The Godhead, Diversified Oneness

[101G]

Another confirmation of God's word as the fact of his plurality, or diversity.

Revelation Chapter 5, he who sits on the throne is he who stands as one slain. oh the beauty of God's diversity, or the plurality of two. he who sits, the the High Priest is in the order of Melchizedek, Jesus the Christ. and it is the Spirit of Christ who Stands as the ROOT of David, the everlasting Father, the Mighty God, the comforter. this plurality, or diversity is cited in Daniel 7:13 "I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him". and the prophet David cited the same, Psalms 110:1 "A Psalm of David. The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool". so here in Revelation chapter 5 we see the Lord, (as a man in flesh and bone sitting), while the LORD, (Spirit, the comforter, the Spirit of truth, the Spirit of Christ), sent into the earth realm making his enemies his footstool. what great time we live in now.

 

[101G]

Another member have proven the diversity "of" oneness. our friend Oz pointed out incorrectly that the Lord Jesus Christ have a God. he miscalculated the preposition "OF", which translates the genitive case of nouns, with various shades of meaning. Of these the subjective and objective are mentioned, "FATHER" and "SON" respectively. the Father is the Son shared/diversified in flesh. the Son is the Father Glorified in diversified/shared spirit as a man, this is why the Unitarians falsely supposed that the Lord Jesus "WILL" be the eternal, or Everlasting Father as Isaiah 9:6 points out. this is an ERROR on their part. the Lord Jesus is the FATHER, only shared/diversified in flesh, he have always been the Father, and always been the Son who came. his title is correct, which is, and which was, and which is to come, or I AM THAT I AM. see post #170 in the topic, "Why do so many Christains treat unbelievers as the enemy of God?"

 

[101G]

To my friend OzSpen. I would like to hear your expert advice on these two scriptures.
#1. Luke 2:11 "For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

#2. Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour".

I would like to know if this are two different saviour, or the same the same Saviour

 

[101G]

@OzSpen. what do the scriptures say on these two verses in the GREEK.

#1. Luke 2:11 "For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

#2. Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour".

I would like to know if this are two different saviour, or the same the same Saviour

apparently you cannot answer, because it will destroy your belief and expose your false doctrine, even if you claim 3 person or a person as agent of God......... (smile) both are wrong.

it's the SAME person, only diversified, meaning that he;s the G243 allos of himself in flesh.

 

[OzSpen]

@OzSpen. what do the scriptures say on these two verses in the GREEK.

#1. Luke 2:11 "For unto you is born this day in the city of David a Saviour, which is Christ the Lord.

#2. Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour".

I would like to know if this are two different saviour, or the same the same Saviour

apparently you cannot answer, because it will destroy your belief and expose your false doctrine, even if you claim 3 person or a person as agent of God......... (smile) both are wrong.

it's the SAME person, only diversified, meaning that he;s the G243 allos of himself in flesh.

This is what happens when you cherry pick single verses and come up with your strange doctrine. There is NOTHING in Lk 2:11 or Isa 43:11 that destroys my Trinitarian belief system.

Lk 2:11 speaks of Jesus the Saviour.
Isa 43:11 is in the midst of a prophecy and deals with the Lord God who is the saviour (small S) for Israel. He saved Israel on so many occasions. Remember coming out of Egypt and crossing the Red Sea??? Throughout the OT there are numerous examples of the Lord the saviour who saved Israel.

Jesus, the Saviour, refers to the one who became flesh to die on the cross and be resurrected to provide salvation from sin for all who would repent and place their faith in Jesus alone for salvation.

So is the original of Isa 43:11 in Greek??

Trick issues don't work with me.

Oz

 

[101G]

This is what happens when you cherry pick single verses and come up with your strange doctrine. There is NOTHING in Lk 2:11 or Isa 43:11 that destroys my Trinitarian belief system.

Lk 2:11 speaks of Jesus the Saviour.
Isa 43:11 is in the midst of a prophecy and deals with the Lord God who is the saviour (small S) for Israel. He saved Israel on so many occasions. Remember coming out of Egypt and crossing the Red Sea??? Throughout the OT there are numerous examples of the Lord the saviour who saved Israel.

Jesus, the Saviour, refers to the one who became flesh to die on the cross and be resurrected to provide salvation from sin for all who would repent and place their faith in Jesus alone for salvation.

So is the original of Isa 43:11 in Greek??

Trick issues don't work with me.

