Universalism: Where Do People Get The Idea

[07-07-07]

Universalism is yet another man-made doctrine to find side doors into Heaven. But, Jesus had words for that:

John 10
[1] Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
[2] But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
[3] To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
[4] And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
[5] And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
[6] This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.
[7] Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.
[8] All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.
[9] I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
[10] The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
[11] I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
[12] But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.
[13] The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.
[14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

 

[Hidden In Him]

Isn't love in its fullest ,eg loving your enemies as Christ loved us when we were yet sinners, fulfilling the law and therefore must be sinless?

Yes, but I didn't take you as one who ascribed to sinless perfection. Are you asking the question from that perspective, or am I misreading you?

Hope you're having a good evening, btw, and good hearing from you : )

 

[07-07-07]

Off to hell with them, it would be merciful!!!

One is exalting himself/herself as God by insinuating what is or is not merciful, just and righteous. Only God can do that.

 

[Base12]

Great, so you know God is love and ignore everything else about God.

Who is the One ignoring?

Go back and read my challenges to everyone. Not a single person answered.

Here, I'll make a pretty picture so that no one can miss it...

Removed

So again...

Is Psalms 139:15 literal or not? If not, why?

And more importantly...

If I decide to take the verse literally, and others disagree, what authority do they have to tell me I can't?

 

[Base12]

According to Jesus, Children are born from Hell...

View media item 1965
The verse even gives an example of this happening twice!

My question to everyone here...

How did these Children arrive Hell in the first place?

 

[Waiting on him]

When seen in that light, the prayers of "Father, forgive them" and "Lord, lay not this sin to their charge" become essentially prayers for their repentance, and for their eyes to be opened to see what they are doing from God's perspective.

So when Christ says forgive them He’s actually only asking for them to have time to come around to His way of thinking, maybe do some good works?

 

[Waiting on him]

Who is the One ignoring?

Go back and read my challenges to everyone. Not a single person answered.

Here, I'll make a pretty picture so that no one can miss it...

Mhp-0703

• Base12
• Dec 29, 2019

So again...

Is Psalms 139:15 literal or not? If not, why?

And more importantly...

If I decide to take the verse literally, and others disagree, what authority do they have to tell me I can't?

Job said it had been better for him to have suffered an untimely birth, but this was before he saw Jesus.

 

[Waiting on him]

Welcome to the dung heap!!

 

[Base12]

Job said it had been better for him to have suffered an untimely birth, but this was before he saw Jesus.

Interesting quote by Job...

Job 1:21
"And said, Naked came I out of my mother’s womb, and naked shall I return thither: the LORD gave, and the LORD hath taken away; blessed be the name of the LORD"

The phrase 'return thither' means to return to the *location* from which they came.

Newer translations spin it to mean something else.

 

[Hidden In Him]

So when Christ says forgive them He’s actually only asking for them to have time to come around to His way of thinking, maybe do some good works?

Try asking in a different way. My apologies, but I'm not sure I understand the question.

 

[Base12]

John 3:4
"Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born?"

The answer is yes... according to Job.

 

[Waiting on him]

Universalism is yet another man-made doctrine to find side doors into Heaven. But, Jesus had words for that:

John 10
[1] Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that entereth not by the door into the sheepfold, but climbeth up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber.
[2] But he that entereth in by the door is the shepherd of the sheep.
[3] To him the porter openeth; and the sheep hear his voice: and he calleth his own sheep by name, and leadeth them out.
[4] And when he putteth forth his own sheep, he goeth before them, and the sheep follow him: for they know his voice.
[5] And a stranger will they not follow, but will flee from him: for they know not the voice of strangers.
[6] This parable spake Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which he spake unto them.
[7] Then said Jesus unto them again, Verily, verily, I say unto you, I am the door of the sheep.
[8] All that ever came before me are thieves and robbers: but the sheep did not hear them.
[9] I am the door: by me if any man enter in, he shall be saved, and shall go in and out, and find pasture.
[10] The thief cometh not, but for to steal, and to kill, and to destroy: I am come that they might have life, and that they might have it more abundantly.
[11] I am the good shepherd: the good shepherd giveth his life for the sheep.
[12] But he that is an hireling, and not the shepherd, whose own the sheep are not, seeth the wolf coming, and leaveth the sheep, and fleeth: and the wolf catcheth them, and scattereth the sheep.
[13] The hireling fleeth, because he is an hireling, and careth not for the sheep.
[14] I am the good shepherd, and know my sheep, and am known of mine.

