Vaccine... Again, sorry.

  • Welcome to Christian Forums, a Christian Forum that recognizes that all Christians are a work in progress.

    You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,048
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE), sometimes less precisely called immune enhancementor disease enhancement, is a phenomenon in which binding of a virus to suboptimal antibodiesenhances its entry into host cells, followed by its replication.[1][2] Antiviral antibodies promote viral infection of target immune cells by exploiting the phagocytic FcγR or complement pathway.[3] After interaction with the virus the antibody binds Fc receptors (FcR) expressed on certain immune cells or some of the complement proteins. FcγR binds antibody via its fragment crystallizable region (Fc). Usually the process of phagocytosis is accompanied by the virus degradation, however, if the virus is not neutralized (either due to low affinity binding or targeting to a non-neutralizing epitope), antibody binding might result in a virus escape and therefore, enhanced infection. Thus, phagocytosis can cause viral replication, with the subsequent death of immune cells. The virus “deceives” the process of phagocytosis of immune cells and uses the host's antibodies as a Trojan horse. ADE may occur due to the non-neutralizing characteristic of the antibody, which bind viral epitopes other than those involved in a host cell attachment and entry. ADE may also happen due to the presence of sub-neutralizing concentrations of antibodies (binding to viral epitopes below the threshold for neutralization).[4] In addition ADE can be induced when the strength of antibody-antigen interaction is below the certain threshold.[5][6] This phenomenon might lead to both increased virus infectivity and virulence. The viruses that can cause ADE frequently share some common features such as antigenic diversity, abilities to replicate and establish persistence in immune cells.[1] ADE can occur during the development of a primary or secondary viral infection, as well as after vaccination with a subsequent virus challenge.[1][7][8] It has been observed mainly with positive-strand RNA viruses. Among them are Flaviviruses such as Dengue virus,[9] Yellow fever virus, Zika virus,[10][11]Coronaviruses, including alpha- and betacoronaviruses,[12] Orthomyxoviruses such as influenza,[13] Retroviruses such as HIV,[14][15][16] and Orthopneumoviruses such as RSV.[17][18][19]
 
  • Like
Reactions: ScottA and amadeus

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,488
31,647
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE), sometimes less precisely called immune enhancementor disease enhancement, is a phenomenon in which binding of a virus to suboptimal antibodiesenhances its entry into host cells, followed by its replication.[1][2] Antiviral antibodies promote viral infection of target immune cells by exploiting the phagocytic FcγR or complement pathway.[3] After interaction with the virus the antibody binds Fc receptors (FcR) expressed on certain immune cells or some of the complement proteins. FcγR binds antibody via its fragment crystallizable region (Fc). Usually the process of phagocytosis is accompanied by the virus degradation, however, if the virus is not neutralized (either due to low affinity binding or targeting to a non-neutralizing epitope), antibody binding might result in a virus escape and therefore, enhanced infection. Thus, phagocytosis can cause viral replication, with the subsequent death of immune cells. The virus “deceives” the process of phagocytosis of immune cells and uses the host's antibodies as a Trojan horse. ADE may occur due to the non-neutralizing characteristic of the antibody, which bind viral epitopes other than those involved in a host cell attachment and entry. ADE may also happen due to the presence of sub-neutralizing concentrations of antibodies (binding to viral epitopes below the threshold for neutralization).[4] In addition ADE can be induced when the strength of antibody-antigen interaction is below the certain threshold.[5][6] This phenomenon might lead to both increased virus infectivity and virulence. The viruses that can cause ADE frequently share some common features such as antigenic diversity, abilities to replicate and establish persistence in immune cells.[1] ADE can occur during the development of a primary or secondary viral infection, as well as after vaccination with a subsequent virus challenge.[1][7][8] It has been observed mainly with positive-strand RNA viruses. Among them are Flaviviruses such as Dengue virus,[9] Yellow fever virus, Zika virus,[10][11]Coronaviruses, including alpha- and betacoronaviruses,[12] Orthomyxoviruses such as influenza,[13] Retroviruses such as HIV,[14][15][16] and Orthopneumoviruses such as RSV.[17][18][19]
LOL!
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,488
31,647
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Just food for thought here:

