The Ones Who Are Left…

[n2thelight]

You'll never understand that, because your mind is too wrapped up in your flesh and this world.

So when it says the dead do not live again for 1000 years, you see that as living during the 1000 years?

Do the dead live during the 1000 years or not?

You don't get it .They are called the dead for the simple fact that they have a mortal soul ,unlike those who died in Christ or were His at His return .

To answer your question , yes the dead do live during the millennium , being taught the true Word of God .

Being dead during the millennium means you can die the 2nd death, which ids the death of the soul

 

[Truth7t7]

Mainly; the faithful Christians will be in the place of safety. Revelation 12:14

The Last Day is after the Millennium, as Revelation 20 describes.
Denial of the sequence of the Return and then the Millennium, as prophesied in Revelation 20 and elsewhere, is a shuffling of Revelation at the best and is a violation of scripture.

The AMill belief is wrong and is easily seen to be wrong, by reading the Prophesies and by the world at present.

Jesus Christ Returns In Fire And Final Judgement, Dissolving This Existing Earth By Fire, Immediately After The Tribulation

This Existing Heaven And Earth Will Be (Replaced) By The New Heaven, Earth, Jerusalem, A New Creation, At The Return Of Jesus Christ

(Behold, I Make All Things New)

2 Peter 3:10-13KJV
10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.
11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness,
12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat?
13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness.

Revelation 21:1-5KJV
1 And I saw a new heaven and a new earth: for the first heaven and the first earth were passed away; and there was no more sea.
2 And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.
3 And I heard a great voice out of heaven saying, Behold, the tabernacle of God is with men, and he will dwell with them, and they shall be his people, and God himself shall be with them, and be their God.
4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.
5 And he that sat upon the throne said, Behold, I make all things new. And he said unto me, Write: for these words are true and faithful.

Matthew 24:29-30KJV
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:
30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

1 Corinthians 3:13KJV
13 Every man's work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man's work of what sort it is.

Luke 17:29-30KJV
29 But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30 Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.

2 Thessalonians 1:7-9KJV
7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;

Malachi 3:2KJV
2 But who may abide the day of his coming? and who shall stand when he appeareth? for he is like a refiner's fire, and like fullers' soap:

Psalm 46:6KJV
6 The heathen raged, the kingdoms were moved: he uttered his voice, the earth melted.

Psalm 50:3KJV
3 Our God shall come, and shall not keep silence: a fire shall devour before him, and it shall be very tempestuous round about him.

Psalm 97:5KJV
5 The hills melted like wax at the presence of the Lord, at the presence of the Lord of the whole earth.

Isaiah 66:15KJV
15 For, behold, the Lord will come with fire, and with his chariots like a whirlwind, to render his anger with fury, and his rebuke with flames of fire.

Zechariah 14:12KJV
12 And this shall be the plague wherewith the Lord will smite all the people that have fought against Jerusalem; Their flesh shall consume away while they stand upon their feet, and their eyes shall consume away in their holes, and their tongue shall consume away in their mouth.

Nahum 1:5-6KJV
5 The mountains quake at him, and the hills melt, and the earth is burned at his presence, yea, the world, and all that dwell therein.
6 Who can stand before his indignation? and who can abide in the fierceness of his anger? his fury is poured out like fire, and the rocks are thrown down by him.

Revelation 20:9KJV
9 And they went up on the breadth of the earth, and compassed the camp of the saints about, and the beloved city: and fire came down from God out of heaven, and devoured them.

 

[Timtofly]

You don't get it .They are called the dead for the simple fact that they have a mortal soul ,unlike those who died in Christ or were His at His return .

To answer your question , yes the dead do live during the millennium , being taught the true Word of God .

Being dead during the millennium means you can die the 2nd death, which ids the death of the soul

Jesus just killed all humanity at Armageddon. This was all who were left. Why do people not see that during this time all 8 billion people on earth die? This is the final harvest. This is the end of Adam's flesh and blood. Amil should at least comprehend the finality of life on earth, although earth itself remains.

But the fact of this time of Greatest Trouble ever is the finality of sinful flesh. God's Wrath being poured out on the wicked, is not just to let all the wicked to continually live in sin. Adam's punishment has an expiration date. After that point, sin and sinful flesh will no longer exist. That is the climactic end of life as we know it.

