What's Wrong with Pride?

[skypair]

In my studying of the psychology of salvation, I've learned that the superego (our soul = heart + conscience) by nature restrains/superintends the ego (our spirit = mind + emotions + will). From birth or early childhood, we "by nature do the things contained in the law … show the work of the law written on their hearts, their consciences bearing them witness, and their thoughts [mind] the meanwhile accusing or else excusing one another." (Ro 2:14-15)

What happens with pride is that the ego, with input from the flesh ("lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life," 1Jn 2:16) begins to superintend the superego. It does so with what the Bible calls "concupiscence" (Ro 7:8) saying to the soul, "I can get away with this" or "Maybe this will actually be good for me." And once either of these thoughts is confirmed by its seemingly beneficial, worldly consequences, we begin to trust our mind/ego instead of our heart and conscience/superego. This is the beginning of pride in self and lordship of self.

And this can happen with outright sin .. or even with theology. We begin to lean on our own understanding (or some human form of understanding) and not in what God has set in our hearts (Prov 3:5) .. or what we are taught in church rather than what the Bible actually says. Most of us come to Christ basically "clueless" on anything the Bible really says except for the gospel of Jesus Christ.

But now notice this about salvation Ro 8:9 — "But your are not of the flesh but of the Spirit is so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you," in your soul. 1Jn 3:9 confirms — "Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin; for His seed remains in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." That is, the soul or superego has been restored to where God superintends our mind and our behavior. That does not mean that we won't sin ignorantly (Psa 19:12) or react in situations without consulting or obeying the Spirit. But we won't be led around by the flesh anymore but by the Spirit .. Who will also lead us to confess and repent.

 

[Windmillcharge]

It depends what one is beiong proud of and how. If onebis good at something, there is nothing wrong with being proud of what you've achieved.
The proviso is that one also acknowledges that ones ability comes from God.

 

[aspen]

In my studying of the psychology of salvation, I've learned that the superego (our soul = heart + conscience) by nature restrains/superintends the ego (our spirit = mind + emotions + will). From birth or early childhood, we "by nature do the things contained in the law … show the work of the law written on their hearts, their consciences bearing them witness, and their thoughts [mind] the meanwhile accusing or else excusing one another." (Ro 2:14-15)

What happens with pride is that the ego, with input from the flesh ("lust of the flesh, lust of the eyes, and the pride of life," 1Jn 2:16) begins to superintend the superego. It does so with what the Bible calls "concupiscence" (Ro 7:8) saying to the soul, "I can get away with this" or "Maybe this will actually be good for me." And once either of these thoughts is confirmed by its seemingly beneficial, worldly consequences, we begin to trust our mind/ego instead of our heart and conscience/superego. This is the beginning of pride in self and lordship of self.

And this can happen with outright sin .. or even with theology. We begin to lean on our own understanding (or some human form of understanding) and not in what God has set in our hearts (Prov 3:5) .. or what we are taught in church rather than what the Bible actually says. Most of us come to Christ basically "clueless" on anything the Bible really says except for the gospel of Jesus Christ.

But now notice this about salvation Ro 8:9 — "But your are not of the flesh but of the Spirit is so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you," in your soul. 1Jn 3:9 confirms — "Whosoever is born of God does not commit sin; for His seed remains in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God." That is, the soul or superego has been restored to where God superintends our mind and our behavior. That does not mean that we won't sin ignorantly (Psa 19:12) or react in situations without consulting or obeying the Spirit. But we won't be led around by the flesh anymore but by the Spirit .. Who will also lead us to confess and repent.

Hello - this is interesting. I am intrigued, but a bit wary - do you have a source I can check out and learn more? Interesting topic

 

[amadeus]

The line is difficult not to cross. It something that is in each of us and attracts us so that when followed it can become sin:

"For all that is in the world, 1) the lust of the flesh, and 2) the lust of the eyes, and 3) the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world." I John 2:16

Each of us has the three things listed in that verse which will lead us into sin. The "world" mentioned is NOT planet Earth, but the little world of each one of us, the little world which we need to overcome... and are only able to do so with the help of God. The first two are plain enough, the third is likely to catch hold of us because the first two seemed to be diminished or gone. We are "proud" that we overcame those "lusts", but if they were overcome it certainly was not done by our own power alone, was it?

