The Problems of Perpetual Belief Alone Salvation-ism.

[Michiah-Imla]

Its just you, as usual, yanking your one verse out of context.

Yes, I get it.

Any evidence I get from the Bible is nullified by the “out of context” card.

Let the treading on the Saviour continue…

“Of how much sorer punishment, suppose ye, shall he be thought worthy, who hath trodden under foot the Son of God, and hath counted the blood of the covenant, wherewith he was sanctified, an unholy thing, and hath done despite unto the Spirit of grace?” (Hebrews 10:29)

There is a Spirit of Grace that you can do despite of by sinning willfully. Christ came to take away sin. If you participate in sin, you are working against Jesus.

“And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.” (Matthew 7:23)

Here’s how this will be dismissed by the self professing unholy ones:

1. Trusting in Jesus voids you from this verse.

2. The verse is addressing the JEWS/Christ rejectors.

3. This is talking about the sin of unbelief.

4. This is talking about the sin of not assembling together.

5. The sin here is whatever sin I’m not doing.

Hey, you guys are not fearing God and His word, why should you with the doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved. You don’t need to suffer warring against sin, you don’t have to feel bad when you sin, just go to church work there.

God is not looking on you:

“…but to this man will I look, even to him that is poor and of a contrite spirit, and trembleth at my word.” (Isaiah 66:2)

 

[Michiah-Imla]

If you will study Act 28, the last 10 verses....you'll discover the same Apostle Paul, is talking to the same unsaved = CHrist rejecting HEBREWS.

Try to focus. The writer of “Hebrews” is not a Christ rejecting Hebrew!

“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins” (Hebrews 10:26)

Acts 28 or any other mumbo jumbo explanation you present cannot nullify the FACT I just pointed out!

 

[mailmandan]

God justifies sinners.
Christ died for Sinners.
"to him that worketh NOT< but believeth on God who justifies THE UNGODLY....their FAITH is counted as Righteousness".

See that?
God justifies, not the GOOD, but the UNGODLY., and once justifed by the Sacrifice of Christ, then always justified.
Salvation, is not part time.
Eternal Life, is not Temporary.

Amen! Salvation is not probation.
Eternal life is not temporary life.
Jesus is the door. He is not a revolving door.

 

[mailmandan]

313

Barely 2 years.

This is the second forum.

The first one is where I “met” @Eternally Grateful and @mailmandan

I was banned from there after about 1,500 posts. The Once Saved Always Saved gang are merciless…

So you blame the OSAS gang on Christian Chat for getting you banned from that site? It's no wonder you relentlessly attack OSAS believers on this site. The same may go for Bible Highlighter as well. You both have a chip on your shoulder towards the OSAS crowd.

 

[mailmandan]

Try to focus. The writer of “Hebrews” is not a Christ rejecting Hebrew!

“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins” (Hebrews 10:26)

The writer of Hebrews is not a Christ rejecting Hebrew, but we can't say the same for Hebrew "nominal" Christians mixed in with the group of genuine Hebrew Christians. Not everyone in a large group of professing Christians is a genuine Christian. Hence, the warning. In regards to Hebrews 10:26, to "sin willfully" in the Greek carries the idea of deliberate intention that is habitual, which stems from rejecting Christ deliberately. This is continuous action, a matter of practice. Now we don't walk along our daily life and "accidentally" fall into a pit called sin. We exercise our will but, the use of the participle clearly shows willful, continuous action. The unrighteous practice sin (1 Corinthians 6:9-10; Galatians 5:19-21); not the righteous, who are born of God. (1 Corinthians 6:11; 1 John 3:9)

 

[Michiah-Imla]

“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,” (Hebrews 10:26)

The writer of Hebrews is not a Christ rejecting Hebrew, but we can't say the same for Hebrew "nominal" Christians mixed in with the group of genuine Hebrew Christians.

“We” encompasses all the genuine believers, including the writer himself sir.

To suggest otherwise is illogical.

