The Holy Spirit ?

[bbyrd009]

Actually while I kind of thought of it that way for before that, a discussion with our old friend Kerry some years ago helped clarify it for me. At first it had to do with colors in scripture. The discussion of colors led to the color of blood, which led to the discussion of the connection between Blood and Spirit. Red blood is carnal for the flesh of the old man. The following is a copy of a pertinent part of that conversation:

Jesus did shed his natural blood, but was that the source of Life for you and for me? Within Jesus was real Life. Perhaps better said: Jesus was/is real Life.

Jesus yielded up the Ghost or he shed the Spirit, the Spirit that was to become available to whosoever will, no?

“Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. ” Matt 27:50

The Ghost is the Holy Ghost or Holy Spirit for Jesus. He was preparing to share with whosoever will the Spirit within him by shedding it. This is the Life promised to us and/or for us:

”Who also hath made us able ministers of the new testament; not of the letter, but of the spirit: for the letter killeth, but the spirit giveth life." II Cor 3:6

The natural blood is a giver of natural life. The spirit of man is a corrupted spirit, which was first corrupted in the Garden of Eden. That spirit provides only natural, temporal or carnal life. That spirit cannot give the Life which Jesus is:

"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." John 14:6

What was it Zechariah wrote?

"Then he answered and spake unto me, saying, This is the word of the LORD unto Zerubbabel, saying, Not by might, nor by power, but by my spirit, saith the LORD of hosts." Zech 4:6

The blood we are to drink [John 6:53] is/was not the natural blood of Jesus consisting of approximately 10 pints inherited from his carnal mother, Mary. That blood was spilled and lost in natural death. The Life giving blood he spilled or shed or spread was the Spirit, the Holy Spirit when he yielded up the Ghost (Spirit).

Well, white is a good color in scripture, while red is the color of natural blood. I do not believe that emphasis is ever put on the color of the blood of Jesus, which we are to drink as being red. I remember having read or heard somewhere that His blood, spiritually was white. I am certain I still have the reference somewhere, but cannot recall where at the moment.[this paragraph is Kerry's]

It is not the red blood of the man who died on the cross 2,000 years ago that is the Life we need. That red blood was the natural blood of a natural man and it probably all spilled out on the ground to end the carnal life of the flesh of Jesus.

The source of Life for us, spiritually speaking, is the Spirit, which is to quicken us. Is it really white? Probably not in the sense that a sheet of paper is white, but rather in the sense that it is pure and spotless without any detracting or negative parts. This is what God is. This would, of course, be what His Spirit is. When the book of Revelation speaks of being clothed in white raiment, it is not speaking of material natural clothing made from cloth. Is it even speaking of a natural color? White from what I remember of my high school physics is the sum of all the colors of light mixed together. Wouldn't that be the "very good" of Gen 1:31?

Well maybe you can take it from there.I never really specifically dealt with it much more than that although it has almost always for years now been where I am on it.

Say Hi to Dave.

"white" blood cells are an interesting reflection in there too imo, especially given their function and MO, their mechanism of operation

 

[amadeus]

ah, now i see why i don't like this perspective; as it strikes me as trying to eat Law to get Grace or something?
Iow this has obviously served you well, but imo there are more rungs on the ladder of "eating Christ's Flesh," that you might not seek simply bc you are happy with your current definition of "eating Christ's Flesh," which Scripture was certainly derived from, but nonetheless still is not.

It is a dead carcass that we eat. It is not only eating the Bible, but things that we hear and see as we moved through God's creation. Everyone does it, but for most people, it remains mostly dead because they remain dead [this is dead to God]. When and if any of it is brought to Life in us, then to that extent it is no longer a dead carcass but the Living Word and we, we are a Living Soul because of the quickening Spirit. ["And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit." I Cor 15:45]

The problem in a conversation like this about the things of God an answer may not really be needed [God's definition of "needed" rather than yours or mine] so a pertinent part of scripture is not quickened and the only answer available and/or given is the carnal answer. The Holy Spirit in us does the quickening and gives us the Word, but this is not at our beck and call. Jeremiah's words remain in effect:

"O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it is not in man that walketh to direct his steps." Jerem 10:23

Anyway, a great model that i would recommend to others, even
ah, so it worked out great anyway iow

Yes, it worked out because I learned why I was defenseless. I had scripture but not the Word of God. People who cannot see the difference will find themselves in trouble.

 

[amadeus]

"white" blood cells are an interesting reflection in there too imo, especially given their function and MO, their mechanism of operation

Help me with this. The white blood cells are for our bodies defense, right? They attack things within the blood stream that are hurting us or potentially could hurt us. Can you take it from there spiritually? I would appreciate it.

