The Saving Faith

[emekrus]

Paul would say to those that move on in the Lord "they live by the faith of the Son of God" Gal. 2:20

The same Paul would say, “For in Jesus Christ neither circumcision avails anything, nor uncircumcision; but faith which works by love”. Galatians 5:6

 

[emekrus]

If you preach having faith in God to heal to others and forbid them to not go to doctors or seek medical care for that faith to be real to others but he, himself, goes to a doctor when he is sick, he is not justified nor righteous for saying he has faith when he does not live by example.

So in the same way for a church to say that they have faith in God's providence ( when they just want to verbalize it to the poor to get out of helping the poor ) they are not justified nor righteous for doing so.

The word "justified" is not used towards the faith in Jesus Christ for salvation, but in how they were using their faith in God's providence without leading by example.

Faith in Jesus Christ for salvation without works is justified because it is by faith in Jesus Christ alone without works is how one is saved and thus justified.

Of course, we are called to be His disciples by learning of His words to abide in Him to bear fruit and that our joy may be full, but it is not for salvation when it is about being His abiding bride to be received at the pre great raptured when the Bridegroom comes.

I had wanted to let you be on this your point of view. But on a second thought, I just wanted to know how you harmonize the preceding verse to your interpretation of what James was saying having to do with faith in God's providence.

Here is the preceding verse of that book of James:

What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?-- James 2:14

How do you harmonise this verse with your interpretation?

 

[soul man]

As to Peter, how is this any different from what Paul says:

You will have to read it in Galatians. Paul tired if arguing with Peter, told him " if you feel God has called you to preach circumcision" you better do it. Paul went his way preaching uncircumcision. It's in plain black and white english. Doesn't make Peter evil, it shows he did know much about grace at the time. Try finding other writers that use the specific terms as in Christ, in whom, by whom, as a message as Paul did, they are few and far between. Paul got in Peters face at one time, it has to be read like it is written. We want to look at these men as gods they were not their human.

 

[soul man]

Do you really believe that God would allow two different Gospels into His Word in order to confuse mankind?

Do you really believe that the church who should be moving mankind along is not confused in certain aspects. Find two that agree on the written word: and we have the message to save humanity I dont think so. Apart from the cross we are a lost bunch trying to feel our way through, mainly because we ignore Paul and try to make a gospel out of 66 books, never happen, the confusion today is immense.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

Ok so in your point of view this how you see the justification that James was talking about. Well, I don't have dominion over your faith. We all have the Holy Spirit.

Now I want to also get your interpretation of Peter in 2 Peter as I posted above. Let me Post it directly to you now and get your interpretation:

The Apostle Peter, is not also left out in this matter. If you read 2 Peter, you'll see that the Apostle Peter doesn't also see faith alone as the only requirement for access to eternal life below is the exact scripture I am talking about:
2Peter1:

5 And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;

6 And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;

7 And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.

8 For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

9 But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

10 Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

11 For so an entrance shall be ministered unto you abundantly into the everlasting kingdom of our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ.

So Peter also says you need to add good works (such as virtue, love, temperance, brotherly kindness, godliness) to your faith so you will never fall and as such, an entrance shall be granted you into the kingdom of God.

And of course, if the forward statement is true, then the backward statement is also true. Wouldn't you think?

Peter is talking about discipleship to a saved believer where by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd in all His promises to us in helping us lay aside every weight & sin in running that race as Paul described, is living that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ.

This "entrance" is referring to being worthy of that resurrection that comes when the Bridegroom comes to be that vessel unto honor in His House.

Look at it in this wise; Jesus warned that saved believers can be led astray in Matthew 7:13-27 where they become workers of iniquity, and the Lord denies them entrance to the Marriage Supper as Luke's parallel warning of Matthew 7:13-27 can be found in Luke 13:24-30.

