(smitharbie;65904)
Question??There is always a great amount of discussion concerning the 'RAPTURE'. However, it seems that when someone uses the term Rapture, it is automatically assumed that they are referring to a pre-tribulation rapture. I, personally, believe in a post-tribulation rapture, and that the Rapture is synonymous with the Second Coming of Christ in the clouds of heaven, and that the pre-tribulation doctrine is one of error, and even lends itself to Satan's attempt at deceiving people into becoming complacent. However, I still many times refer to the event of being 'caught up' to be with the Lord in the air, as the Rapture because the word rapture means 'caught up'. Is there some reason why someone using the word 'Rapture' is automatically pounced on as if they were Satan's emissaries? Am I missing something, or is the word 'Rapture' a sworn enemy? Is it possible or not possible to use the word Rapture without aligning with 'pre-trib' error?
You are somewhat correct its true that most jump on the word as meaning Pre- tribbut that is the lie most men preach today... So therefore the word Rapture has become synonymous with Pre -Trib Another problem with this as far as the Word Rapture is what men have come to understand it means some kind of escape .. It does not. If there is a Post trib Rapture which is the only kind/time of a Rapture that has any Biblical possibility or support is it will be very short lived.. as Christ is coming here to rule on earth so any meeting in the air would be a very short term event... So it becomes a very fine line for those of us that are concerned for our fellow brothers and sisters are being mislead and lied to by because if we say Rapture its the idea one will escape that concerns us. There is no escape everyone has to chose to follow Christ or Antichrist this is the trashing the harvest where the true Wheat (believer) is separated from the chaff The true believer will escape only by following Gods commands and knowing his Word God has foretold us all things he tells that antichrist comes first If we learn this simple truth we can then understand we are to stay working in the field (world) and not believe a lie, Rapture teaches people to believe "oh this is lesson not for us we wont be here". That is the danger if you dont know when Antichrist comes you are in danger of following the wrong christ.The way Gods protects his own is the same way he did in Egypt when the Angel of death came ..Passover is our example of how the true believer will escape.. Not any made up theory of mans fly away doctrine (Eze 13:20)pre-trib rapture doctrineSo I guess in essence what Im saying is if there is a Rapture, its after we see the Lord coming in the clouds at the 7th trump, and compared to that glorious event any short term raising to meet him is really a nothing but a meager detail, which is why its only mentioned once. Even then the subject of the chapter is "where are the dead" ...not a rapture so if, one is alluded to at all, its not even the subject of the chapter, but a mere mention. The only point worth making about it, if that's what one believes is said,is that it lets us know what to expect at the true Christs coming...So if anyone wants to make a big deal out of it .its usually because they have made a doctrine out of Pre-trib Ratpure which doesnt even exist in scripture so thats why we always assume its Pre-Trib they want to talk about..
Question??There is always a great amount of discussion concerning the 'RAPTURE'. However, it seems that when someone uses the term Rapture, it is automatically assumed that they are referring to a pre-tribulation rapture. I, personally, believe in a post-tribulation rapture, and that the Rapture is synonymous with the Second Coming of Christ in the clouds of heaven, and that the pre-tribulation doctrine is one of error, and even lends itself to Satan's attempt at deceiving people into becoming complacent. However, I still many times refer to the event of being 'caught up' to be with the Lord in the air, as the Rapture because the word rapture means 'caught up'. Is there some reason why someone using the word 'Rapture' is automatically pounced on as if they were Satan's emissaries? Am I missing something, or is the word 'Rapture' a sworn enemy? Is it possible or not possible to use the word Rapture without aligning with 'pre-trib' error?
You are somewhat correct its true that most jump on the word as meaning Pre- tribbut that is the lie most men preach today... So therefore the word Rapture has become synonymous with Pre -Trib Another problem with this as far as the Word Rapture is what men have come to understand it means some kind of escape .. It does not. If there is a Post trib Rapture which is the only kind/time of a Rapture that has any Biblical possibility or support is it will be very short lived.. as Christ is coming here to rule on earth so any meeting in the air would be a very short term event... So it becomes a very fine line for those of us that are concerned for our fellow brothers and sisters are being mislead and lied to by because if we say Rapture its the idea one will escape that concerns us. There is no escape everyone has to chose to follow Christ or Antichrist this is the trashing the harvest where the true Wheat (believer) is separated from the chaff The true believer will escape only by following Gods commands and knowing his Word God has foretold us all things he tells that antichrist comes first If we learn this simple truth we can then understand we are to stay working in the field (world) and not believe a lie, Rapture teaches people to believe "oh this is lesson not for us we wont be here". That is the danger if you dont know when Antichrist comes you are in danger of following the wrong christ.The way Gods protects his own is the same way he did in Egypt when the Angel of death came ..Passover is our example of how the true believer will escape.. Not any made up theory of mans fly away doctrine (Eze 13:20)pre-trib rapture doctrineSo I guess in essence what Im saying is if there is a Rapture, its after we see the Lord coming in the clouds at the 7th trump, and compared to that glorious event any short term raising to meet him is really a nothing but a meager detail, which is why its only mentioned once. Even then the subject of the chapter is "where are the dead" ...not a rapture so if, one is alluded to at all, its not even the subject of the chapter, but a mere mention. The only point worth making about it, if that's what one believes is said,is that it lets us know what to expect at the true Christs coming...So if anyone wants to make a big deal out of it .its usually because they have made a doctrine out of Pre-trib Ratpure which doesnt even exist in scripture so thats why we always assume its Pre-Trib they want to talk about..
r 12:1 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset [us], and let us run with patience the race that is set before us, My point is that this passage may just be saying that when Christ returns, we will be caught up to Him spiritually by the pouring out of the Holy Spirit upon us that remain and the Clouds may be a reference to the multitude of angels that will come with Him at this time.Allow me to show you some another passages in the Old Testament that seems to be also speaking of this event. After all, keeping all the bible in context is rather important.Zec 9:14 And the LORD shall be seen over them, and his arrow shall go forth as the lightning: and the Lord GOD shall blow the trumpet, and shall go with whirlwinds of the south. To be compared with:Mat 24:27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be. andZec 12:10 And I will pour upon the house of David, and upon the inhabitants of Jerusalem, the spirit of grace and of supplications: and they shall look upon me whom they have pierced, and they shall mourn for him, as one mourneth for [his] only [son], and shall be in bitterness for him, as one that is in bitterness for [his] firstborn. withAct 2:18 And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: I guess what I am trying to say (I do try to keep it simple and clear as well as I can) is that I think that the passage in Thes means that when Christ returns the following passage will be fulfilled:Zec 12:8 In that day shall the LORD defend the inhabitants of Jerusalem; and he that is feeble among them at that day shall be as David; and the house of David [shall be] as God, as the angel of the LORD before them. In a nutshell, what I believe is that just as the Beast is about to devour the last of the childern of God, Christ appears and fulls them will absolute power, causing them to turn the tables and take over the Beasts' kingdom. At that time the fulfillment of Revelations will occur.PS. Notice the end of the last passage that speaks of these children of God becoming as God "as the Angel of the Lord before them"?Since this is a future event and most of us know that Jesus is not an angel, but the Son of God, I believe this supports my contention of Michael appearing on the earth to lead the children of God during the Last Times is true.