 

[Rudometkin]

No. I do not have a problem with Scripture.

James 1:13 says,
“Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man:”

James 1:13 says God does not tempt any man. If God directly moved David to sin, then that would be temptation on God's part and God would be contradicting His own Word in that He tempts no man.

James 1:13 does not mean what you think it means. God plainly says He creates evil. Isaiah 45:7.

God works everything according to His purpose. That is what the Scriptures say.

Proverbs 16:4 God creates all things for His purpose, even the wicked.

You are twisting and struggling to explain this away, and your explanations do not work.

1 Chronicles 21:1 explains who the identity of the he really is in 2 Samuel 24:1.

1 Chronicles 21:1 says,
“And Satan stood up against Israel, and provoked David to number Israel.”

Now here is 2 Samuel 24:1 with commentary based on the facts given to us in 1 Chronicles 21:1.

2 Samuel 24:1
“And again the anger of the LORD was kindled against Israel, and he [i.e. Satan - 1 Chronicles 21:1] moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah.”

See. No contradiction here. God does not tempt man to sin just as James 1:13 says. But of course you don't believe James 1:13 (among many other verses).

No, Scripture says the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah. Scripture makes it plain and clear that God moved David and God works all things according to His purpose, even the wicked. All God's plan because God is God over His creation. Totally Sovereign and in control. He has all the power. Sorry you don't like it that way.

I also notice by your own standards, you either don't believe the Gospel origin, or you don't believe James 1:13.

God determined the crucifixion, which is murder of innocence. Murder is evil. Therefore, God determined evil for His own good purpose!

But you teach that God does not touch evil with a thousand yard stick. You have a problem there.

By your standards, either James 1:13 isn't true, or God did not determine the crucifixion.

Read Acts 22:23 and proclaim God did not determine the crucifixion.

This is irrefutable and you cannot escape it.

 

[mailmandan]

“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,” (Hebrews 10:26)

“We” encompasses all the genuine believers, including the writer himself sir.

To suggest otherwise is illogical.

What you miss is that there are make believers mixed in with the group. All throughout the book of Hebrews we see this:

Hebrews 3:14 - For we have become [past tense Gk. verb, gegonamen, meaning we have become already] partakers of Christ, if we hold fast the beginning of our confidence steadfast to the end. Notice that this is essentially a repeat of verse 6, where we have read: but Christ was faithful as a Son over His house - whose house we are, if we hold fast our confidence and the boast of our hope firm until the end. The wording is not - "and you will be saved (future indicative) if you (future indicative) persevere." It is rather - "you have been, and now are, partakers of Christ, (demonstrative evidence) if in the future you hold fast to Christ."

The point is that not all of these Hebrews have become partakers in their promised Messiah and the only ones in the end who will be identified as truly born again Hebrews who have partaken in Messiah, will have been those who have held fast the beginning of their confidence steadfast to the end. What about those faltering Hebrews who ultimately depart from God, yet begin with loud confidence and profession of loyalty? But later? Future perseverance is proof of genuine conversion.

In Hebrews 4:1-2, we read - "For indeed the gospel was preached to US as well as to THEM; but the word which THEY heard did not profit THEM, not being mixed with faith in those who heard it. For we who have believed do enter that rest, as He has said: "So I swore in My wrath, 'They shall not enter My rest," although the works were finished from the foundation of the world. Obviously, not all of these Hebrews were believers. Notice that verses 2-3 make a distinction between US who have BELIEVED and do enter that rest and THEM who heard the word but did not mix faith with what they heard and will not enter that rest because of UNBELIEF.

In Jude 1:5, we read that the Lord at one time delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe.

In Hebrews 10:39, pay close attention to - But WE are not of those who draw back to perdition, but OF THOSE who believe to the saving of the soul. Again, those who draw back to perdition do not believe to the saving of the soul and those who believe to the saving of the soul do not draw back to perdition.

