Types of Christians….what type are you?
- Thread starter Grailhunter
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LOL Duly Noted. Heartwashed does not like Grailhunter. Am I to assume no Valentine cards?
Actually I like you quite a bit...
although I don't think that you are born again.
I am definitely born again and I walk with Christ everyday....
Ever hear of the cliché. Friends do not let friends drive stoned, I do not let friends live stupid.
I at least give people an opportunity to know the Truth. My ministry I call the Johnny Appleseed of Truth. The Truth has power....I do not have to beat around the bush or sugarcoat it. As Christ said, The truth will set you free.
Still after the world has feed one lie after another and one false belief after another, and then you are presented with the Truth, it can be shocking, startling, even infuriating. Are you going to be mad at me for telling you the Truth or mad at those that lied to you? For the most of it, it is not their fault either, they were lied to too. And it is not all lies, a lot of it is the progression of information and understanding through history. And as history goes, sometimes history is disturbing.
I am presenting information that can be looked up. I do not get into the complicated topics on this forum. The thing is again, Truth has power. Truth will stand up to and smash false beliefs and lies. That is why I do not tell people to believe me.....Instead I say, prove me wrong. Now if they say, This guy is crazy! I am going to prove him wrong! And they go and dig and dig, and in the end they are going to find out that I am right. But the other blessings I have given them is that, along the way on that "dig" they are going to find other Truths, and they are going to learn "how" to dig....research so they can find other Truths on their own. Give a man a fish and you feed him for a day, give him a fishing pole and feed him for a lifetime.
And I understand it is shocking and there is more to come. And you are going to feel like, He is attacking what we believe! No apologies, why would you want a religion of false beliefs. The attack on Christianity was when they split the faith into thousands and thousands of denominations....all because they could not understand. Wouldn't it be better to have Faith and Truth? My intent is to strengthen Christian beliefs....a religion built on false beliefs is a house of cards. It is like Christ said....in Matthew chapter 7
24 “Everyone then who hears these words of mine and does them will be like a wise man who built his house on the rock. 25 And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat on that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on the rock. 26 And everyone who hears these words of mine and does not do them will be like a foolish man who built his house on the sand. 27 And the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell, and great was the fall of it.”
Truth will stand up to all challenges....Truth strengthens Faith and instills confidence. If you know the Truth, no one, not even Satan can challenge your beliefs or your faith. And we will talk about Truth some more.... But I am not a preacher....I am a speaker....as you will find I am a walking speech. I have been pulled out of crowds a few times at the last minute to speak when the scheduled speaker did not show or was late and received good applause. Truth is a treasure and I am sharing it with you all, it is up to you what you do with it. I have traveled the world to bring this treasure to the forum here, but it does not hurt my feeling if people do not believe. That is up to the Holy Spirit. Johnny Appleseed of Truth....I just cast the seeds....will they grow? That is up to you all and God.
Be good and do good....and you will know a new relationship with God.
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This came from the Thread… Is it possible to get past the lies?
So after the Bible was written and after time passed there were people that had personal beliefs that were not in the Bible but they wanted people to believe as they did. So they promoted slogans and buzzwords to insert their beliefs into Christianity. The problem is that nearly 100% of these slogans and buzzwords are not in the Bible and are false beliefs. If what they were promoting was the truth some of these slogans and buzzwords would be in the Bible. Men improving on the scriptures? I think not.
I do not have to get into the complicated topics to clear 90% of this up. Some of these are completely wrong and others are partially right. The promotion of these theological slogans and buzzword over the years are not too much unlike advertising in general….”Nationwide is on your side or M’m M’m Good! M'm! M'm! Good! That’s what Campbell soup is! M'm! M'm! Good!”
The way it works is that the word is promoted or promulgated, and the “name” of the word will have some connection to the Bible, but the definitions are either partially wrong or completely wrong. As in advertising, a lie has to have a little mud mixed into it to get it to stick to the wall. And the best way for you to learn, is to dig deep to prove me horribly wrong.
The first word is Trinity
Most know that this word is not in the Bible. And it was not only promulgated but was a decree of the Roman Council of Nicaea, a doctrine that was enforced by threat of excommunication which usually led to death. And the people behind this did not necessarily believe it either. The story behind the story; Emperor Constantine demanded that the council define one religion. This is what the Roman Catholic Church was all about….one religion.
Constantine believed that for Christianity to be true it had to be one truth. So the doctrine of the Trinity was set in place to stop the arguments, even among the varies Bishops at the council, they could not agree on the seemingly different characters of God the Father and God the Son and what role the Holy Spirit played, who was superior and who did what. Even if some of the things that Yahweh had done in the Old Testament was evil?
So the one God formula was produced, indicating they were all one person and everything was done by all of them. One person, one character, and all things done by all of them. End of arguing or die. The concept of the Trinity is not wrong, it is the commonly understood definition that is wrong….The one God formula for the Trinity is a lie.
The truth is; 3
Yahweh…God the Father….Supreme God….Creator God….Creator of Heaven and Earth and Adam and Eve.
Yeshua….God the Son….Savior….Messiah
The unnamed God….the Holy Spirit….guide…. nurturer …. strengthener… communicator….and teacher. Teacher of many things through the centuries.
Trinity….tri-unty…..not triune. Unity…accord….alliance. They are a family. But not one….separate wills, separate minds, separate presence, separate thrones, and separate authority with a hierarchy. All three are full-fledged Gods. The Trinity can be seen as a Godhead.
In Grailhunter’s Corner I have around 200 scriptural reasons why the one God formula is wrong.
Grailhunter’s Corner
Original Sin
Pretty much the doctrine of a mad man. You would have to study St. Augustine writings to appreciate that statement. The short of it, he had absolutely no control of his sexual behavior and his drinking habits and he figured no one else did either. A lot of his religious efforts focused on dealing with and understanding his own issues. Kind of like a person that becomes a psychiatrist to figure out why they are crazy.
Augustine was never married but had several sexual relationships and had an illegitimate child. After the point that he concluded humans could not control their sexual desires, his solution was to be celibate and not enter into any relationship with a female. He more or less isolated himself in the church community. He blamed his woes on the sin passed on by Adam… through sexual contact…kind of like a venereal disease. Babies born with sin….if they die….they go to hell. John Calvin was also a supporter of this….and also that God is an evil puppet master that denied mankind free will and controls their every thought and action….And this is going to be the tread….false beliefs coming from corrupt people.
St. Augustine was well educated and a prolific writer. I called him a mad man but his issues were not of the mind, but more along the lines of reasoning and emotional issues, issues that he was unable to control. His reasoning capacities were quite imaginative but were mostly abstract, not connected to reality.
St. Augustine was heavily influenced by Christoplatonism, a term used to refer to the Christian reflection of a dualistic philosophy of the Greek, Pagan philosopher Plato, which holds that the spirit is good but matter is evil, and guess what? We are matter. This religious philosophy which is Pagan influenced some of the Christian churches, and is in direct contradiction of the teachings of the Bible and thus through the centuries had received constant criticism from many teachers in the Christian Church.
St. Augustine refrained from baptism thinking that a person needed to obtain a level of perfection, before being baptized. And he believed that people should not get baptized until they were basically on there death bed. Which is exactly what he did. Thinking that this was the best way to enter Judgment Day free of sin. And of course to even get close to perfection he believed a person would have to be celibate and have little or no contact with women.
Because…..