 

[amadeus]

you have not yet been called to sweat any blood bible - Google Search

a Living Sacrifice does not literally bleed, all the "bleeding" is internal lol

Again my mind is going blank on this. Will you amplify spiritually if you can?

 

[bbyrd009]

Help me with this. The white blood cells are for our bodies defense, right? They attack things within the blood stream that are hurting us or potentially could hurt us. Can you take it from there spiritually? I would appreciate it.

oh, i heard a pastor make a sermon out of it once, but really those are the high spots. When something Foreign enters the blood, a decision is made based upon, essentially, the fruit of the Foreign Agent, whether beneficial or harmful, then they all act on the agent the same way. A whacked immune system will attack the wrong things, and not attack the right ones, and the food we eat--or rather, don't eat--has a big impact on their health. Plus they are either all healthy, or not, generally speaking, iow there is no division there, all are affected the same way by the choices made by the ego or id, the Priest. There are no pockets of "special healthy white blood cells" iow, nowhere to go for that.

Again my mind is going blank on this. Will you amplify spiritually if you can?

oh, a parent suffering through one of their kids' learning lessons comes to mind, one of their later kids say, bc they tried helping kid 1 in that situation, and that didn't work, right, so with kid2 you just bite your tongue and suffer with them, at least if you're smart, right. And by kid 8, ...well, that is a different lesson i guess lol.

So, we are talking about "children" learning lessons, but there is a lesson, several lessons, about our relationship to our "children" in there, too, they end up not being an extensions of our egos as we imagine at first, even as they choose which aspects of us to extend, and i guess prolly highlight or mirror a parent's behavior back to the parent in revealing ways, like convicting the parent, in the sincerest way possible? something like that?

 

[Helen]

<snip>
Jesus did shed his natural blood, but was that the source of Life for you and for me? Within Jesus was real Life. Perhaps better said: Jesus was/is real Life.

Well, white is a good color in scripture, while red is the color of natural blood. I do not believe that emphasis is ever put on the color of the blood of Jesus, which we are to drink as being red. I remember having read or heard somewhere that His blood, spiritually was white. I am certain I still have the reference somewhere, but cannot recall where at the moment.[this paragraph is Kerry's]

It is not the red blood of the man who died on the cross 2,000 years ago that is the Life we need. That red blood was the natural blood of a natural man and it probably all spilled out on the ground to end the carnal life of the flesh of Jesus.
The source of Life for us, spiritually speaking, is the Spirit, which is to quicken us. Is it really white? Probably not in the sense that a sheet of paper is white, but rather in the sense that it is pure and spotless without any detracting or negative parts. This is what God is. This would, of course, be what His Spirit is. When the book of Revelation speaks of being clothed in white raiment, it is not speaking of material natural clothing made from cloth. Is it even speaking of a natural color? White from what I remember of my high school physics is the sum of all the colors of light mixed together. Wouldn't that be the "very good" of Gen 1:31?

Well maybe you can take it from there.I never really specifically dealt with it much more than that although it has almost always for years now been where I am on it.

Thanks John.
We ( Dave and I ) too believe that the blood of Adam was light/white. ( in his pre sin state) there is a relation between light and blood...blood being a lower form of light.
I remember hearing a word shared which we then took as 'our own' position. Being that - when the Holy Spirit covered Mary and she conceived of the Spirit. Luke 1:35 "The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God."
I believe the flesh and spirit met 'in Mary'...within the seed of God that implanted within her was that drip of blood from Father. "God, in Christ, reconciling the world unto Himself... "
So since way back, we believe that the flesh of Jesus was Mary's but the blood of Jesus was God's...coloured red from Adam/Mary also. Which was to be shed for the remission of sin. By which we are saved, cleansed, set free, delivered and kept.
I cannot through out the concept that maybe the Holy Spirit and the Blood of Jesus were one and the same.
Yet I have to muse on the thoughts that the blood was shed at Calvary.
Yet He said to them- "If I go not away the Comforter cannot come"...yet if the blood be the Holy Spirit...It/He was already there, being shed at the cross!
I can see I have much musing to yet do on this. Thanks for the provocation...I like being made to think. (And always appreciate that it is a gift which our old friend Kerry has. Maybe we should invite him here to this Site...I have often thought of that. )

 

[amadeus]

@bbyrd009

Amadeus said: Help me with this. The white blood cells are for our bodies defense, right? They attack things within the blood stream that are hurting us or potentially could hurt us. Can you take it from there spiritually? I would appreciate it.

bbyrd009 said:
oh, i heard a pastor make a sermon out of it once, but really those are the high spots. When something Foreign enters the blood, a decision is made based upon, essentially, the fruit of the Foreign Agent, whether beneficial or harmful, then they all act on the agent the same way. A whacked immune system will attack the wrong things, and not attack the right ones, and the food we eat--or rather, don't eat--has a big impact on their health. Plus they are either all healthy, or not, generally speaking, iow there is no division there, all are affected the same way by the choices made by the ego or id, the Priest. There are no pockets of "special healthy white blood cells" iow, nowhere to go for that.