The Millennium starts out with a resurrection, and those dead people in sin bodies will no longer be present. No salvation, no church, no faith in the unknown. Jesus Christ will be ruling over people without sin, nor the corruption and death of sinful flesh. This will be with an iron rod. Any disobedience will be instant death, no prison time nor reformation.

There will not be death nor funerals. There will be cursed people, who according to Isaiah 65 will die for their disobedience. It will be the blessings and curses set up by Christ. Not based on the old covenant law of sin and death. The Millennium will be a whole different time on earth.

The dead will not live again until the thousand years are finished, just like John claims in Revelation 20. Satan will be locked away in the pit. These conditions will truly exist, not just a spiritual practice:

"to finish the transgression, and to make an end of sins, and to make reconciliation for iniquity, and to bring in everlasting righteousness, and to seal up the vision and prophecy, and to anoint the most Holy"

 

[Davy]

You'll never understand that, because your mind is too wrapped up in your flesh and this world.

So when it says the dead do not live again for 1000 years, you see that as living during the 1000 years?

Do the dead live during the 1000 years or not?

I understand the Revelation 20:5 verse about "the dead" very well, because I keep all... of God's Word as written, but you do not. You instead heed doctrines devised by men that deceive, either knowingly or unknowingly.

When God's consuming fire that WILL happen on the LAST DAY of this world, on the "day of the Lord", that... is when this PRESENT FLESH WORLD EARTH AGE will end.

In the WORLD TO COME, no one will be in a flesh body!

Our flesh body is NOT what is raised from the dead. Our spiritual body is what the resurrection body is.

You haven't even understood the following basic 101 Scripture by Lord Jesus Himself of what the resurrection is...

Matt 22:30-32
30 For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven.
31 But as touching the resurrection of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
32 "I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob?" God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
KJV

That means what for those of the "resurrection of damnation" of John 5:28-29? What kind of bodies will they... be raised to?

 

[Davy]

....

Well, no…hang on a minute, you’ve still rather missed my point:

Matthew 24:31
[31] And he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Mark 13:27
[27] And then he will send out the angels and gather his elect from the four winds, from the ends of the earth to the ends of heaven.

Matthew might ONLY list ‘heaven’, but Mark has both…he doesn’t just specify ‘earth’. So…to say one passage is only saying ‘gathering the dead’ while the other is ‘gathering the alive’ is not accurate. Indeed…we ought to ask as well what “the four winds” means as well. Many argue it is not a reference to the heavenly realm, but covers the entirety of earth. Put simply, both passages are simply saying: “no matter where you are, alive or dead, if you belong to Christ, this is the time you will be gathered to him”.

Sorry to correct you, but the two passages are clearly... different. They are both about Christ sending His angels to gather His saints, but they are markedly different according to which 'group' is gathered from which 'location'.

Matthew 24:31 = gathered from heaven
Mark 13:27 = gathered from the earth

The "four winds" is the idea of its issuing from the four cardinal points, north, south, east, and west. It is used as a symbol for the resurrection idea in Ezekiel 37 and the breath. It is used in Revelation 7 and they are told to not blow yet on the earth until God has sealed His servants with His seal. Thus in Christ's Olivet discourse, it is given in connection with the day of Christ's coming and gathering of His Church. It is even connected to the idea of the 7th Vial being poured out into the "air", which actually symbolizes the end of this flesh world on the day of Christ's second coming by God's consuming fire of 2 Peter 3:10.

 

[Keraz]

Jesus just killed all humanity at Armageddon. This was all who were left. Why do people not see that during this time all 8 billion people on earth die? This is the final harvest. This is the end of Adam's flesh and blood. Amil should at least comprehend the finality of life on earth, although earth itself remains.

This belief is quite wrong. It is not what the Prophets tell us.
Jesus angels will gather the living Christian peoples to where He is at His Return. The dead must wait until the GWT Judgment, after the 1000 years have passed. Only the martyrs killed during the 42 months of Satanic control, will be raised back to life then.