"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat." Gen 3:6

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." Gen 2:17

"And as it is appointed unto men once to die..." Heb 9:27

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" John 11:26

"And these signs shall follow them that believe;...They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them..." Mark 16:17-18
 

Brakelite

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2020
8,547
6,393
113
Melbourne
brakelite.wordpress.com
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Antibody-dependent enhancement (ADE), sometimes less precisely called immune enhancementor disease enhancement, is a phenomenon in which binding of a virus to suboptimal antibodiesenhances its entry into host cells, followed by its replication.[1][2] Antiviral antibodies promote viral infection of target immune cells by exploiting the phagocytic FcγR or complement pathway.[3] After interaction with the virus the antibody binds Fc receptors (FcR) expressed on certain immune cells or some of the complement proteins. FcγR binds antibody via its fragment crystallizable region (Fc). Usually the process of phagocytosis is accompanied by the virus degradation, however, if the virus is not neutralized (either due to low affinity binding or targeting to a non-neutralizing epitope), antibody binding might result in a virus escape and therefore, enhanced infection. Thus, phagocytosis can cause viral replication, with the subsequent death of immune cells. The virus “deceives” the process of phagocytosis of immune cells and uses the host's antibodies as a Trojan horse. ADE may occur due to the non-neutralizing characteristic of the antibody, which bind viral epitopes other than those involved in a host cell attachment and entry. ADE may also happen due to the presence of sub-neutralizing concentrations of antibodies (binding to viral epitopes below the threshold for neutralization).[4] In addition ADE can be induced when the strength of antibody-antigen interaction is below the certain threshold.[5][6] This phenomenon might lead to both increased virus infectivity and virulence. The viruses that can cause ADE frequently share some common features such as antigenic diversity, abilities to replicate and establish persistence in immune cells.[1] ADE can occur during the development of a primary or secondary viral infection, as well as after vaccination with a subsequent virus challenge.[1][7][8] It has been observed mainly with positive-strand RNA viruses. Among them are Flaviviruses such as Dengue virus,[9] Yellow fever virus, Zika virus,[10][11]Coronaviruses, including alpha- and betacoronaviruses,[12] Orthomyxoviruses such as influenza,[13] Retroviruses such as HIV,[14][15][16] and Orthopneumoviruses such as RSV.[17][18][19]
I've been saying that all along. For the life of me I can't understand why no-one is listening. It's so frustrating.
 
  • Like
Reactions: amadeus

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,048
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
If I understand it correctly, the vaccine can cause ADE if the threshold is off but even without a vaccine a coronavirus can cause ADE. Even more reason to just trust God.
 
  • Like
Reactions: kcnalp and amadeus

Brakelite

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2020
8,547
6,393
113
Melbourne
brakelite.wordpress.com
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Just food for thought here:

"And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat." Gen 3:6

"But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die." Gen 2:17

"And as it is appointed unto men once to die..." Heb 9:27

"And whosoever liveth and believeth in me shall never die. Believest thou this?" John 11:26

"And these signs shall follow them that believe;...They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them..." Mark 16:17-18
Great verses my friend. But we are to live by faith yes? Is that faith and trust to be in
A. That the vaccine I take will not harm me because God will protect me...
B. That by not taking the vaccine God will protect me against the diseases of the Egyptians...
C. By burying my head in the sand God will dig it up, chop it off, and give it to my friend who already had ten heads.
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,488
31,647
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Great verses my friend. But we are to live by faith yes? Is that faith and trust to be in
A. That the vaccine I take will not hawk me because God will protect me...
B. That by not taking the vaccine good will protect me against the diseases of the Egyptians...
C. By burying my head in the sand God will dig it up, chop it off, and give it to my friend who already had ten heads.
Faith it is:

"Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen." Heb 11:1

Faith in what? Does not everyone have faith in something!
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,048
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Great verses my friend. But we are to live by faith yes? Is that faith and trust to be in
A. That the vaccine I take will not harm me because God will protect me...
B. That by not taking the vaccine God will protect me against the diseases of the Egyptians...
C. By burying my head in the sand God will dig it up, chop it off, and give it to my friend who already had ten heads.