I live in Oklahoma, a big sports state and particular a big American football state. Most everyone seems to be proud of the home team, whether it is small town or the OSU Cowboys or the OU Sooners. Is this wrong? Is it wrong to root for the home team? Certainly not, did not God make everything "very good"? But we must not only remember the following words but sincerely believe them:

"But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you." Matt 6:33

Even if you are NOT one who attends a regular meeting on Sunday to worship God, you can understand the problem with needing to leaving early from the service already limited in most places by man to one hour in order to get home to watch the game. 168 hours there are in the week and only one hour of that supposedly belongs to God and even that must be shortened in order to watch a football game. Hmmm? Who is it that is first?

Is this pride? Is this selfishness? Is this simply an innocent pastime? Hmmm?

Is the spirit of our team on a higher plane than the Holy Spirit in our heart? Hmmm?

 

[pia]

Is the spirit of our team on a higher plane than the Holy Spirit in our heart? Hmmm

What a great post John, and an awesome question for some, I'm sure...

 

[skypair]

Hello - this is interesting. I am intrigued, but a bit wary - do you have a source I can check out and learn more? Interesting topic

I'll get back to you, but no. Most Christians, in fact, have the soul and spirit aspects of man reversed. It was only be beginning with "it is the soul that needs saving" (Jas 1:21, 5:20, etc.) that I was able to straighten the roles out. It is a worthy study, though.

skypair

 

[skypair]

Starting with the soul, it is the soul that dies spiritually on account of willful trespass of God's commandments, Ezek 18:20. So it is the soul that is cut off from God. Man is soul, spirit, and body - 1Thes 5:23. As we know, the spirit and body are still alive. So what is alive is the mind, emotions, and will. We know this because we experience life through them daily. Anything and everything comes into us from the senses to the mind first.

And so does the gospel. The mind then processes the gospel and the gospel, if believed, actually "opens" the heart to paying attention, Acts 16:14, Lydia. The first thing the gospel does is convict the heart and conscience (soul) of sin and its consequences in our life, Jn 16:8-10. Confronted with the truth/Spirit, if we believe it, we have received the Holy Spirit "as any Calvinist will tell you), but that is not salvation. The Holy Spirit is simply the wisdom of God and "grace," prevenient grace to the Arminians.

If we then obey the gospel and repent to God (Acts 2:38), He will forgive our consciences and revive our hearts by the indwelling of the Holy Ghost .. the "new [spiritual, regenerated] man." Now Christ, the Comforter, is in your soul and the soul/superego once again superintends the spirit/ego as it once did when your mom told you, "Let your conscience be your guide," right?

skypair

 

[aspen]

The early church taught that the soul is spirit+body

 

[Helen]

The early church taught that the soul is spirit+body

I thought it was mind+body. Spirit +heart.

 

[aspen]

I thought it was mind+body. Spirit +heart.

Soul = entire being

 

[Helen]

Soul = entire being

Mmmm I will have to think on that. Mainly because it blows all I have ever believed. Ha!!

 

[aspen]

Mmmm I will have to think on that. Mainly because it blows all I have ever believed. Ha!!

Plato believed the soul was another name for the spirit

 

[Helen]

Plato believed the soul was another name for the spirit

Now that I am totally against. God would not speak of a difference is it were the same.
The soulish man can be moved by emotion..by beauty, by music . It touches the soul and lifts it. " To me" the spirit is always steady, always linked to God. I see them totally different.

We are called to live in the Spirit...the soul is easily moved either way..towards the world, or toward the Spirit.
I believe Adam was firstly a man of the spirit...but after the fall became up side down, and then became dominated by his soul...which, if we listen to it...will lead us about by the nose..

Those are my thoughts on it...

bless you...H

 

[aspen]

Now that I am totally against. God would not speak of a difference is it were the same.
The soulish man can be moved by emotion..by beauty, by music . It touches the soul and lifts it. " To me" the spirit is always steady, always linked to God. I see them totally different.

We are called to live in the Spirit...the soul is easily moved either way..towards the world, or toward the Spirit.
I believe Adam was firstly a man of the spirit...but after the fall became up side down, and then became dominated by his soul...which, if we listen to it...will lead us about by the nose..