This truth is proved by how there will be Death during the Millennium. Isaiah 65:20

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Clearly, Jesus wasn't talking about 'regular' water. Nor was he talking about His blood, as he was and is still very much alive.

this I don’t understand. “Nor was he about his blood, as he was and is still very much alive.”
John 6:55 For my flesh is meat indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.

Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit. You said or commented about being filled with the Spirit …what is to be filled if not to be filled with His righteousness “not meat and drink; but righteousness, peace, and joy in the Holy Spirit”?

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Lazarus was also raised from the dead into a permanent incorruptible physical body, without a sin nature.

you said “Lazarus also raised from the dead into a permanent incorruptible physical body, without a sin nature.” I have to ask then what of the “firstborn from the dead”? Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

?

 

[Timtofly]

you said “Lazarus also raised from the dead into a permanent incorruptible physical body, without a sin nature.” I have to ask then what of the “firstborn from the dead”? Colossians 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.

Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

Colossians 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

Hebrews 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

?

Christ was born before Christ raised Lazarus from the dead. How much sin nature do you accuse Jesus of having?

In Matthew 27:50-53, which is it? Are they resurrected when Jesus said it is finished, or later. You still have resurrection before the resurrection.

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."

Is God able to do as God pleases, or do some literally hold God to His Word, via interpretation? Is Jesus then a liar, and not able to raise the dead with a permanent incorruptible physical body? Your choice which way you want to make God look bad. It is your objection, not mine.

I interpret Jesus Christ already having a permanent incorruptible physical body. Jesus gave up the Breath of Life. John 10:17-18

"Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father."

Jesus already claimed no one could take His life. He had God's command to both die and resurrect His own life.

 

[Naomi25]

I fully agree we need to converse in forums, however there is one future resurrection of all on the last day, and there isn't wiggle room to change this biblical truth, it's that simple

I would see scripture saying the same thing. I have even argued for it. But…I’m unsure that the best way to enter into a conversation is to declare outright that there is zero wiggle room. You’re not going to engage many people in an open conversation that way..it’ll be more a case of two (or more) folks throwing hard opinions at one another. And I just don’t know how helpful that would be…even trying to reach the truth…you know? People mostly don’t get up after being smacked in the head with a plank and go “goodness, that was the truth that just hit me”, and respect and embrace it. They give it the bird and walk away. Well…here in AU they’d tend to.

 

[Naomi25]

Sorry to correct you, but the two passages are clearly... different. They are both about Christ sending His angels to gather His saints, but they are markedly different according to which 'group' is gathered from which 'location'.

Matthew 24:31 = gathered from heaven
Mark 13:27 = gathered from the earth

The "four winds" is the idea of its issuing from the four cardinal points, north, south, east, and west. It is used as a symbol for the resurrection idea in Ezekiel 37 and the breath. It is used in Revelation 7 and they are told to not blow yet on the earth until God has sealed His servants with His seal. Thus in Christ's Olivet discourse, it is given in connection with the day of Christ's coming and gathering of His Church. It is even connected to the idea of the 7th Vial being poured out into the "air", which actually symbolizes the end of this flesh world on the day of Christ's second coming by God's consuming fire of 2 Peter 3:10.

You say they’re markedly different, but they’re just not. They are “a little” different. And by that, you’d say…a smidge off exactly different.
Look. If one said “gather from the heavens” and the other said “gather from the earth”…I’d concede that it’s an interesting difference. The problem, as I’ve said before. Is that Matthew says “gathered from the heavens”, and Mark says “gathered from the heavens and the earth”. And then they both say “and from the four winds”. So, in point of fact, the ONLY difference we see in Matthew, is that he leaves out ‘earth’…but as you say above, the ‘four winds’ can be metaphorical of the four points ‘north, south, east, west’…the breadth of the earth, in point of fact.
When we put that together with the KNOWN fact that gospel accounts ARE slightly different, then there is little expectation that this MUST be describing different events. The passages are just too similar. And when we go to Paul’s 1 Thess 4 and see that, once again, the two (alive and dead) are talked about in the same verse, then we have nothing to suppose that both Mark and Matthew are not doing the same as well.
And…considering I’ve gone over this about 4 times now, that’s the last time I do it, regardless of how you disagree, which I know you will. Cheers, feel free to.

