Timing of Eze 37 and 38 pre Trib?

[The Light]

No. The covenant is made for seven years and only broken in the middle of that. There are seven years still, no one shortened what God said would be! What is shortened is included in that last time. Otherwise man would no longer exist and all flesh would die.

Matt 24:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

The verses do not mean that ALL flesh would die if the days were not shortened. The verses mean that if the days were not shortened there would be no flesh alive to be saved. In other words all BELIEVERS would be killed and there would be no flesh alive raptured to salvation.

 

[ewq1938]

You need to pay attention to what you are reading. Rev 11 is THE END OF THE WRATH OF GOD.

No, it's the start of God's wrath. You need to READ the verse not just skip to your own personal opinion of it.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Here it clearly states that God's wrath has come (arrives) after the 7th trump sounds. Clearly God's wrath hadn't been coming for a long time before this or else the statement would be meaningless.

 

[ewq1938]

In other words all BELIEVERS would be killed and there would be no flesh alive raptured to salvation.

This is correct. The flesh mentioned is the flesh of the saints that enter the Great Tribulation. If it was the original duration of 7 years no saints would survive so God cut it in half down to 42 months. Now some saints will survive it and be raptured.

 

[dad]

So again with the whole 7 years shortened down to 7 years. This is false. It was shortened from 7 years down to 42 months or half of 7 years.

The seven years is what things were shortened to. Claing the given times of prophesy are changed is what is very false.

Rev 13:5 And there was given unto him a mouth speaking great things and blasphemies; and power was given unto him to continue forty and two months.

The Great Tribulation is not one day longer than 42 months.

The Great Tribulation is just the second half of the seven years. Why would half of seven years be longer...or shorter? It is what it is. Did you actually think that God declared so many years in prophesy, and even weeks and days, yet He made a mistake and had to shorten that time?? No. Whatever time was shortened resulted in there being the prophesied time.

 

[dad]

Matt 24:
21 For then shall be great tribulation, such as was not since the beginning of the world to this time, no, nor ever shall be.

22 And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.

The verses do not mean that ALL flesh would die if the days were not shortened. The verses mean that if the days were not shortened there would be no flesh alive to be saved. In other words all BELIEVERS would be killed and there would be no flesh alive raptured to salvation.

The rapture is before the days even start probably, at the start of the wrathful seven years. There is no way the days, or months are changed in any way. They are written in stone basically. When it says he will confirm a covenant for seven years that will be seven years. When the angel direct from the throne of God says there is a final seven years, you can take that to the bank.

 

[ewq1938]

The seven years is what things were shortened to. Claing the given times of prophesy are changed is what is very false.

And what verse says the Great Tribulation was to be longer than 7 years?

The Great Tribulation is just the second half of the seven years. Why would half of seven years be longer...or shorter? It is what it is. Did you actually think that God declared so many years in prophesy, and even weeks and days, yet He made a mistake and had to shorten that time?? No. Whatever time was shortened resulted in there being the prophesied time.

God can change prophecy before it is fulfilled. Daniel spoke of a 7 year Great Tribulation, many years later Jesus announced that Great Tribulation would be shortened and in Revelation we see it is 42 months. The 7 year Great Tribulation will not happen.

 

[dad]

And what verse says the Great Tribulation was to be longer than 7 years?

The Great Tribulation is the last part of the seven years. Three and a half years. That time is given in days and months also, and is not something God changes/shortens

God can change prophecy before it is fulfilled.

When He speaks it is so.

Daniel spoke of a 7 year Great Tribulation, many years later Jesus announced that Great Tribulation would be shortened and in Revelation we see it is 42 months. The 7 year Great Tribulation will not happen.

Not at all, you just misapplied a verse about how that time was shortened. Yes it was shortened, and the result was that we have the seven years, the last half of which is the Great Tribulation.

