The answer of hell and its origins

[Grailhunter]

You dont have anything to offer this thread or discussion sorry.

Just the truth....is the truth not welcome on this thread?
Or is it just dedicated to the lies of the Jehovah's Witnesses?
Maybe you should rename it the the blasphemous heretics thread.
Care to test me on anything I have said?

 

[face2face]

Just the truth....is the truth not welcome on this thread?
Or is it just dedicated to the lies of the Jehovah's Witnesses?
Maybe you should rename it the the blasphemous heretics thread.
Care to test me on anything I have said?

For reason's already stated you failed to understand Hebrews 11 which was very simple and your NT only approach to the subject of hell is laughable.
So where there is no substance there can be no questions.
F2F

 

[Grailhunter]

For reason's already stated you failed to understand Hebrews 11 which was very simple and your NT only approach to the subject of hell is laughable.
So where there is no substance there can be no questions.
F2F

I all ready told you that the over all point of Hebrews 11 is faith and he was sighting Old Testament figures. I am almost scared to thing what you think it means.

Figured you would not take on the truth. But your tail between your legs and move on.

 

[face2face]

#239

Anyone care to provide their wisdom on Matthew 10:28

Both Soul and Body destroyed?

 

[face2face]

Sounds like the grave to me....you know dust you are and dust you shall return!

 

[Jack]

Satan LOVES it when his children convince others that there is no eternal Hell fire!

 

[face2face]

#239....thought so!

Maybe its time to call it on this discussion.

I was hoping to move through the NT passages to show they all refer to the severity of going to the grave never to come out - or to come out and find you have to go back in - now that would be weeping and gnashing of teeth!

 

[Earburner]

exactly dear sister . IF it was , HOW COME PAUL who was born again , LOOKED FOR HIS SECOND COMING .
AS did james and others . the PROMISE OF HIS COMING again , THE CHURCHES ALL talked about it .
YOUR SPOT ON RIGHT SISTER . NEVER SELL OUT . KEEP looking for the blessed coming of the LORD .

STILL, none of you understand or know how to apply Luke 17:20.
First coming to Israel only- observable.
Matthew 15:24
Second coming to all individuals- unobservable.
Luke 17:21, Acts 2:17, Revelation 3:20.
Third coming for only His OWN- observable.
Romans 8:8-9, Revelation 1:7

 

[face2face]

Into hell (gehenna) … where their worm dieth not, and the fire is not quenched. Mark 9:43-47

Do eternal fire advocates also believe there are special worms in this eternal hell fire?
What do these freakish worms eat? your soul? Does your soul grow back and the worms just keep eating

Ironically there are worms called "worms from hell"

or

So funny...the one of the left is a real creature while the one of the right has been conjured up in the mind of a deluded christian.

There are many.

F2F

 

[Jack]

#239....thought so!

Maybe its time to call it on this discussion.

I was hoping to move through the NT passages to show they all refer to the severity of going to the grave never to come out - or to come out and find you have to go back in - now that would be weeping and gnashing of teeth!

Notice how JW's LOVE to mock Scripture when Christians don't fall for their deceit!

 

[Jack]

STILL, none of you understand or know how to apply Luke 17:20.

Kingdom Hall does? lol

 

[face2face]

Notice how JW's LOVE to mock Scripture when Christians don't fall for their deceit!

Ah I think you mean to mock your false understanding of Scripture!
Big difference.
Jesus did it also of the Pharisees...so....do you believe in special worms Jack?

 

[face2face]

STILL, none of you understand or know how to apply Luke 17:20.
First coming to Israel only- observable.
Matthew 15:24
Second coming to all individuals- unobservable.
Luke 17:21, Acts 2:17, Revelation 3:20.
Third coming for only His OWN- observable.
Romans 8:8-9, Revelation 1:7

Hey earburner - the observable point was for the Pharisees who were forcing Jesus to tell them when the KoG was coming.
However, I do believe the second coming is to gather the saints and then the third will be to show himself to all mankind.
F2F

 

[Grailhunter]

The strange beliefs of the Jehovah's Witnesses.

They do not believe in Hell.

They do not believe that Yeshua is a God.

They do not know the name of God the Father.

They do not celebrate Christian holidays.

They do not require a Christian Wedding ceremony.

They have a strange view of the New Covenant.

