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. [3] And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky;(the temporal) but can ye not discern the signs of the times?
Isaiah 27:6
[6] He shall cause them that come of Jacob to take root: Israel shall blossom and bud, and fill the face of the world with fruit.
He spoke of the budding and to look for it. If there is no faith on earth...then why does He say Romans 8:21
[21] Because the creature itself also shall be delivered from the bondage of corruption into the glorious liberty of the children of God.
Isaiah 61:11
[11] For as the earth bringeth forth her bud, and as the garden causeth the things that are sown in it to spring forth; so the Lord God will cause righteousness and praise to spring forth before all the nations.
Isaiah 60:21-22
[21] Thy people also shall be all righteous: they shall inherit the land for ever, the branch of my planting, the work of my hands, that I may be glorified. [22] A little one shall become a thousand, and a small one a strong nation: I the Lord will hasten it in his time.
One small point that probably needs to be made is that when the OT prophets spoke of "forever" it just meant a very long time (such as 1,000 years, for example). It is much the same way among certain English speakers (children) who will often say things like, "Christmas is taking forever to come."
But it is also important to note that when the New Testament speaks of "immortality" that it is speaking of life unending.
VictoryinJesus
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One small point that probably needs to be made is that when the OT prophets spoke of "forever" it just meant a very long time (such as 1,000 years, for example). It is much the same way among certain English speakers (children) who will often say things like, "Christmas is taking forever to come."
Feels like forever.
Can’t forget Luke 11:2
[2] And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done, as in heaven, so in earth.
Yes--the spiritual Kingdom is already in heaven. What remains to be established is the rule of Christ over the whole earth. It is now under the control of Satan. When we put on immortality (life unending) we will be able to see all of this so much more clearly. Now, we see "as through a glass darkly".
Correct! The MoB is not in the world as of yet, but at the moment, we all are NOW participating in the design and construction of it (credit/debit cards-crypto currency- digital cash). I repeat: when the MoB is implemented, it will be NON-religious.
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Rev. 20:4
A. And I saw thrones [in Heavenly places]
As new spiritual creatures, we are made to sit in Heavenly places, in Christ Jesus. Eph. 2
[6] And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
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B. and they sat upon them,
They that sat upon the thrones, is everyone who is "born again" of His Spirit.
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C. and judgment was given unto them:
We are NOW kings and Priests of God, ambassadors in Christ's stead, and therefore we have the authority to help people to repent towards God, through Jesus for the forgiveness of sins, or allow them to retain their sins.
John 3:18- IS THAT judgment!
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D. and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus,
Speaks of the Early church.
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E. and for the word of God,
Speaks of the Middle age church.
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F. and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands;
Speaks of the End time church.
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G. and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
Speaks of the Age of God's Grace now, of which has NO length or limitation of OUR sense of time applied to it, just as it is said:
1000 years is AS one day, and one day is AS a thousand years to God.
God's understanding of "time" makes no sense to our "natural" and finite minds, because it speaks of His eternity.
The only sign that WILL be significant, that Jesus is about to return, is when there will be "a falling away" (from faith), on a Global scale. 2 Thes. 2:3; Luke 18:8; 2 Peter 3:9.
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