On the topic of sexual desire...“Who can control this when its appetite is aroused? No one! In the very movement of this appetite, then, it has no ‘mode’ that responds to the decisions of the will. But when those who delight in this pleasure are not moved to it at their own will, whether they confine themselves to lawful or transgress to a unlawful pleasures; but sometimes this lust importunes them in spite of themselves, and sometimes fails them when they desire to feel it, so that though lust rages in the mind, it stirs not in the body Written by St. Augustine
“We must conclude, that a husband is meant to rule over his wife as the spirit rules over the flesh. and “the flesh lusts against the spirit and the spirit against the flesh.” Written by St. Augustine
Referring to the Hell that awaits women, Augustine in his famous Latin sermon ''Ad Fratres in Eremitate Sermo LXIX.'' He describes how Satan seized the damned female and commanded his fellow devils to “pierce her eyes with forks as she enjoyed looking at unclean things, pierce her mouth as she used them for blasphemy, pierce her heart, as she did not harbor piety, compassion, clemency, and forgiveness there, pierce her hands with the heavy fork forged in Hell since she reached with them at things unclean and did not use them to distribute alms and help her neighbors, use the fiery forks to pierce her legs that she used to dance and meet her lovers.' Then to the gates of Hell she is carried and then '"out steps a hideous, horrible dragon, always ready to devour sinners. The dragon inserts the female into his mouth, full of stench. After chewing and digesting its prey, the dragon vomits the female into a fiery lake, where millions of other sinners wait for their trial by our Lord." Written by St. Augustine
The concept of perfection was one of St. Augustine’s intellectual failures. Even in the abstract it can only exist in the imagination. In reality the attempt for human perfection is the folly of fools. In fact, the need, the plan, and the application of salvation, even the purpose of Christ’s crucifixion was and is for the imperfect. My motto, be good and do good to the best of your ability.
So after the Bible was written and after time passed there were people that had personal beliefs that were not in the Bible but they wanted people to believe as they did. So they promoted slogans and buzzwords to insert their beliefs into Christianity. The problem is that nearly 100% of these slogans and buzzwords are not in the Bible and are false beliefs. If what they were promoting was the truth some of these slogans and buzzwords would be in the Bible. Men improving on the scriptures? I think not.
I do not have to get into the complicated topics to clear 90% of this up. Some of these are completely wrong and others are partially right. The promotion of these theological slogans and buzzword over the years are not too much unlike advertising in general….”Nationwide is on your side or M’m M’m Good! M'm! M'm! Good! That’s what Campbell soup is! M'm! M'm! Good!”
The way it works is that the word is promoted or promulgated, and the “name” of the word will have some connection to the Bible, but the definitions are either partially wrong or completely wrong. As in advertising, a lie has to have a little mud mixed into it to get it to stick to the wall. And the best way for you to learn, is to dig deep to prove me horribly wrong.
The first word is Trinity
Most know that this word is not in the Bible. And it was not only promulgated but was a decree of the Roman Council of Nicaea, a doctrine that was enforced by threat of excommunication which usually led to death. And the people behind this did not necessarily believe it either. The story behind the story; Emperor Constantine demanded that the council define one religion. This is what the Roman Catholic Church was all about….one religion.
Constantine believed that for Christianity to be true it had to be one truth. So the doctrine of the Trinity was set in place to stop the arguments, even among the varies Bishops at the council, they could not agree on the seemingly different characters of God the Father and God the Son and what role the Holy Spirit played, who was superior and who did what. Even if some of the things that Yahweh had done in the Old Testament was evil?
So the one God formula was produced, indicating they were all one person and everything was done by all of them. One person, one character, and all things done by all of them. End of arguing or die. The concept of the Trinity is not wrong, it is the commonly understood definition that is wrong….The one God formula for the Trinity is a lie.
The truth is; 3
Yahweh…God the Father….Supreme God….Creator God….Creator of Heaven and Earth and Adam and Eve.
Yeshua….God the Son….Savior….Messiah
The unnamed God….the Holy Spirit….guide…. nurturer …. strengthener… communicator….and teacher. Teacher of many things through the centuries.
Trinity….tri-unty…..not triune. Unity…accord….alliance. They are a family. But not one….separate wills, separate minds, separate presence, separate thrones, and separate authority with a hierarchy. All three are full-fledged Gods. The Trinity can be seen as a Godhead.
In Grailhunter’s Corner I have around 200 scriptural reasons why the one God formula is wrong.
Grailhunter’s Corner
Original Sin
Pretty much the doctrine of a mad man. You would have to study St. Augustine writings to appreciate that statement. The short of it, he had absolutely no control of his sexual behavior and his drinking habits and he figured no one else did either. A lot of his religious efforts focused on dealing with and understanding his own issues. Kind of like a person that becomes a psychiatrist to figure out why they are crazy.
Augustine was never married but had several sexual relationships and had an illegitimate child. After the point that he concluded humans could not control their sexual desires, his solution was to be celibate and not enter into any relationship with a female. He more or less isolated himself in the church community. He blamed his woes on the sin passed on by Adam… through sexual contact…kind of like a venereal disease. Babies born with sin….if they die….they go to hell. John Calvin was also a supporter of this….and also that God is an evil puppet master that denied mankind free will and controls their every thought and action….And this is going to be the tread….false beliefs coming from corrupt people.
St. Augustine was well educated and a prolific writer. I called him a mad man but his issues were not of the mind, but more along the lines of reasoning and emotional issues, issues that he was unable to control. His reasoning capacities were quite imaginative but were mostly abstract, not connected to reality.
St. Augustine was heavily influenced by Christoplatonism, a term used to refer to the Christian reflection of a dualistic philosophy of the Greek, Pagan philosopher Plato, which holds that the spirit is good but matter is evil, and guess what? We are matter. This religious philosophy which is Pagan influenced some of the Christian churches, and is in direct contradiction of the teachings of the Bible and thus through the centuries had received constant criticism from many teachers in the Christian Church.
St. Augustine refrained from baptism thinking that a person needed to obtain a level of perfection, before being baptized. And he believed that people should not get baptized until they were basically on there death bed. Which is exactly what he did. Thinking that this was the best way to enter Judgment Day free of sin. And of course to even get close to perfection he believed a person would have to be celibate and have little or no contact with women.
Because…..
On the topic of sexual desire...“Who can control this when its appetite is aroused? No one! In the very movement of this appetite, then, it has no ‘mode’ that responds to the decisions of the will. But when those who delight in this pleasure are not moved to it at their own will, whether they confine themselves to lawful or transgress to a unlawful pleasures; but sometimes this lust importunes them in spite of themselves, and sometimes fails them when they desire to feel it, so that though lust rages in the mind, it stirs not in the body Written by St. Augustine
“We must conclude, that a husband is meant to rule over his wife as the spirit rules over the flesh. and “the flesh lusts against the spirit and the spirit against the flesh.” Written by St. Augustine
Referring to the Hell that awaits women, Augustine in his famous Latin sermon ''Ad Fratres in Eremitate Sermo LXIX.'' He describes how Satan seized the damned female and commanded his fellow devils to “pierce her eyes with forks as she enjoyed looking at unclean things, pierce her mouth as she used them for blasphemy, pierce her heart, as she did not harbor piety, compassion, clemency, and forgiveness there, pierce her hands with the heavy fork forged in Hell since she reached with them at things unclean and did not use them to distribute alms and help her neighbors, use the fiery forks to pierce her legs that she used to dance and meet her lovers.' Then to the gates of Hell she is carried and then '"out steps a hideous, horrible dragon, always ready to devour sinners. The dragon inserts the female into his mouth, full of stench. After chewing and digesting its prey, the dragon vomits the female into a fiery lake, where millions of other sinners wait for their trial by our Lord." Written by St. Augustine
The concept of perfection was one of St. Augustine’s intellectual failures. Even in the abstract it can only exist in the imagination. In reality the attempt for human perfection is the folly of fools. In fact, the need, the plan, and the application of salvation, even the purpose of Christ’s crucifixion was and is for the imperfect. My motto, be good and do good to the best of your ability.
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St. Augustine’s doctrine of Original Sin is not only about Adam’s sin being past by sex and conception, it is about the end of Christianity. Because the only way to prevent it being past on was to live a life of celibacy….no reproductions and no families….and Christianity would die out shortly. They were not worried about that because they thought Christ was going to return soon. From there it gets weird, you would think that in becoming a Christian, we could be forgiven of that sin. Not according to Him and others. Any sex was a sin…married or not. And in itself was a sin to pass the sin through sex and conception. So they believed that sex made you impure and celibacy made you more right with God, so many of the more well known early Christian leaders and the Catholic Church leaders practiced celibacy and non-marriage and families.