In Hebrews 12:15, in your pet version of the Bible (KJV) we read - Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God; lest any root of bitterness springing up trouble you, and thereby many be defiled. On the surface, this appears to teach a loss of salvation because of failure, which surely tickles your ears. Yet in other translations, we get a clearer message. In the NASB we read - See to it that no one comes short of the grace of God. The NIV says - falls short of the grace of God. The ESV says - fails to obtain the grace of God.

 

[Taken]

I disagree. If I am not sinning. I have no sin. I am in a perfected state.

I also disagree with your interpretation of sin. While breaking one of the ten is a sin. If that is our standard. we are far to low on what sin really is

Sin is anything not done in love. or anything done for self (the flesh)

I can do a good deed. But not do it in love. or for selfish reasons. That is sin, no matter what it is.

we also have sins of the mind. If I look at a lady with lust. I have sinned

we also have sins of ommission. If we know to do something that is right yet do not do it. it is sin.

the problem is if we think we have reached sinlessness, we are not able to see the sin that is in our life. if we deny we have sin, we are deceived. and in a hopeless state. because even the chastening of the HS will not be effective..

That is okay.
I have never been under Mosaic Law.
My sin was against God. That is resolved between God and myself.
I have never sinned against man. No man has sinned against me.
I have never been given authority to forgive sin.
I believe sin is against God and only the Lord God can Forgive sin.
Men do not “REACH” sinlessness! Men are not sinless!

You make behavior between people, a sin.
God calls that a trespass, and certainly says to right your trespasses, forgive men their trespasses against you.

The difference is SIN against God, is DISBELIEF IN Him, is encouraging other to not Believe in Him, is Preaching, Teaching against God.
That is what He forgave you for, IF you have asked Him for Forgiveness.

Steal from some guy, deceive some guy, cheat some guy, covet another mans things, lie to to some guy, etc. you have trespassed against him.
Fix, correct, make restitution.
You were never told to BELIEVE in People...or carte’ blanch Trust People.
Trespassing will happen between people, WITH and WITHOUT intent.
(Because men are NOT all knowing...tell your kid you will take them swimming tomorrow, tomorrow a lightening storms comes up...and you don’t go swimming. Did you lie? Yes. Was that a sin against your kid?
No. You trespassed, and apologize.
Rejecting God IS SIN...Rejecting men IS not a sin.
Sin is against God, only God forgives sin.
Behaviors between men are called Precepts.
You do your best, take care of failures, and...bear the burden of the outcome.

Gal 6: [5] For every man shall bear his own burden.

Our father which art in heaven.....
Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
...No need to ask...you forgive men their trespasses, so also will God forgive yours, whether or not men forgive you.

 

[Rudometkin]

God does not tempt man to sin

God is not the tempter. He creates evil and works all things according to His purpose. Satan is the tempter who serves God's ultimate purpose. God determined the crucifixion - the greatest act of evil in all of mankind.

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

The Hebrew word of evil here is ra‘.

Ra‘ is used dozens of times in original Hebrew Scripture.

Genesis 2:17
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil [ra‘] thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

1 Sam 2:23
And he said unto them, Why do ye such things? for I hear of your evil [ra‘] dealings by all this people.

Proverbs 1:16
For their feet run to evil [ra‘], and make haste to shed blood.

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil [ra‘]: I the LORD do all these things.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

James 1:13 does not mean what you think it means.

Sure it does. James 1:13 says God does not tempt any man. That’s what it says, and you don’t believe that verse.

God plainly says He creates evil. Isaiah 45:7.

I take it you are KJB Only or you prefer the KJB. I am Core KJB. The KJB is more core foundational guide for all matters of faith and doing the work of faith, but I do use Modern Translations to help update what the KJB says. If you were to study the KJB issue for any length of time, you would eventually discover that there are archaic words in the King James Bible. I would suggest picking up the book called, Archaic words and the Authorized Version by Laurence M Vance.

https://www.amazon.com/Archaic-Words-Authorized-Version-Laurence/dp/0982369735

Anyways, the word evil is an archaic word in the King James Bible (Note: Archaic does not mean it is not true, it simply means it is an outdated word that is no longer used at all or often today).