Very humble on your part.

 

[Waiting on him]

John 3:4
"Nicodemus saith unto him, How can a man be born when he is old? can he enter the second time into his mother’s womb, and be born?"

The answer is yes... according to Job.

Welcome to the forum base 12, may God give you the grace to stick around.

 

[Base12]

Welcome to the forum base 12, may God give you the grace to stick around.

Thank you Friend.

I'm usually banned for taking the position I hold.

We'll see how it goes.

 

[brakelite]

I would say you were the one putting all the blame on Satan when you wrote: "An enemy has done this.... God, with this one statement, denies all responsibility for sin in the world." Don't try to put those words in my mouth.

KJV Matthew 13
The Parable of the Tares
24 Another parable put he forth unto them, saying, The kingdom of heaven is likened unto a man which sowed good seed in his field:
25 But while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat, and went his way.
26 But when the blade was sprung up, and brought forth fruit, then appeared the tares also.
27 So the servants of the householder came and said unto him, Sir, didst not thou sow good seed in thy field? from whence then hath it tares?
28 He said unto them, An enemy hath done this. The servants said unto him, Wilt thou then that we go and gather them up?
29 But he said, Nay; lest while ye gather up the tares, ye root up also the wheat with them.
30 Let both grow together until the harvest: and in the time of harvest I will say to the reapers, Gather ye together first the tares, and bind them in bundles to burn them: but gather the wheat into my barn.

The householder played no part in sowing tares, not was it his will that the field should yield a mixed crop. But when sin came, he had a plan to defeat it.
Yes, ultimately Satan will be forced to accept responsibility for the rebellion, but indeed we have a choice as to whether we join him or not. There are deeper reasons why God did not immediately put down the rebel permanently right at the beginning.
Any rebellion had political overtones... With the lies, innuendos, and deceptions that come with any attempt at a political takeover. Satan's entire treasonous insurrection in heaven was based on a lie that God's government was somehow deficient. That the laws by which the kingdom of God operated were in some ways unfair, unjust, and either impossible to obey, or unnecessary. I hear that from Christians today. What Satan started was a mind game that is still having a ripple effect throughout the world. If God had squashed Satan then, such an act would not have removed the ideas that Satan had ingested the angelic realm with, but contrariwise would have confirmed the idea of tyranny... Unjust... Arbitrary. That's why we have spent 6000 years on this planet watching and living through as witnesses God permitting Satan to prove whether or not his form of government... Self will and doing what is right in our own eyes... Is better. When the disastrous prophecies of revelation dealing with Antichrist and the evil and violence that ensures from a global government, Babylon, persecuting the few remaining people of God keeping His commandments, and the resulting chaos and turmoil in the world, then will the world finally see the true Christ formed in the lives of Gods children. Then all will be without excuse.

 

[brakelite]

Rejecting Christ is something very specific.

Indeed. Which in the long run it will be easier to be saved than lost. It takes determined effort to resist God's love. Yet Jesus said many take the wide road...

 

[brakelite]

Off to hell with them, it would be merciful!!!

You believe people with characters and habits and desires that have no accord with righteousness and holiness... Who shun even now the company of Christians... Who despise the very thought of godliness today, would be happy and content in the company of holy angels and in the presence of God Himself?

 

[Waiting on him]

Thank you Friend.

I'm usually banned for taking the position I hold.

We'll see how it goes.

If you get a chance check out trying to operate the machinery without the instructions thread, it may be of interest to you.

 

[Waiting on him]

You believe people with characters and habits and desires that have no accord with righteousness and holiness... Who shun even now the company of Christians... Who despise the very thought of godliness today, would be happy and content in the company of holy angels and in the presence of God Himself?

None of what you’ stated enters in.
In other words only what perseveres will enter in only what is Christ.

 

[Waiting on him]

You believe people with characters and habits and desires that have no accord with righteousness and holiness... Who shun even now the company of Christians... Who despise the very thought of godliness today, would be happy and content in the company of holy angels and in the presence of God Himself?

Micah 4:5 KJV
[5] For all people will walk every one in the name of his god, and we will walk in the name of the Lord our God for ever and ever.

Do you see this, this is what makes heaven so appealing to me. Those that are trying to announce something they’ve added to the name of Christ are only offering a FBOS!
Do you picture yourself hand in hand with elen standing at the edge of the lake of fire kicking those that are trying to crawl out in the face... saying get back in there it’s what you deserve?

I’d suggest you guys watch your footing.
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