The Abortion question

[Stan B]

So what's the difference between King Abimelech who was going to take Abraham's sister,
and King David who took Uriah's wife?

Now God stopped King Abimelech in a dream. Why didn't God stop David?

Just thinking out loud

I like Solomon, with his 600 wives and 300 concubines. Scripture never says that in doing so, he was sinning. ??

When we all get to Heaven, I don’t envy him!

 

[BarneyFife]

At the time I was pregnant I was in the 8th grade. The school wouldn't let me return because of the "image" I may create among other young girls.
I ended up dropping out. But I later got my GED and did go to a Liberal college for 1 year. Which I had to quit because it ewas either go to school or lose my job. I kept my job.
But yeah, the stigma was with me for a couple years. Everybody looking at you and judging you.
Life goes on.

Hugs

Back in the good ol' days (for some people, right?). I'm really sorry you had to bear that, Zig.

Is it true that whatever doesn't kill you makes you stronger? (I've had to deal with some pretty awful stuff, but there's awful, and then there's awful... You know I mean.)

I suppose that's some variation on a Bible teaching. Most things are.

Back when I was a young pup working in a big union factory all of the lifers (old guys that needed to retire) would talk about the way things were 30 years ago. But they couldn't decide whether those days were good or bad. It just depended on whatever it was they wanted to gripe about - lol. If it was about how easy things were for us younger guys then times were tough back then. But if it was about what they didn't like to do or tolerate in the now then they were the good ol' days.

I got to a point that whenever "back in the day" came up, I would interrupt and holler out, "You mean back in the good ol' days, when everything sucked?" Can you believe they didn't appreciate the humor in that?

Most folks here can probably picture me doing something like that.

 

[BarneyFife]

Hi Ziggy, things happen but at least you didn’t abort the baby, that’s what counts.

Always comfort before you encourage.

 

[liafailrock]

Yeah imagine that! A book written by Jews for Jews. Does that mean the entire Bible is a piece of garbage because it has been contaminated by Jews? And wow!! And that Jesus guy was also Jewish!! Send him to Auschwitz??! Who have you found to replace Him??!

Interesting how you jump around and evade one topic and comment on something long ago. Show me in the scriptures where the breath of life begins when a baby is born? I already gave the Luke scriptures. Tell me how Elizabeth for example said the baby jumped for joy? She even called it a baby even though he was not born yet.

Now, you seem to want to use Numbers 5 and Scriptures about "bereaving them of children" to justify aborting a baby. How about you read the whole thing? Why did the woman have that drink with the Tabernacle dust? Because the husband suspected her of adultery but had no proof. If she aborted, she was adulterous. Likewise, the people bereaved of children was because of their sin. Do you notice a common denominator here? We are not aborting out of choice or convenience, but because they are all cursed. Adultery was punishable by death anyway which means the baby would have died with the stoning. The test was to see if she conceived a child in the event she was innocent it would not have been right to kill her.

But just for the record, if you want the "pro-choice" people to have this scriptural backing to allow for abortion, you can go on record as well that you think they ought to be cursed. Because that's what the Scripture says. I suspect anyone fighting this overturning would not really want to hear that.

 

[Philip James]

I don’t have a problem with government stepping in to suppress a bunch of

Freedom loving Canadians..

Attitudes like yours allow oppresive regeims to take hold as they intimidate the opposition to their quasi fascist/communist takeover at the behest of the WEF..

Keep being a lapdog for Schwab..

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

Dropship, you will hear a lot of anti-God, anti-Bible anti-abortion cult here. But Scripture does not contain a "Thou shalt not have an abortion" law. Quite the opposite. In certain instances, Scripture demands abortion.

For instance, Scriptural demand for abortion goes all the way back to the Books of the Law where an abortion drug was administered by the priest to an adultress:

"But if you have gone astray while married to your husband and you have made yourself impure by having sexual relations with a man other than your husband”— here the priest is to put the woman under this curse—“may the Lord cause you to become a curse among your people when he makes your womb miscarry and your abdomen swell. May this water that brings a curse enter your body so that your abdomen swells or your womb miscarries.” Numbers 5:20-22 NIV

In this instance, anti-abortionists are declaring: that God is not nearly as holy as they are; God is a murderer!!

Then in Hosea 9:13-16, the prophet Hosea prayed to God to abort the fetuses of his enemies which God did.

For you have played the harlot, forsaking your God.