Then...
Jehovah’s Witnesses have a two-class system of salvation in which they divide their followers into two groups. They call the first group the “little flock” and limit it to 144,000 members, and they call the second group the “great crowd” which is open to the rest of the population of mankind. When examining what they believe about this two-class system of salvation, it is here that we discover the greatest hole in Watchtower theology because there is not a single Scripture that supports their unique views on this issue. Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that all of the privileges associated with the New Covenant belong only to the first group of 144,000 people. It is claimed that most of the followers in this first group (with few exceptions) have been appointed between Pentecost 33 A.D. and the year 1935. 1. The New Covenant privileges given to this group of 144,000 include the ability to be born again, to be spiritually adopted into God’s family, to be able to approach Jesus as personal “Mediator” between them and God, the ability to partake in the Lord’s Evening Meal (Lord’s Supper), and the hope of resurrection to life in heaven.

 

[Jack]

Ah I think you mean to mock your false understanding of Scripture!
Big difference

I quote Jesus and you call it mocking. Kingdom Hall won't help you on Judgment Day. Get saved before you're in Hell JW!

Jesus did it also of the Pharisees...so....do you believe in special worms Jack?

Special worms? lol
I hope you get saved and don't meet those nasty worms Jesus warned you about.

 

[face2face]

The strange beliefs of the Jehovah's Witnesses.

They do not believe in Hell.

True.

They do not believe that Yeshua is a God.

True

They do not know the name of God the Father.

He has many names often derived by a situation or manifesting an intended meaning.

They do not celebrate Christian holidays.

I cant blame them...Christianity is full of pagan doctrines eternal hell fire being one of them

They do not require a Christian Wedding ceremony.

Is there such a thing?

They have a strange view of the New Covenant.

The Christian model is corrupted by the trinity! You dont understand how God was in Christ reconciling the World to Himself.

Then...
Jehovah’s Witnesses have a two-class system of salvation in which they divide their followers into two groups. They call the first group the “little flock” and limit it to 144,000 members, and they call the second group the “great crowd” which is open to the rest of the population of mankind. When examining what they believe about this two-class system of salvation, it is here that we discover the greatest hole in Watchtower theology because there is not a single Scripture that supports their unique views on this issue. Jehovah’s Witnesses believe that all of the privileges associated with the New Covenant belong only to the first group of 144,000 people. It is claimed that most of the followers in this first group (with few exceptions) have been appointed between Pentecost 33 A.D. and the year 1935. 1. The New Covenant privileges given to this group of 144,000 include the ability to be born again, to be spiritually adopted into God’s family, to be able to approach Jesus as personal “Mediator” between them and God, the ability to partake in the Lord’s Evening Meal (Lord’s Supper), and the hope of resurrection to life in heaven.

This is a false teaching however, I sense at the judgement this doctrine will easily be explained away by the Lord. It is true the JW's have given up on natural Israel to their own hurt and yet to fully know the Mercy of God or His Covenants of Promise which he will not deny.

What you are finding is there are degrees of truth in Christianity - one Bible 45,000 denominations.

One body will be full of truth or very close to it when the Lord returns.

Let's hope you are not with the masses.

F2F

 

[face2face]

All flesh shall come to worship before me, saith the Lord. And they shall go forth and look upon the carcasses of men … for their worm shall not die, neither shall their fire be quenched. Isaiah 66:23-24.

Quoted by the Lord in Mark 9:43-47

So Hell has immortal worms which eat away at human souls.

Who created these eternal worms?
When they eat your soul does your soul grow back so the worms can keep feeding?

Just asking...

 

[Earburner]

Hey earburner - the observable point was for the Pharisees who were forcing Jesus to tell them when the KoG was coming.
However, I do believe the second coming is to gather the saints and then the third will be to show himself to all mankind.
F2F

You are half way there, but you are trying to fabricate, so as to keep your end time doctrine of men. To be in Jesus, and he in us, is to BE IN the KoG.

His first coming in the visible flesh, was to manifest himself to Israel only. Jesus Himself is the KoG.

His second coming in His invisible Spirit, was to manifest himself to all who are Born Again only.
Jesus Himself is the KoG.

His third coming in His visible Immortality, is to redeem His own only, and to simultaneously manifest the Glory of His Being to all the unsaved world. Jesus Himself is the KoG.

To the Jews Jesus said:
Matt.21[43] Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God [Jesus himself] shall be TAKEN from you, and GIVEN to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.

Jesus' prophecy of himself was fulfilled in the manifestation of His Spirit GIVEN to His Born Again saints. WE, who are born again,..... ARE that nation.
He left Israel and has COME to us. Revelation 3:20

1Pet.2[9] But ye are a CHOSEN generation [of people], a royal priesthood, an holy nation [of new creatures], a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light.

