The Sin Nature

[Davy]

I think the heart of the matter is this. Only God is good. In that God pronounced His creation good, it was, but with an imparted goodness, not intrinsic goodness. God is intrinsically good, and does not change. Creation was created good, but not intrinsically good, and was subject to change. And change came.

Much love!

I understand, but study what Apostle Paul said in Romans 8:18-25 about God having placed the creation in bondage to corruption, and that the creation along with us seeks a release from that. That reveals this present world earth age is not in a perfect state, even though God said it was good in Genesis 2. What Paul said there aligns with Jeremiah 4:23-28 also about the earth in mourning today and the heavens above being black (i.e., violent weather and storms is of this 2nd world earth age, not for the world to come.)

 

[Davy]

John didn't understand what kind of flesh that was either, just like us.

John saw that flesh in person, He knew Christ walked through that door where they were gathered.

I agree that we don't yet know what we shall be, the power we will have, the abilities that glorified state of flesh will give us.

It's all a wonder to us as well as to him. Obviously the Lord did not explain any of this to the 12 apostles, but I do believe Paul had a much better idea of what it is through his revelation from Christ.

Your words I made bold and underlined above still betray you wanting to think the "spiritual body" Apostle Paul taught is one of 'flesh'. It is not a flesh body. The flesh is of this material EARTHLY world. The "spiritual body", which is the resurrection type body per Paul, is a HEAVENLY type body, and Paul revealed exactly that in 1 Corinthians 15, even with Christ's flesh body being made "a quickening spirit"...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV


Even in Ecclesiastes 12:5-7 we are shown about that. It reveals that we have a flesh body and a spirit that are of 2 separate orders or realms. And there is a "silver cord" that holds the two together while alive on earth. And when that "silver cord" is loosed at flesh death, our flesh goes back to the earthy elements of matter where it came from, and our spirit goes back to God Who gave it.

And in Matthew 10:28, Lord Jesus told us to not fear those who can kill our body (flesh), but not our soul. By that He revealed our 'soul' continues on to God in the heavenly, and that our 'soul' is not of earth matter. That means our soul is attached with our spirit, eternally, and that is what is actually raised at flesh death and goes back to God.

But when Jesus returns in the future, the same way He ascended to Heaven from the Mount of Olives in view of His Apostles, the Heavenly is going to be opened upon this earth with all to see, with flesh cast off on the "last trump" of 1 Corinthians 15. That is the change at the twinkling of an eye that Apostle Paul spoke of. And it will happen for all peoples still alive upon this earth on that day of Christ's future coming, as per the Isaiah 25 chapter where Paul was pulling from about 'death swallowed up in victory'.

So I do wish more brethren would open up their Bible more and quit listening to every Tom, Dick, and Harry that preaches their 'own' word instead of sticking with God's Word as written.

 

[theefaith]

Must be born again by baptismal regeneration in Christ!

 

[marks]

I understand, but study what Apostle Paul said in Romans 8:18-25 about God having placed the creation in bondage to corruption, and that the creation along with us seeks a release from that. That reveals this present world earth age is not in a perfect state, even though God said it was good in Genesis 2.

Agreed! I'm not sure where we miscommunicated, but yes, this creation is subjected to vanity, nothing works right anymore. We can survive, but this is not the fruitful place God first created.

Much love!

 

[marks]

Your words I made bold and underlined above still betray you wanting to think the "spiritual body" Apostle Paul taught is one of 'flesh'. It is not a flesh body. The flesh is of this material EARTHLY world. The "spiritual body", which is the resurrection type body per Paul, is a HEAVENLY type body, and Paul revealed exactly that in 1 Corinthians 15, even with Christ's flesh body being made "a quickening spirit"...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV


Even in Ecclesiastes 12:5-7 we are shown about that. It reveals that we have a flesh body and a spirit that are of 2 separate orders or realms. And there is a "silver cord" that holds the two together while alive on earth. And when that "silver cord" is loosed at flesh death, our flesh goes back to the earthy elements of matter where it came from, and our spirit goes back to God Who gave it.