7 The days of punishment have come,
The days of retribution have come;

11 As for Ephraim, their glory will fly away like a bird—
No birth, no pregnancy and no conception!
12 Though they bring up their children,
Yet I will bereave them until not a man is left.
Yes, woe to them indeed when I depart from them!
13 Ephraim, as I have seen,
Is planted in a pleasant meadow like Tyre;
But Ephraim will bring out his children for slaughter.
14 Give them, O Lord what will You give?

Hoseas's prayer: Give them a miscarrying womb and dry breasts.

16 Ephraim is stricken, their root is dried up,
They will bear no fruit.
Even though they bear children,
I will slay the precious ones of their womb.
17 My God will cast them away
Because they have not listened to Him;

And thus the identity of Tribe of Ephraim disappeared as it was assimilated into the surrounding nations.

IMO, the anti-abortion cult is Satanic, trying destroy peoples' freedom and force their false religion onto every else. That is Satan's way of doing things.

God's decision to abort fetuses is His decision only, not ours. He gives life and takes it away.
Something much bigger is coming. Death to about 2/3 of the population. Those who do abort prove their selfishness and lack of faith in God. They are blind and so they go a different path.
I did not have faith in God until I was 35 years old. Prior to that it was whatever was more beneficial to me in my life according to my rules and understanding. I was blind, now I can see. Now I trust God with my life and the lives of my family. He provides. Unbelievers do not have this faith, they fear, they doubt and they don't want anyone to get in their way, even their own baby.

 

[TLHKAJ]

to be clear I had an abortion when I was a teen so I’m not in support of it. Because regardless of whether it is right then or not…sooner or later the man or woman will never forget. It will come back up. Even if a child is handicapped mentally or physically, or if the woman has been raped making the decision to abort will have an impact. Even for a mother who does it, say, in the welfare of the child knowing it would be born handicap …someone still will have to live with that. Even women rioting with “women's rights” can change their mind decades down the road and it will bring regret like the verse
Romans 6:21-23 What fruit had you then in those things whereof you are now ashamed? for the end of those things is death. [22] But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, you have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life. [23] For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

But (Imo) I don’t see your verse quoted having any thing to do with supporting or not supporting a position on abortion.

So ....would you consider taking the life of a handicapped child ...say, with Muscular Dystrophy, or Cerebral Palsy because the child doesn't have a quality of life (according to some people's standards)? Would that be in their best interest?

 

[TLHKAJ]

I'm responsible for my own body, my own choices, and my own actions.
I chose to keep my baby when I was 14 years old.
I have never had another pregnancy since that first one.
My grandson just graduated high school at the beginning of this month.

I don't believe government should be involved at all.
I believe doctors should have the right to administer according to their conscience.
I do not agree with abortion. I would not then nor now have one.

Each person will have to live with their choices and their actions.
Each person will be judged according to their deeds.

I believe abortion is murder and a miscarriage is the bodies reaction to that pregnancy.
I believe in choosing life over death, unless your a henious criminal and deserve the death penalty.
Children do not fall into to this catagory, specially the unborn that have committed no wrong doing whatsoever.

But I am not your judge. I can't make you make my choices.
I can't prevent a criminal by committing a crime because I choose for them not to commit a crime.

Should there be laws determining the choices that we make with our bodies?
I don't believe man has the right to decide another man's life.
I believe the law of conscience should override all man's laws.

If you have no conscience.... no man can fix that, no law can create that.
And maybe the ones who are choosing not to have children are saving them from growing up with parents that have no conscience.
If you are willing to take an innocent life before their born, then perhaps abortion saves the child from growing up in a life of hell.

Education is lacking.
More people that have experienced abortions that have left internal scars, need to speak out loudly to those who have yet to make that choice.
The only voice being heard today is, if it inconviences you, then do it. And that is selfishness on the ultimate level.
There are always alternatives.

But truthfully, Abortion is big business, big money, and no one in government should have the right to play the monopoly game of life.

That's how I feel about it.
Hugs

I can see what you're saying, sister. But I believe all murder should be against the law. A person can choose to break that law and suffer the consequences. Killing a baby shouldn't be a choice. That body doesn't belong to anyone but God and we have no right to kill them.

 

[Grailhunter]

I presented the Scriptural position on abortion in posting #5. Until you can prove Scripture is wrong, then I am not at all interested in your babbling with totally unrelated subject matter.

So . . . Back to posting #5 where the subject is directly declared in Scripture!

