The Bible: One of the Believer's Biggest Problems

[Behold]

People who worship the Bible are not on the right track. Worship God.

Try not to be deceived., Bob.

listen...
There is a genuine love for the word of God that is the end result of Christ the Word in you living His life, with you submitted.
Jesus Himself, loved, LOVED the word of God......and that you dont, is an unfortunate thing for you. and for all those who are like you, found on this forum.

IVe no doubt that you will try to come back now and defend your sudden and new found appreciation of the word of God, (and not just you)... but if you really loved it, you would be loving it and not abusing it with your opinion on a public forum.

See when you insult real believers who love God's word, you are spitting on the word, as if its not worth loving.

"Thy word is TRUTH"...... Bob.

Your word is not.

The bible, the Holy Bible, the Scriptures, are not just a "book".
They are Light for Life, they are Milk and Meat, they are a Lamp and they are the power of God unto salvation.
The words in the Holy Bible are Spiritual, they are alive with the very life of God.
Its the preaching of the word of God that the Holy Spirit uses to bring a soul to Christ.

Without the HOLY word of God, you would not even know how to believe corretly.
Its the word of God= the Holy Bible that has the GOSPEL in it.
This is where its FOUND, Bob, and maybe you'll find it one day.
Its those words that God uses, to teach you, to lead you, and to deliver you... through the Holy Spirit.

Its through the receiving of the seed of the word that the spiritual washing of regeneration is caused, is FOUND.....as born again.

Its the reading and the study and the love for the word of God that keeps us clean, and keeps us close to God the Father and Jesus The Lord.

You are not aware of any of this, or you would not be found on a "christian" forum trying to denounce the word of God by implying that its not worth loving, cherishing, and learning.
See Bob, that is not "worship< that is LOVE.....loving the Word.
Jesus did this... He LOVED the word.

You see and view this incorrectly as "worship", and that is why you know so little about it, and will always know so little about it.
See, when you have no love for the word of God, then you will be kept on the outside of it, looking in........exactly as you find yourself today.

 

[Bob Estey]

Try not to be deceived., Bob.

listen...
There is a genuine love for the word of God that is the end result of Christ the Word in you living His life, with you submitted.
Jesus Himself, loved, LOVED the word of God......and that you dont, is an unfortunate thing for you. and for all those who are like you, found on this forum.

IVe no doubt that you will try to come back now and defend your sudden and new found appreciation of the word of God, (and not just you)... but if you really loved it, you would be loving it and not abusing it with your opinion on a public forum.

See when you insult real believers who love God's word, you are spitting on the word, as if its not worth loving.

"Thy word is TRUTH"...... Bob.

Your word is not.

The bible, the Holy Bible, the Scriptures, are not just a "book".
They are Light for Life, they are Milk and Meat, they are a Lamp and they are the power of God unto salvation.
The words in the Holy Bible are Spiritual, they are alive with the very life of God.
Its the preaching of the word of God that the Holy Spirit uses to bring a soul to Christ.

Without the HOLY word of God, you would not even know how to believe corretly.
Its the word of God= the Holy Bible that has the GOSPEL in it.
This is where its FOUND, Bob, and maybe you'll find it one day.
Its those words that God uses, to teach you, to lead you, and to deliver you... through the Holy Spirit.

Its through the receiving of the seed of the word that the spiritual washing of regeneration is caused, is FOUND.....as born again.

Its the reading and the study and the love for the word of God that keeps us clean, and keeps us close to God the Father and Jesus The Lord.

You are not aware of any of this, or you would not be found on a "christian" forum trying to denounce the word of God by implying that its not worth loving, cherishing, and learning.
See Bob, that is not "worship< that is LOVE.....loving the Word.
Jesus did this... He LOVED the word.

You see and view this incorrectly as "worship", and that is why you know so little about it, and will always know so little about it.
See, when you have no love for the word of God, then you will be kept on the outside of it, looking in........exactly as you find yourself today.

If you don't get to know God, then the Bible hasn't done you a bit of good.

 

[Bob Carabbio]

Such ambiguity appears to clearly demonstrate that the writings are the musings of men, however, many still attribute its contents to a deity figure. Why?!

Chuckle!!! Because it's the Word of GOD, and when read with the Holy Spirit as a guide, it has the power to Save.

You're obviously handling it with the motivation to discredit it, probably so you don't need to bother with either it OR God's demands on your life.
That's your decision, but hopefully you'll be Convicted of your SIN, and of impending Judgement, repent, and become Born Again of the Holy SPirit.

 

[Behold]

If you don't get to know God, then the Bible hasn't done you a bit of good.