An iniquity is a work that denies Him, even if they are religious works as denying that faith in Him that we are saved without works in Titus 1:15-16

You can only run that race in being His disciples to bear fruit so that your joy may be full as a saved believer ( John 15:1-5 ), but you can be cut off for not abiding in Him: John 15:6 so it is about being His disciple by abiding in Him ( John 15:7-8 ) ; not about obtaining salvation as in....obtaining His seal of adoption, but running that race to be accepted by Him.

Proof is here in how Paul is warning even former believers to depart from iniquity in 2 Timothy 2:18-21 so by purging themselves with His help, they can be vessels unto honor in serving Him in the ministry as well as being received as vessels unto honor in His House when the Bridegroom comes.

If those having His seal do not depart from iniquity, even former believers, they will become castaways as denied entrance to the Marriage Supper and be "damned" as vessels unto dishonor but still in His House. Why? It is part of this faithful saying ( 2 Timothy 2:10-13 ) for why the call is given to depart from iniquity so they can be received as vessels unto honor in His House at the pre great trib rapture when the Bridegroom comes.

So any work of iniquity that a saved believer does, makes him a worker of iniquity as any work of iniquity that denies Him, they will be denied entrance and be "excommunicated" from having fellowship at that Marriage Supper as any church should excommunicate an unrepentant brother from eating in fellowship 1 Corinthians 5:11 but do note that purpose for this excommunication in 1 Corinthians 5:4-5 because that is the same purpose for why God will excommunicate saved believers found as workers of iniquity.

So we are saved; but not every saved believer will be found abiding in Him as His disciple to be receive to attend the Marriage Supper in proper fellowship. So all works that deny Him that was built on that foundation laid by Jesus Christ will be burned away in that day when they are left behind, but their spirits shall be received by Him when they die still because that foundation laid by Jesus Christ cannot be removed ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ) nor His seal taken away ( Ephesians 4:30 ) as His promise is that He will not lose any of what the Father has given Him ( John 6:38-40 ), including the lost sheep left behind ( Matthew 18:10-17 ). So even those His sheep were not of the fold that followed His voice but a stranger's voice as in led astray ( John 10:1-5 ), they shall be made to hear His voice and be of the one fold and one shepherd ( John 10:16 ).

That is the point of warning even His disciples to be ready or else in Luke 12:40-49 so that knowing that they are saved and thus His, they can lean on Him all the time as their Good Shepherd in getting them ready to go by laying aside every weight & sin daily ( 2 Timothy 4:18 ) as well as helping them to hate this life to be willing to leave it and all our loved ones behind when the Bridegroom comes to take us to the Supper ( Luke 14:15-33 )

If you ever wanted to have a Bible study with Him on this issue, then may He lead you as His Good Shepherd to study this post by the scriptures.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

I had wanted to let you be on this your point of view. But on a second thought, I just wanted to know how you harmonize the preceding verse to your interpretation of what James was saying having to do with faith in God's providence.

Here is the preceding verse of that book of James:

What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?-- James 2:14

How do you harmonise this verse with your interpretation?

By keeping that verse in context of the message given in James 2nd chapter. James began that chapter addressing the mistreatment of the poor.

James 2:1My brethren, have not the faith of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Lord of glory, with respect of persons. 2 For if there come unto your assembly a man with a gold ring, in goodly apparel, and there come in also a poor man in vile raiment; 3 And ye have respect to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place; and say to the poor, Stand thou there, or sit here under my footstool: 4 Are ye not then partial in yourselves, and are become judges of evil thoughts? 5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him? 6 But ye have despised the poor..............

So James went on to list another offense that the church was doing in despising the poor by noting how they would give a benediction to the departing poor in voicing their faith in God's Providence to take care of them so that the church could get out of helping the poor of meeting their immediate needs of the poor that were perishing from starvation and the elements from the bounty collected after church service.

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

To discern what kind of faith James is talking about in verse 14 requires us to read on in keeping it in context of what he is talking about how the church was despising the poor in another way.

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food, 16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

So like voicing faith, "be healed" as if believing God will heal that person, so were they voicing faith be ye warmed and filled as if God would provide for them, but they say their faith in God's Providence to the poor WITHOUT meeting their needs, the church's faith is no profit to the poor.