The scripture you presented is Old Testament....we are not Jews....from a culture that sold their daughters as sex slaves. Now a days there is very few reasons to justify murdering babies....to justify murdering 600,000 a babies a year for less than a fraction of 1 percent that might have a legitimate case. I will go for saving 600,000 babies.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

So ....would you consider taking the life of a handicapped child ...say, with Muscular Dystrophy, or Cerebral Palsy because the child doesn't have a quality of life (according to some people's standards)? Would that be in their best interest?

no. My friends daughter has Cerebral Palsy. She is a teenager now. Maggie is very smart. She is probably more compassionate than a lot of those on this board including myself. The point of the post I guess gets lost, which was that when a woman has an abortion …at the time she might think it won’t affect her …but many years later it can still come up as regret.

 

[Ziggy]

I can see what you're saying, sister. But I believe all murder should be against the law. A person can choose to break that law and suffer the consequences. Killing a baby shouldn't be a choice. That body doesn't belong to anyone but God and we have no right to kill them.

That's why we're not supposed to participate with the way the world does things, even though we have to live in the world.
Everyone will have to answer for their own actions.
Stealing is against the law, and yet the world is full of thieves.
And sad to say, most of them get away with it, because they belong to a world of thieves.
That's why we're seperate. That's why they hate us.

Psa 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
Psa 1:2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
Psa 1:3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
Psa 1:4 The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
Psa 1:5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
Psa 1:6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.

When I say everyone should have a right to choose, I'm really saying they are taking judgment upon themselves.
Only God knows the heart.
There are people (and I'm watching them LIVE right now on Portland Andy, on Youtube)
and they live to kill babies.
They will have their reward.. in hell.

Hugs

 

[amigo de christo]

At the time I was pregnant I was in the 8th grade. The school wouldn't let me return because of the "image" I may create among other young girls.
I ended up dropping out. But I later got my GED and did go to a Liberal college for 1 year. Which I had to quit because it ewas either go to school or lose my job. I kept my job.
But yeah, the stigma was with me for a couple years. Everybody looking at you and judging you.
Life goes on.

Hugs

March onwards in the LORD . You are loved dear sister .

 

[amigo de christo]

That's why we're not supposed to participate with the way the world does things, even though we have to live in the world.
Everyone will have to answer for their own actions.
Stealing is against the law, and yet the world is full of thieves.
And sad to say, most of them get away with it, because they belong to a world of thieves.
That's why we're seperate. That's why they hate us.

Psa 1:1 Blessed is the man that walketh not in the counsel of the ungodly, nor standeth in the way of sinners, nor sitteth in the seat of the scornful.
Psa 1:2 But his delight is in the law of the LORD; and in his law doth he meditate day and night.
Psa 1:3 And he shall be like a tree planted by the rivers of water, that bringeth forth his fruit in his season; his leaf also shall not wither; and whatsoever he doeth shall prosper.
Psa 1:4 The ungodly are not so: but are like the chaff which the wind driveth away.
Psa 1:5 Therefore the ungodly shall not stand in the judgment, nor sinners in the congregation of the righteous.
Psa 1:6 For the LORD knoweth the way of the righteous: but the way of the ungodly shall perish.

When I say everyone should have a right to choose, I'm really saying they are taking judgment upon themselves.
Only God knows the heart.
There are people (and I'm watching them LIVE right now on Portland Andy, on Youtube)
and they live to kill babies.
They will have their reward.. in hell.

Hugs

Sodom is marching in uproar . I seen some carrying signs that said
Women need Roe V wade , and that women DONT NEED JESUS . THEY are openly declaring war on the LAMB and the saints .
This world is truly as the days of lott and days of noah .
WE must double down all efforts and point to Christ to all biblical sound truth , while there still be time to do so .
Cause on the day of the LORD many are gonna wail , wishing they had chosen Christ and not this all inclusive false love god .

 

[Ziggy]

So, back in 2020 during the George Floyd summer of Love riots.. I mean peaceful protests..
I watched Portland Andy for 120 consecutive days and nights, watching antifa and blm burn, loot, and murder.
I got so depressed that I ended up finding this forum for peace.
I don't think I have the stomach to watch it all again like a bad rerun.
But on the other hand, I feel I need to be witness to it.
So when the left come out saying, It never happened,
I know I saw it for myself.
I watched Jan6 the same way.
I watched antifa change clothes and dress in MAGA hats and attack the capitol.
I heard conversations saying what they were planning on doing.
Now when I watch these sham hearings I know they are only showing one side of the story and it's extremely biased and twisted.
I don't watch Fox News. I don't watch TV at all.
But I do watch a lot of livestreams on the internet.
This way you get to decide forself what is real and what is fake news.