And in Matthew 10:28, Lord Jesus told us to not fear those who can kill our body (flesh), but not our soul. By that He revealed our 'soul' continues on to God in the heavenly, and that our 'soul' is not of earth matter. That means our soul is attached with our spirit, eternally, and that is what is actually raised at flesh death and goes back to God.

But when Jesus returns in the future, the same way He ascended to Heaven from the Mount of Olives in view of His Apostles, the Heavenly is going to be opened upon this earth with all to see, with flesh cast off on the "last trump" of 1 Corinthians 15. That is the change at the twinkling of an eye that Apostle Paul spoke of. And it will happen for all peoples still alive upon this earth on that day of Christ's future coming, as per the Isaiah 25 chapter where Paul was pulling from about 'death swallowed up in victory'.

So I do wish more brethren would open up their Bible more and quit listening to every Tom, Dick, and Harry that preaches their 'own' word instead of sticking with God's Word as written.

While not the same kind of flesh as we know today, we'll still be in a flesh body, just like Jesus' body, Feel me, handle me, does a spirit have flesh and bone as you see I do?

So we will have a physical resurrection, only, different.

Much love!

 

[Charlie24]

That's just it, in 1 Corinthians 15 Apostle Paul showed that Jesus' flesh body was made 'a quickening spirit', but hardly any brethren want to believe that...

1 Cor 15:44-50
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.

45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.

46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.

48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.

49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.

50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

So was Jesus' flesh body resurrected? Yes, but it was made "a quickening spirit" at some point after that, according to Apostle Paul.

And Paul made it very clear in the above Scripture that the heavenly order is not about an eternal flesh body, but a "spiritual body".

The false belief in everlasting flesh is an old Jewish doctrine from Old Testament times.

Paul is telling us about the resurrection in this Chapter, But first he defines the different types of flesh.

"The first Adam was made a living soul" this is speaking of the natural body.

"The second Adam (Christ) was made a quickening Spirit" this is speaking of the glorified body of Christ at His resurrection.

Paul is speaking here of the natural body and the resurrected body. He says that all flesh is not the same, vs.39.

Vs. 44, The natural body is raised a Spiritual body. The flesh of the natural body is not the same as the flesh of the Spiritual body.

The Spiritual body Paul is speaking of here is the body of flesh that is now energized with the Spirit, and no longer the natural body which is energized by the blood.

Paul is telling us the difference in these bodies of flesh! Then he goes on to tell us what will happen at the resurrection.

 

[Ronald David Bruno]

People speak of a "sin nature", but I can't find that in my Bible.

What I do find is that our flesh has been corrupted by sin, and so until we are born again being baptized into Jesus Christ, we are spiritually dead, and are slaves to sin.

Do we have a "sin nature"? What is it? Where are we taught this in the Bible?

Much love!

When we think of someone's nature, we think of their behavior, personality (which is a range of habits), tendencies, idiosyncrasies, what they a drawn to, etc. Sin corrupts our nature, makes us bent towards behaving and thinking unrighteously and evil, slaves to sin, it is our nature. You can look at a lion and ask what is his nature, his natural behavior, tendencies, what drives and motivates him. He is a predator. He wasn't that way when God created him. Sin corrupted his nature. God will correct this nature in us and the animal kingdom, then our nature will be at peace, loving, in harmony. Just my two cents.

 

[Bob Estey]

People speak of a "sin nature", but I can't find that in my Bible.

What I do find is that our flesh has been corrupted by sin, and so until we are born again being baptized into Jesus Christ, we are spiritually dead, and are slaves to sin.

Do we have a "sin nature"? What is it? Where are we taught this in the Bible?

Much love!

I believe we create a sin nature when we disobey God. In other words, I think sin has an addictive quality.

 

[Davy]

While not the same kind of flesh as we know today, we'll still be in a flesh body, just like Jesus' body, Feel me, handle me, does a spirit have flesh and bone as you see I do?

So we will have a physical resurrection, only, different.

Much love!

That's still referring to the earthly body of this world, which is a temporary body. The word 'physical' can refer to anything of this world that has shape. But it is still usually put for things of earth material matter.

Do you believe that our Heavenly Father and His Son existed BEFORE the foundation of this material world? I do. So what kind of outward image or body did They and the angels have back then?