At KingJamesBibleDictionary.com it lists the definition as calamity or loss under the Webster’s 1828 dictionary.

King James Bible Dictionary - Reference List - Evil

The word calamity is what we see in various Modern Translations.

God works everything according to His purpose. That is what the Scriptures say.

God can turn a bad situation into a good one (like He did with Joseph). But God does not want people to sin.

Proverbs 16:4 God creates all things for His purpose, even the wicked.

Look. God did not form evil beings out of thin air. God created free will moral agents who then chose of their own free will to do evil. God can say He created the wicked because He can see ahead into the future the bad choices that they were going to make. It wasn’t that God created evil people or created the devil out of thin air since day one of their existence.

You are twisting and struggling to explain this away, and your explanations do not work.

Right, because you are a Calvinist who sees the god of Calvinism and not the God of the Bible.

No, Scripture says the anger of the Lord was kindled against Israel, and he moved David against them to say, Go, number Israel and Judah. Scripture makes it plain and clear that God moved David and God works all things according to His purpose, even the wicked. All God's plan because God is God over His creation. Totally Sovereign and in control. He has all the power. Sorry you don't like it that way.

So your god of Calvinism is illogical. So you believe your god of Calvinism actually influences men to sin and then gets angry at them for sinning? Yeah, that does not make a whole lot of sense. That would be stupid and contradictory.

I also notice by your own standards, you either don't believe the Gospel origin,

While there is a proto-gospel before the cross in that Jesus is the good news that was preached to others in that He can save people, when the apostle Paul came, he gave us the full and complete gospel as found in 1 Corinthians 15:1-4. This gospel is believing that Christ died for your sins, he was buried, and he was risen the third day.

Some Calvinists say that Calvinism is the gospel. This again is just like the Non-Calvinistic Protestants. They just make up words as if it was from the Bible when it’s not in the Bible.

or you don't believe James 1:13.

Nope. I believe James 1:13 just fine. You are the one who does not believe it because you don’t believe the part of the verse that says that God does not tempt any man.

God determined the crucifixion, which is murder of innocence. Murder is evil. Therefore, God determined evil for His own good purpose!

Murder only applies to men and not God because God is the giver and taker of life. God determines the appointed day of our death.
The Lord gives and the Lord takes away. We did not create life. God did. So God can take that life away because He owns everything. God has a right to decide when something can live or die because He owns things He created. We are not the Creator. God is.

But you teach that God does not touch evil with a thousand yard stick. You have a problem there.

God permits evil and God can allow the devil to tempt men, but God does not directly influence men to do evil like you believe. If that was the case, then God would not be good or holy. 1 John 1:5 says there is no darkness in God.

By your standards, either James 1:13 isn't true, or God did not determine the crucifixion.

God was able to take the events of what men were going to do of their own free will choice and turn it around for a greater good.
It was not evil for the Son to be sacrificed for mankind (even though God was able to use free will moral agents who did do evil).
That does not equate that God approved of their own personal acts of sin. God is able to accomplish His purposes despite men’s intentions.

Read Acts 22:23 and proclaim God did not determine the crucifixion.

I never said God did not determine the crucifixion. I believe God arranged the crucifixion before the world was created.
That does not mean God influenced anyone to sin by that event. God was able to take the choices that men were going to make anyways and use that for a greater good (i.e. the redemption of mankind so that the free will offer of eternal life could be preached to others).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God is not the tempter. He creates evil and works all things according to His purpose. Satan is the tempter who serves God's ultimate purpose. God determined the crucifixion - the greatest act of evil in all of mankind.

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

The Hebrew word of evil here is ra‘.

Ra‘ is used dozens of times in original Hebrew Scripture.

Genesis 2:17
But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil [ra‘] thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die.

1 Sam 2:23
And he said unto them, Why do ye such things? for I hear of your evil [ra‘] dealings by all this people.

Proverbs 1:16
For their feet run to evil [ra‘], and make haste to shed blood.