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone. 18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

So faith in God's Providence is dead in the eyes of the poor if the church is unwilling to give those things that are needful to the body of the poor after church service from the collection provided by the Lord in raising up cheerful givers. The church's faith in God's Providence in the eyes of the poor does not profit the poor nor will it save the poor when in the eyes of the poor, the church's faith in His Providence is dead when the church does not lead by examples by their works... or lack thereof towards the poor.

So James 2:14 lack of works in showing faith in His Providence is not what fails to save the church, but the poor.

James reference to Abraham and Isaac in that chapter was about the well known report of how God provided a ram for Abraham to avoid sacrificing Isaac as that whole incident and the name of that place where it had happened to Abraham was named after God as the Provider... Jehovahjireh.

Genesis 22:7 And Isaac spake unto Abraham his father, and said, My father: and he said, Here am I, my son. And he said, Behold the fire and the wood: but where is the lamb for a burnt offering? 8 And Abraham said, My son, God will provide himself a lamb for a burnt offering: so they went both of them together..........
13 And Abraham lifted up his eyes, and looked, and behold behind him a ram caught in a thicket by his horns: and Abraham went and took the ram, and offered him up for a burnt offering in the stead of his son. 14 And Abraham called the name of that place Jehovahjireh: as it is said to this day, In the mount of the Lord it shall be seen.

So by keeping James 2:14 in context to what James was talking about in the church's mistreatment of the poor members of their congregation, we can see that James was only addressing the church's faith in His Providence to the poor needing works to save the poor; not the faith in Jesus Christ for salvation.

 

[H. Richard]

Since you are accusing James -- a servant of God and Christ -- of writing "what is not true", you have already failed to make you case.

The onus is on YOU to accept that what Peter, James, John, and Paul wrote was by divine inspiration -- therefore GOD'S TRUTH.

After that the onus is on YOU to reconcile any apparent discrepancies, so that every passage harmonizes with Gospel truth.

***

I have already should that James got the scriptures wrong. It is a fact that is in the scriptures. I didn't put them in the scriptures. To ignore then makes it possible to include the teachings of James into the gospel of grace. Absolutely ignoring the FACT that James said he was addressing the Jews only in James1:1. So if you claim James is writing to the Gentiles too where do you get that idea from. Isn't it from those who want to be able to work their way into heaven without a mention of the cross. How many times did James write the word cross? NONE!

The Holy Spirit expect us to see what is in the scriptures. He has taught me to be able to see that the book of James was not written to the grace church but was written to the Jews. But you can't seem to see that that is what the scripture says in James 1:1. WHY????? I can prove my statment by using the scripture. Can you???

 

[Enoch111]

...the book of James was not written to the grace church but was written to the Jews.

Well let me ask you one simple question: Was the church in Smyrna (one of the seven churches in Revelation) a "grace church" or a Jewish synagogue?

The answer is obvious, and here is what Christ said to those Christians: Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried [trials]; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. (Rev 2:10)

And here is what James said to the Hebrew Christians he was addressing (also a part of the Church, the Body of Christ): Blessed is the man that endureth temptation [trials]: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. (James 1:12)

Do you now see how the Holy Spirit has tied the book of James into the NT, which is for all Christians? The twelve tribes are simply Hebrew Christians, saved by grace, just like the Gentile Christians.

 

[Ac28]

Well, dear brother,
You know, I love rebukes allots, it has really helped me so much and has also helped many as well that I have rebuked. But could you please point out to me the area you think is going wanton in understanding?

My Brother,

I went on your website and saw, with joy, that many of the Bible verses you quoted are from the ONLY section of the Bible that applies DIRECTLY to us Gentiles (Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles), in this 2000 year period of pure grace that we're now in. And, I see you've used the correct word, citizenship, in Phil 3:20.

