THE TRUTH OF DANIEL'S SEVENTY WEEKS PROPHECY

[Brakelite]

That would be John describing a vision he had. If you’re Protestant you probably believe the woman is Israel. If you’re Catholic you probably say it’s Mary.

You are correct, with a nuance that Barney mentioned. Catholicism is predominantly preterist, while protestantism is predominantly futurist. Both hermeneutics, believe it or not, developed and popularized by 2 Jesuits during the counter reformation, both being extremely short-sighted interpretations of scripture that conveniently hide the Antichrist from view.
God was not confined to being able to see but one of two short periods of history, (take your pick which one), and be blind to 2000 years of church and gospel history, 1260 years of Antichrist rule and power, and over 1000 years of persecution, human misery and suffering, as well as the rising and fall of nations. God's perspective has always been all encompassing, seeing not just the end from the beginning, but everything in between.

 

[BarneyFife]

You are correct, with a nuance that Barney mentioned. Catholicism is predominantly preterist, while protestantism is predominantly futurist. Both hermeneutics, believe it or not, developed and popularized by 2 Jesuits during the counter reformation, both being extremely short-sighted interpretations of scripture that conveniently hide the Antichrist from view.
God was not confined to being able to see but one of two short periods of history, (take your pick which one), and be blind to 2000 years of church and gospel history, 1260 years of Antichrist rule and power, and over 1000 years of persecution, human misery and suffering, as well as the rising and fall of nations. God's perspective has always been all encompassing, seeing not just the end from the beginning, but everything in between.

.
AMEN

What's really unfortunate is that more harm is done by preterist and futurist interpretations than is normally recognized, even by those who reject them, present company excepted, I trust.

It is much easier to justify/encourage the sins resulting from the carnal, world-loving heart if the sinner believes that there is no prophetic message from God for the present time.

• If the message is simply "Fear not, for the sins of the pre-advent Israel are not your own, and so all you need do is to get with the apostolic succession program and work your way into entrance to Heaven"...
• Or if the message is "Fear not, for the coming tribulation and the complicated things of prophecy are not for you and you need only 'get saved' to fashion your own entrance to Heaven"...

...then in the former, there is a need for reformation, but no revival; in the latter, there is only need for revival, but no reformation.

(And sadly, by canceling out half of the revival and reformation equation, the entirety of the needs of man are rendered -NOT IN STOCK-.)

The problem with both erroneous eschatological views is that the emphasis on the character of God is hidden, and this is the very key to true religion.

(Of course, "religion" is a dirty word to many, which is very pleasing to the enemy of souls. He knows the tendency of men to throw out the baby with the bath water. Anti-religion/denomination is all the rage in postmodern Christendom—many of whom are old enough to know better—as if God could not possibly manage to organize any of His own people. But in following this lead, those who claim to be followers of Christ may unwittingly be emulating skeptics and anti-theists. I say "unwittingly" because, to be fair, it is not easy to hold oneself faithful to God amidst a group of other, even well-meaning, nonetheless erring mortals, especially if "oneself" maintains no vital connection with Christ.)

James 1​

26 If anyone thinks he is religious and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his heart, this person’s religion is worthless. 27 Religion that is pure and undefiled before God the Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their affliction, and to keep oneself unstained from the world.​

Did Christ not visit the orphan and the widow, and keep Himself unstained from the world?

What is an orphan but one who is without a father and, likely, a brother?

And what is a widow but one who has lost her bridegroom?

What are we, but orphans and widows?

Christ is our Brother, and the church's Bridegroom, and God is our Father.

Pre-advent Israel offers a policeman; Rome offers one who is claimed to be the mother of God.

What does God offer when He visits?

Himself—see Calvary.

All we need and all we may, indeed, want for and yet may fully have is found in Christ.

Oh, that the tongue was sufficient to express the bounty that is Christ! Heaven has been emptied for the children of men!

Flee from religion that has not, at its center, the character of God in Christ, the Lamb that taketh away the sin of the world (completely—not just from the books!).

.

 

[Bibleinvestigations]

You are correct, with a nuance that Barney mentioned. Catholicism is predominantly preterist, while protestantism is predominantly futurist. Both hermeneutics, believe it or not, developed and popularized by 2 Jesuits during the counter reformation, both being extremely short-sighted interpretations of scripture that conveniently hide the Antichrist from view.
God was not confined to being able to see but one of two short periods of history, (take your pick which one), and be blind to 2000 years of church and gospel history, 1260 years of Antichrist rule and power, and over 1000 years of persecution, human misery and suffering, as well as the rising and fall of nations. God's perspective has always been all encompassing, seeing not just the end from the beginning, but everything in between.

Yes God predicted everything in the church in advance me most has been fulfilled.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Regarding the original post, I find that any person who is proposing an interpretation, if they do not directly investigate and explain exactly why the King James Version (among others) includes capitalization of Messiah and Prince where the original Hebrew text does not have this, always comes up with a faulty system.

"unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks"

 

[BarneyFife]

This ought to be interesting.

Welcome, @EclipseEventSigns!

 

[FaithWillDo]

Regarding the original post, I find that any person who is proposing an interpretation, if they do not directly investigate and explain exactly why the King James Version (among others) includes capitalization of Messiah and Prince where the original Hebrew text does not have this, always comes up with a faulty system.

"unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks"

Dear EclipseEventSigns,
Rather than just making criticisms, why don't you make your point?
Joe

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Dear EclipseEventSigns,
Rather than just making criticisms, why don't you make your point?
Joe

It was a statement of fact. People need to explain that part of the verse - not ignore it. That's the point.

 

[FaithWillDo]

It was a statement of fact. People need to explain that part of the verse - not ignore it. That's the point.

Dear EclipseEventSigns,
The verse could be translated as "anointed ruler" instead, but regardless, the verse is still referring to Christ. I see no need to explain whether or not it should be capitalized as the KJV does.

You must have a point in making your statement because you said that a person will "always comes up with a faulty system" if they do not explain why the KJV capitalizes it.

Or do you not have a point?

Joe

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Dear EclipseEventSigns,
The verse could be translated as "anointed ruler" instead, but regardless, the verse is still referring to Christ. I see no need to explain whether or not it should be capitalized as the KJV does.

You must have a point in making your statement because you said that a person will "always comes up with a faulty system" if they do not explain why the KJV capitalizes it.

Or do you not have a point?

Joe

That is the entire point. Ah hah. "referring to Christ". Why is Christ capitalized? There is the point.

 

[Truth7t7]

It was a statement of fact. People need to explain that part of the verse - not ignore it. That's the point.

The Jews "Presently" await for their Messiah as prophesied in the old testament, they will build in the future unto this prophesied Messiah the Prince, who we know "Was" and "Is" Jesus Christ

Caps are used because the KJV translators were well aware of this context, they are building to the Old Testament "Messiah The Prince" Jesus Christ

Daniel 9:25KJV
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The Jews "Presently" await for their Messiah as prophesied in the old testament, they will build in the future unto this prophesied Messiah the Prince, who we know "Was" and "Is" Jesus Christ

Caps are used because the KJV translators were well aware of this context, they are building to the Old Testament "Messiah The Prince" Jesus Christ

Daniel 9:25KJV
25 Know therefore and understand, that from the going forth of the commandment to restore and to build Jerusalem unto the Messiah the Prince shall be seven weeks, and threescore and two weeks: the street shall be built again, and the wall, even in troublous times.

Actually, Hebrew language does not have capitals. Neither does it have punctuation. The KJV when they place capitals where there aren't any and arrange sentences with punctuation where there aren't any - it is entirely an interpretation. Those that base their understanding on purely the KJV without understanding any of this, come up with an interpretation based on an interpretation.

 

[Truth7t7]

Actually, Hebrew language does not have capitals. Neither does it have punctuation. The KJV when they place capitals where there aren't any and arrange sentences with punctuation where there aren't any - it is entirely an interpretation. Those that base their understanding on purely the KJV without understanding any of this, come up with an interpretation based on an interpretation.

Those who use new Bible versions NIV, NASB, ESV, etc are unaware they are backed by a Greek text created by adulterers and a homosexual union supporter

I'll stick with the highly educated Christian men in the 1611 KJV translation

 

[David in NJ]

Those who use new Bible versions NIV, NASB, ESV, etc are unaware they are backed by a Greek text created by adulterers and a homosexual union supporter

I'll stick with the highly educated Christian men in the 1611 KJV translation

i do not not trust 'highly educated men'

But i do know that God was guiding them for His Purpose in the translating.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Those who use new Bible versions NIV, NASB, ESV, etc are unaware they are backed by a Greek text created by adulterers and a homosexual union supporter

I'll stick with the highly educated Christian men in the 1611 KJV translation

I suggest doing some more research into the history of the various manuscripts for both the Old Testament and New Testament and exactly how the KJV was translated. Your comments are invalid in many ways.

The biggest flaw in what you state is that the book of Daniel is in the Old Testament. He wrote his material in both Hebrew and Aramaic. Not Greek.

 

[Truth7t7]

I suggest doing some more research into the history of the various manuscripts for both the Old Testament and New Testament and exactly how the KJV was translated. Your comments are invalid in many ways.

The biggest flaw in what you state is that the book of Daniel is in the Old Testament. He wrote his material in both Hebrew and Aramaic. Not Greek.

The biggest flaw is the new Bible versions that follow the corrupt Alexandrian schools in Egypt, the 1% minority of manuscript evidence

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The biggest flaw is the new Bible versions that follow the corrupt Alexandrian schools in Egypt, the 1% minority of manuscript evidence

Again. Do some research. There is nothing about the New Testament manuscripts in this thread discussion. It is about Daniel. In the Old Testament. Written in Hebrew and Aramaic. NOT GREEK.