This may look like the old debate like, 'which came first, the chicken or the egg?', but really it's not. To even begin to start understanding about the two separate dimensions of existence per God's Word, one must first understand about God before His creation.

And since The Father has said He will return to this earth to live with us, per Revelation 21, and that His Eden where He lives was once established upon this earth per Genesis 2, then in what kind of body will He return in? And that is pointing to God The Father returning, and not just Lord Jesus.

 

[Davy]

Paul is telling us about the resurrection in this Chapter, But first he defines the different types of flesh.

"The first Adam was made a living soul" this is speaking of the natural body.

"The second Adam (Christ) was made a quickening Spirit" this is speaking of the glorified body of Christ at His resurrection.

Paul is speaking here of the natural body and the resurrected body. He says that all flesh is not the same, vs.39.

Vs. 44, The natural body is raised a Spiritual body. The flesh of the natural body is not the same as the flesh of the Spiritual body.

The Spiritual body Paul is speaking of here is the body of flesh that is now energized with the Spirit, and no longer the natural body which is energized by the blood.

Paul is telling us the difference in these bodies of flesh! Then he goes on to tell us what will happen at the resurrection.

That's really a Chapter that one must pay very, very close attention to...

In 1 Corinthians 15:37, Paul revealed by analogy that body which is sown (i.e. ,flesh), is NOT that body that shall be ("spiritual body"). So even right there Paul made a clear distinction between the two different type dimensions of existence and their two different body types.

And when Paul was making distinctions about different flesh bodies, he was speaking only... of this earthly material dimension type bodies, like the bodies of different animals, birds, fish. Likewise with the idea of celestial and terrestrial bodies, both are still about earthly dimension bodies of our earthly dimension (planets, sun, stars).

At 1 Corinthians 15:42 Paul begins talking about the body of that other dimension of existence, the Heavenly dimension. And he points out that "It" is sown in corruption, and that "It" is raised in corruption. I'm not sure if the KJV translators understood, but they made a proper translation of that from the Greek with that idea of "It", simply because Paul explained in verse 37 that seed which is sown is NOT the body that shall be. And that "It" that is sown is about our 'soul' sown into a flesh body, but raised with the "spiritual body".

1 Cor 15:37
37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
KJV

Paul is trying to show the body that shall be, the resurrection body, is not a body of flesh (i.e., the original seed body). To make this plain, Paul reveals the two different dimensions of existence, the earthly vs. the heavenly.

1 Cor 15:44
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
KJV

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

1 Cor 15:45
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
KJV

And because flesh cannot enter into that Heavenly dimension, even Lord Jesus' body was translated to "a quickening spirit", and THAT is the actual glorious body of the world to come.

 

[Charlie24]

That's really a Chapter that one must pay very, very close attention to...

In 1 Corinthians 15:37, Paul revealed by analogy that body which is sown (i.e. ,flesh), is NOT that body that shall be ("spiritual body"). So even right there Paul made a clear distinction between the two different type dimensions of existence and their two different body types.

And when Paul was making distinctions about different flesh bodies, he was speaking only... of this earthly material dimension type bodies, like the bodies of different animals, birds, fish. Likewise with the idea of celestial and terrestrial bodies, both are still about earthly dimension bodies of our earthly dimension (planets, sun, stars).

At 1 Corinthians 15:42 Paul begins talking about the body of that other dimension of existence, the Heavenly dimension. And he points out that "It" is sown in corruption, and that "It" is raised in corruption. I'm not sure if the KJV translators understood, but they made a proper translation of that from the Greek with that idea of "It", simply because Paul explained in verse 37 that seed which is sown is NOT the body that shall be. And that "It" that is sown is about our 'soul' sown into a flesh body, but raised with the "spiritual body".

1 Cor 15:37
37 And that which thou sowest, thou sowest not that body that shall be, but bare grain, it may chance of wheat, or of some other grain:
KJV

Paul is trying to show the body that shall be, the resurrection body, is not a body of flesh (i.e., the original seed body). To make this plain, Paul reveals the two different dimensions of existence, the earthly vs. the heavenly.

1 Cor 15:44
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
KJV

1 Cor 15:48-50
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

1 Cor 15:45
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
KJV

And because flesh cannot enter into that Heavenly dimension, even Lord Jesus' body was translated to "a quickening spirit", and THAT is the actual glorious body of the world to come.