 

[ewq1938]

The Great Tribulation is the last part of the seven years. Three and a half years. That time is given in days and months also, and is not something God changes/shortens


When He speaks it is so.
Not at all, you just misapplied a verse about how that time was shortened. Yes it was shortened, and the result was that we have the seven years, the last half of which is the Great Tribulation.

No, I am correctly applying it and Revelation 13 supports that. The GT used to be 7 years now it's 42 months. We actually agree on that last part but it is given in months not days.

 

[dad]

No, I am correctly applying it and Revelation 13 supports that. The GT used to be 7 years now it's 42 months. We actually agree on that last part but it is given in months not days.

Rev 13 or any other chapter does not support erasing the last seven years of history given in prophesy to Daniel. The 42 months is in the midst of the week. It did not REPLACE the week!

 

[ewq1938]

Rev 13 or any other chapter does not support erasing the last seven years of history given in prophesy to Daniel. The 42 months is in the midst of the week. It did not REPLACE the week!

God shortened the week down to half a week. There will be no tribulation from the antichrist before the 42 months nor will the antichrist even be on the scene. He appears at the start of the 42 months. The 42 months before that are the sorrows, not tribulation.

 

[dad]

God shortened the week down to half a week.

No. He did not.

There will be no tribulation from the antichrist before the 42 months nor will the antichrist even be on the scene.

There will be seven years allotted for the end. Of course the white horse rider will be on the scene as well. When he breaks the covenant in the middle of the seven years then he will not only be on the scene, but start the Great Tribulation.

He appears at the start of the 42 months. The 42 months before that are the sorrows, not tribulation.

You can call it a tomato if you like, it is still the seven years. Probably the Rapture is at the start of that seven years. The war in Eze also. The mark of the beast will likely be here as well...etc.

 

[Keraz]

Here is how the last 7 years and the extra days of Daniel 12:11-12 fit in:
Firstly the Sixth Seal worldwide disaster will happen.
This enables a One World Govt to be set up, but we Christians won't be a part of it.

The leader of the World Govt will make a seven year peace treaty with the people then living in all of the holy Land.
He will do this because the Lord will have just wiped out the massive attack upon them from the North. Ezekiel 38 and 39 and Joel 2:20

There will be peace for the next 3 1/2 years, exactly 1260 days, but then he will conquer God's people, Daniel 7:25, Zechariah 14:1-2 and Rev 13:7, and sit in the Temple. 2 Thess 2:4
Then for the next 1260 days, he will control all the world, but all the punishments prophesied of the 7 Trumpets and the 7 Bowls, will take place, culminating with the 7th Bowl - Armageddon . Revelation 16:13-18
Plus the Two Witnesses will preach in Jerusalem for these 1260 days, Revelation 11:3

Also, the faithful believers will be kept in a place of safety on earth. Revelation 12:14

Jesus will Return on the Day of Tabernacles, 15 Tishri. [Tabernacles means; God with us] Exactly 2520 days since the peace treaty was signed.

30 days later, [day 1290 since the Temple was desecrated] we will celebrate the Feast of Purim and 75 days later; 1335 days since the Temple was desecrated, we will rededicate the Temple at the final Hanukkah.
Proved by the exact 75 day period between 15 Tishri; Tabernacles and 25 Kislev; Hanukkah.

 

[ewq1938]

No. He did not.

Scripture is on my side. Christ said the Great Tribulation was to be shortened. This was new information. It changes the old 7 year Great Tribulation from Daniel.

 

[The Light]

The rapture is before the days even start probably,

What I told you about no flesh being saved is correct.

However, you are correct in saying that the rapture of the Church will happen before the 7 years. That is when the fullness of the Gentiles comes in and God turns His attention to Israel.

The fig tree has two harvests. Jacob had two brides, Leah and His chosen bride Rachel who he worked 7 more years for. The Lord Himself will come for His Church. It will be like the days of Noah where Noah is in the ark 7 days before the flood. It will happen at the trump of God or voice of God. When the Lord comes the second time,He will send His angels to gather the elect from heaven and earth. It will be like the days of Lot, where the very day Lot left Sodom, destruction came. This coming will occur at the last trump which is blown on the Feast of Trumpets.

at the start of the wrathful seven years.