 

[VictoryinJesus]

Christ was born before Christ raised Lazarus from the dead. How much sin nature do you accuse Jesus of having?

In Matthew 27:50-53, which is it? Are they resurrected when Jesus said it is finished, or later. You still have resurrection before the resurrection.

"Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost. And, behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent; And the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,
And came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many."

Is God able to do as God pleases, or do some literally hold God to His Word, via interpretation? Is Jesus then a liar, and not able to raise the dead with a permanent incorruptible physical body? Your choice which way you want to make God look bad. It is your objection, not mine.

I interpret Jesus Christ already having a permanent incorruptible physical body. Jesus gave up the Breath of Life. John 10:17-18

"Therefore doth my Father love me, because I lay down my life, that I might take it again. No man taketh it from me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This commandment have I received of my Father."

Jesus already claimed no one could take His life. He had God's command to both die and resurrect His own life.

I do see what you are saying but it doesn’t make sense to me how He can be the firstborn among many brethren …firstborn that He may have preeminence…firstborn from the dead? Also “forerunner” as Hebrews 6:17-20 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: [18] That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us: [19] Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; [20] Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

What of all those raised prior is what I’m asking? You said (unless I’ve misunderstood) Lazarus being raised up from the dead, received an incorruptible body to never die again? Strong's Greek: 4274. πρόδρομος (prodromos) -- a running forward, going in advance

 

[Timtofly]

I do see what you are saying but it doesn’t make sense to me how He can be the firstborn among many brethren …firstborn that He may have preeminence…firstborn from the dead? Also “forerunner” as Hebrews 6:17-20 Wherein God, willing more abundantly to shew unto the heirs of promise the immutability of his counsel, confirmed it by an oath: [18] That by two immutable things, in which it was impossible for God to lie, we might have a strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold upon the hope set before us: [19] Which hope we have as an anchor of the soul, both sure and stedfast, and which entereth into that within the veil; [20] Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

What of all those raised prior is what I’m asking? You said (unless I’ve misunderstood) Lazarus being raised up from the dead, received an incorruptible body to never die again? Strong's Greek: 4274. πρόδρομος (prodromos) -- a running forward, going in advance

I do not see Jesus raising Lazarus into a sin nature corruptible body as proof of the Resurrection and the Life. Other people were brought back from near death experiences. It was acknowledged that Lazarus had been dead 4 days, even longer than the acceptable 3 days. His body would have to either be miraculously healed despite being in a very bad state of decay, or entirely free of decay. I think this is the leper talked about as well. He may have already been missing some limbs even while alive. The Resurrection would not have been believable either way still by many. While this is speculation based on much other historical speculation of others, it should not be a factor either way.

My sole point was that Jesus Christ could both remove sin from a person's life as well as restore life 4 days after death. Neither could be done without Jesus being God. The Pharisees did fear Jesus after that event.

"If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation."

Jesus accomplished all that is claimed in being the firstborn of many brethren into the family of God. Lazarus was proof Jesus Christ was God. He was the Resurrection and the Life.

 

[Truth7t7]

I would see scripture saying the same thing. I have even argued for it. But…I’m unsure that the best way to enter into a conversation is to declare outright that there is zero wiggle room. You’re not going to engage many people in an open conversation that way..it’ll be more a case of two (or more) folks throwing hard opinions at one another. And I just don’t know how helpful that would be…even trying to reach the truth…you know? People mostly don’t get up after being smacked in the head with a plank and go “goodness, that was the truth that just hit me”, and respect and embrace it. They give it the bird and walk away. Well…here in AU they’d tend to.

Respectful debate, and let Gods words be true, it's that simple

Hebrews 4:12KJV
12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

Ephesians 6:10-18KJV
10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.
11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.
12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.
13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.
14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;
15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;
16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.
17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:
18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

 

[VictoryinJesus]

I do not see Jesus raising Lazarus into a sin nature corruptible body as proof of the Resurrection and the Life. Other people were brought back from near death experiences. It was acknowledged that Lazarus had been dead 4 days, even longer than the acceptable 3 days. His body would have to either be miraculously healed despite being in a very bad state of decay, or entirely free of decay. I think this is the leper talked about as well. He may have already been missing some limbs even while alive. The Resurrection would not have been believable either way still by many. While this is speculation based on much other historical speculation of others, it should not be a factor either way.