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil [ra‘]: I the LORD do all these things.

Uh, the crucifixion is not the greatest act of evil. It’s the greatest example of God’s love. You have your poles reversed. It’s like you read the Bible as if you are some kind of Sith Lord or Darth Vader. Stop making God out to something He is not. God is good, and holy (Not just in our saying those words only but God is holy and good by His actions).

Side Note:

Please keep in mind I don’t watch Star Wars anymore. I merely made the reference so as to help you to snap out of your imaginary religion.

 

[Rudometkin]

God was able to take the events of what men were going to do of their own free will choice and turn it around for a greater good.

All the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing.

That crumbles your theology to a pile of dust.

God does what He pleases. God declares the end from the beginning.

God determines what happens in reality. Not man. Quit making man the creator of the universe actions.

Daniel 4:35 Isaiah 46:10

God does not peek into future and react to man. He is not like you. He is not a man with superpowers. He is entirely different than all things that exist. All things exist by God's power. God holds all things together. This is what it means to be God.

You are blind to see it, but other people here see it: you make yourself into God in your theology. You say, "I DECLARE MY END FROM MY BEGINNING!"

You even affirm that God put you on the same level as Him when it comes to determining reality, so He submitted His position as sole determiner of what occurs in Creation when He created you and Adam. You call it "free will". What you have is God bending over backwards working according to what you freely choose to do.

Utter evil theology. That is your evil flesh wanting to be God for yourself.

You will not submit.

We are the clay, and God is the potter. He forms us for His purpose. End of note. Wise, logical and simple. You take that biblical analogy and say, "God wants us to form ourselves, so we are really the potter of ourselves. He loves us and wants us to choose...I AM THE POTTER. I AM THE POTTER OF MYSELF. I DECIDE WHAT I WILL BECOME." That is all I hear from your underdeveloped theology. Sad rebellion.

 

[Eternally Grateful]

That is okay.
I have never been under Mosaic Law.
My sin was against God. That is resolved between God and myself.
I have never sinned against man. No man has sinned against me.
I have never been given authority to forgive sin.
I believe sin is against God and only the Lord God can Forgive sin.
Men do not “REACH” sinlessness! Men are not sinless!

You make behavior between people, a sin.
God calls that a trespass, and certainly says to right your trespasses, forgive men their trespasses against you.

The difference is SIN against God, is DISBELIEF IN Him, is encouraging other to not Believe in Him, is Preaching, Teaching against God.
That is what He forgave you for, IF you have asked Him for Forgiveness.

Steal from some guy, deceive some guy, cheat some guy, covet another mans things, lie to to some guy, etc. you have trespassed against him.
Fix, correct, make restitution.
You were never told to BELIEVE in People...or carte’ blanch Trust People.
Trespassing will happen between people, WITH and WITHOUT intent.
(Because men are NOT all knowing...tell your kid you will take them swimming tomorrow, tomorrow a lightening storms comes up...and you don’t go swimming. Did you lie? Yes. Was that a sin against your kid?
No. You trespassed, and apologize.
Rejecting God IS SIN...Rejecting men IS not a sin.
Sin is against God, only God forgives sin.
Behaviors between men are called Precepts.
You do your best, take care of failures, and...bear the burden of the outcome.

Gal 6: [5] For every man shall bear his own burden.

Our father which art in heaven.....
Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us.
...No need to ask...you forgive men their trespasses, so also will God forgive yours, whether or not men forgive you.

Sin is a word taken from the greek word hamarte. It means to miss the mark

Sin is also called a tresspass whether your tresspass against God or man. Failing to love is to break the law.

Excuse it however you want. It is a sin, you MISS THE MARK

 

[stunnedbygrace]

Misrepresentation as a result of your false conclusion in regards to those who expose the doctrine of Once Saved Always Saved.