Oz

LOL, LOL, LOL, I love you educated guys,
#1. you said, "Lk 2:11 speaks of Jesus the Saviour.", and then you said, "Isa 43:11 is in the midst of a prophecy and deals with the Lord God who is the saviour (small S) for Israel. He saved Israel on so many occasions. Remember coming out of Egypt and crossing the Red Sea??? Throughout the OT there are numerous examples of the Lord the saviour who saved Israel". LIE, that's physical saving. the Lord Jesus didn't come to save us physically, but spiritually. see how you lie. Israel was looking for a physical deliverance just as you Ignorantly stated.
Now revelation TIME, the small "s" in saviour is the LORD, all cap diversified spirit in flesh, supportive scripture, Zechariah 4:6 "Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts". LOL, LOL my, my, my. yes, the LORD's spirit, small case "s" in spirit, as in small case saviour..... LOL, LOL, LOL, how Ignorant you are of the scripture. see oz, you don't get this in seminary. this is acquired in the Holy Spirit, GOD almighty. 1 Corinthians 2:13 "Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual".
#2. then you said, "Jesus, the Saviour, refers to the one who became flesh to die on the cross and be resurrected to provide salvation from sin for all who would repent and place their faith in Jesus alone for salvation". the one who became flesh? YES, and that's the LORD all caps, Isaiah 43:11 "I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. thank oz, you're good for something.

conclusion it's the same person, not two difference person, but the same one person diversified, or shared in flesh. so oz, your doctrine is false, be ye it Unitarianism, or the three person doctrine....

 

[101G]

Ladies and gentleman of the jury I rest my case for now. the expert oz, have certified the doctrine of "diversified Oneness" by explain, or the lack of explaining, how the Lord Jesus is the Saviour (small case "s") as the LORD, (all caps). this in turn certified that the God in the OT is the Lord Jesus in the NT who came in flesh. in the OT the Lord Jesus did not have flesh and bone, only until, when he MANIFESTED in flesh, or personified himself in flesh according to John 1:1. this is the reason why Genesis 1:26 was saying "us" and "our" which was to come, supportive scripture, Romans 5:14 "Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come". the "us" and the "we" was to come. and he did, God don't lie. that's why the Lord Jesus is the G243 allos of himself in flesh. yes, God name is "YESHUA", transliterated, "JESUS".

so I thank my friend and expert oz for that confirmation.

PS to my friend Oz. you have two strikes, the gifts of tongue, and now the Godhead. would you like to try for three Psalms 110:1... (smile)

 

[bbyrd009]

Ladies and gentleman of the jury I rest my case for now.

mired in Law much? Imo it is a poor characterization at best, and comes across as self serving. Oz' pov is as valid for him as yours is for you, after all. After all, you assume the place of Judge here, in rendering a decision; when at best you are a lawyer, in this rather stark analogy, yes?

 

[101G]

mired in Law much? Imo it is a poor characterization at best, and comes across as self serving. Oz' pov is as valid for him as yours is for you, after all. After all, you assume the place of Judge here, in rendering a decision; when at best you are a lawyer, in this rather stark analogy, yes?

you can hold that. I never declared myself a scholar, he did, and two it's makes me no difference. and I just used his scholarly - ship to prove my point. now as for a place of Judging here, I'm not one bit concern, .. (smile). my beliefs and doctrine is solidified. don't need yours or anyone else approval.. . now, I'll have fun with whom I will, but as U said, this was your opinion........ (smile).

 

[OzSpen]

LOL, LOL, LOL, I love you educated guys,
#1. you said, "Lk 2:11 speaks of Jesus the Saviour.", and then you said, "Isa 43:11 is in the midst of a prophecy and deals with the Lord God who is the saviour (small S) for Israel.

It has zero to do with 'you educated guys'. It has to do with my knowing the Word of God and interpreting in context.

Any other time you use LOL, I will not reply to you because it is an Appeal to Ridicule Fallacy.

 

[OzSpen]

now, I'll have fun with whom I will, but as U said, this was your opinion........ (smile).

So you are using an Appeal to Emotion Fallacy instead of using reason to 'win your argument.

So is your meant to indicate you really won't use 'fun' in your reply to me and that you will be serious with the Scriptures?



Oz

 

[101G]

So you are using an Appeal to Emotion Fallacy instead of using reason to 'win your argument.

So is your meant to indicate you really won't use 'fun' in your reply to me and that you will be serious with the Scriptures?

View attachment 962

Oz

Nope.... LOL, it's funny how educate men struggle with the word of God. hey don't i suppose to be on your ignore list... (smile).

see you couldn't answer the question. and in trying, you lied. so I give you another chance. Isaiah 35:4 "Say to them that are of a fearful heart, Be strong, fear not: behold, your God will come with vengeance, even God with a recompence; he will come and save you". so Oz who came .... now remember this is OT.

 

[OzSpen]

Nope.... LOL, it's funny how educate men struggle with the word of God.

I have a very high view of Scripture, believing in the inerrancy of Scripture in the original documents.

I do not struggle with the word of God. That's a false allegation.

I will stand up and be counted when false teaching is being perpetrated. That's what you've been doing in some of your posts on this forum. I'll refute you from Scripture.

By the way, how many educated people were used to translate the Bible that you use? Or was the translation done by farmers who did not know Hebrew, Aramaic and Koine Greek grammar?

I come from a sugar cane farming family. I did not learn Koine Greek in that family. I had to go to college to learn Greek. Why are you so opposed to educated people?