My sole point was that Jesus Christ could both remove sin from a person's life as well as restore life 4 days after death. Neither could be done without Jesus being God. The Pharisees did fear Jesus after that event.

"If we let him thus alone, all men will believe on him: and the Romans shall come and take away both our place and nation."

Jesus accomplished all that is claimed in being the firstborn of many brethren into the family of God. Lazarus was proof Jesus Christ was God. He was the Resurrection and the Life.

I do see your point and feel bad since that is not the topic of the thread (feeling like I’m going off in to too many directions), so I’ll leave it alone. Your comment earlier concerning Lazarus just stumped me. Like the man that went to sleep and fell from the window taken up dead. And Paul saying “trouble not yourselves; for his life is in him.”

 

[Davy]

You say they’re markedly different, but they’re just not. They are “a little” different. And by that, you’d say…a smidge of exactly different.
Look. If one said “gather from the heavens” and the other said “gather from the earth”…I’d concede that it’s an interesting difference. The problem, as I’ve said before. Is that Matthew says “gathered from the heavens”, and Mark says “gathered from the heavens and the earth”. And then they both say “and from the four winds”. So, in point of fact, the ONLY difference we see in Matthew, is that he leaves out ‘earth’…but as you say above, the ‘four winds’ can be metaphorical of the four points ‘north, south, east, west’…the breadth of the earth, in point of fact.
When we put that together with the KNOWN fact that gospel accounts ARE slightly different, then there is little expectation that this MUST be describing different events. The passages are just too similar. And when we go to Paul’s 1 Thess 4 and see that, once again, the two (alive and dead) are talked about in the same verse, then we have nothing to suppose that both Mark and Matthew are not doing the same as well.
And…considering I’ve gone over this about 4 times now, that’s the last time I do it, regardless of how you disagree, which I know you will. Cheers, feel free to.

If you would rather not heed those Scriptures as written, fine, your choice. But you'll never convince me they are exactly the same, otherwise I... would be the one who needs eye glasses.

So... are you a believer on the Pre-tribulational Rapture Theory??? I know the Pre-trib school preaches that Christ's Olivet discourse is not for us. Is that why you reject that Scripture maybe?

 

[Truth7t7]

If you would rather not heed those Scriptures as written, fine, your choice. But you'll never convince me they are exactly the same, otherwise I... would be the one who needs eye glasses.

So... are you a believer on the Pre-tribulational Rapture Theory??? I know the Pre-trib school preaches that Christ's Olivet discourse is not for us. Is that why you reject that Scripture maybe?

I dont believe in a pre-trib rapture, and the Olivet discourse is future, written to a future generation, that will be eyewitnesses to the future AOD, great tribulation, and second coming of Jesus Christ

 

[Davy]

I dont believe in a pre-trib rapture, and the Olivet discourse is future, written to a future generation, that will be eyewitnesses to the future AOD, great tribulation, and second coming of Jesus Christ

Yes.

However, the Pre-trib Rapture school tries to steer their followers away from Christ's Olivet discourse, because it reveals the Pre-trib Rapture idea is false, specifically the Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 passages. And the fact that Jesus in those two examples covered the gathering of His saints from the two groups Paul covered in 1 Thessalonians 4, that further shows that Paul actually got the gathering of the Church events from Lord Jesus.

 

[Truth7t7]

Yes.

However, the Pre-trib Rapture school tries to steer their followers away from Christ's Olivet discourse, because it reveals the Pre-trib Rapture idea is false, specifically the Matthew 24:29-31 and Mark 13:24-27 passages. And the fact that Jesus in those two examples covered the gathering of His saints from the two groups Paul covered in 1 Thessalonians 4, that further shows that Paul actually got the gathering of the Church events from Lord Jesus.

The resurrection of all takes place on the last day at the second coming of Jesus Christ (The End)

 

[Davy]

The resurrection of all takes place on the last day at the second coming of Jesus Christ (The End)

Yes. There is only ONE coming of Christ, and it's after the tribulation like He said, and that only is when He will gather His Church.