OSAS is correct in that if you receive Gods Spirit, you will live forever. BUT, in a great house, there are both vessels of honor and vessels of dishonor. And yet, the only way to be a vessel of honor is through trust. Your own working won’t bring about the child who inherits the blessing. The child of your own working and willing must be sent away. Only the child God has promised receives the inheritance.
So it’s got to be through trust, patience and waiting on God.
And this is why we do all we can to help strengthen and grow each other’s trust (edify), so that none of us will fail to enter Gods rest and cease from our own labors.
This is the spirit and truth of the sabbath rest command. To cease our working to try to bring about the child that receives the inheritance and to trust God to do it.

 

[Radrook]

Very true. There is definitely a difference between wilfully sinning and unwillingly succumbing to the compulsions of our fallen nature.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

All the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing.

That crumbles your theology to a pile of dust.

God does what He pleases. God declares the end from the beginning.

God determines what happens in reality. Not man. Quit making man the creator of the universe actions.

Daniel 4:35 Isaiah 46:10

God does not peek into future and react to man. He is not like you. He is not a man with superpowers. He is entirely different than all things that exist. All things exist by God's power. God holds all things together. This is what it means to be God.

You are blind to see it, but other people here see it: you make yourself into God in your theology. You say, "I DECLARE MY END FROM MY BEGINNING!"

You even affirm that God put you on the same level as Him when it comes to determining reality, so He submitted His position as sole determiner of what occurs in Creation when He created you and Adam. You call it "free will". What you have is God bending over backwards working according to what you freely choose to do.

Utter evil theology. That is your evil flesh wanting to be God for yourself.

You will not submit.

We are the clay, and God is the potter. He forms us for His purpose. End of note. Wise, logical and simple. You take that biblical analogy and say, "God wants us to form ourselves, so we are really the potter of ourselves. He loves us and wants us to choose...I AM THE POTTER. I AM THE POTTER OF MYSELF. I DECIDE WHAT I WILL BECOME." That is all I hear from your underdeveloped theology. Sad rebellion.

And I thought I was the only one who thought there was a connection between Calvinism and the dark-side.
It seems folks have already created memes on this already.

But 1 John 1:5 says there is no darkness in God.

Note: The first meme was actually taken from Calvinists.
How scary is that. They actually admit they are of the dark-side of the force.
It makes sense. Some of them actually think stupid things like God actually directly created literal evil.

Wake up. God is good.

In Isaiah 45:7, the word evil is archaic in the KJB, and it is talking about calamity, loss, or misfortune (Which aligns with Modern Translations and definitions from older dictionaries).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

All the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing.

That crumbles your theology to a pile of dust.

God does what He pleases. God declares the end from the beginning.

God determines what happens in reality. Not man. Quit making man the creator of the universe actions.

Daniel 4:35 Isaiah 46:10

God does not peek into future and react to man. He is not like you. He is not a man with superpowers. He is entirely different than all things that exist. All things exist by God's power. God holds all things together. This is what it means to be God.

You are blind to see it, but other people here see it: you make yourself into God in your theology. You say, "I DECLARE MY END FROM MY BEGINNING!"

You even affirm that God put you on the same level as Him when it comes to determining reality, so He submitted His position as sole determiner of what occurs in Creation when He created you and Adam. You call it "free will". What you have is God bending over backwards working according to what you freely choose to do.

Utter evil theology. That is your evil flesh wanting to be God for yourself.

You will not submit.

We are the clay, and God is the potter. He forms us for His purpose. End of note. Wise, logical and simple. You take that biblical analogy and say, "God wants us to form ourselves, so we are really the potter of ourselves. He loves us and wants us to choose...I AM THE POTTER. I AM THE POTTER OF MYSELF. I DECIDE WHAT I WILL BECOME." That is all I hear from your underdeveloped theology. Sad rebellion.

God threatened the city of Nineveh with judgment.