Virgin Mary
The phrase Virgin Mary does not appear in the Bible nor does the Bible suggest that she remained a virgin after Christ’s birth. Nor does it suggest that she did not join with Joseph after Christ’s birth LOL She was his wife. Perpetual virginity? Why was that promoted? One reason was the very negative Christian view on sex. The genitals were dirty and nasty and full of sinful….Maybe even Satan lived there. I heard a story about someone seeing Satan’s head peaking out from under a woman’s skirt! LOL LOL That is funny!
Well anyway, the Church was not going to tolerate Yeshua touching or having anything to do with female genitals.
So Yahweh having sex with Miriam was not going to be tolerated, and Yeshua passing through the birth canal and genitals of a female was not going to be tolerate….more or less the belief that Christ was beamed in and out of the womb.
The other reason, Yahweh impregnated Miriam while she was betrothed to Joseph, according to the Mosaic Law that was adultery and unlike the sons of God, He did not marry her…that is two violations. So they were attempting to distract from that, and all of this was a controversy at the time. Then there is the concept of purity at the time…the belief that sex makes you impure. So ridicules! Did Yahweh say…. For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh and they will forever be impure. Because what I made is dirty, nasty, and sinful and is of the devil…..NO that is not what He said.
Be fruitful and multiply was the only command that Yahweh kept repeating throughout the Old Testament….and multiplication of descendants was a common promise.
They changed a few things too.
Why don’t we call the mother of Christ by her name….Miriam. They may not have liked her name. She was named after the older sister of Moses and Aaron and she chastised Moses for marrying a pagan woman. Her name means rebellion or bitterness…
But I love Miriam very much. Saved me and about a dozen other’s in Iraq. Met her and talked with her, she is real. Unbelievably incredible. But she is not a virgin….impregnated by Yahweh….pretty good sized…..
Immaculate Conception of Miriam. This Catholic phrase does not appear in the Bible. Once again, it was promoted because of the belief that sex caused a person to be impure and then there is also the belief of Original Sin that they wanted to insulate Miriam from.
Mother of God.
This phrase does not appear in the Bible and it goes along with the one God formula of the Trinity. Concept based on the fact that she was the mother of Yeshua and then the false belief that there is only one God….so Mother of God
Fornication
A 5th century deception that made its way into some Bibles. After the close of the biblical era Christianity developed some very negative views of sex and women. As seen, the early Christian writers reflected a lot of that. The scriptures use various Greek words to designate different types of sexual immorality, variations of the word porneia, but the scriptures do not indicate two single people having sex as a sin, unless it is casual sex. The word fornication encompasses all the specific Greek words for the types of sexual sins and then lumps them all together in the fornication and adds the belief that two people having sex is a sin. Which is contrary to both the scriptures and history, because that is how they coupled up to form a marriage. And that was how it was done for a long time after the biblical era. No requirement in the Bible, anywhere for a wedding ceremony. It was the Protestants that first required a wedding ceremony in the 1500’s which was soon followed by a civil law in 1753. Of course I agree with the need for wedding ceremonies completely. But if a couple has sex before the wedding it is not a sin. But then again and of course adultery, prostitution, or any other form of casual sex is a sin. But we do not need the word fornication to explain that, because it perverts everything. If the scriptures are translated correctly using the Greek words that define the different type of sexual sin, it is more descriptive and accurate anyway.
Sodomy
The word does not appear in the scriptures. Another promoted concept and meaning. Of course its biblical connection is to Sodom and Gomorrah and the sexual sins thereof and I imagine that there was a lot. But its definition has come to mean any sexual activity that is not the missionary position and orifice. Even between married couples. That is false.
Years ago there were states that made anything put the missionary position illegal. LOL
Wedding ceremonies
The Bible, the scriptures, do not indicate a requirement for wedding ceremonies. This fact…this fact is both biblical and historical. As I said the sexual union was what formed their marriages and that was the way it was for centuries after the biblical period. Why? One of the reasons is that all wedding ceremonies originate from Pagan sources. But as Paul Harvey use to say; Stay tuned for the rest of the story.
The Israelites / Jews did not have wedding ceremonies in the Old Testament. No word in the Hebrew language for wed or wedding. That does not mean that they did not celebrate marriages….and that is another story.
But eventually the Jews did develop wedding ceremonies. When did that happen? The Persian conquest of Babylonia is in the Bible and the Jews found themselves under the friendly rule of the Persians who helped them recover their gold and rebuild their Temple in Jerusalem. Ezra 1:1 to 10:14
The Persians did have wedding ceremonies and they were elaborate, beautiful, and could last days. It seems that the Jews liked these weddings and developed wedding ceremonies of their own…not as a requirement but as an option. But they did not adopt the Persian weddings as a template for their weddings. They came up with their own and it was based on the Old Testament, events and figures. This seems to be reflected in modern Jewish weddings. This was probably an in between the testaments event.
But then Alexander the Great conquered Persia and they treated the Jews horribly…. Atrocities!…. Thousands died in grotesque spectacles and when the Romans took over they continued the abuse….thousands and thousands of Jews were crucified in every despicable manner. So needless to say the Jews hated them….
So they looked back on their history….they had lost their kingdom and the 1st Temple and for centuries were under the rule of Pagans. There is a phrase in the scriptures that says at times that Yahweh had sold them into the hands of their enemies...It appears more than once but here is an example; The anger of the LORD burned against Israel, and He gave them into the hands of plunderers who plundered them; and He sold them into the hands of their enemies around them, so that they could no longer stand before their enemies. Judges 2:20
So they came to think that the reason for their demise was being too tolerant of the Pagans. And this was particularly true after the 69-70 AD siege that destroyed the 2nd Temple and Jerusalem….thousands crucified in a ring around the city wall as a gruesome display and tens of thousands killed. So they tried to separate themselves from all that, and the Jewish Weddings fell under the axe…not gone, just not popular. It took centuries for the Jewish Wedding to reappear.
Regardless during the New Testament period there were probably a few Jewish weddings. The Wedding in Cana may have been one, but we do not know that. When Christ spoke of the ten virgins, who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom and the wedding feast….it is this Jewish Wedding ceremony that He is talking about. Because you will not find any of that in the Old Testament.
So in the Old and New Testament marriages were consummated by the union. Now in the 1st century there are a lot of Jewish-Christians but after the siege of Jerusalem, a lot of Jewish-Christians were killed. By the 2nd century the Gentile-Christians were firmly at the helm….so some of their customs from different regions started to show up in Christianity. As time went on some of these customs were Christianized. Wedding ceremonies and vows were some of these customs. They were modeled approximately after the Roman weddings and still are today.
Virgin Mary
The phrase Virgin Mary does not appear in the Bible nor does the Bible suggest that she remained a virgin after Christ’s birth. Nor does it suggest that she did not join with Joseph after Christ’s birth LOL She was his wife. Perpetual virginity? Why was that promoted? One reason was the very negative Christian view on sex. The genitals were dirty and nasty and full of sinful….Maybe even Satan lived there. I heard a story about someone seeing Satan’s head peaking out from under a woman’s skirt! LOL LOL That is funny!
Well anyway, the Church was not going to tolerate Yeshua touching or having anything to do with female genitals.
So Yahweh having sex with Miriam was not going to be tolerated, and Yeshua passing through the birth canal and genitals of a female was not going to be tolerate….more or less the belief that Christ was beamed in and out of the womb.
The other reason, Yahweh impregnated Miriam while she was betrothed to Joseph, according to the Mosaic Law that was adultery and unlike the sons of God, He did not marry her…that is two violations. So they were attempting to distract from that, and all of this was a controversy at the time. Then there is the concept of purity at the time…the belief that sex makes you impure. So ridicules! Did Yahweh say…. For this reason a man shall leave his father and his mother, and be joined to his wife; and they shall become one flesh and they will forever be impure. Because what I made is dirty, nasty, and sinful and is of the devil…..NO that is not what He said.
