Untitled

[JellyJam]

I accept that you accept Jesus is real, that in your mind most of you have accepted what you believe to be real.

There's only one way an outsider can know this same experience. To totally surrender to a belief in him as well. I never got to that point, so my 20 year's of faith was fake.

I thought I was a Christian, but I was not even close.

Had I actually surrendered to Jesus, I would have altered my mind in such a way that I could never return from.This is why no matter what I say is seen as a lie, because you of the one true faith have accepted something that I am not.

 

[Windmillcharge]

I accept that you accept Jesus is real, that in your mind most of you have accepted what you believe to be real.

There's only one way an outsider can know this same experience. To totally surrender to a belief in him as well. I never got to that point, so my 20 year's of faith was fake.

I thought I was a Christian, but I was not even close.

Had I actually surrendered to Jesus, I would have altered my mind in such a way that I could never return from.This is why no matter what I say is seen as a lie, because you of the one true faith have accepted something that I am not.

No, it has nothing to do with " in our mind......believe to be real. "
Statements like this show you have no idea how historian evaluate history or what is needed for something in history to be accepted as fact.

Please explain how people hostile to Christianity could write about Jesus if he was fictious.

Then there is the problem for you to show how the bible authors falsified there story.
Why were 'women' principal witnesses to the resurection?
Why is the bible demonstratably an early book when comsidering the history of Christianity and by that I mean that its claim to be written by eyewitness is true, unless of course you can demonstrate otherwise.

 

[Soverign Grace]

I accept that you accept Jesus is real, that in your mind most of you have accepted what you believe to be real.

There's only one way an outsider can know this same experience. To totally surrender to a belief in him as well. I never got to that point, so my 20 year's of faith was fake.

I thought I was a Christian, but I was not even close.

Had I actually surrendered to Jesus, I would have altered my mind in such a way that I could never return from.This is why no matter what I say is seen as a lie, because you of the one true faith have accepted something that I am not.

Hi - I'll tell you my experience if it will help you any. I had gone through hardship and sought God. I had thought that I was a good person, but the delusions were pulled aside and I could see myself as I really was: a sinner. It wasn't a pretty sight. Prior to that I had tried to read the bible but it was as gibberish. Then i began to understand it - little by little. One day I was in a store and found a booklet: "Steps to Christ." I read it and how the "veil" is removed and I knew that I had been spiritually reborn. (I think you can get a copy of the book for free mailed to you if you look online)

I don't understand God but He is still opening up the Bible to me.

Scripture says "Ye shall seek me and find me when ye search for me with all your heart." That's what I did and He let me find Him. I have turned from Him several times since I thought He allowed too much in my life but I go back again for lack of any better place to go. "Whom have I in Heaven but Thee..."

 

[JellyJam]

No, it has nothing to do with " in our mind......believe to be real. "
Statements like this show you have no idea how historian evaluate history or what is needed for something in history to be accepted as fact.

Please explain how people hostile to Christianity could write about Jesus if he was fictious.

Then there is the problem for you to show how the bible authors falsified there story.
Why were 'women' principal witnesses to the resurection?
Why is the bible demonstratably an early book when comsidering the history of Christianity and by that I mean that its claim to be written by eyewitness is true, unless of course you can demonstrate otherwise.

It doesn't matter how the story's of Jesus evolved, it doesn't matter if they were based on a grain of truth, it doesn't matter if there was a Jesus or not.

The only thing that matters is what people today believe, because you and no other person today can go back there to confirm if any of these events are real.

There is a mountain of evidence against the whole religious operation called Christianity.
But the evidence will never be enough to convince a true believer, because they only accept what they believe.

 

[JellyJam]

Hi - I'll tell you my experience if it will help you any. I had gone through hardship and sought God. I had thought that I was a good person, but the delusions were pulled aside and I could see myself as I really was: a sinner. It wasn't a pretty sight. Prior to that I had tried to read the bible but it was as gibberish. Then i began to understand it - little by little. One day I was in a store and found a booklet: "Steps to Christ." I read it and how the "veil" is removed and I knew that I had been spiritually reborn. (I think you can get a copy of the book for free mailed to you if you look online)

I don't understand God but He is still opening up the Bible to me.

Scripture says "Ye shall seek me and find me when ye search for me with all your heart." That's what I did and He let me find Him. I have turned from Him several times since I thought He allowed too much in my life but I go back again for lack of any better place to go. "Whom have I in Heaven but Thee..."

A true believer never leaves. Once they truly believe they are stuck that way for life.

 

[JellyJam]

Hi - I'll tell you my experience if it will help you any. I had gone through hardship and sought God. I had thought that I was a good person, but the delusions were pulled aside and I could see myself as I really was: a sinner. It wasn't a pretty sight. Prior to that I had tried to read the bible but it was as gibberish. Then i began to understand it - little by little. One day I was in a store and found a booklet: "Steps to Christ." I read it and how the "veil" is removed and I knew that I had been spiritually reborn. (I think you can get a copy of the book for free mailed to you if you look online)

I don't understand God but He is still opening up the Bible to me.