The Last Adam (Christ) made a "quickening spirit" is referring to a immortal body now made alive in the Spirit, no longer mortal with blood circulating throughout the body. It also refers to all who believe being made alive in the Spirit through His death, burial, and resurrection.

Christ ascended into heaven in a immortal body of flesh made alive through the Spirit. It is mortal flesh (and blood) that cannot enter into heaven!

 

[Davy]

The Last Adam (Christ) made a "quickening spirit" is referring to a immortal body now made alive in the Spirit, no longer mortal with blood circulating throughout the body. It also refers to all who believe being made alive in the Spirit through His death, burial, and resurrection.

Does that mean you still believe it is a flesh body? Yet Apostle Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:50 that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Did Paul lie?

Christ ascended into heaven in a immortal body of flesh made alive through the Spirit. It is mortal flesh (and blood) that cannot enter into heaven!

Still sounds like you may be confused about the difference between Spirit and flesh.

John 3:6
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
KJV

 

[Charlie24]

Does that mean you still believe it is a flesh body? Yet Apostle Paul said in 1 Corinthians 15:50 that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God. Did Paul lie?



Still sounds like you may be confused about the difference between Spirit and flesh.

John 3:6
6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh; and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
KJV

What you do not understand is we who believe will one day have a body just as Jesus had at His resurrection.

That body is immortal flesh, not mortal! Paul explained the difference in these bodies.

It is FLESH AND BLOOD, the mortal flesh, that cannot enter into heaven. Just as Paul said!

The scripture plainly illustrates Thomas touching the immortal flesh of Christ after His resurrection.

The same flesh we will one day have as believers.

 

[L.A.M.B.]

James 1 12-15 ( cxt )
Blessed is the man that endureth temptation:
For when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him.
Let no man say when he is tempted, I am tempted of God: for God cannot be tempted by evil, neither tempeth he any man:
BUT EVERY MAN IS TEMPTED, WHEN HE IS DRAWN AWAY OF HIS OWN LUST,AND ENTICED.
THEN WHEN LUST HATH CONCEIVED, IT BRINGETH FORTH ...SIN: AND SIN WHEN IT IS FINISHED ,BRINGETH FORTH...DEATH.

 

[marks]

I believe we create a sin nature when we disobey God. In other words, I think sin has an addictive quality.

I think so also, that sin is addictive. Have you read anything on "brain plasticity"? Our brains change their biological structure to support what we choose.

I think that Adam's and Eve's sin changed them, and all who came from them, that their brains or some such was damaged, producing a bent towards sin.

I think we increase that when we continue to choose sin, and we can also choose righteousness, and our brains will follow those choices.

I think this is what the renewing of the mind refers to, as our physical brains are retrained by the spiritual life in us.

Much love!

 

[Davy]

What you do not understand is we who believe will one day have a body just as Jesus had at His resurrection.

What you're trying to follow is an old Jewish flesh doctrine about the resurrection. Sounds like you believe the dead literally sleep in the ground too when they die.

I well understand what kind of body type the 'resurrection' is, as per Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15, and it is not a flesh and blood type body according to Paul.

So by your saying I don't understand, you are calling Apostle Paul a liar, because Paul is where my understanding of the resurrection body comes from.

And because Apostle Paul was 'very specific' about the "spiritual body" NOT being a flesh type body, that means one must understand Luke 24:39 in relation to what Apostle Paul taught, instead of just bypassing the 1 Corinthians 15 Scripture like you're trying to do.

So get angry at Apostle Paul, not me, because Paul is who I am following on this matter.

1 Cor 15:42-50
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

 

[marks]

That's still referring to the earthly body of this world, which is a temporary body. The word 'physical' can refer to anything of this world that has shape. But it is still usually put for things of earth material matter.

Do you believe that our Heavenly Father and His Son existed BEFORE the foundation of this material world? I do. So what kind of outward image or body did They and the angels have back then?

This may look like the old debate like, 'which came first, the chicken or the egg?', but really it's not. To even begin to start understanding about the two separate dimensions of existence per God's Word, one must first understand about God before His creation.