Be fruitful and multiply was the only command that Yahweh kept repeating throughout the Old Testament….and multiplication of descendants was a common promise.
They changed a few things too.
Why don’t we call the mother of Christ by her name….Miriam. They may not have liked her name. She was named after the older sister of Moses and Aaron and she chastised Moses for marrying a pagan woman. Her name means rebellion or bitterness…
But I love Miriam very much. Saved me and about a dozen other’s in Iraq. Met her and talked with her, she is real. Unbelievably incredible. But she is not a virgin….impregnated by Yahweh….pretty good sized…..
Immaculate Conception of Miriam. This Catholic phrase does not appear in the Bible. Once again, it was promoted because of the belief that sex caused a person to be impure and then there is also the belief of Original Sin that they wanted to insulate Miriam from.
Mother of God.
This phrase does not appear in the Bible and it goes along with the one God formula of the Trinity. Concept based on the fact that she was the mother of Yeshua and then the false belief that there is only one God….so Mother of God
Fornication
A 5th century deception that made its way into some Bibles. After the close of the biblical era Christianity developed some very negative views of sex and women. As seen, the early Christian writers reflected a lot of that. The scriptures use various Greek words to designate different types of sexual immorality, variations of the word porneia, but the scriptures do not indicate two single people having sex as a sin, unless it is casual sex. The word fornication encompasses all the specific Greek words for the types of sexual sins and then lumps them all together in the fornication and adds the belief that two people having sex is a sin. Which is contrary to both the scriptures and history, because that is how they coupled up to form a marriage. And that was how it was done for a long time after the biblical era. No requirement in the Bible, anywhere for a wedding ceremony. It was the Protestants that first required a wedding ceremony in the 1500’s which was soon followed by a civil law in 1753. Of course I agree with the need for wedding ceremonies completely. But if a couple has sex before the wedding it is not a sin. But then again and of course adultery, prostitution, or any other form of casual sex is a sin. But we do not need the word fornication to explain that, because it perverts everything. If the scriptures are translated correctly using the Greek words that define the different type of sexual sin, it is more descriptive and accurate anyway.
Sodomy
The word does not appear in the scriptures. Another promoted concept and meaning. Of course its biblical connection is to Sodom and Gomorrah and the sexual sins thereof and I imagine that there was a lot. But its definition has come to mean any sexual activity that is not the missionary position and orifice. Even between married couples. That is false.
Years ago there were states that made anything put the missionary position illegal. LOL
Wedding ceremonies
The Bible, the scriptures, do not indicate a requirement for wedding ceremonies. This fact…this fact is both biblical and historical. As I said the sexual union was what formed their marriages and that was the way it was for centuries after the biblical period. Why? One of the reasons is that all wedding ceremonies originate from Pagan sources. But as Paul Harvey use to say; Stay tuned for the rest of the story.
The Israelites / Jews did not have wedding ceremonies in the Old Testament. No word in the Hebrew language for wed or wedding. That does not mean that they did not celebrate marriages….and that is another story.
But eventually the Jews did develop wedding ceremonies. When did that happen? The Persian conquest of Babylonia is in the Bible and the Jews found themselves under the friendly rule of the Persians who helped them recover their gold and rebuild their Temple in Jerusalem. Ezra 1:1 to 10:14
The Persians did have wedding ceremonies and they were elaborate, beautiful, and could last days. It seems that the Jews liked these weddings and developed wedding ceremonies of their own…not as a requirement but as an option. But they did not adopt the Persian weddings as a template for their weddings. They came up with their own and it was based on the Old Testament, events and figures. This seems to be reflected in modern Jewish weddings. This was probably an in between the testaments event.
But then Alexander the Great conquered Persia and they treated the Jews horribly…. Atrocities!…. Thousands died in grotesque spectacles and when the Romans took over they continued the abuse….thousands and thousands of Jews were crucified in every despicable manner. So needless to say the Jews hated them….
So they looked back on their history….they had lost their kingdom and the 1st Temple and for centuries were under the rule of Pagans. There is a phrase in the scriptures that says at times that Yahweh had sold them into the hands of their enemies...It appears more than once but here is an example; The anger of the LORD burned against Israel, and He gave them into the hands of plunderers who plundered them; and He sold them into the hands of their enemies around them, so that they could no longer stand before their enemies. Judges 2:20
So they came to think that the reason for their demise was being too tolerant of the Pagans. And this was particularly true after the 69-70 AD siege that destroyed the 2nd Temple and Jerusalem….thousands crucified in a ring around the city wall as a gruesome display and tens of thousands killed. So they tried to separate themselves from all that, and the Jewish Weddings fell under the axe…not gone, just not popular. It took centuries for the Jewish Wedding to reappear.
Regardless during the New Testament period there were probably a few Jewish weddings. The Wedding in Cana may have been one, but we do not know that. When Christ spoke of the ten virgins, who took their lamps and went out to meet the bridegroom and the wedding feast….it is this Jewish Wedding ceremony that He is talking about. Because you will not find any of that in the Old Testament.
So in the Old and New Testament marriages were consummated by the union. Now in the 1st century there are a lot of Jewish-Christians but after the siege of Jerusalem, a lot of Jewish-Christians were killed. By the 2nd century the Gentile-Christians were firmly at the helm….so some of their customs from different regions started to show up in Christianity. As time went on some of these customs were Christianized. Wedding ceremonies and vows were some of these customs. They were modeled approximately after the Roman weddings and still are today.
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Weddings were not a church thing…early writers do not mention a need for wedding ceremonies….the 4th century Ecumenical Councils and later do not mention a need or a requirement for wedding ceremonies. In fact they did not have a lot of good things to say about marriage. I am not saying that Christians were not performing ceremonies, I think they were, but the first documented Christian wedding ceremony occurred in the 9th century. The Catholic Church’s views on women, marriage, and wedding ceremonies was just weird, complicated and generally negative.
“..marriage is a crime against God, because it changed the state of virginity that God gave every man and woman at birth....Marriage is a prostitution of the members of Christ, and married people ought to blush at the state in which they live.” ***************Written by St. Ambrose
“I don’t see what sort of help woman was created to provide man with, if one excludes procreation. If woman is not given to man for help in bearing children, for what help could she be? To till the earth together? If help were needed for that, man would have been a better help for man. The same goes for comfort in solitude. How much more pleasure is it for life and conversation when two friends live together than when a man and a woman cohabitate?”…………………Written by St. Augustine De Genesi ad literam (The Literal Meaning of Genesis) 9.5.9
”And do you not know that you are (each) an Eve? The sentence of God on this sex of yours lives in this age: the guilt must of necessity live too. You are the devil’s gateway: you are the unsealer of that (forbidden) tree: you are the first deserter of the divine law: you are she who persuaded him whom the devil was not valiant enough to attack. You destroyed so easily God’s image, man. On account of your desert—that is, death—even the Son of God had to die. And do you think about adorning yourself over and above your tunics of skins?”……………………Written by Tertullian
Do you imagine that we approve of any sexual intercourse except for the procreation of children? . . .He who is too ardent a lover of his own wife is an adulterer [of his God and wife]. Written by
St. Jerome, against Jovinianus, Book 1, Section 20, 40, A.D. 393: “
Like I said the Catholic Church’s views on women, marriage, and wedding ceremonies was just weird, complicated and generally negative. And this did not just start with the Catholic Church and it got a lot worse.
But the Protestants had a more positive view of marriage and sex… maybe not women… LOL But they saw the validity of marriage, so they mandated a requirement for wedding ceremonies and vows in the mid 1500’s and the Catholics, I guess they felt they had to follow suit, so shortly after they required wedding ceremonies, but only recognized Catholic weddings…..of course.
The need for weddings was among many things taught to Christians by the Holy Spirit after the biblical era.
Lucifer
The word is not in the scriptures. The word is Latin and it is female. The word is the Latin word for Venus the planet…for Venus the morning star ….for Venus the light bearer and Venus the Greco-Roman goddess, but it has nothing to do with Satan. If you read chapters 13 and 14 in Isaiah you will see that the topic is about the Babylonian king Nebuchadnezzar.