Lot's of bad language, but it is what it is. Real.
Hugs

 

[amigo de christo]

Buckle down and strap all heavenly armour on . We are in an all out battle and souls are at stake .
On the day o the LORD lambs are gonna rejoice but i tell us all that many folks will wail . They will truly be terrified
as they hear depart from me i never knew you , depart to the lake o fire prepared for the devil and his angels .
Endure as battle drawn soldiers of the LORD cause i also remind us THIS WORLD aint gonna love us .
WE will be betrayed even by church folks . Its gonna get ugly so be prepared to lose all for the Sake of the GLORIOUS LORD .
Remember that eternal life is forever , this life is but as the dew on the grass in a texas morning during a heat wave
it barely appears and then its gone . WHERE WE SPEND ETERNITY is all that matters in the END .
CLING to JESUS and stay sharp in those bibles . Be in prayer , be hearers and doers of all things our Lord did teach
and point the peoples to Christ and correct brethren in any error . This world cannot survive on the path its on .
THE COMING of the LORD does draw nigh .

 

[Ziggy]

Buckle down and strap all heavenly armour on . We are in an all out battle and souls are at stake .
On the day o the LORD lambs are gonna rejoice but i tell us all that many folks will wail . They will truly be terrified
as they hear depart from me i never knew you , depart to the lake o fire prepared for the devil and his angels .
Endure as battle drawn soldiers of the LORD cause i also remind us THIS WORLD aint gonna love us .
WE will be betrayed even by church folks . Its gonna get ugly so be prepared to lose all for the Sake of the GLORIOUS LORD .
Remember that eternal life is forever , this life is but as the dew on the grass in a texas morning during a heat wave
it barely appears and then its gone . WHERE WE SPEND ETERNITY is all that matters in the END .
CLING to JESUS and stay sharp in those bibles . Be in prayer , be hearers and doers of all things our Lord did teach
and point the peoples to Christ and correct brethren in any error . This world cannot survive on the path its on .
THE COMING of the LORD does draw nigh .

Sing my Friend, Sing!
God Bless You
Hugs

 

[TLHKAJ]

no. My friends daughter has Cerebral Palsy. She is a teenager now. Maggie is very smart. She is probably more compassionate than a lot of those on this board including myself. The point of the post I guess gets lost, which was that when a woman has an abortion …at the time she might think it won’t affect her …but many years later it can still come up as regret.

Yes, most (except for those whose hearts are hardened) will always remember that baby and that they took it's life.

Isaiah 49:15-16
[15]Can a woman forget her sucking child, that she should not have compassion on the son of her womb? yea, they may forget, yet will I not forget thee.
[16]Behold, I have graven thee upon the palms of my hands; thy walls are continually before me.

 

[Stan B]

The scripture you presented is Old Testament....we are not Jews....from a culture that sold their daughters as sex slaves.

You make Adolph Hitler seem like a mere amateur when it comes to antisemetism.

 

[Grailhunter]

You make Adolph Hitler seem like a mere amateur when it comes to antisemetism.

You know see, you just do not pay attention.
Toning this down compared to what I was going to write!
Have you defended Israel? Have you defended the Jews? Have you stood between them and their enemies? I have.
My job in the government was to deploy and train new weapons systems in the field.
I worked with Raytheon to deploy the Patriot missile battery in Israel. I stood there and watched the Scud missiles coming and watched the Patriot missiles shoot them down and evaluated the effectiveness of the Patriot missile battery and made recommendations. And later I deployed Ord Alt's and updates to the battery. And then later worked with the Israelite army to train them.

I would fight for Israel and die with a grin on my face if I had to. But I am not a Jew and Judaism is not my religion. I grew up in University City with the Jews and had many Jewish friends and still have a few.....love the Jews.

And guess what....modern Jews do not sell their daughters as sex slaves anymore. Like the Christians they learned a few things after the biblical era.

 

[Dropship]

Are you talking about my 11 year old daughter who was raped; that she should go through 9 months is pregnancy; followed by having her daughter seized and put up for adoption, a situation where often her daughter will be forced to endure a life of living hell!
The rejected alternative would be to simply take a couple pills to abort the unwanted fetus.
Which would be the loving alternative for my daughter??

Every case is different, I think the main factor in all cases should be what the girls and women want, or in this case your daughter.
The only cases in which abortion is surely wrong is if women get rid of a healthy fetus simply as a form of birth control.

PS- my brother-in-laws mum had him out of wedlock and put him in an orphanage straight after the birth and he grew up there with periods of being foster cared by couples, and became a well-balanced popular chap without any trauma or hangups.
We once asked him if he'd ever thought of trying to trace his birth mother and he said "No never; she didn't want me so I don't want her".

By contrast Brit MP Clare Short had a baby when she was a young student and gave him up for adoption. They met years later and he was all forgiveness-