I have Christ in me.

Now think about this Bob......."the word of God, is a DISCERNER of your thoughts and intent."
It is able to separate your soul from your spirit.
= This is the BIBLE.
Its not just a book.
It not just words on a page.

 

[Jim B]

The subject of the thread is The Bible, one of the believer's biggest problems. That is beyond nonsense. The Bible is now and has been The (written) Word of God. It's only a problem for those who can't/won't read it. If you're a believer, then you know the truth. Why is this even being debated?

 

[Behold]

The subject of the thread is The Bible, one of the believer's biggest problems. That is beyond nonsense. The Bible is now and has been The (written) Word of God. It's only a problem for those who can't/won't read it. If you're a believer, then you know the truth. Why is this even being debated?

Its because the Devil and his owned, don't like the word of God.
He's been altering it, or denying it, since the Garden of Eden when Satan said of God's word....>"hath god said"?

In other words....>"what is your opinion, as isn't your opinion your God, so..... never mind that bible, you have your opinion"..

 

[Jim B]

Its because the Devil and his owned, don't like the word of God.
He's been altering it, or denying it, since the Garden of Eden when Satan said of God's word....>"hath god said"?

In other words....>"what is your opinion, as isn't your opinion your God, so..... never mind that bible, you have your opinion"..

I'm not concerned if the devil and his owned (sic) don't like the word of God. The Bible is the written Word of God, regardless of who disagrees with it or doesn't like it.

 

[Behold]

I'm not concerned if the devil and his owned (sic) don't like the word of God. The Bible is the written Word of God, regardless of who disagrees with it or doesn't like it.

And if we were in the Church of Satan, in California, then this Thread and many attitudes here would be right at home.
But we're not, and that's a problem, Jim B.

Everyone is invited to God's table, but that does not include spitting on the WOG while you are sitting there.

 

[Jim B]

And if we were in the Church of Satan, in California, then this Thread and many attitudes here would be right at home.
But we're not, and that's a problem, Jim B.

Everyone is invited to God's table, but that does not include spitting on the WOG while you are sitting there.

It's a problem that we're not in the Church of Satan? For you, perhaps.

I'm disregarding your obscene last sentence.

 

[Behold]

It's a problem that we're not in the Church of Satan?

Let me explain what i said, more succinctly.

Its Like this JimB.

Are you on a Thread, that is discounting the Word Of God? Abusing it, by casting doubt on it?
See the Thread't TITLE for an update, in case missed it.
So.... Are you able to recognize that this Thread is designed to attempt to cast doubt on the Bible.
Now, Is this a "Christian forum"?
Yes ??

So, here is my question, and i'll ask you again..
Would not a Bible denying Thread, best be found on a Forum that celebrates Satan?

 

[Jim B]

Let me explain what i said, more succinctly.

Its Like this JimB.

Are you on a Thread, that is discounting the Word Of God? Abusing it, by casting doubt on it?
See the Thread't TITLE for an update, in case missed it.
So.... Are you able to recognize that this Thread is designed to attempt to cast doubt on the Bible.
Now, Is this a "Christian forum"?
Yes ??

Connect the dots.


<B><

I don't understand what you mean by "connect the dots". This is a discussion about the Bible being a supposed problem for believers. If you can't deal with that, why are you here?

 

[Behold]

I don't understand what you mean by "connect the dots". This is a discussion about the Bible being a supposed problem for believers. If you can't deal with that, why are you here?

Here is the Thread's Point of View.

I'll quote it for you.

""""""The Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe and have built varying beliefs systems around. Yet, the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing """"


so, the OP stated, as FACT, that the Bible, the word of God, is "ambiguous, confusing, and contradictory".

So, that is all a lie.....not a ""discussion.""
You apparently are not able to realize this, which explain why you are here, not understanding what This Thread, is designed to do.

Let me me make it crystal clear for you.
Let say 4 brand new Christians show up here today.......They all got saved today, and came to this Forum, and this Thread.
They just READ....

""""'The Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe and have built varying beliefs systems around. Yet, the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing """""

Now do you see the problem?
What if they BELIEVED these Lies?

So, what is the good news?
The good news is that if these 4 came here, they would find what im writing and that should protect them.

ok then....hope that helps .


<B><

 

[Berserk]

Truth OT: "Thanks for chiming in Bob. The fact that there is contention within the Christian faith(s) bolsters my point that the Bible is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing regarding numerous religious subjects that would appear to be of upmost importance."