So why would St Jerome use the word Lucifer in the Vulgate Bible and why would earlier translations pull a Latin word from the Vulgate to use in English Bibles…. We can speculate….it sounds sinister….they had issues with Satan not being better described as the devil in the Old Testament. There is a reason for that, the Israelites / Jews of the Old Testament did not believe in a devil and still do not believe in a devil today. Of course Satan is defined as the devil in the New Testament, which is true. Now tracking when that happened, how it happened, and why, is more difficult.
Star of the Nativity
This phrase does not appear in the scriptures. The scriptures indicate the star actually traveled to Yeshua’s home in Nazareth, as much as a year later.
Wise men
The scriptures do not call the Magi wise men. The phrase wise men is used to replace the word Magi in earlier translations of the Bible…the Geveva Bible and the KJV Bible to name a few. Why? Probably they did not like what the word Magi because it means….witches … sorcerers.
The phrases of Tulip…Calvinism
Total depravity, Unconditional election, Limited atonement, Irresistible grace, and Perseverance of the saints. Of course these phrases do not appear in the scriptures and they are a deception of John Calvin and his followers.
Once Save, Always Saved
Not a phrase that appears in the scriptures and it is strictly a false belief. Our walk with Christ is a journey of free will and faith. It is up to us to be true to Christ and live our lives like Christians and in the end our destination will be decided on Judgment Day….it is not decided on the day you are baptized… that is the beginning of the journey….and we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
And if you notice a lot of these words are connected to sex in a negative way. This is no mystery. As time went on, it appears that the Christian leaders did not think the Bible was negative enough toward sex and women…..so they introduced words and phrases and even a book.
The Catholic Church came up with a torture manual…basically for women, to torture their more “naked tender parts” The Malleus Maleficarum directed Church driven atrocities…. the witch-hunts and inquisitions. All and all an attempt to demonize, condemn, and punish what God had designed from the beginning.
The other side of this are the man-made sins and there are many. So much so that it can turn a Christian’s life into a minefield of sins and fake sins which effectively distract from the real sins. One can easily step on a real sin trying to avoid a fake sin. Beside the fact that fake sins can cause real sins by condemning other over fake sins. And what these man made sins and the words and phrase were all about…was an attempt to cause an alternate morality through condemnation.
At times I have discussed the “don’t doers” religious aspect of Christianity. Our “rightness with God” defined by what we do not do. So much so that Good Deeds are considered irrelevant, pretty much the lazy man’s approach to Christianity…don’t really have to do anything…go live a closet and be the most righteous Christian.
Well we need to consider what we do and what we should do. The Bible by no means is a romance love manual. The churches do little to give instruction on romantic relationship because they are hung up on preaching sex as sinful. The parents! LOL Do not look forward to explaining the birds and bees to their children….and the schools are all too happy to teach perversions. So is it any wonder that young people are doing the wrong things.
The churches and the parents should be addressing romantic relationships in a positive way and in a constructive way. Because it forms stable families! And they have to do it early, because society is ready to pounce on the young people with every perversion imaginable. The churches and parents should not be focusing on sin and what not to do. Because romantic relationships are not sinful. They need to focus on conduct and what to do. What is respect? What are respectful interactions? What is love? What does that look like? How do you show love and respect? Courtesy…manners… consideration and etiquette. How should a Christian couple conduct themselves in public and in private? What is wrong with teaching our children manners?
Christians are pressed to do this early because the world is standing by to show them sexual images before they should be exposed to that. Sexual stimulation is not for children. And it is hard to insulate them from that because you almost would have to put them in a closet. So we have to address it early. We have to explain to them that there are evil people that want to lead them the wrong way. And part of this is raising them in a church community….more than just going to church but active in church functions and plays and picnics and Bible Camp. Keep them busy with Christianity.
And as I said we need to explain to them how to conduct themselves in romantic relationships. And when that should start….I think that unchaperoned dates should not start until they are out of High School….but now a days that is almost considered child abuse. Keep in mind that dating was never an option in the Bible and did not become common until the advent of the automobile…..not a good thing. How many people were conceived in the backseat of a Chevy?
I realize there are false beliefs that people want to believe and have believed for a long time. Old habits die hard. But no matter how you cut it, a religion of Truths is better than a religion of false beliefs. So I have to stress that this is not my opinion….You are free to research this yourself….if you are interested in Truth. Feel free to try to prove me wrong….have your ducks in a row.
“..marriage is a crime against God, because it changed the state of virginity that God gave every man and woman at birth....Marriage is a prostitution of the members of Christ, and married people ought to blush at the state in which they live.” ***************Written by St. Ambrose
“I don’t see what sort of help woman was created to provide man with, if one excludes procreation. If woman is not given to man for help in bearing children, for what help could she be? To till the earth together? If help were needed for that, man would have been a better help for man. The same goes for comfort in solitude. How much more pleasure is it for life and conversation when two friends live together than when a man and a woman cohabitate?”…………………Written by St. Augustine De Genesi ad literam (The Literal Meaning of Genesis) 9.5.9
”And do you not know that you are (each) an Eve? The sentence of God on this sex of yours lives in this age: the guilt must of necessity live too. You are the devil’s gateway: you are the unsealer of that (forbidden) tree: you are the first deserter of the divine law: you are she who persuaded him whom the devil was not valiant enough to attack. You destroyed so easily God’s image, man. On account of your desert—that is, death—even the Son of God had to die. And do you think about adorning yourself over and above your tunics of skins?”……………………Written by Tertullian
Do you imagine that we approve of any sexual intercourse except for the procreation of children? . . .He who is too ardent a lover of his own wife is an adulterer [of his God and wife]. Written by
St. Jerome, against Jovinianus, Book 1, Section 20, 40, A.D. 393: “
Like I said the Catholic Church’s views on women, marriage, and wedding ceremonies was just weird, complicated and generally negative. And this did not just start with the Catholic Church and it got a lot worse.
But the Protestants had a more positive view of marriage and sex… maybe not women… LOL But they saw the validity of marriage, so they mandated a requirement for wedding ceremonies and vows in the mid 1500’s and the Catholics, I guess they felt they had to follow suit, so shortly after they required wedding ceremonies, but only recognized Catholic weddings…..of course.
The need for weddings was among many things taught to Christians by the Holy Spirit after the biblical era.
Lucifer
The word is not in the scriptures. The word is Latin and it is female. The word is the Latin word for Venus the planet…for Venus the morning star ….for Venus the light bearer and Venus the Greco-Roman goddess, but it has nothing to do with Satan. If you read chapters 13 and 14 in Isaiah you will see that the topic is about the Babylonian king Nebuchadnezzar.
So why would St Jerome use the word Lucifer in the Vulgate Bible and why would earlier translations pull a Latin word from the Vulgate to use in English Bibles…. We can speculate….it sounds sinister….they had issues with Satan not being better described as the devil in the Old Testament. There is a reason for that, the Israelites / Jews of the Old Testament did not believe in a devil and still do not believe in a devil today. Of course Satan is defined as the devil in the New Testament, which is true. Now tracking when that happened, how it happened, and why, is more difficult.
Star of the Nativity
This phrase does not appear in the scriptures. The scriptures indicate the star actually traveled to Yeshua’s home in Nazareth, as much as a year later.
Wise men
The scriptures do not call the Magi wise men. The phrase wise men is used to replace the word Magi in earlier translations of the Bible…the Geveva Bible and the KJV Bible to name a few. Why? Probably they did not like what the word Magi because it means….witches … sorcerers.
The phrases of Tulip…Calvinism
Total depravity, Unconditional election, Limited atonement, Irresistible grace, and Perseverance of the saints. Of course these phrases do not appear in the scriptures and they are a deception of John Calvin and his followers.