All scripture is FOR us, for our learning and for all those other things that are listed, but, not all scripture directly applies TO us. Not many of us sacrifice animals, as an extreme example. We are told in Phil 1:10 to "test the things that differ" - see Strong's, and then we are told to rightly divide (Correctly Cut) God's Word of Truth, 2Tim 2:15. There are many categories of God's Word in the Bible - Word of Salvation, Word of Faith, Word of Promise, Word of Wisdom, Word of Knowledge, Word of Reconciliation, Word of Life. In 2Tim 2:15, we are to Cut His Word of Truth, which can only mean the entire Bible. Notice that both Phil 1:10 and 2Tim 2:15 occur ONLY in Paul's post Acts epistles. Those rules were never needed in the other 59 books, because, to make a long story short, those books were all-Israel - even during Acts, when all the Gentiles in the church were grafted into Israel and were, therefore, part of Israel. Paul's 7 Acts books were all written in light of his ministry ALWAYS being to the Jew first. But now, the rules have changed.

To first apply Phil 1:10, "test the things that differ", we find the most obvious difference in comparing Paul's Acts epistles with his 7 post-Acts epistles, is the calling. Up until the very end of Acts, and in Paul's Acts epistles, the calling was the heavenly city, the New Jerusalem. The NJ is not Heaven. It comes down out of Heaven (thus the reason it is called the "heavenly"city) and attaches to the New Earth. In the post-Acts epistles, the hope is to actually go to the actual Heaven, where Christ now sits at the right hand of God - cp. Eph 1:20 (Christ) with Eph 1:3 and 2:6 (Us). There is NEVER an indication in any of the other 59 books, that ANYONE, EVER, had a hope of going to Heaven. I used to have a list of about 50 things that were totally different after Acts. One of the other big ones is the rapture (Acts) vs the appearing (after Acts). Another is the Church - A body of believers in Christ (Acts) vs THE actual Body of Christ where He is the actual Head (after Acts).


This is the absolute worst forum for losing posts I am working on. This post is about 1/4 of what I had finished. I may or may not complete it.

 

[emekrus]

My Brother,

I went on your website and saw, with joy, that many of the Bible verses you quoted are from the ONLY section of the Bible that applies DIRECTLY to us Gentiles (Paul's 7 post-Acts epistles), in this 2000 year period of pure grace that we're now in. And, I see you've used the correct word, citizenship, in Phil 3:20.

All scripture is FOR us, for our learning and for all those other things that are listed, but, not all scripture directly applies TO us. Not many of us sacrifice animals, as an extreme example. We are told in Phil 1:10 to "test the things that differ" - see Strong's, and then we are told to rightly divide (Correctly Cut) God's Word of Truth, 2Tim 2:15. There are many categories of God's Word in the Bible - Word of Salvation, Word of Faith, Word of Promise, Word of Wisdom, Word of Knowledge, Word of Reconciliation, Word of Life. In 2Tim 2:15, we are to Cut His Word of Truth, which can only mean the entire Bible. Notice that both Phil 1:10 and 2Tim 2:15 occur ONLY in Paul's post Acts epistles. Those rules were never needed in the other 59 books, because, to make a long story short, those books were all-Israel - even during Acts, when all the Gentiles in the church were grafted into Israel and were, therefore, part of Israel. Paul's 7 Acts books were all written in light of his ministry ALWAYS being to the Jew first. But now, the rules have changed.

To first apply Phil 1:10, "test the things that differ", we find the most obvious difference in comparing Paul's Acts epistles with his 7 post-Acts epistles, is the calling. Up until the very end of Acts, and in Paul's Acts epistles, the calling was the heavenly city, the New Jerusalem. The NJ is not Heaven. It comes down out of Heaven (thus the reason it is called the "heavenly"city) and attaches to the New Earth. In the post-Acts epistles, the hope is to actually go to the actual Heaven, where Christ now sits at the right hand of God - cp. Eph 1:20 (Christ) with Eph 1:3 and 2:6 (Us). There is NEVER an indication in any of the other 59 books, that ANYONE, EVER, had a hope of going to Heaven. I used to have a list of about 50 things that were totally different after Acts. One of the other big ones is the rapture (Acts) vs the appearing (after Acts). Another is the Church - A body of believers in Christ (Acts) vs THE actual Body of Christ where He is the actual Head (after Acts).