All of the above...?
Lol
 

Brakelite

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2020
8,547
6,393
113
Melbourne
brakelite.wordpress.com
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Seriously, I think by taking the vaccine we are placing unwarranted trust in the health officials and pharma companies, none of whom have our best interests at heart.
The medical fraternity by and large had a monetized interest in prolonging illness. Hence why so many products in the chemists... Drug stores... That are designed specifically to treat symptoms.
Yep, lets make the symptoms all go away so people
A. Won't know they are sick
B. Actively fight against their own bodies immune systems by shutting down those means ( sneezes.. Coughs... Temperature... Vomiting... Diarrhea etc etc) by which the immune system uses to free the body from the disease.
C. Come back to the drug stores to spend more money on more drugs to fight the same symptoms when the virus relocates to another part of the body, or family member.
D. Die from a disease that was never removed or broken in the first place.
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,048
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Listen, we were wrong about the world being flat, we were wrong that eggs are bad for you, we were wrong about plastic bags, but we got it all figured out now and can most definitely say the vaccine is good for you. We are now certain. And look, our medical cadeuces thingy has a snake on a pole so of course you can look to us in trust!

The Gods of the Copybook Headings, Rudyard Kipling.

As I pass through my incarnations in every age and race,
I make my proper prostrations to the Gods of the Market-Place.
Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all.

We were living in trees when they met us. They showed us each in turn
That Water would certainly wet us, as Fire would certainly burn:
But we found them lacking in Uplift, Vision and Breadth of Mind,
So we left them to teach the Gorillas while we followed the March of Mankind.

We moved as the Spirit listed. They never altered their pace,
Being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the Gods of the Market Place,
But they always caught up with our progress, and presently word would come
That a tribe had been wiped off its icefield, or the lights had gone out in Rome.

With the Hopes that our World is built on they were utterly out of touch.
They denied that the Moon was Stilton; they denied she was even Dutch.
They denied that Wishes were Horses; they denied that a Pig had Wings.
So we worshipped the Gods of the Market Who promised these beautiful things.

When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.
But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;
But, though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "If you don't work you die."

Then the Gods of the Market tumbled, and their smooth-tongued wizards withdrew,
And the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe it was true
That All is not Gold that Glitters, and Two and Two make Four—
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings limped up to explain it once more.

As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of Man—
There are only four things certain since Social Progress began:—
That the Dog returns to his Vomit and the Sow returns to her Mire,
And the burnt Fool's bandaged finger goes wabbling back to the Fire;

And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins
When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return![8]
 

stunnedbygrace

Well-Known Member
Aug 18, 2018
12,397
12,048
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Seriously, I think by taking the vaccine we are placing unwarranted trust in the health officials and pharma companies, none of whom have our best interests at heart.
The medical fraternity by and large had a monetized interest in prolonging illness. Hence why so many products in the chemists... Drug stores... That are designed specifically to treat symptoms.
Yep, lets make the symptoms all go away so people
A. Won't know they are sick
B. Actively fight against their own bodies immune systems by shutting down those means ( sneezes.. Coughs... Temperature... Vomiting... Diarrhea etc etc) by which the immune system uses to free the body from the disease.
C. Come back to the drug stores to spend more money on more drugs to fight the same symptoms when the virus relocates to another part of the body, or family member.
D. Die from a disease that was never removed or broken in the first place.


Reminds you of the verse about how they would not stop their sorceries/pharmakon...
 
  • Like
Reactions: APAK and Brakelite

Brakelite

Well-Known Member
Feb 6, 2020
8,547
6,393
113
Melbourne
brakelite.wordpress.com
Faith
Christian
Country
Australia
Listen, we were wrong about the world being flat, we were wrong that eggs are bad for you, we were wrong about plastic bags, but we got it all figured out now and can most definitely say the vaccine is good for you. We are now certain. And look, our medical cadeuces thingy has a snake on a pole so of course you can look to us in trust!

The Gods of the Copybook Headings, Rudyard Kipling.

As I pass through my incarnations in every age and race,
I make my proper prostrations to the Gods of the Market-Place.
Peering through reverent fingers I watch them flourish and fall,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings, I notice, outlast them all.

We were living in trees when they met us. They showed us each in turn
That Water would certainly wet us, as Fire would certainly burn:
But we found them lacking in Uplift, Vision and Breadth of Mind,
So we left them to teach the Gorillas while we followed the March of Mankind.