Once Save, Always Saved
Not a phrase that appears in the scriptures and it is strictly a false belief. Our walk with Christ is a journey of free will and faith. It is up to us to be true to Christ and live our lives like Christians and in the end our destination will be decided on Judgment Day….it is not decided on the day you are baptized… that is the beginning of the journey….and we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
And if you notice a lot of these words are connected to sex in a negative way. This is no mystery. As time went on, it appears that the Christian leaders did not think the Bible was negative enough toward sex and women…..so they introduced words and phrases and even a book.
The Catholic Church came up with a torture manual…basically for women, to torture their more “naked tender parts” The Malleus Maleficarum directed Church driven atrocities…. the witch-hunts and inquisitions. All and all an attempt to demonize, condemn, and punish what God had designed from the beginning.
The other side of this are the man-made sins and there are many. So much so that it can turn a Christian’s life into a minefield of sins and fake sins which effectively distract from the real sins. One can easily step on a real sin trying to avoid a fake sin. Beside the fact that fake sins can cause real sins by condemning other over fake sins. And what these man made sins and the words and phrase were all about…was an attempt to cause an alternate morality through condemnation.
At times I have discussed the “don’t doers” religious aspect of Christianity. Our “rightness with God” defined by what we do not do. So much so that Good Deeds are considered irrelevant, pretty much the lazy man’s approach to Christianity…don’t really have to do anything…go live a closet and be the most righteous Christian.
Well we need to consider what we do and what we should do. The Bible by no means is a romance love manual. The churches do little to give instruction on romantic relationship because they are hung up on preaching sex as sinful. The parents! LOL Do not look forward to explaining the birds and bees to their children….and the schools are all too happy to teach perversions. So is it any wonder that young people are doing the wrong things.
The churches and the parents should be addressing romantic relationships in a positive way and in a constructive way. Because it forms stable families! And they have to do it early, because society is ready to pounce on the young people with every perversion imaginable. The churches and parents should not be focusing on sin and what not to do. Because romantic relationships are not sinful. They need to focus on conduct and what to do. What is respect? What are respectful interactions? What is love? What does that look like? How do you show love and respect? Courtesy…manners… consideration and etiquette. How should a Christian couple conduct themselves in public and in private? What is wrong with teaching our children manners?
Christians are pressed to do this early because the world is standing by to show them sexual images before they should be exposed to that. Sexual stimulation is not for children. And it is hard to insulate them from that because you almost would have to put them in a closet. So we have to address it early. We have to explain to them that there are evil people that want to lead them the wrong way. And part of this is raising them in a church community….more than just going to church but active in church functions and plays and picnics and Bible Camp. Keep them busy with Christianity.
And as I said we need to explain to them how to conduct themselves in romantic relationships. And when that should start….I think that unchaperoned dates should not start until they are out of High School….but now a days that is almost considered child abuse. Keep in mind that dating was never an option in the Bible and did not become common until the advent of the automobile…..not a good thing. How many people were conceived in the backseat of a Chevy?
I realize there are false beliefs that people want to believe and have believed for a long time. Old habits die hard. But no matter how you cut it, a religion of Truths is better than a religion of false beliefs. So I have to stress that this is not my opinion….You are free to research this yourself….if you are interested in Truth. Feel free to try to prove me wrong….have your ducks in a row.
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ScottA
Well-Known Member
This is the question...and one need look no further than the Pharisees to answer it.
Jim B
Well-Known Member
So do you want to get back to the basics on what is sin? Lets do it!
Because the Holy Spirit can instill the Christian conscience in Christians, I am going to assume some know all this.
Wrong thinking has hurt Christianity, it turned Christianity into a “don’t doers” religion as in Good Deeds and made them pretty much ignore the “love thy neighbor” commandment of Christ. And the belief that sexual sins and women were the worst of sins caused the Church to commit some the worst atrocities known to man. And have mistreated women since nearly the beginning of Christianity. There are a lot of explanations for this…one of them is …in a male dominant religion….where sex is the worst of all sins…dirty, nasty, and sinful and of the devil….women are seen as the temptresses of good men to lead them to perdition. So obviously they are in league with the devil! Boy that worked out bad!
The worst of sin are blasphemy against God and sins that hurt people. So the worst of sins are things like religions that deny the deity of Christ, those that preach that God would deny free-will and Christianity is about worshipping a god that is a puppet master of all humanity. Blasphemies! Blasphemies against God! and then you have murder and abortions and the occult.
The Bible tells us how these things will be judged and gives us a good list of actual sins….
2nd Corinthians 5:10: For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad…..Remember you are being judged on what you have done….Good Deeds or sins.
1st Corinthians 6:9-10 “Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor those habitually drunk, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God”
Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: sexual immorality, impurity, indecent behavior, idolatry, witchcraft, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Revelation 21:8
But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
There are a few words here we could discuss the meaning of, but mostly it is very strait foreword.
Christians are going to be judged by this and Christians can be judged to hell.
Then again forgiveness is up to Christ, not other Christians. Can you sin all your life and live sinful lifestyles and expect not to go to hell….Abortion doctors, homosexual relationships and marriages….LOL…homosexual marriages….taking vows to sin for the rest of their lives….I wonder if that comes with a ticket to hell! LOL. As far as sins and forgiveness of sins do not take Yeshua for a fool.
The Church developed a belief that because Christ suffered, all followers of Christ should suffer….no happiness or pleasure, so some were living in caves and whipping themselves and each other….and they wore torture devises, ate rancid food, and no smilng and walked around with their heads down, quietism was practiced. And of course celibacy. LOL No happiness and no pleasure! Live your lives miserable, eat nasty food and die young!
Christ never said anything like that. They took the scripture about picking up their crosses to mean to torture themselves and never be happy or enjoy life or pleasure….pretty morbid.
So to help this along…and to compete between denominations as to who was most right with God they came up with there own lists of things not to do, to be right with God. LOL Whatever you do, do not exhaust yourself doing right! LOL
So here is our list of man-made don’t do’s for righteousness….
This include various denominations….
Tobacco use, they did not even know what tobacco was in the Bible.
Sexual desire, married or single
Sexual pleasure
Sex in general
Nudity
Having sex in the nude
Having sex in any position other than the missionary position.
Having sex anyplace other than the bedroom, only at night, door locked, windows locked lights off…it is sin if you enjoy it and if your intent is not to have a baby.
Wardrobe design for sexual arousal…. lingerie
Contraception
Divorce
Re-marriage after divorce
not Tithing
Various types of music
Drinking alcoholic beverages
Drinking coffee…tea...anything with caffeine
Eating pork
Eating food that is not Kosher
Eating chocolate, made from the same plant that cocaine is made from
Cards and dice and board games
Gambling
Not going to church regularly
Women speaking in church
Women wearing pants
Women wearing shorts
Women wearing make-up
Women wearing dresses above the knees
Women wearing dress or top that are not tight around the neck. In other words showing cleavage
Women taking shoes off in church
Wearing jewelry
Men with long hair
Women with short hair
Women working outside the home
Female alone in a room with any male not her husband or father
Tattoos
Dancing
Swimming with men and women together
Bikinis
Physical sports such as boxing and football
Physical sports in general baseball, volleyball, croquet, golf
Various holidays and celebrations, Halloween, Easter, Christmas, birthdays etc
Military service
Law enforcement
Self-defense or the defense of others
Karate - martial arts
Exercising
Blood transfusions
Various medicines
Various medical procedures
Communication and entertainment devises TV, radio, phones
Television show with anything above a G rating
The use of vehicles, trains, or airplanes
The general use of any modern devices electrical
The use of any other bible other than the King James Version
Visiting or associating with other denominational churches
Not having a denomination
The Catholic set of man-made laws could add several dozen to this list of which most are a matter of physical and belief control.
As Christ said, The truth will set you free…
The big question has always been what does the truth set us free…from? There is room for debate. But this statement occurs in a conversation Christ had with the Jews in John 8:1-32. This includes the event were the Jews brought the adulteress before Him to test Him and He forgave her and sent her on hers way and told her not to sin no more.