This is the absolute worst forum for losing posts I am working on. This post is about 1/4 of what I had finished. I may or may not complete it.

Dear Brother in Christ,
Please I have a request to make. Could you please help post this reply at the appropriate thread on this forum or the appropriate post on my blog so can discuss.
I just want us to stay on topic sir.

 

[emekrus]

***

I have already should that James got the scriptures wrong. It is a fact that is in the scriptures. I didn't put them in the scriptures. To ignore then makes it possible to include the teachings of James into the gospel of grace. Absolutely ignoring the FACT that James said he was addressing the Jews only in James1:1. So if you claim James is writing to the Gentiles too where do you get that idea from. Isn't it from those who want to be able to work their way into heaven without a mention of the cross. How many times did James write the word cross? NONE!

The Holy Spirit expect us to see what is in the scriptures. He has taught me to be able to see that the book of James was not written to the grace church but was written to the Jews. But you can't seem to see that that is what the scripture says in James 1:1. WHY????? I can prove my statment by using the scripture. Can you???

The Bible tells us that all scriptures are given by the inspiration of God. James was writing to saved Christians. Whether Jew or gentile. In Christ Jesus, there is no differentiation. What Christ or the Holy Spirit says to one, he says to all. And that all, is all Christians, including Jew, Greek, e.t.c.

 

[soul man]

The Bible tells us that all scriptures are given by the inspiration of God. James was writing to saved Christians. Whether Jew or gentile. In Christ Jesus, there is no differentiation. What Christ or the Holy Spirit says to one, he says to all. And that all, is all Christians, including Jew, Greek, e.t.c.

There is no Jew or Gentile "in Christ.

 

[Grams]

This is from our Church....... maybe this will help ...


http://www.rightlydividing.org/secondarypages/Q and A combined email index and document 170918.htm

 

[emekrus]

There is no Jew or Gentile "in Christ.

And that's exactly what I mean.James' writing applies to all believers not only to the Jews.

 

[Truth]

Well, dear brother,
You know, I love rebukes allots, it has really helped me so much and has also helped many as well that I have rebuked. But could you please point out to me the area you think is going wanton in understanding?

Dear Brother, add Humble to the list from your post # 10 for truly you have IT, there are many that can not be Humble, being right is first and foremost, Be Blessed!

 

[Enoch111]

The Bible tells us that all scriptures are given by the inspiration of God. James was writing to saved Christians. Whether Jew or gentile. In Christ Jesus, there is no differentiation. What Christ or the Holy Spirit says to one, he says to all. And that all, is all Christians, including Jew, Greek, e.t.c.

Correct. This is critical. The epistles are written to all Christians, regardless of who is addressed. Indeed, the epistle to the Hebrews is fundamental for Christians to thoroughly grasp the perfection and finality of the finished work of Christ.

 

[emekrus]

Peter is talking about discipleship to a saved believer where by faith in Him as our Good Shepherd in all His promises to us in helping us lay aside every weight & sin in running that race as Paul described, is living that reconciled relationship with God through Jesus Christ.

This "entrance" is referring to being worthy of that resurrection that comes when the Bridegroom comes to be that vessel unto honor in His House.

Look at it in this wise; Jesus warned that saved believers can be led astray in Matthew 7:13-27 where they become workers of iniquity, and the Lord denies them entrance to the Marriage Supper as Luke's parallel warning of Matthew 7:13-27 can be found in Luke 13:24-30.

An iniquity is a work that denies Him, even if they are religious works as denying that faith in Him that we are saved without works in Titus 1:15-16

You can only run that race in being His disciples to bear fruit so that your joy may be full as a saved believer ( John 15:1-5 ), but you can be cut off for not abiding in Him: John 15:6 so it is about being His disciple by abiding in Him ( John 15:7-8 ) ; not about obtaining salvation as in....obtaining His seal of adoption, but running that race to be accepted by Him.