1 "And the word of the LORD came unto Jonah the second time, saying,
2 Arise, go unto Nineveh, that great city, and preach unto it the preaching that I bid thee.
3 So Jonah arose, and went unto Nineveh, according to the word of the LORD. Now Nineveh was an exceeding great city of three days' journey.
4 And Jonah began to enter into the city a day's journey, and he cried, and said, Yet forty days, and Nineveh shall be overthrown." (Jonah 3:1-4).​

God changed His mind and He did not bring wrath upon the Ninevites when He had seen that they turned from their evil and wicked ways.

"And God saw their works, that they turned from their evil way; and God repented of the evil, that he had said that he would do unto them; and he did it not." (Jonah 3:10).​

While many verses refute Calvinism, these 5 verses above in Jonah 3 is the achilles heel to Calvinism. This is a major story in the Bible! Yet, Calvinists do not seem to realize what this story really says here. I am wondering: How do Calvinists explain these verses in the "Story of Jonah"?

If God enables or regenerates man so as to grant him the ability to repent (2 Timothy 2:25), then how could God threaten the city of Nineveh with Judgment and Wrath, and then change His mind on that Judgment as soon as they repented and turned from their evil and wicked ways? Was God's threat on the city of Nineveh just a useless scare tactic? What purpose did God need Jonah to preach to the city of Nineveh at all if God could just convict everyone of their sin and get them to repent? Does it not seem contradictory of God to threaten a city with Judgment if He was just going to later regenerate them so as to grant them repentance later?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

If Calvinism was true, the following scenario would have taken place in the story of Jonah.

Jonah comes to the city of Nineveh, and says to them, "I am here to tell you what God is going to do in you already. You are going to believe and repent and turn from your wicked ways."

There would be no mention of the Judgment. Just how they were going to believe.

God brings salvation to the Ninevites and opens their hearts.
Then the Ninevites repented and turned from their evil and wicked ways.

But that is not how things played out.
It was the reverse.

The Ninevites were under danger of Judgment whereby they were actually going to perish like the gourd. This real threat to their lives led to their repentance and forsaking of their evil ways.
When God seen they had turned away from their sinful ways, that is when God decided to no longer to bring Judgment that would overthrow the city and make them to perish.

Jesus says in Matthew 12:41 that the Ninevites will stand in judgment against this generation because they repented at the preaching of Jonah. They had true repentance because they cried out to God (repentance) and they forsaken their evil ways (the natural fruits that always follow true repentance). So this was Judgment and not some kind of chastening. Jesus was giving us an example of repentance, as well. This was not an example of Calvinistic repentance being shown to us.

If such were the case, then we would see the whole city overnight change mysteriously by God involving their wicked ways. They would just drop in the middle of their sinful acts and fall to their knees and ask God for forgiveness. But this is not what we see. We do not see Ninevites about to do something sinful and then stop midway in doing something sinful and call unto God. That is what we need to see if Calvinism's version of repentance is actually true. For the testimony of Jonah 3 stands strongly against the Calvnistic version of repentance. It is all about what the Ninevites did and not what God did in regards to whether or not they were saved. Yes, salvation cannot be had without God. Nobody is denying that. Syngerism does not deny God in the process of salvation. God of course sets forth the way of salvation for man and God seeks to convict man's heart if He is open to being convicted. It depends on how hard their heart is in regards to their own sin and if they truly want the Lord and His good ways in their life.

 

[BloodBought 1953]

151


God executed many of His people in the Old Testament by the hand of other nations for not keeping them.

Remember that.

The next punishment is the lake of fire for those taking these things lightly.

151


God executed many of His people in the Old Testament by the hand of other nations for not keeping them.

Remember that.

The next punishment is the lake of fire for those taking these things lightly.

You’re Darn Tootin’ that God executed many of His people in the Old Testament! Aren’t you glad that we live under the “NEW” Testament?

That actual “ Next Punishment” that you mentioned that is in the Lake Of Fire will be for those that thought that they got Saved by “ keeping a Law “ That was Impossible to keep and God “ Found Fault” with......what was that “ Fault?” You ask? It had “NO POWER TO SAVE!”

REMEMBER THAT.