Perhaps what I can make of this is that the Holy Spirit in us can only work for or against what it knows. What it knows is according to what we have consumed. If we faithfully eat of the flesh of Jesus, then the Holy Spirit has fresh and complete information and/or ammunition to properly fight the enemies within us. This is the white blood cell role of the Holy Spirit. It is effectively fighting to kill any and all remnants of the old man and his ways.

On the other hand, the red blood cells if I remember correctly carry in the new food and carry out the waste products. This is another role of the Holy Spirit within us to build up the new man with new food [the sources of the good things of God, which may include scripture, the flesh of Jesus, etc.]
so that the new man grows with the Life given to the food by the Holy Spirit itself.

 

[amadeus]

@bbyrd009

bbyrd009 said: "you have not yet been called to sweat any blood"

a Living Sacrifice does not literally bleed, all the "bleeding" is internal lol

Amadeus said: Again my mind is going blank on this. Will you amplify spiritually if you can?

bbyrd009 said: oh, a parent suffering through one of their kids' learning lessons comes to mind, one of their later kids say, bc they tried helping kid 1 in that situation, and that didn't work, right, so with kid2 you just bite your tongue and suffer with them, at least if you're smart, right. And by kid 8, ...well, that is a different lesson i guess lol.

So, we are talking about "children" learning lessons, but there is a lesson, several lessons, about our relationship to our "children" in there, too, they end up not being an extensions of our egos as we imagine at first, even as they choose which aspects of us to extend, and i guess prolly highlight or mirror a parent's behavior back to the parent in revealing ways, like convicting the parent, in the sincerest way possible? something like that?

The blood [red] coming out is under the pressure of Jesus' concern for his own physical suffering to come and/or the unrelieved pain and suffering of the people around him until the Way is opened by him. Is the physical manifestation of blood being sweated out another type or shadow of the Holy Spirit pressing to come out of Jesus to accomplish God's will for people? The people are the children in need of relief, but from the natural parent even with the shedding of his red blood will not, cannot, accomplish the task. Maybe I have missed this. Let me know what you see...

 

[Richard_oti]

of course, what else should one expect from one in the Holy of Holies, other than "you are not forgiven?"

Mat 6:14 For if ye forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
15 But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

don't you realize who he is?

Apparently not. Oh well, of course, it ain't the first time I have failed to realize such.

 

[Jonadab]

Not the voice of God, but certainly the Spirit of God.

All Three of the common Trinity doctrine simply come to us in personified fashion by the way that God has revealed them. These are not assumptions, nor is "persons" completely accurate: There is so much more. It is the Holy Spirit (of God) who personifies the mysteries of God and the world to come, which now is.

 

[Jonadab]

What is the holy spirit ? It is not a person like God. Rather, it is God's active force. -Psalm 104:30.
Trinity is not a Bible teaching.

 

[101G]

What is the holy spirit ? It is not a person like God. Rather, it is God's active force. -Psalm 104:30.
Trinity is not a Bible teaching.

first welcome to the board. but in addressing your post. U said, the Holy Spirit, "It is not a person like God". I must disagree with you here, the Holy is Spirit is the only true God. and he is the only person in the Godhead.

the verse you posted, Psalm 104:30 is not speaking of the Holy Spirit, but man's spirit. supportive scripture, Isaiah 42:5 "Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein". see it now?.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

 

[ScottA]

What is the holy spirit ? It is not a person like God. Rather, it is God's active force. -Psalm 104:30.
Trinity is not a Bible teaching.

You misspeak.

Jesus Himself instructed that all people be baptized "in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost", referring to "Him" as "another Helper."