Most of your responses betray a need to pontificate fundamentalist talking points rather than a sincere effort to respect where you are coming from and to find a possible foundation to advance your spiritual quest.
You are basically correct about the Bible and if any fundamentalists want to challenge my rejection of biblical inerrancy, I can quickly provide several objective errors for which they have no answer.

But Truth OT, what about the idea that divinely inspired lives produced very human biblical texts and the idea that the Holy Spirit can provide you with spiritual experiences and self-authenticating insights that make biblical principles and teachings ring true for you? Have you thought about what convincing case might prove decisive for a more pro-Christian faith quest? Consider these 5 areas for further dialogue:

(1) Suppose God gave you an electrifying and self-authentic experience of His grace and love for you? Would you dismiss the psychological certainty of that experience as too subjective for credibility?
(2) What if you could be convinced on rational grounds that Jesus really did perform the miracles alleged in the Gospels?
(3) What if you could be convinced that Jesus really did rise from the dead? Might that not inspire a longing to find God real in your personal experience?
(4) What if you could be convinced of the reality of modern miracles performed in Jesus' name? Would that support the case for you that Jesus might have performed comparable miracles back then?
(5) What if you could be convinced by paranormal evidence that God encounters in NDEs and ADCs are real? NDEs are near-death experiences and ADCs are often even more impressive after-death contacts often with deceased loved ones.

Might some combination of (1)-(5) reach a "tipping point" for you that makes your conversion more likely.
I ask these questions because I am loathe to engage in the posturing that some fundamentals are demonstrating in your thread. But if you think you are open-minded enough to consider becoming a believer, pending sufficient evidence, then I'd be eager to hang in there with you until your issues find greater clarity. If you agree that this post constructively points the way forward for you, why don't you start a new thread focusing specifically on each or some of (1)-(5) posted above that are relevant to your quest? If you do, I will respond with all the evidence I can muster. btw. I was a Teaching Fellow in New Testament at Harvard, while I was doing my doctorate in New Testament, Intertestamental Judaism, and Greco-Roman backgrounds there and have been a theology professor for 12 years and a United Methodist pastor for several years until my retirement in 2015.

 

[Behold]

I can quickly provide several objective errors for which they have no answer.

Objective errors ?

You will show us misspelled words and your opinion regarding "original Koine greek", and "Original Extant manuscripts", when in fact the only originals are the Apostle's letters, and they dont exist.
So, you want to ERECT your strawman based on quoting your educational history, as if this proves you are the authority over the word of God.
This is your self anointing, waiting to be turned loose to awe us here?
really?
Too funny.
Why dont you just save that for someone who will buy it, as we are not buying that from you.

So, your true reason to be on this Thread is the same reason the OP landed here.
You've already identified yourself as a self anointed bible critic, who sits in authority, in your mind.... above the word of God.
See....You've already stated that is what you are happy to prove.

No need, as the last thing any Christian Forum needs is one more of those who wants to pretend they are the final judge and jury OVER the Word of God based on your resume'.

Ill tell you a fact......the word of God has judged you already, according to your own words... to be ultra offensive to the Spirit of Christ who inspired that HOLY bible, Berserk.

I'll now give you a fair warning, a word to the unknowing..
When you decide to be a public bible castigator, you set yourself in direct opposition to the Truth, who is Jesus the Word.
You mess with that, and you'll end up more than Berserk.
Believe it.

Selah

 

[Berserk]

[Behold: "Objective errors ? You will show us misspelled words and your opinion regarding "original Koine greek", and "Original Extant manuscripts", when in fact the only originals are the Apostle's letters, and they dont exist.
So, you want to ERECT your strawman based on quoting your educational history, as if this proves you are the authority over the word of God.
This is your self anointing, waiting to be turned loose to awe us here?" really? Too funny."

You need to create a false strawman of what I mean by "objective error" to avoid the hard work of explaining this one error among many others that I'm about to lay out in response to your challenge. In Luke the women at Jesus' tomb are greeted by 2 angels and don't see the risen Jesus. Then they tell 2 disciples that they just saw angels there (24:23). But in Matthew (28:8-10) and John (20:11-15), the women see Jesus near the tomb. In Matthew, Jesus instructs the women to go, tell the disciples that they have seen Him and that they must go to Galilee to see Him there. In John Mary Magdalene sees the risen Jesus, who tells her to report to the disciples that she has seen Him.

Behold will now explain why Luke's version does not contradict Matthew and John's version. Not!

 

[Behold]

[Behold: "Objective errors ?

Behold will now explain why Luke's version does not contradict Matthew and John's version. Not!

I think your question is not correctly written.
Is that because you could not cut and paste it from someone else's website, where you are getting all your other posts as well?
Seems so....and in that case.. I'll adjust your malformed question for you and then i'll answer it..