Scripture says "Ye shall seek me and find me when ye search for me with all your heart." That's what I did and He let me find Him. I have turned from Him several times since I thought He allowed too much in my life but I go back again for lack of any better place to go. "Whom have I in Heaven but Thee..."

A true believer never leaves. Once they truly believe they are stuck that way for life.

 

[Soverign Grace]

A true believer never leaves. Once they truly believe they are stuck that way for life.

Not true. The bible talks about "backsliding." When I walked away from God it doesn't mean my regenerated spirit changed. I was disappointed and stopped reading my bible. But I realized that I have no one else to hold onto - no hope, nothing. I was spiritually regenerated approximately 40 years ago and that status never changed. The only thing that changed was my bible reading.

 

[Soverign Grace]

It sounds as if you're searching - trying to find God.

 

[Taken]

I accept that you accept Jesus is real, that in your mind most of you have accepted what you believe to be real.

What you accept is in error.
People who Accept Jesus, do so with the thoughts of their HEART, (not their MIND).

There's only one way an outsider can know this same experience.

Correct.

To totally surrender to a belief in him as well.

Yes, from the thoughts in their HEART.

I never got to that point, so my 20 year's of faith was fake.

Your FAITH, was "not fake".
Your FAITH, was IN small Measures.
You "walked" away,
You "stopped" receiving Measures of Faith.
You "fell from Faith".
You "sought" other things.
You "NEVER" received "FAITH-FULLNESS".

Earnest "seeking" is up to the man.
Earnest "belief" is up to the man.
Earnest "following"is up to the man.

Receiving "FAITH" is an ACT of God.

I thought I was a Christian, but I was not even close.

"IF" you were FOLLOWING and BELIEVING...
You "WERE" a Christian.
You simply didn't Continue, Believe in your Heart, Receive FULL "faith-FULLNESS" and surrender your Life to the Lord.
You NEVER became "a Saved and Born Again Christian"...or in short, AKA, A man "Converted IN Christ".

Had I actually surrendered to Jesus,

Quite possible....
From your MINDS thoughts.
Participated in a church RITUAL.
But:
From your Heart<---> not possible.

I would have altered my mind in such a way that I could never return from.

Agree. Your MIND sought other avenues.

The QUESTION is WHY?
The ANSWER is; you were never Really Satisfied with "your mindful belief" in the Lord.
The WHY is; you Didn't surrender with True thoughts of YOUR HEART.

I would presume you Experienced NO EFFECTS of the Lords Spirit BEING IN YOU.
I would say, that is Because He wasn't.

This is why no matter what I say is seen as a lie, because you of the one true faith have accepted something that I am not.

Not so much as a LIE, but rather Irrelevant.
No one IN Christ, will be Swayed or Distracted to Consider Anything Other than thee Heavenly Lord God Almighty.

Coming into FAITH-FULLNESS, requires the DESIRE of the Individual and the EFFORTS of the Individual.

Glory to God,
Taken

 

[JellyJam]

Not true. The bible talks about "backsliding." When I walked away from God it doesn't mean my regenerated spirit changed. I was disappointed and stopped reading my bible. But I realized that I have no one else to hold onto - no hope, nothing. I was spiritually regenerated approximately 40 years ago and that status never changed. The only thing that changed was my bible reading.

Actually the writers (Wink wink) of the new testament didn't really know if leaving Jesus was even possible. Backsliding is just when Christians turn bad, like as some of the hypocritical types in the book of act's.

 

[Pearl]

I was brought up to go to church. I thought I was a Christian. In the sixties I used to hear talk about how Cliff Richard had become a Christian and I thought, 'So what, so am I.'
I was confirmed in the church of England when I was 11, I married in church when I was 20; I had my two girls Christened in church. I got divorced and re-married and wanted my son to be christened in church but because of the divorce I was too ashamed to go to see the vicar so my husband went.

I thought that would be it, but no, the vicar came to the house and sat and talked to us about what we believed. When he left he gave us a copy of 'Journey Into Life' to read. I opened it and right on the first page it set out what doesn't make you a Christian. Like being born into a Christian family, going to church, reading the bible, believing in God and other examples. I read to the end and finally knew the difference between someone who is just a churchgoer and a real Christian and I understood Cliff Richard's decision.

I said the prayer in the booklet and then at the Christening of my son when I stood to make the promises and said, 'I turn to Christ, I repent of my sins, I renounce evil.' I absolutely meant those things and God turned my life around. Up until then, even during my pregnancy, I had been taking valium but after that I never had another. The world was brighter and I felt new and clean and I never looked back. Like others have said it has to come from the heart.

If you open your heart to Jesus he will come in and fill those empty places. Logic is no good, it has to be a heart decision.