I keep telling you, I don't care how many TV preachers tell you that the wrath of God and the tribulation are the same period, they are not. The tribulation is over at the 6th seal, and then the wrath of God begins. The wrath of God does not last 7 years.

IMMEDIATELY AFTER THE TRIBULATION.

Matthew 24
29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken:

30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory.

31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Rev 6
12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood;

13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

The tribulation is OVER at the 6th seal. Then the wrath of God begins.

Rev 6
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?

There is no way the days, or months are changed in any way. They are written in stone basically. When it says he will confirm a covenant for seven years that will be seven years. When the angel direct from the throne of God says there is a final seven years, you can take that to the bank.

I never said the 7 years is shortened. This should be more proof to you that the TRIBULATION is not the same as the WRATH OF GOD. The tribulation is shortened but not the 7 years. So if the tribulation and the wrath of God are the same timeframe, how could He shorten the days? Answer, they are not the same timeframe.

 

[The Light]

God shortened the week down to half a week. There will be no tribulation from the antichrist before the 42 months nor will the antichrist even be on the scene. He appears at the start of the 42 months. The 42 months before that are the sorrows, not tribulation.

Totally wrong. The week is not shortened. The Great Tribulation is shortened. The 70th week of Daniel is about the people of Daniel and the full week will happen.

 

[The Light]

No, it's the start of God's wrath. You need to READ the verse not just skip to your own personal opinion of it.

Rev 11:15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.
Rev 11:16 And the four and twenty elders, which sat before God on their seats, fell upon their faces, and worshipped God,
Rev 11:17 Saying, We give thee thanks, O Lord God Almighty, which art, and wast, and art to come; because thou hast taken to thee thy great power, and hast reigned.
Rev 11:18 And the nations were angry, and thy wrath is come, and the time of the dead, that they should be judged, and that thou shouldest give reward unto thy servants the prophets, and to the saints, and them that fear thy name, small and great; and shouldest destroy them which destroy the earth.

Here it clearly states that God's wrath has come (arrives) after the 7th trump sounds. Clearly God's wrath hadn't been coming for a long time before this or else the statement would be meaningless.

That is the end of wrath. What do you think happens when the kingdoms of this world become the kingdoms of our Lord?

Rev 11
15 And the seventh angel sounded; and there were great voices in heaven, saying, The kingdoms of this world are become the kingdoms of our Lord, and of his Christ; and he shall reign for ever and ever.

I'll give you a hint. Jesus has returned and set up His kingdom on earth.

You need to apply a little common sense. The trumpets are not the same as the seals. The seventh seal has to be opened BEFORE the wrath of God which are the trumpets can begin. There is a reason that they are numbered and opened in order.

 

[The Light]

This is correct. The flesh mentioned is the flesh of the saints that enter the Great Tribulation. If it was the original duration of 7 years no saints would survive so God cut it in half down to 42 months. Now some saints will survive it and be raptured.

The week was not shortened. 70 weeks are determined upon the people of Daniel and that is scriptural fact. Only the great tribulation is shortened. The tribulation is over at the 6th seal and then the wrath of God begins. The seals are NOT the same timeframe as the trumpet of wrath.

 

[Timtofly]

You thought the wheat had to be separated from the chaff way up in the air?? Strange.

No you did.

You claimed there was a war for 7 years, because Daniel 9:27 said so.

 

[ewq1938]

The week was not shortened.

Duh. The Tribulation was originally a week not it's the last half of the week. There is no middle point where it gets worse.

The two beasts of Revelation 13 have 42 months total, not 84 months.

 

[The Light]

Duh. The Tribulation was originally a week not it's the last half of the week. There is no middle point where it gets worse.

The two beasts of Revelation 13 have 42 months total, not 84 months.

Maybe the 70th WEEK of Daniel might possibly give a smallish whim of a hint of being 1 week long.