And since The Father has said He will return to this earth to live with us, per Revelation 21, and that His Eden where He lives was once established upon this earth per Genesis 2, then in what kind of body will He return in? And that is pointing to God The Father returning, and not just Lord Jesus.

You may be misunderstanding me. "Bodies" are subjective, and the perception of the solidity of our body has a lot to do with how we perceive things. We won't be unhouses spirits, and won't have bodies like we do today, I think, but I believe we will have bodies that will feel real and solid to us, and that they will be suited for our environment.

My thinking is that the veil between heaven and earth will be no more.

Do you believe that our Heavenly Father and His Son existed BEFORE the foundation of this material world? I do. So what kind of outward image or body did They and the angels have back then?

Concerning earth ages prior to the 6 days of creation, I don't agree on that. I think the Bible "indicates" that the angels were created on the 2nd or 3rd day. All that was created was created in the 6 days of creation, and on the seventh, God rested.

God is Spirit, so I'm thinking that means He does not have a body. Jesus incarnated into flesh to be born and offer His body as sacrifice. I don't see anything in the Bible that tells us God had an "outward image" before creation, only silence.

Much love!

 

[theefaith]

I believe we create a sin nature when we disobey God. In other words, I think sin has an addictive quality.

that’s true
But because of the fall the lower carnal passions are not subject to the intellect and will

 

[Charlie24]

What you're trying to follow is an old Jewish flesh doctrine about the resurrection. Sounds like you believe the dead literally sleep in the ground too when they die.

I well understand what kind of body type the 'resurrection' is, as per Apostle Paul in 1 Corinthians 15, and it is not a flesh and blood type body according to Paul.

So by your saying I don't understand, you are calling Apostle Paul a liar, because Paul is where my understanding of the resurrection body comes from.

And because Apostle Paul was 'very specific' about the "spiritual body" NOT being a flesh type body, that means one must understand Luke 24:39 in relation to what Apostle Paul taught, instead of just bypassing the 1 Corinthians 15 Scripture like you're trying to do.

So get angry at Apostle Paul, not me, because Paul is who I am following on this matter.

1 Cor 15:42-50
42 So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption:
43 It is sown in dishonour; it is raised in glory: it is sown in weakness; it is raised in power:
44 It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45 And so it is written, The first man Adam was made a living soul; the last Adam was made a quickening spirit.
46 Howbeit that was not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.
47 The first man is of the earth, earthy: the second man is the Lord from heaven.
48 As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy: and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49 And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50 Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
KJV

You know Davy, I have a problem with those who would use Paul as a liar if we don't agree with you!

That is not the way a Christian approaches the Scripture!

The resurrected body can be whatever you want it to be. The example is Christ Himself.

He had a spiritual body of flesh. Yes, that contradicts everything we can imagine. But that is the body Christ resurrected with and it is the body we will have.

John said of this, "it does not yet appear what we shall be, but we know, when He shall appear, we will be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is."

The glorified body that Christ has is a mystery to all of us, even to John. The born-again child of God is not all we shall be, we will be glorified and that means a new body as He had.

So whatever you want it to be is fine with me, none of us will know for sure until the resurrection.

 

[Davy]

You may be misunderstanding me. "Bodies" are subjective, and the perception of the solidity of our body has a lot to do with how we perceive things. We won't be unhouses spirits, and won't have bodies like we do today, I think, but I believe we will have bodies that will feel real and solid to us, and that they will be suited for our environment.

I can only understand the wording you use. The idea of bodies is actually objective, which points to an outward likeness or image likeness. I don't think you truly understand the idea of spirit, and you're not alone in that, for many are confused by man's ideas on that instead of what God's Word reveals.

When Lord Jesus said 'that which is born of flesh is flesh, and that which is born of Spirit is spirit', He was pointing to the two separate dimensions of existence shown in God's Word. And Apostle John said in John 4:24 that God is "a Spirit", and those who worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth.

So what KIND of body does our Heavenly Father have, and has had since eternity, since He has never been born in the flesh like His Son Lord Jesus had? And likewise, what kind of body did Lord Jesus have with The Father before... Jesus was born in the flesh? It's not a difficult question if one stays with the written Scripture about it.