Here we go..

"why do the 4 Gospel's, contain differences", asks the self anointed bible critic ?

Let me explain that to you readers, and to you also Berserk...and then you'll have learned something useful today.


Look closely.. and see for yourself....

Lets say that .....You and I and Your mother and a stranger, are standing on a street corner, in Israel, yesterday.
We were waiting for the RED LIGHT to stop all traffic, so that we can cross the street safely to the other side.
Out of nowhere, !!!! a car runs the red light and hits and smashes into an oncoming car that is turning left.
We , the 4 of us, are 27 ft away, about 9 meters, and we all see this accident, with our eyes wide open... as it happened at NOON, and its a sunny blue sky day.

Then.......IN the next Hour, we, each of us, gives the Policeman our eyewitness account, regarding what we all saw... as we stood there together.

Im first, and you are last to give your deposition, Berserk.

At the station, later, the COP is writing up the final report, and he notices the usual......and that is......4 people saw the same accident, the same, event, yet, each of us listed our own personal details, that WE SAW, as compared to the other 3.

Why is that, Berserk?......Reader ????
Its because 4 eyewitness accounts are by 4 different people and each will have their own memory of it, yet all are telling the facts and the truth.

And the Gospels, are 4 accounts, which is why they are telling the same event, the same story, but, with slightly different DETAILS as evidenced by each of the 4.

See, this is how you KNOW its true......as if, all the accounts given by 4 different people...said the same exact thing, then that would not be 4, that would only be 1.. So, the Gospels do tell the same event, eyewitness accounts,> 4<...but each has a different perspective, as this has to be so, ..READER... as its 4 different people explaining the same event.

 

[Jim B]

Here is the Thread's Point of View.

I'll quote it for you.

""""""The Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe and have built varying beliefs systems around. Yet, the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing """"


so, the OP stated, as FACT, that the Bible, the word of God, is "ambiguous, confusing, and contradictory".

So, that is all a lie.....not a ""discussion.""
You apparently are not able to realize this, which explain why you are here, not understanding what This Thread, is designed to do.

Let me me make it crystal clear for you.
Let say 4 brand new Christians show up here today.......They all got saved today, and came to this Forum, and this Thread.
They just READ....

""""'The Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe and have built varying beliefs systems around. Yet, the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing """""

Now do you see the problem?
What if they BELIEVED these Lies?

So, what is the good news?
The good news is that if these 4 came here, they would find what im writing and that should protect them.

ok then....hope that helps .


<B><

It doesn't "help". The fact is that, even as a Christian, I can say that the Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe and have built varying beliefs systems around. Yet, the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing.

That is a fact that can't be denied. The Bible isn't a cookbook! You can't just read a "spiritual recipe" and follow the steps. That's why it has been read over and over for thousands of years, each time being a new experience.

Personally, each time I read the Bible, God reveals more about Himself and His interactions with humanity. It's when it becomes a platform for a rigid ideology that the trouble starts. That is the trouble with the various denominations, each one claiming to be the truth.

 

[Behold]

It doesn't "help". The fact is that, even as a Christian, I can say that the Bible presents a very broad general narrative many believe

The bible is the word of God.
What you believe, ....your opinion, is not relevant.....except to you.

See, when they put you and your opinion to sleep in a hole in the ground.....the Bible will still be here, same as it was before you were born.
It'll still be the word of God......so, no matter what your low opinion of the word of God is, ......it does not matter, except to you, Jim.
Believe it.

 

[Jim B]

The bible is the word of God.
What you believe, ....your opinion, is not relevant.....except to you.

See, when they put you and your opinion to sleep in a hole in the ground.....the Bible will still be here, same as it was before you were born.
It'll still be the word of God......so, no matter what your low opinion of the word of God is, ......it does not matter, except to you, Jim.
Believe it.

It is absurd to say that I have a low opinion of the word of God. I hold it in the highest esteem as His revelation to all people of who He is, the Godhead, creation, justification, etc.

I really don't care what your opinion of me and/or my faith is. Many believers have been judged poorly by those who can't understand God's truth.

 

[Behold]

It is absurd to say that I have a low opinion of the word of God. I hold it in the highest esteem

Let's examine your honesty.......as you just said you hold the bible in "Highest esteem".

Yet, here was your previous post...
You'll note there seems to be a issue with your honestly, when we look closely at your own words.

You just posted. :

"""""" the book is very ambiguous, at times contradictory, and downright confusing.""""""

See, Jim.... the issue is......when you define the bible, based on the fact that it confuses you.......then you have discovered the problem, and its not the bible.