We moved as the Spirit listed. They never altered their pace,
Being neither cloud nor wind-borne like the Gods of the Market Place,
But they always caught up with our progress, and presently word would come
That a tribe had been wiped off its icefield, or the lights had gone out in Rome.

With the Hopes that our World is built on they were utterly out of touch.
They denied that the Moon was Stilton; they denied she was even Dutch.
They denied that Wishes were Horses; they denied that a Pig had Wings.
So we worshipped the Gods of the Market Who promised these beautiful things.

When the Cambrian measures were forming, They promised perpetual peace.
They swore, if we gave them our weapons, that the wars of the tribes would cease.
But when we disarmed They sold us and delivered us bound to our foe,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "Stick to the Devil you know."

On the first Feminian Sandstones we were promised the Fuller Life
(Which started by loving our neighbour and ended by loving his wife)
Till our women had no more children and the men lost reason and faith,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "The Wages of Sin is Death."

In the Carboniferous Epoch we were promised abundance for all,
By robbing selected Peter to pay for collective Paul;
But, though we had plenty of money, there was nothing our money could buy,
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings said: "If you don't work you die."

Then the Gods of the Market tumbled, and their smooth-tongued wizards withdrew,
And the hearts of the meanest were humbled and began to believe it was true
That All is not Gold that Glitters, and Two and Two make Four—
And the Gods of the Copybook Headings limped up to explain it once more.

As it will be in the future, it was at the birth of Man—
There are only four things certain since Social Progress began:—
That the Dog returns to his Vomit and the Sow returns to her Mire,
And the burnt Fool's bandaged finger goes wabbling back to the Fire;

And that after this is accomplished, and the brave new world begins
When all men are paid for existing and no man must pay for his sins,
As surely as Water will wet us, as surely as Fire will burn,
The Gods of the Copybook Headings with terror and slaughter return![8]
Can you imagine the remaining verses if he lived to our day?
 

amadeus

Well-Known Member
Jan 26, 2008
22,488
31,647
113
80
Oklahoma
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
Seriously, I think by taking the vaccine we are placing unwarranted trust in the health officials and pharma companies, none of whom have our best interests at heart.
The medical fraternity by and large had a monetized interest in prolonging illness. Hence why so many products in the chemists... Drug stores... That are designed specifically to treat symptoms.
Yep, lets make the symptoms all go away so people
A. Won't know they are sick
B. Actively fight against their own bodies immune systems by shutting down those means ( sneezes.. Coughs... Temperature... Vomiting... Diarrhea etc etc) by which the immune system uses to free the body from the disease.
C. Come back to the drug stores to spend more money on more drugs to fight the same symptoms when the virus relocates to another part of the body, or family member.
D. Die from a disease that was never removed or broken in the first place.
How much trust should we put in any man, even those we believe are sincerely working toward the best solution for everyone?

Should we ever start our motor vehicles because there might be a defect caused by men accidently or purposely which would cause it explode injuring or killing us? So no more cars!

Should we ever buy food from a grocery store because there might be a poison in it caused by men accidently or purposely which would hurt us? So no more grocery stores!

Should we ever walk down the street as a pedestrian because some disturbed man may be driving along looking for someone hurt or kill with his vehicle? So no more walking down the street!

Should we never trust in any trained or educated experts in fields in which we have no knowledge because they might accidently or purposely hurt us? So no more consulting any experts about anything!

Should we hide ourselves in a cave in a desolate part of the mountains to avoid all the accidental or purposeful things some people may do to harm us? So no more interaction with people at all!

Or is the following a viable alternative?

"Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; and lean not unto thine own understanding.
In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.
Be not wise in thine own eyes: fear the LORD, and depart from evil.
It shall be health to thy navel, and marrow to thy bones." Prov. 3:5-8

And then again there is this:

"Now the just shall live by faith:... Heb 10:38

Again the question: Faith in what?
 

dev553344

Well-Known Member
Jul 14, 2020
14,521
17,189
113
USA
Faith
Christian
Country
United States

JohnDB

Well-Known Member
Feb 7, 2010
4,472
2,931
113
TN
Faith
Christian
Country
United States
I wonder when those who went through the trials don't die here in two months what will be said then.
Instead in about two months those who are in the trials will show that the mRNA vaccines prevent infection and not just disease....I wonder what new lies will come from the conspiracy theorists then.