What this means to me is that Christ has set us free from the finality of sin. This goes along with the fact that Yeshua set us free from the burden of the Mosaic Law and the fact that according to the Law, one sin separated you from God….where if you break one Law, you have broke them all. For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Hebrews 10:4
So in the big picture of reality….we are going sin. And Yahweh explained it this way… “If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it.” Genesis 4:7 So we must master our behavior and strive to keep sin to a minimum. So…then consider this...For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law, but under grace. Romans 6:14.
So this goes back to my motto and the way I apply Christianity in my life. Be good and do good the best you can. Strive to live your life for good, for Christ. Walk with Christ everyday…like He is by your side all the time. Remember the poem…Footprints? Exhaust yourself in doing…living right and doing good. Keep your eyes on the light. So then those few times you stumble, Christ will pick you up, dust you off and forgive you and send you on your way because He love you and is proud of you and enjoys seeing you do right. It is always important to please the Lord.
Live your life to the fullest, meet all challenges with courage and enjoy life and love. And as my mom taught this big OX, if you love a lady, treat her with love, tenderness, and respect and if you have not married her yet...give her wedding that she will never forget and will always treasure.
God bless and be good and do good.
Because the Holy Spirit can instill the Christian conscience in Christians, I am going to assume some know all this.
Wrong thinking has hurt Christianity, it turned Christianity into a “don’t doers” religion as in Good Deeds and made them pretty much ignore the “love thy neighbor” commandment of Christ. And the belief that sexual sins and women were the worst of sins caused the Church to commit some the worst atrocities known to man. And have mistreated women since nearly the beginning of Christianity. There are a lot of explanations for this…one of them is …in a male dominant religion….where sex is the worst of all sins…dirty, nasty, and sinful and of the devil….women are seen as the temptresses of good men to lead them to perdition. So obviously they are in league with the devil! Boy that worked out bad!
The worst of sin are blasphemy against God and sins that hurt people. So the worst of sins are things like religions that deny the deity of Christ, those that preach that God would deny free-will and Christianity is about worshipping a god that is a puppet master of all humanity. Blasphemies! Blasphemies against God! and then you have murder and abortions and the occult.
The Bible tells us how these things will be judged and gives us a good list of actual sins….
2nd Corinthians 5:10: For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad…..Remember you are being judged on what you have done….Good Deeds or sins.
1st Corinthians 6:9-10 “Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor those habitually drunk, nor verbal abusers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God”
Galatians 5:19-21 Now the deeds of the flesh are evident, which are: sexual immorality, impurity, indecent behavior, idolatry, witchcraft, hostilities, strife, jealousy, outbursts of anger, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions, envy, drunkenness, carousing, and things like these, of which I forewarn you, just as I have forewarned you, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.
Revelation 21:8
But for the cowardly and unbelieving and abominable and murderers and immoral persons and sorcerers and idolaters and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.”
There are a few words here we could discuss the meaning of, but mostly it is very strait foreword.
Christians are going to be judged by this and Christians can be judged to hell.
Then again forgiveness is up to Christ, not other Christians. Can you sin all your life and live sinful lifestyles and expect not to go to hell….Abortion doctors, homosexual relationships and marriages….LOL…homosexual marriages….taking vows to sin for the rest of their lives….I wonder if that comes with a ticket to hell! LOL. As far as sins and forgiveness of sins do not take Yeshua for a fool.
The Church developed a belief that because Christ suffered, all followers of Christ should suffer….no happiness or pleasure, so some were living in caves and whipping themselves and each other….and they wore torture devises, ate rancid food, and no smilng and walked around with their heads down, quietism was practiced. And of course celibacy. LOL No happiness and no pleasure! Live your lives miserable, eat nasty food and die young!
Christ never said anything like that. They took the scripture about picking up their crosses to mean to torture themselves and never be happy or enjoy life or pleasure….pretty morbid.
So to help this along…and to compete between denominations as to who was most right with God they came up with there own lists of things not to do, to be right with God. LOL Whatever you do, do not exhaust yourself doing right! LOL
So here is our list of man-made don’t do’s for righteousness….
This include various denominations….
Tobacco use, they did not even know what tobacco was in the Bible.
Sexual desire, married or single
Sexual pleasure
Sex in general
Nudity
Having sex in the nude
Having sex in any position other than the missionary position.
Having sex anyplace other than the bedroom, only at night, door locked, windows locked lights off…it is sin if you enjoy it and if your intent is not to have a baby.
Wardrobe design for sexual arousal…. lingerie
Contraception
Divorce
Re-marriage after divorce
not Tithing
Various types of music
Drinking alcoholic beverages
Drinking coffee…tea...anything with caffeine
Eating pork
Eating food that is not Kosher
Eating chocolate, made from the same plant that cocaine is made from
Cards and dice and board games
Gambling
Not going to church regularly
Women speaking in church
Women wearing pants
Women wearing shorts
Women wearing make-up
Women wearing dresses above the knees
Women wearing dress or top that are not tight around the neck. In other words showing cleavage
Women taking shoes off in church
Wearing jewelry
Men with long hair
Women with short hair
Women working outside the home
Female alone in a room with any male not her husband or father
Tattoos
Dancing
Swimming with men and women together
Bikinis
Physical sports such as boxing and football
Physical sports in general baseball, volleyball, croquet, golf
Various holidays and celebrations, Halloween, Easter, Christmas, birthdays etc
Military service
Law enforcement
Self-defense or the defense of others
Karate - martial arts
Exercising
Blood transfusions
Various medicines
Various medical procedures
Communication and entertainment devises TV, radio, phones
Television show with anything above a G rating
The use of vehicles, trains, or airplanes
The general use of any modern devices electrical
The use of any other bible other than the King James Version
Visiting or associating with other denominational churches
Not having a denomination
The Catholic set of man-made laws could add several dozen to this list of which most are a matter of physical and belief control.
As Christ said, The truth will set you free…
The big question has always been what does the truth set us free…from? There is room for debate. But this statement occurs in a conversation Christ had with the Jews in John 8:1-32. This includes the event were the Jews brought the adulteress before Him to test Him and He forgave her and sent her on hers way and told her not to sin no more.
What this means to me is that Christ has set us free from the finality of sin. This goes along with the fact that Yeshua set us free from the burden of the Mosaic Law and the fact that according to the Law, one sin separated you from God….where if you break one Law, you have broke them all. For it is impossible for the blood of bulls and goats to take away sins. Hebrews 10:4
So in the big picture of reality….we are going sin. And Yahweh explained it this way… “If you do well, will not your countenance be lifted up? And if you do not do well, sin is crouching at the door; and its desire is for you, but you must master it.” Genesis 4:7 So we must master our behavior and strive to keep sin to a minimum. So…then consider this...For sin shall not be master over you, for you are not under law, but under grace. Romans 6:14.
So this goes back to my motto and the way I apply Christianity in my life. Be good and do good the best you can. Strive to live your life for good, for Christ. Walk with Christ everyday…like He is by your side all the time. Remember the poem…Footprints? Exhaust yourself in doing…living right and doing good. Keep your eyes on the light. So then those few times you stumble, Christ will pick you up, dust you off and forgive you and send you on your way because He love you and is proud of you and enjoys seeing you do right. It is always important to please the Lord.
Live your life to the fullest, meet all challenges with courage and enjoy life and love. And as my mom taught this big OX, if you love a lady, treat her with love, tenderness, and respect and if you have not married her yet...give her wedding that she will never forget and will always treasure.
God bless and be good and do good.
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Desire Of All Nations
Well-Known Member
This is a false assumption. Protestant churches are riddled with more sexual scandals than Catholic churches. Catholic churches' scandals are the ones that make the headlines because the Roman Catholic Church is viewed as the headquarters of Christianity, but the fact of the matter is that Protestant church leaders are exponentially more corrupt. It's not hard to see why when they allow their adherents to be their own boss.
Judaism is not the religion that God established through Moses in the OT, so your argument is based on a widely inaccurate assumption. Judaism was the religion of the Pharisees, which was based on oral interpretations of Moses' writings and various other unbiblical traditions.