 

[Jonadab]

first welcome to the board. but in addressing your post. U said, the Holy Spirit, "It is not a person like God". I must disagree with you here, the Holy is Spirit is the only true God. and he is the only person in the Godhead.

the verse you posted, Psalm 104:30 is not speaking of the Holy Spirit, but man's spirit. supportive scripture, Isaiah 42:5 "Thus saith God the LORD, he that created the heavens, and stretched them out; he that spread forth the earth, and that which cometh out of it; he that giveth breath unto the people upon it, and spirit to them that walk therein". see it now?.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

 

[Jonadab]

Psalm 104:30:"If you (Jehovah) send forth your spirit, they are created. And you make the face of the grond new." Read also Genesis 1:2.
A comparison of Bible trxts that refer to the holy spirit shows that it is spoken of as 'filling' people; they can be 'baptized' with it; and they can be "anointed" with it. (Luke 1:41 Matt. 3:11; Acts 10:38)
None of these expressions would be appropriate if the holy spirit were a person.
Go to JW.org and ask for a free Bible-study.

 

[Helen]

Psalm 104:30:"If you (Jehovah) send forth your spirit, they are created. And you make the face of the grond new." Read also Genesis 1:2.
A comparison of Bible trxts that refer to the holy spirit shows that it is spoken of as 'filling' people; they can be 'baptized' with it; and they can be "anointed" with it. (Luke 1:41 Matt. 3:11; Acts 10:38)
None of these expressions would be appropriate if the holy spirit were a person.
Go to JW.org and ask for a free Bible-study.

I cannot agree..Jesus says John 15:-
"Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me."
I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing."

I have no problem at all with agree with the scriptures!!
HE is in me...and I walk IN HIM!!

If Jesus said that the Holy Spirit was a HE, and not an IT, that is good enough for me.
John 16:13
"Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come."

 

[bbyrd009]

The people are the children in need of relief, but from the natural parent even with the shedding of his red blood will not, cannot, accomplish the task. Maybe I have missed this. Let me know what you see...

ha, i guess you, um, nailed it alright, and "My God, why have You forsaken Me?" can now come to be understood better

 

[101G]

Psalm 104:30:"If you (Jehovah) send forth your spirit, they are created. And you make the face of the grond new." Read also Genesis 1:2.
A comparison of Bible trxts that refer to the holy spirit shows that it is spoken of as 'filling' people; they can be 'baptized' with it; and they can be "anointed" with it. (Luke 1:41 Matt. 3:11; Acts 10:38)
None of these expressions would be appropriate if the holy spirit were a person.
Go to JW.org and ask for a free Bible-study.

no need to go to JW.org, but if you insist, so be it. let's eliminate your premise that the Holy Spirit is not a person. you quoted in Psalms 104:30 (Jehovah) send forth your spirit, they are created. let's see who your (Jehovah) really is. from JW.org, your new world translation. scripture, Revelation 22:6 "He said to me: “These words are faithful* and true; yes, Jehovah, the God who inspired the prophets, has sent his angel to show his slaves the things that must shortly take place". so your Jehovah sent his angel, right. well lets see who your Jehovah who sent "his" angel to slaves. listen real good, Revelation 22:16 "I, Jesus, sent my angel to bear witness to you about these things for the congregations. I am the root and the offspring of David and the bright morning star". well, well, well, you have a BIGGER problem, because your Jehovah is none other that the LORD Jesus. and now your other problem. the Lord Jesus is the Holy Spirit. John 14:16-18 "And I will ask the Father and he will give you another helper to be with you forever, 17 the spirit of the truth, which the world cannot receive, because it neither sees it nor knows it. You know it, because it remains with you and is in you. 18 I will not leave you bereaved. I am coming to you". here in your new world translation, the HELPER is coming, right. let's see who this HELPER is. 1 John 2:1 "My little children, I am writing you these things so that you may not commit a sin. And yet, if anyone does commit a sin, we have a helper with the Father, Jesus Christ, a righteous one". see Jonadab, the Lord Jesus is that "HELPER" to come. the Spirit of Truth, the HOLY SPIRIT.

all of these scriptures are of the New world translation. YOUR BIBLE.
so start with Revelation 22:6, and Revelation 22:16 answer it. then read John 14:16-18 and 1 John 2:1 answer it.

your own bible don't agree with you. if you have any questions, just ask.

Peace in Christ Yeshua.

 

[twinc]

sad, sad is it not all this misinterpretation and misunderstanding turning into blasphemy as claimed inspiration and guidance by the Holy Spirit - the prophets of old claimed "thus sayest the Lord" whilst the modern so called prophets claim "thus sayest the Holy Spirit" but fail the test of the prophet "by their fruits shall ye know them - twinc

 

[Miss Hepburn]

There are 179 posts here...I don't think this has been brought up...does anyone know why the Holy Spirit has been represented by a dove?
I know how I heard it explained.
But first, anyone? Thanks ☺