Proof is here in how Paul is warning even former believers to depart from iniquity in 2 Timothy 2:18-21 so by purging themselves with His help, they can be vessels unto honor in serving Him in the ministry as well as being received as vessels unto honor in His House when the Bridegroom comes.

If those having His seal do not depart from iniquity, even former believers, they will become castaways as denied entrance to the Marriage Supper and be "damned" as vessels unto dishonor but still in His House. Why? It is part of this faithful saying ( 2 Timothy 2:10-13 ) for why the call is given to depart from iniquity so they can be received as vessels unto honor in His House at the pre great trib rapture when the Bridegroom comes.

So any work of iniquity that a saved believer does, makes him a worker of iniquity as any work of iniquity that denies Him, they will be denied entrance and be "excommunicated" from having fellowship at that Marriage Supper as any church should excommunicate an unrepentant brother from eating in fellowship 1 Corinthians 5:11 but do note that purpose for this excommunication in 1 Corinthians 5:4-5 because that is the same purpose for why God will excommunicate saved believers found as workers of iniquity.

So we are saved; but not every saved believer will be found abiding in Him as His disciple to be receive to attend the Marriage Supper in proper fellowship. So all works that deny Him that was built on that foundation laid by Jesus Christ will be burned away in that day when they are left behind, but their spirits shall be received by Him when they die still because that foundation laid by Jesus Christ cannot be removed ( 1 Corinthians 3:10-17 ) nor His seal taken away ( Ephesians 4:30 ) as His promise is that He will not lose any of what the Father has given Him ( John 6:38-40 ), including the lost sheep left behind ( Matthew 18:10-17 ). So even those His sheep were not of the fold that followed His voice but a stranger's voice as in led astray ( John 10:1-5 ), they shall be made to hear His voice and be of the one fold and one shepherd ( John 10:16 ).

That is the point of warning even His disciples to be ready or else in Luke 12:40-49 so that knowing that they are saved and thus His, they can lean on Him all the time as their Good Shepherd in getting them ready to go by laying aside every weight & sin daily ( 2 Timothy 4:18 ) as well as helping them to hate this life to be willing to leave it and all our loved ones behind when the Bridegroom comes to take us to the Supper ( Luke 14:15-33 )

If you ever wanted to have a Bible study with Him on this issue, then may He lead you as His Good Shepherd to study this post by the scriptures.

Dear Brother,
I have more scriptures that beg your interpretation along your line of faith. And I will want us to be taking them one at a time. After all, this a bible discussion thread. There should be no rush.
Since we are on the book of Peter, let's consider this inspired word from Peter:

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? --1Peter 4:18

The above scripture makes a remarkable statement. It says the very righteous(the justified) scarcely (hardly) gets saved. What do you make of this statement? And how do you harmonise it with your point of view?

 

[Hidden In Him]

But here is the correspondence between James and Paul:

THE ROYAL LAW IS THE LAW OF CHRIST

If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well (James 2:8).

Owe no man any thing, but to love one another: for he that loveth another hath fulfilled the law. For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law. (Romans 13:8-10).

Well let me ask you one simple question: Was the church in Smyrna (one of the seven churches in Revelation) a "grace church" or a Jewish synagogue?

The answer is obvious, and here is what Christ said to those Christians: Fear none of those things which thou shalt suffer: behold, the devil shall cast some of you into prison, that ye may be tried [trials]; and ye shall have tribulation ten days: be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life. (Rev 2:10)

And here is what James said to the Hebrew Christians he was addressing (also a part of the Church, the Body of Christ): Blessed is the man that endureth temptation [trials]: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him. (James 1:12)

Do you now see how the Holy Spirit has tied the book of James into the NT, which is for all Christians? The twelve tribes are simply Hebrew Christians, saved by grace, just like the Gentile Christians.

Two amazingly good posts. Best posts on the thread, and the best posts I've seen at this Forum since being here.