 

[JellyJam]

I was brought up to go to church. I thought I was a Christian. In the sixties I used to hear talk about how Cliff Richard had become a Christian and I thought, 'So what, so am I.'
I was confirmed in the church of England when I was 11, I married in church when I was 20; I had my two girls Christened in church. I got divorced and re-married and wanted my son to be christened in church but because of the divorce I was too ashamed to go to see the vicar so my husband went.

I thought that would be it, but no, the vicar came to the house and sat and talked to us about what we believed. When he left he gave us a copy of 'Journey Into Life' to read. I opened it and right on the first page it set out what doesn't make you a Christian. Like being born into a Christian family, going to church, reading the bible, believing in God and other examples. I read to the end and finally knew the difference between someone who is just a churchgoer and a real Christian and I understood Cliff Richard's decision.

I said the prayer in the booklet and then at the Christening of my son when I stood to make the promises and said, 'I turn to Christ, I repent of my sins, I renounce evil.' I absolutely meant those things and God turned my life around. Up until then, even during my pregnancy, I had been taking valium but after that I never had another. The world was brighter and I felt new and clean and I never looked back. Like others have said it has to come from the heart.

If you open your heart to Jesus he will come in and fill those empty places. Logic is no good, it has to be a heart decision.

You have to renounce good also, because that'll kill you too.

 

[Pearl]

You have to renounce good also, because that'll kill you too.

I don't understand your reasoning, but you know what you mean.

 

[JellyJam]

I don't understand your reasoning, but you know what you mean.

Genesis 2:17 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

 

[Pearl]

Genesis 2:17 17but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat from it you will certainly die."

That verse means that if they eat from the tree in disobedience to God's command then they will experience a spiritual death. And through their disobedience every human being born into the world has been dead spiritually until they are born again and restored to spiritual life.

This is why God's son Jesus came into the world, to enable humankind to have that restored close relationship with God that Adam and Eve enjoyed before they ate the fruit of that tree. His death paid the price for the sin of the world, he was the sacrificial lamb who atoned for our sin so that we could be reconciled with God. The word 'sin' comes from an archery term and means to miss or fall short of the mark or in Christian words we don't meet God's high standard. When we respond to Jesus in our hearts that sin is forgiven and we are given a clean slate and become a new creation. It is a wonderful thing.

 

[JellyJam]

That verse means that if they eat from the tree in disobedience to God's command then they will experience a spiritual death. And through their disobedience every human being born into the world has been dead spiritually until they are born again and restored to spiritual life.

This is why God's son Jesus came into the world, to enable humankind to have that restored close relationship with God that Adam and Eve enjoyed before they ate the fruit of that tree. His death paid the price for the sin of the world, he was the sacrificial lamb who atoned for our sin so that we could be reconciled with God. The word 'sin' comes from an archery term and means to miss or fall short of the mark or in Christian words we don't meet God's high standard. When we respond to Jesus in our hearts that sin is forgiven and we are given a clean slate and become a new creation. It is a wonderful thing.

Are you from any another world than this one? Do you know anything outside your own beliefs?

I've been to the other side, the 4th dimension as I've coined it. I know there's actually something else, you only believe you know.

 

[Stranger]

Are you from any another world than this one? Do you know anything outside your own beliefs?

I've been to the other side, the 4th dimension as I've coined it. I know there's actually something else, you only believe you know.

How do you know?

Stranger

 

[JellyJam]

How do you know?

Stranger

Because it's not something I believe stranger.

That's how I know, and you'd know too if you stood in a dimension that was endless desire.

Your Christian love is pale in comparison.

 

[Windmillcharge]

It doesn't matter how the story's of Jesus evolved, it doesn't matter if they were based on a grain of truth, it doesn't matter if there was a Jesus or not.

The only thing that matters is what people today believe, because you and no other person today can go back there to confirm if any of these events are real.

There is a mountain of evidence against the whole religious operation called Christianity.
But the evidence will never be enough to convince a true believer, because they only accept what they believe.

Sorry that is where you are totaly and utterly wrong.

If you can prove Jesus did not live, die and rise again, in fact if you can prove just the last I would have no reason to believe in Christianity.

You claim there is a mountain of evidence against Christianity.

Strange how it never is quoted in debates with people like William lane Craig, or even with Ken Ham.

 

[Stranger]

Because it's not something I believe stranger.

That's how I know, and you'd know too if you stood in a dimension that was endless desire.

Your Christian love is pale in comparison.

The Christian believes and knows. We are not of this world. We are of the Spirit of our Father, God. Our experience with God and His Holy Spirit is not the same as your experience with some worldly spirit.

If you have entered some sort of 'dimension' as you call it, it is not of God's Spirit.

But, my point was, how do you know? Are you saying it is just your experience? The Christians faith in Christ results in his being born-again and indwelt by the Holy Spirit. Atheists and agnostics mock such faith and experience and ask for us to prove it. Show the evidence and proof they say. So, again, how do you know? Where is 'your' evidence and proof?

Stranger