Those are my thoughts on it...

bless you...H

Ok.

All I am saying is your view is not consistent with the traditional understanding of the word soul. Meaning of words change over time

 

[Helen]

Ok.

All I am saying is your view is not consistent with the traditional understanding of the word soul. Meaning of words change over time

LOL, and how often have you seen me believe in much that has the word traditional attached to it!
I just go by what I see in scripture...nowhere can I see that soul and spirit are the same.

 

[aspen]

LOL, and how often have you seen me believe in much that has the word traditional attached to it!
I just go by what I see in scripture...nowhere can I see that soul and spirit are the same.

I do not believe they are the same either. I do see modern day Christians using the words interchangeably however and I think it is a pretty minor issue, unless it happens to interfere with the Christian teaching of bodily resurrection - and in some cases, it does.

 

[Truth]

Now that I am totally against. God would not speak of a difference is it were the same.
The soulish man can be moved by emotion..by beauty, by music . It touches the soul and lifts it. " To me" the spirit is always steady, always linked to God. I see them totally different.

We are called to live in the Spirit...the soul is easily moved either way..towards the world, or toward the Spirit.
I believe Adam was firstly a man of the spirit...but after the fall became up side down, and then became dominated by his soul...which, if we listen to it...will lead us about by the nose..

Those are my thoughts on it...

bless you...H

I know that this is out of context, But being lead by the nose is a fact! Many Israelite's were lead into captivity, the conquering people would pierce their nose with a thin twig, and tie a string to it and wherever they wanted them to go they just pulled the string. so the soul can be turned in such a simple way, if we allow it! I believe that the Scripture states, what good is it if a man gain's the whole world, But loose's His Soul.

 

[brakelite]

Mmmm I will have to think on that. Mainly because it blows all I have ever believed. Ha!!

Not just the early church Grace, but Judaism as well.
Genesis 2:7 And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground,(body) and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; (Spirit)and man became a living soul. (Us).

 

[skypair]

The early church taught that the soul is spirit+body

Yes, sir! That was OT teaching. And they also taught that the soul or "ghost" was the spiritual body or person .. like when Jesus commended His spirit to the Father and "gave up the ghost." And so this is the "ghost" that we receive when we receive the Holy Ghost, Acts 2:38. It is "Christ in us" (Col 1:27) .. the "Comforter" (Jn 14:26) who "dwells with you but shall be in you" (Jn 14:17).

Aspen .. we are all creating a "ghost" within our fleshly body .. either our Holy Ghost or a spiritual body of our own creation that will appear at the great white throne judgment unto the 2nd death and the lake of fire (Rev 20:11-17). It is our Holy Ghost that will be raptured to meet the Lord in the air (1Thes 4:16-17, 2Thes 2:6-8).

skypair

 

[skypair]

Now that I am totally against. God would not speak of a difference if it were the same.

I think maybe you will like this formulation, Grace: The stimuli from our flesh (hearing, seeing, etc.) goes first to our SPIRIT (mind, emotions, and will). Then, in the exercise of our mental processes (psychology), the spirit considers what one already has learned and understood in the SOUL (heart and conscience).

So remember when your mother told you, "Let your conscience be your guide?" That is what we normally do. So when we hear the gospel, the Holy Spirit, we do compare what it says about sin. Conviction comes from our heart and conscience and leads to the heart being "opened" (remember how folks used to tell you to keep an open mind? They really meant don't let your conscience block what i am saying).

So let's suppose that you believed the gospel .. then you have "received the Holy Spirit." You are not saved yet because there is still sin in your conscience that you are well aware of now. You have to repent of a sinful heart (sin nature) and a sinful conscience (sin guilt) and turn to Christ for forgiveness and salvation.

Now this is where it gets interesting. You know how your spirit was listening to God's Spirit on the outside .. the gospel and the Word of God? Well, when we are saved, we listen to the Spirit on the inside .. dwelling in our soul .. our "conscience" is God's conscience and our new "Guide" (Jn 16:13)! Now what we hear from the Word is reconciled with what we have in our hearts (2Cor 5:20) and so our mind is at peace with God!

skypair