 

[Ac28]

The church during Acts was a body of believers whose leader was Christ. It was 100% Israel, since all the Gentiles in the church were grafted into Israel and were, therefore, part of Israel. The ONLY purpose of grafting a few Gentiles into the all-Israel Acts church that started at Pentecost and ended at the end of Acts, was to provoke the nation Israel to jealousy, so they might believe in Christ, so Christ would return and Israel's earthly Kingdom of Heaven would be set up. The Gentiles in Acts were given a few of the same blessings that the Jewish members had - the gifts, the rapture, the calling of the New Jerusalem. The Gentiles in the church did not have the covenants or the law, the adoption (which means they had no inheritance), none of the promises of God made to Abraham, Issac, Jacob, and David, and, they couldn't preach or teach, since Israel had the Service of God. See Rom 9:4. Is that what you want?

Nothing ever given to Israel was also given to the Gentiles, unless it says so in scripture, like the gifts, rapture, and the calling of the NJ were. However, those all faded out at the end of Acts, when Israel, as a nation, was set aside, and their hope of Israel's earthly Kingdom of Heaven was postponed for at least 2000 years. The stealing of Israel's blessings is the denominational system's stock in trade. If you removed all the doctrine stolen from Israel, which definitely has NOTHING to do with Gentiles today, they would have nothing to talk about. NONE see the truth of the new church in Paul's 7 after-Acts epistles. Only in those 7 books will you find the marching orders for the Gentile church today. Only there will you find that your calling is not the New Jerusalem, as was the calling in ALL of Acts, but is now the calling of actual Heaven. If the calling is different, EVERYTHING is different.

No one that can read could ever say that the book of James is written TO Gentiles today. For those that believe their Bible, they will believe James 1:1, which says it was written to the 12 tribes of Israel. If you're not a descendant of Jacob and if you don't practice the full law, James is NOT written TO you - DUH! People have forgotten how to read. Almost everything taught in Christendom today has zero basis in Bible truth. It's ALL what people wish it was and not what it really is.

Why anyone would want those meagerly things the Gentiles in Acts were given, when everything after-Acts is infinitely better, is beyond my comprehension. You can't have both. Also, those who believe that they can now claim those things not given to Gentiles, at the time they were given to Israel, are living in a dream world. If you didn't get it then, where does it say you can have it now? If it doesn't say that it's for Gentiles today, it isn't for Gentiles today.

All of this idiocy started with the 100% false, un-scriptural idea that Israel was finished, due to their unbelief, and were replaced by the "Church". That phony concept is being taught by more preachers than most people think. My guess is that Israel will be back on the scene in about 2063, or 2000 years after they were set aside at the end of Acts, in about 63AD.

The biggest difference in you and I is that I believe the only blessings in scripture to Gentiles are those specifically given to Gentiles, and you believe that you rightly deserve all the blessings in scripture given only to Israel. You don't realize it, but you're all replacement theoligists. Of course, as with all replacement theologists, this means that you'll never get what you think you'll get. And, I can't see God giving you what you should get in Eph, Col, etc., if you don't believe in it. That's why He approves those who divide His word rightly, thus weeding out all the myriads of Israel-only things from your faulty doctrine. I don't blame you for this, since you are a product of 2 millenniums of faulty Christianity. The origin of this was that Paul, the ONLY apostle you have and the VERY LAST WORD in your actual true doctrine, was essentially dismissed until the last 200 years, or so.

I apologize for my constant badgering on these points. However, I truly believe that, if you don't get rid of all that Jewish baggage from Acts, that you all carry around, God won't give you, Eph 1:17-18, "the spirit of wisdom and revelation in the knowledge of him: The eyes of your understanding being enlightened; that ye may know what is the hope of his calling, and what the riches of the glory of his inheritance in the saints" Why would Paul pray for this, if Heaven were automatic for all believers.

