The Wrong Effect

[justbyfaith]

It's not just the 'big' stuff that is obviously sin but I'm pretty sure each and every one of us inadvertently sins on a daily basis even if it is some 'small' sin like impatience, or pride, or anger with another shopper or driver. But because we have matured we can now recognise these failings for what they are and look to God to forgive us and keep us walking in the light. We don't have to beat ourselves up about it.

Keep reading...

 

[justbyfaith]

I have been having victory over the flesh for quite some time now; and I am fully aware of that victory that the Lord has given unto me.

I know also that because I think I am standing I need to take heed lest I fall.

However, the fact that temptation may be coming to my door does not mean that I necessarily have to give in to it.

 

[Pearl]

Keep reading...

Keep reading what?

 

[justbyfaith]

Keep reading what?

Your Bible...posts on these boards...things in general that apply to the doctrine/truth that is according to godliness (1 Timothy 6:3, Titus 1:1).

 

[marks]

You think that I don't know what it means to walk according to the flesh? I have been having victory over the flesh for quite some time now; and I am fully aware of that victory that the Lord has given unto me.

I don't really have any thought on to what degree you know what it means to walk according to the flesh.

I'm just asking where your certainty is. It sounds like you arrive at this conclusion based on what you understand about yourself and how you are, would that be fair to say?

For myself, I find that as I continue to mature in the Lord, I continue to realize that things I didn't previously recognize as sin, I now do, and I wonder whether that will continue in the future, meaning, there may be aspects in my life right now that I don't recognize as being derived from the flesh. So I don't consider my knowledge perfect.

And then there is the matter of knowing one's own heart. Paul himself said he wasn't fit to judge himself concerning whether he was sinning or not. Specifically,

1 Corinthians 4:3-5
3) But with me it is a very small thing that I should be judged of you, or of man's judgment: yea, I judge not mine own self.
4) For I know nothing by myself; yet am I not hereby justified: but he that judgeth me is the Lord.
5) Therefore judge nothing before the time, until the Lord come, who both will bring to light the hidden things of darkness, and will make manifest the counsels of the hearts: and then shall every man have praise of God.

He's saying here, I don't judge myself, because I don't know anything against myself, but I'm not justified in that, it's the Lord Who will judge me. So don't you do it, Jesus will when He comes back, because He is the one who reveals what's inside us.

"I judge not mine own self" because it is Jesus who will reveal what we are really about. We don't always know even our own selves, and should recognize we really just have a perception of our self, and from that perception we form our opinion. But that's all it is. We have opinions based on our perceptions of our self.

I hear some say, My conscience is clean every day, this is what Paul said in other words. But he goes on to say, again, in other words, that's not what matters. What I think of myself means nothing, it is Jesus Who will show what's real about me. It's easy to hope for His mercy!!

But this is how it is I wonder when someone says that they aren't sinning. Paul seems pretty clear in this passage, and it really makes a lot of sense to me as I look at myself.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

I think that passages that apply to this topic are 1 John 1:7 and Proverbs 20:27.

 

[Pearl]

Your Bible...posts on these boards...things in general that apply to the doctrine/truth that is according to godliness (1 Timothy 6:3, Titus 1:1).

I honestly don't know what you're getting at but it sounds a little aggressive.

 

[marks]

I think that passages that apply to this topic are 1 John 1:7 and Proverbs 20:27.

How do these passages teach us that we have a complete understanding of our own hearts? Considering that Paul, writing by the Holy Spirit, acknowledge in no uncertain terms that he did not?

It sounds as if you don't accept this to be true, or that it may be true for Paul, but not for others? Is that what you mean?

Much love!

 

[marks]

It's not just the 'big' stuff that is obviously sin but I'm pretty sure each and every one of us inadvertently sins on a daily basis even if it is some 'small' sin like impatience, or pride, or anger with another shopper or driver. But because we have matured we can now recognise these failings for what they are and look to God to forgive us and keep us walking in the light. We don't have to beat ourselves up about it.

I think we can even do things we approve of, with seeming good results, things that we feel good about, and yet, it can still be from the flesh, and not the leading of the Holy Spirit.

People who are not saved can do really good seeming things, and yet, they remain children of Adam, and condemned in sin and death. Those who are in flesh cannot please God, and cannot keep His law. But we might look at their lives, and think, what a good person that is!

I think the same can be true for us, we can have a flesh that cleans up pretty good, yet, it's still the flesh.

I think we grow in understanding, God reveals us to ourselves, but I for one would never assume that this process is over, and now I know everything about myself.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

There is a seeming paradox in scripture, that if we are wholly sanctified, we would not know it (1 John 1:8, Job 9:21, John 9:41, Isaiah 42:19 (kjv))...and that yet we can know if we have made progress in the Lord.

Because it is written,

Luk 11:33, No man, when he hath lighted a candle, putteth it in a secret place, neither under a bushel, but on a candlestick, that they which come in may see the light.
Luk 11:34, The light of the body is the eye: therefore when thine eye is single, thy whole body also is full of light; but when thine eye is evil, thy body also is full of darkness.
Luk 11:35, Take heed therefore that the light which is in thee be not darkness.
Luk 11:36, If thy whole body therefore be full of light, having no part dark, the whole shall be full of light, as when the bright shining of a candle doth give thee light.