Oz

 

[101G]

To Oz, look, let's get pass your pride, I'm trying to help you. now listen up. the sticking point is in PERSON(s). I'll start you off on the basic. understand, G243 Allos means what?. once you answer that then we can build.

 

[OzSpen]

To Oz, look, let's get pass your pride, I'm trying to help you. now listen up. the sticking point is in PERSON(s). I'll start you off on the basic. understand, G243 Allos means what?. once you answer that then we can build.

This is an Appeal to Ignorance Fallacy. We cannot have a logical conversation when you carry on like this and treat me as an idiot.

Bye,
Oz

 

[101G]

This is an Appeal to Ignorance Fallacy. We cannot have a logical conversation when you carry on like this and treat me as an idiot.

Another cop-out. I have always said, "if someone call you a dog, why bark, unless it's true... (smile).
same as an idiot, why act like one, or say someone is treat you like one if you're not?. if you know that you're not an idiot, then don't bark. (I mean act like one)... .

so when you're ready to ask, and answer biblical question, instead of lying, then we can have a logical conversation, until then mum's the word.......

 

[bbyrd009]

but as U said, this was your opinion

well, you rendered a decision too, and that is not opinion wadr.

 

[101G]

since there was some interest in this topic, as of today 09/13/17. I'm encourage to add more to understanding this doctrine. to understand the plurality of this doctrine and God, two words one needs to make themselves familiar with. 1. G243 Allos and G2087 heteros. both means "another", but with different understanding. #2. H259 אֶחָד 'echad.

in definition #1 of G243 Allos and G2087 heteros, Vine's Expository Dictionary of New Testament Words gives a good definition of both. Allos expresses a numerical difference and denotes another of the same sort. heteros expresses a qualitative difference and denotes "another of a different sort". the Hebrew word "Adam" simply means "ANOTHER", either G243 Allos and, or G2087 heteros . Eve, the woman is "ANOTHER" of the man expressed as G243 Allos.
ADAM: H120 אָדָם 'adam (aw-dawm') n-m.
ruddy i.e. a human being (an individual or the species, mankind, etc.).
[from H119]
KJV: X another, + hypocrite, + common sort, X low, man (mean, of low degree), person.
see, Adam is as I have bold in blue means another of oneself. the woman is an Adam, (see Genesis 5:1 & 2). the Lord Jesus is ANOTHER of God as the definition of G243 Allos states. meaning he is of the same "SORT". and sort means, according to dictionary.com. a particular kind, species, variety, class, or group, distinguished by a common character or nature. the Lord Jesus is in the GOD class, in the GOD group, in the GOD kind. now knowing this , allos also expresses a numerical difference, meaning more than ONE, hence the plurality of God according to Genesis 1:1 and his expression of "us" and "we" in Genesis 1:26.
expressing "diversity", which we Get the word "OFFSPRING". definition time. OFFSPRING: G1085 γένος genos (ǰe'-nos) n.
kin. (abstract or concrete, literal or figurative, individual or collective)
[from G1096]
KJV: born, country(-man), diversity, generation, kind(-red), nation, offspring, stock
Root(s): G1096

see, this is where I get the title of this doctrine from "diversified oneness". diversity simply means "OFFSPRING" or another from oneself. just like Eve is "another" of the man. the Lord Jesus is the "offspring", or the "ANOTHER", or the G24 Allos of God in flesh. this should be clear now. if not re-read it again.


now, the Hebrew word which correspond with this plurality in the OT, H259 אֶחָד 'echad. which my Masonic Jewish friends now hold to and use to show God's plurality of ONE. their error is this, not a unity of one which the word express, but a separation of two or more. and God is not separated. for Phil 2:6 states, "Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God". if one is "another" then the wording would be "equal TO". but the word of God is clear, "equal WITH" indicating the same one, only shared, indicating a numerical difference as G243 Allos express. meaning 1, a Title holder "Father", and 2, a title holder of "Son"

the verify this, Father (Spirit), subjective, abstract. Son (Flesh and Bones) Objective, concrete. see the allos, or the plurality now?.

hope this helped. or only for eyes to see.

be blessed.

 

[Helen]

I don't pretend to be smart at all..LOL So much goes over my head. You have to talk 'street talk' to me.
My husband understands and says he likes what you say here and agrees.
So are you saying the the godhead is like triplets ? (My dad was an identical twin.)
Triplets = One Egg = but three individual identities, fingerprints etc ?
My dad and his twin brother didn't have to speak much. He told me that things would happen like...his brother would run up stairs for something, come down, and throw a book down next to my dad saying ..."you wanted me to bring this didn't you?" Dad said they were like that all the time.
Moving that up into the spiritual realm of the Godhead...One in every thought, plan and desire...(except fingerprints.)
Am I anywhere near close? haha!

 

[Helen]

Oh golly, I have JUST seen that there are five pages here to read...I only read the first one!!! I see I have much to read...after I have checked the other new posts today.