The only place you find the "hope of your calling", which is Heaven, itself, is in Paul's 7 after-Acts books. According to Paul's prayer, above, God has to give you the eyes of understanding to SEE this hope of Heaven. No one in Acts or any of those in the other 59 books ever had a hope of Heaven, so, if you believe all those INFERIOR things in Acts belong to you, why would God give you those SUPERIOR things found ONLY in Eph, Phil, Col, 1&2Tim, Titus, and Philemon. Be approved unto God (2Tim 2:15) by making a single straight cut (rightly dividing) through God's Word of Truth at the only possible place to divide Israel from the Gentiles - Acts 28:28. Then, for things that apply TO you, eliminate everything that you believe from the Israel side of the cut, and believe only those things on the Gentile side of the cut.

 

[JesusIsFaithful]

Dear Brother,
I have more scriptures that beg your interpretation along your line of faith. And I will want us to be taking them one at a time. After all, this a bible discussion thread. There should be no rush.
Since we are on the book of Peter, let's consider this inspired word from Peter:

And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear? --1Peter 4:18

The above scripture makes a remarkable statement. It says the very righteous(the justified) scarcely (hardly) gets saved. What do you make of this statement? And how do you harmonise it with your point of view?

Peter is referring to being received by the Bridegroom at the pre great trib rapture when God will judge His House first. I see Peter mirroring Paul's call of those looking to Him to help them lay aside every weight & sin in departing from iniquity of that race run by faith in Jesus Christ as our Good Shepherd.

When you see how that chapter began in how sinners as mockers are living in these latter days, then you may see Peter's warning to be abiding in Him to be ready to go.

1 Peter 4:1Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin; 2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God. 3 For the time past of our life may suffice us to have wrought the will of the Gentiles, when we walked in lasciviousness, lusts, excess of wine, revellings, banquetings, and abominable idolatries: 4 Wherein they think it strange that ye run not with them to the same excess of riot, speaking evil of you: 5 Who shall give account to him that is ready to judge the quick and the dead. 6 For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit. 7 But the end of all things is at hand: be ye therefore sober, and watch unto prayer.

So Peter's reference to the end of all things being at hand is for believers to abide in Him for when He comes to escape what is coming on the earth as there will be judgment on the ungodly and the unbelievers, but He will be judging His House first.

Jesus warned of this preparing to be ready to go to believers seeking to be His disciples in Luke 12:40-49 where the consequence is being cut off and cast away to be with the unbelievers that are still on the earth when that fire comes.

Getting back to Peter's message for preparedness before God comes to judge as the Bridegroom, we see the same message in the 2nd epistle by him that mirrors how mockers will be in the last days for how we should not run as they do from Peter's first epistle.

2 Peter 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation. 5 For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water: 6 Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished: 7 But the heavens and the earth, which are now, by the same word are kept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men......9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up. 11 Seeing then that all these things shall be dissolved, what manner of persons ought ye to be in all holy conversation and godliness, 12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens being on fire shall be dissolved, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat? 13 Nevertheless we, according to his promise, look for new heavens and a new earth, wherein dwelleth righteousness. 14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for such things, be diligent that ye may be found of him in peace, without spot, and blameless. 15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you;

Peter refers to Paul in how Paul had warned them to be ready and abiding in Him by running that race to avoid becoming a castaway, but it is not for eternal life as in to obtain salvation by, but to be ready as His disciples to escape and be saved from what is coming on the earth.

I go back to your reference in 1 Peter 4:17-19 to include verse 19, in the KJV because it is significant in pointing out that those that are not abiding in Him, He is faithful still as He will keep their souls while they suffer being left behind.

1 Peter 4:17 For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God?18 And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?19 Wherefore let them that suffer according to the will of God commit the keeping of their souls to him in well doing, as unto a faithful Creator.

So while you see that as if salvation is to come with works, I say please repent of that notion, because Jesus Christ is your Saviour because He has saved you. Those unrepentant saints & former believers left behind to suffer that fire coming on the earth, He is keeping their souls still because He is their Saviour, even though they were not abiding in Him as His disciples by faith in Him as their Good Shepherd in having them ready to go, they will become vessels unto dishonor in His House testifying to the power of God in salvation by those who believe in Jesus Christ, even in His name.