To be in Jesus, and he in us, is to BE IN the KoG.
To be in the KoG, is to BE IN Jesus, and he in us.
Luke.17[21] Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.

 

[Grailhunter]

They do not celebrate Christian holidays.

I cant blame them...Christianity is full of pagan doctrines eternal hell fire being one of them

Part of the problem is that the Jehovah's Witnesses are a late comers to Christianity.....established around the late 19th century.
The other problem is that they do not teach history in Church....not even Christian history. The Apostles were Jews and the early Christians were Jewish-Christians. Most of the Jews rejected Christ. Paul's ministry was to the Pagans .... Pagan converts to Christianity .... Gentiles. Within the first century or shortly after Gentiles dominated Christianity and then completely took over the helm of the Church.

The Gentiles....coming from many regions and countries....Believed in Christ but they came from different cultures and they did not abandons those cultures. And they still celebrated certain days....and they were Pagan....but as time went on they Christianized these holidays. Then Emperor Constantine consolidated the holidays.

Now I think Yeshua knew all about what was going to happen and if He did not want it, He would not have commissioned Paul to start his ministry to the Pagans. Yeshua did not have to do that, He did not have to offer salvation to the Pagans. Then because the Jewish-Christians did not last long....Christianity might have died out....but that is another story.

The Jehovah's Witnesses attitude toward Christian holidays is one of many things that put them in the column under anti-Christ.... anti-Christian....and more in line with Judaism.



They do not require a Christian Wedding ceremony.

Is there such a thing?

Well there certainly is now and the Protestants were the ones that required it. But people can plan ceremonies as they wish and Christians get married in a church. And that is my point.

And there is more than one model for the Trinity. Jehovah's Witnesses object to the Trinity because the want to demean Christ.

The Jehovah's Witnesses view of the covenant....I do not think that it is a set model. I participated in a few interventions to try to save people from the Jehovah's Witnesses and it did not seem that they all believed the same way about the new covenant. Best I can tell the Jehovah's Witnesses do not believe we are in the new covenant yet.

 

[Earburner]

They do not celebrate Christian holidays.


Part of the problem is that the Jehovah's Witnesses are a late comers to Christianity.....established around the late 19th century.
The other problem is that they do not teach history in Church....not even Christian history. The Apostles were Jews and the early Christians were Jewish-Christians. Most of the Jews rejected Christ. Paul's ministry was to the Pagans .... Pagan converts to Christianity .... Gentiles. Within the first century or shortly after Gentiles dominated Christianity and then completely took over the helm of the Church.

The Gentiles....coming from many regions and countries....Believed in Christ but they came from different cultures and they did not abandons those cultures. And they still celebrated certain days....and they were Pagan....but as time went on they Christianized these holidays. Then Emperor Constantine consolidated the holidays.

Now I think Yeshua knew all about what was going to happen and if He did not want it, He would not have commissioned Paul to start his ministry to the Pagans. Yeshua did not have to do that, He did not have to offer salvation to the Pagans. Then because the Jewish-Christians did not last long....Christianity might have died out....but that is another story.

The Jehovah's Witnesses attitude toward Christian holidays is one of many things that put them in the column under anti-Christ.... anti-Christian....and more in line with Judaism.



They do not require a Christian Wedding ceremony.


Well there certainly is now and the Protestants were the ones that required it. But people can plan ceremonies as they wish and Christians get married in a church. And that is my point.

And there is more than one model for the Trinity. Jehovah's Witnesses object to the Trinity because the want to demean Christ.

The Jehovah's Witnesses view of the covenant....I do not think that it is a set model. I participated in a few interventions to try to save people from the Jehovah's Witnesses and it did not seem that they all believed the same way about the new covenant. Best I can tell the Jehovah's Witnesses do not believe we are in the new covenant yet.

Unfortunately, by you approaching their arguments as being contrary to the standard beliefs of main line church-ianity, you are just adding fuel for the fire.
Don't you yet know that "all of the churches have some of His truth, but none of them have all of His truth"- Earburner.

Maybe now you can better understand the Lord's words:
Luke 12[51] Suppose ye that I am come to give peace on earth? I tell you, Nay; but rather division:
[52] For from henceforth there shall be five in one house divided, three against two, and two against three.
[53] The father shall be divided against the son, and the son against the father; the mother against the daughter, and the daughter against the mother; the mother in law against her daughter in law, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.