And therefore, since the light shines in the heart and there is no part dark, it would seem that there is nothing hidden from the scrutiny of that light. Even as the blood of Jesus cleanses us from all sin, because we are walking in that light; and therefore when the light shines in that place and yet finds no sin, it is in such a case that we will find that we have been cleansed from all sin and I believe that in such a case we are sworn to secrecy as to the direct nature of our sinless state. Even as Jesus said to the leper who had been cleansed of all of his leprosy in Matthew 8:1-4; for we know that leprosy is a type of sin in holy scripture.

Of course, if we judge on the basis of our behaviour as it relates to the law of God, then we are judging ourselves not on whether or not we have no sin; but rather we are judging ourselves on our behaviour over an extended period of time.

I believe that we can indeed know, if we gauge our behaviour by the law, whether our behaviour is blameless according to the law or not. For by the law is the knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20). And we know sin by the law (Romans 7:7).

Therefore the law is a light that we can shine on our behaviour to determine whether we are walking in the fruit of the Spirit or whether we are committing the works of the flesh. Because if we abide in the fruit of the Spirit, there is no law that will condemn our behaviour (Galatians 5:22-23)...we will walk as law-abiding citizens of the kingdom of heaven if we walk not after the flesh but after the Spirit (Romans 8:4).

 

[justbyfaith]

I honestly don't know what you're getting at but it sounds a little aggressive.

Sometimes we need to be aggressive in our battle against the enemy of our souls.

But I am uncertain as to what you think is aggressive about my statements.

I feel that I was being rather passive.

 

[Pearl]

Sometimes we need to be aggressive in our battle against the enemy of our souls.

But I am uncertain as to what you think is aggressive about my statements.

I feel that I was being rather passive.

Your Bible...posts on these boards...things in general that apply to the doctrine/truth that is according to godliness (1 Timothy 6:3, Titus 1:1).

Why do you think I don't read my bible? You seem to be accusing me of something here but I'm not sure what or why. That's why it comes across as aggressive. If you have something to say you need to be up front about it and hide behind some stuff that you expect me to understand. Mind reading is not one of my talents.

 

[justbyfaith]

Why do you think I don't read my bible? You seem to be accusing me of something here but I'm not sure what or why. That's why it comes across as aggressive. If you have something to say you need to be up front about it and hide behind some stuff that you expect me to understand. Mind reading is not one of my talents.

Do you think that you have a perfect knowledge of everything that the Bible teaches?

If you don't, then I simply say to you, keep reading...

The Lord has yet to speak to you on certain issues if you will continue to delve into His word and seek His real answers on every issue.

 

[Pearl]

Sometimes we need to be aggressive in our battle against the enemy of our souls.

But I am uncertain as to what you think is aggressive about my statements.

I feel that I was being rather passive.

I re-read your post to me and still don't get it. And I feel that the aggression is that you are accusing me of not readin my bible or posts on these boards...or understanding things in general that apply to the doctrine/truth that is according to godliness.

 

[Pearl]

Do you think that you have a perfect knowledge of everything that the Bible teaches?

If you don't, then I simply say to you, keep reading...

The Lord has yet to speak to you on certain issues if you will continue to delve into His word and seek His real answers on every issue.

I do not think that I have a perfect knowledge of everything the bible teaches. Nobody does. So I do keep reading, and yes I expect the Lord to speak to me as he has in the past. I am sure he will show me what I need to know.

So, again, I don't understand why you are getting at me this way. It certainly doesn't feel very friendly.

 

[marks]

Therefore the law is a light that we can shine on our behaviour to determine whether we are walking in the fruit of the Spirit or whether we are committing the works of the flesh.

1 Timothy 1:8-11
8) But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9) Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10) For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11) According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

 

[justbyfaith]

1 Timothy 1:8-11
8) But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;
9) Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,
10) For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;
11) According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

The law will point out therefore, to the lawless and disobedient, to the ungodly and to sinners, to the unholy and to the profane, that they are sinners; by identifying specifically what their sins are that need to be repented of in their lives.

For as long as you are a sinner, the law will point out to you your sin.

If you ever come to the point where Jesus, by His blood, has cleansed you from all sin, the law will no longer be pointing out your sins; because there will be no sin left to highlight; you will not be a sinner anymore: you will no longer be "lawless and disobedient, ungodly and a sinner, unholy and profane".

But it should be clear that the law is the light by which we obtain the knowledge of sin (Romans 3:20).

1Jo 1:7, But if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin.

 

[marks]

For as long as you are a sinner, the law will point out to you your sin.

This is identifying yourself with the old man.

In Christ we are a new creation, the new man.

Much love!

 

[justbyfaith]

This is identifying yourself with the old man.

In Christ we are a new creation, the new man.

Much love!

Question:

When we commit sins in the flesh, do they matter?

Or, are they inconsequential because it is not who we really are (the new creation, our spirit-man) that is committing them?

I would say that a specific answer to these questions means that you are believing in and purporting gnosticism.

 

[justbyfaith]

It certainly doesn't feel very friendly.

I apologize. I didn't mean to appear unfriendly.

I merely was being lazy; I didn't want to take the time to convince you of my pov; because I believed that if you keep reading my posts on these boards in other places, you will be convinced of it soon enough. That is, if you are receptive to the teaching of the Holy Ghost; which He teaches when we compare spiritual things with spiritual.