Jesus was absolutely clear in Matt. 5 that He came to uphold every last bit of Moses' writings as authoritative, and in verse 20 He said that His followers were obligated to do a better job of living by it than the religious leaders did if they wanted to inherit the Kingdom of God, so there is no such thing as a Christian that doesn't live by the Law.
If someone doesn't do what God requires of them in the Law, then they are not a Christian, no matter how much they claim to be one.
Once Save, Always Saved
Not a phrase that appears in the scriptures and it is strictly a false belief. Our walk with Christ is a journey of free will and faith. It is up to us to be true to Christ and live our lives like Christians and in the end our destination will be decided on Judgment Day….it is not decided on the day you are baptized… that is the beginning of the journey….and we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
“ The one who BELIEVES in the Son * HAS* Eternal Life.....”
There are so many more verses like these .....Don’t let Ignorant and Confused “ Teachers” take away the Assurance That God wants you to have....
Please remember—- ANY verse that “appears” to go against OSAS is either one of two things—— that Verse is either taken out of context or it is a Verse NOT being addressed to the Body Of Christ..
Not a phrase that appears in the scriptures and it is strictly a false belief. Our walk with Christ is a journey of free will and faith. It is up to us to be true to Christ and live our lives like Christians and in the end our destination will be decided on Judgment Day….it is not decided on the day you are baptized… that is the beginning of the journey….and we are to work out our salvation with fear and trembling.
“ The one who BELIEVES in the Son * HAS* Eternal Life.....”
There are so many more verses like these .....Don’t let Ignorant and Confused “ Teachers” take away the Assurance That God wants you to have....
Please remember—- ANY verse that “appears” to go against OSAS is either one of two things—— that Verse is either taken out of context or it is a Verse NOT being addressed to the Body Of Christ..
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Your fact of the matter is wrong. The Catholics have a history of despicable atrocities. Dead babies stuck in walls....In more modern times decades of child abuse and lawsuits that the Catholic Church has paid to resolve.
I am not saying the protestants do not have their problems, just not the magnitude and centuries of history of it.
Yes I do call it Judaism because people understand that....I have called the Yahwehists....What would you like to call them?
I believe mostly Christ conducted himself in accordance with the Law, but there are exceptions...
And his followers were not under the Law, but were to excel above the Law.
I totally disagree...pretty much with everything you said.
Maybe you should comment on the thread A discussion on how the Old Testament applies to Christianity.
Jesus was absolutely clear in Matt. 5 that He came to uphold every last bit of Moses' writings as authoritative, and in verse 20 He said that His followers were obligated to do a better job of living by it than the religious leaders did if they wanted to inherit the Kingdom of God, so there is no such thing as a Christian that doesn't live by the Law.
If someone doesn't do what God requires of them in the Law, then they are not a Christian, no matter how much they claim to be one.
“ By The Works Of The Law *NO MAN* will be Justified “
“ The Law was an Impossible System That neither We nor our Fathers could Keep”
“ Whoever keeps the Law and stumbles on One Point is Guilty Of breaking it All”
Paul could not keep The Law , but Quail hunter insists that “ WE” do.....lHe preaches a “False and Perverted” gospel.....His Sad Fate is revealed in Gal.1:8.....
God gave the Law to reveal His Standard Of Perfection ( “ You must be PERFECT, even as your Father in Heaven is Perfect”) which is meant to show us our True Guilt before Him, so that we would see our need for His Grace—- it was Given to show us our need for the Gospel ....
The Law was great, but God “ Found Fault” with it because all it could do was “ point out “ sin—- it had No POWER to “ Save” us from Sin....
Where is that “ POWER?” —— The Power to actually Save is Found In Paul’s Gospel ( Given to him by Jesus) .....discover this “ Good News” in 1 Cor15:1-4......
If someone doesn't do what God requires of them in the Law, then they are not a Christian, no matter how much they claim to be one.
“ By The Works Of The Law *NO MAN* will be Justified “
“ The Law was an Impossible System That neither We nor our Fathers could Keep”
“ Whoever keeps the Law and stumbles on One Point is Guilty Of breaking it All”
Paul could not keep The Law , but Quail hunter insists that “ WE” do.....lHe preaches a “False and Perverted” gospel.....His Sad Fate is revealed in Gal.1:8.....
God gave the Law to reveal His Standard Of Perfection ( “ You must be PERFECT, even as your Father in Heaven is Perfect”) which is meant to show us our True Guilt before Him, so that we would see our need for His Grace—- it was Given to show us our need for the Gospel ....
The Law was great, but God “ Found Fault” with it because all it could do was “ point out “ sin—- it had No POWER to “ Save” us from Sin....
Where is that “ POWER?” —— The Power to actually Save is Found In Paul’s Gospel ( Given to him by Jesus) .....discover this “ Good News” in 1 Cor15:1-4......
God bless and be good and do good
I sure hope that this is NOT your Salvation Doctrine—-If it “ is” its straight from Hell....
I hope that everybody here and especially Newbies to the Faith will take note—- For Salvation, the Old Hymn nailed it—- it’s NOTHING BUT THE BLOOD !
I sure hope that this is NOT your Salvation Doctrine—-If it “ is” its straight from Hell....
I hope that everybody here and especially Newbies to the Faith will take note—- For Salvation, the Old Hymn nailed it—- it’s NOTHING BUT THE BLOOD !
Jim B
Well-Known Member
Do you actually expect anyone to read all this? If so, you are delusional.
BTW, all of it is your opinion.
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
The Bible teaches only past sins are forgiven us (not future sins).
Believers need to confess and
forsake sin to continue to obtain forgiveness (or salvation).
Here are the verses in the Bible that teach or imply that past sins only are forgiven:
2 Peter 1:9 KJB
“But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.”
2 Peter 1:9 BLB
“For in whomever these things are not present, he is blind, being short sighted, having received forgetfulness of the purification from his former sins.”
1 John 1:9 KJB
“If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.”
Acts of the Apostles 8:22 KJB
“Repent therefore of this thy wickedness, and pray God, if perhaps the thought of thine heart may be forgiven thee.”
Hebrews 10:26 KJB
“For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins,”
Proverbs 28:13 KJB
“He that covereth his sins shall not prosper: but whoso confesseth and forsaketh them shall have mercy.”
Romans 6:22-23 KJB
22 “But now being made free from sin, and become servants to God, ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.”
Romans 8:13 KJB
“For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.”
1 Corinthians 6:9-11 KJB
9 “Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.”
John 3:20 KJB
“For every one that doeth evil hateth the light, neither cometh to the light, lest his deeds should be reproved.”
1 John 3:15 KJB
“Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.”
1 John 3:8 KJB
“He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.”
Acts of the Apostles 5:1-11 KJB
1 “But a certain man named Ananias, with Sapphira his wife, sold a possession,
2 And kept back part of the price, his wife also being privy to it, and brought a certain part, and laid it at the apostles' feet.
3 But Peter said, Ananias, why hath Satan filled thine heart to lie to the Holy Ghost, and to keep back part of the price of the land?
4 Whiles it remained, was it not thine own? and after it was sold, was it not in thine own power? why hast thou conceived this thing in thine heart? thou hast not lied unto men, but unto God.
5 And Ananias hearing these words fell down, and gave up the ghost: and great fear came on all them that heard these things.
6 And the young men arose, wound him up, and carried him out, and buried him.
7 And it was about the space of three hours after, when his wife, not knowing what was done, came in.
8 And Peter answered unto her, Tell me whether ye sold the land for so much? And she said, Yea, for so much.
9 Then Peter said unto her, How is it that ye have agreed together to tempt the Spirit of the Lord? behold, the feet of them which have buried thy husband are at the door, and shall carry thee out.
10 Then fell she down straightway at his feet, and yielded up the ghost: and the young men came in, and found her dead, and, carrying her forth, buried her by her husband.
11 And great fear came upon all the church, and upon as many as heard these things.”
Matthew 10:33 KJB
“But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.”
Matthew 6:15 KJB
“But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.”
Revelation 22:12-15 KJB
12 “And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie
Bible Highlighter
Well-Known Member
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